State of Fast Pass Return (or replacement)

[ladyderks]

Just a hunch, but it makes sense to me. Why have people actually standing in line? You get your virtual place in line, then just hang out doing whatever until it's your turn.

This! But adding that less time waiting in lines = more time buying merchandise and food in the park. If all the lines were virtual, people would have more time (theoretically) to spend in the shops and restaurants.

 

[onelove8187]

The more I think about it, the more I believe WDW is going to try to eliminate standby lines almost completely. All queues for major rides will be virtual. Just a hunch, but it makes sense to me. Why have people actually standing in line? You get your virtual place in line, then just hang out doing whatever until it's your turn.
I think they will probably want a system where you can be a little more spontaneous, so you don't have to book all your rides 60 days in advance. And I don't think they want all rides to be booked solid instantly at 0700. So they'll have to figure that out. But I feel like virtual queues is definitely the direction we are headed.

Although clearly Disney would want this, it is not feasible during busy times unless the reduce capacity limits. These limits assume the large percentage of people waiting in standby lines. Imagine Christmas week.

 

[DL1WDW2]

@DL1WDW2
It’s the Cabins at Fort Wilderness, $450 a night. Nice, right?

I guess Disney isn’t worried about alligators in the waters unless you are staying at a Deluxe Resort. Mold could be even scarier…

 

[vincep]

I've found that Mickey Views gives Disney the benefit of the doubt because he is a huge fan and much of his life is centered around it so why would he criticize it unless he felt strongly about something? Calling his podcasts clickbait is offensive. We have seen Magical Express taken away, menus ridiculously reduced and long wait times increased for transportation. Annual passes have been eliminated from Disneyland and new ones are not available for WDW. He is basing his thoughts about what is going on at Disneyland Paris. He is not pulling these things out of thin air.
Disney wants fewer but richer customers or as they call them 'guests.' And of course less money spent on staff. Disney's 'inclusion' joke as many people have pointed out means inclusion only for the well heeled.

 

[vincep]

I've found that Mickey Views gives Disney the benefit of the doubt because he is a huge fan and much of his life is centered around it so why would he criticize it unless he felt strongly about something? Calling his podcasts clickbait is offensive. We have seen Magical Express taken away, menus ridiculously reduced and long wait times increased for transportation. Annual passes have been eliminated from Disneyland and new ones are not available for WDW. He is basing his thoughts about what is going on at Disneyland Paris. He is not pulling these things out of thin air.
Disney wants fewer but richer customers or as they call them 'guests.' And of course less money spent on staff. Disney's 'inclusion' joke as many people have pointed out means inclusion only for the well heeled.

 

[justdoip]

Although clearly Disney would want this, it is not feasible during busy times unless the reduce capacity limits. These limits assume the large percentage of people waiting in standby lines. Imagine Christmas week.

Maybe. But a better plan would be to find something else for those people to do. If "Keep a lot of people standing around doing nothing at all times" is a critical part of their business strategy, then they probably want to reconsider that.

 

[DL1WDW2]

The more I think about it, the more I believe WDW is going to try to eliminate standby lines almost completely. All queues for major rides will be virtual. Just a hunch, but it makes sense to me. Why have people actually standing in line? You get your virtual place in line, then just hang out doing whatever until it's your turn.
I think they will probably want a system where you can be a little more spontaneous, so you don't have to book all your rides 60 days in advance. And I don't think they want all rides to be booked solid instantly at 0700. So they'll have to figure that out. But I feel like virtual queues is definitely the direction we are headed.

Disney already has a sample of this with the virtual Q for ROTR … have you seen all the guests hanging around with nothing to do at Hollywood Studios?

 

[onelove8187]

Maybe. But a better plan would be to find something else for those people to do. If "Keep a lot of people standing around doing nothing at all times" is a critical part of their business strategy, then they probably want to reconsider that.

I think the goal is some sort of optimization… maximum capacity at maximum price point while maximizing spend per guest per day which requires minimizing time in standby queue without cannibalizing maximum capacity. None of its simple but clearly they want to squeeze every imaginable penny at all costs lol

 

[Mle8308]

The posted wait times are calculated on a daily basis the Fastpass won’t change that.
What is does change is how long you are waiting (not the posted time). If you are in the Standby line and the Fastpass line is feeding into your line people are getting in front of you. If there is no Fastpass line the Standby line will continue to move without additional people.

The posted wait times used to be calculated by guests going through the stand by line. The CM at the queue entrance would scan a card and then ask a guest entering the line to take it with them, then hand it to the last CM they see. That final CM would scan the card and it would calculate the time spent in line. This is normally done 4 to 5 times per hour. There is usually some type of buffer built in, so it may automatically add 10 minutes to the time. That buffer can be determined by management & adjusted as necessary. FP distribution & wait times are as much of an art as science!

 

[TinkerBelle_325]

Disney already has a sample of this with the virtual Q for ROTR … have you seen all the guests hanging around with nothing to do at Hollywood Studios?

Nothing to do? ROTR isn’t the only attraction lol. Sure there was a point in time where DHS lacked rides….but now there are:
- Mickey & Minnie’s Runaway Railway
- Rock n’ Roller Coaster
- Tower of Terror
- Star Tours
- Millennium Falcon Smuggler’s Run
- Alien Swirling Saucers
- Toy Story Mania
- Slinky Dog Dash
- Muppet Vision 3D
And slowly shows/theatre attractions are returning….
- For the First Time in Forever
- Disney Junior
- Lightning McQueen’s Racing Academy
- Walt Disney Presents
- Vacation Fun - A Mickey & Minnie Short

Not to mention Savi’s Workshop, Droid Depot, Cavalcades, characters wandering Galaxy’s Edge…..

But yeah, sure, they have nothing to do

 

[DL1WDW2]

Here's an interesting article from the Motley Fool taking the position that Disney won't implement a paid fastpass+ system this year. Maybe there is hope after all.

https://www.fool.com/investing/2021/07/09/3-reasons-disney-world-will-not-start-charging-for/

I think Disney will not be in a hurry to offer the pay for Fastpass for more than just these 3 reasons.
How are you going to charge $$$ when they can’t guarantee the attraction won’t breakdown. I can see the most valuable line to pay for would be the one everybody is standing in at Guest Services to complain. Their aren’t enough comp FP ‘s available for this scenario!

I also think Disney is going to discover that many families will now be signing up for the VIP Tour Guide since they have announced they will have access to the newer attractions… I expect Disney is going to keep a close eye on the results of this announcement…I hear they are booking up and better get your VIP money out of the bank or just throw it on the credit card… VIP= $$$ and happy guests

 

[TinkerBelle_325]

I think Disney will not be in a hurry to offer the pay for Fastpass for more than just these 3 reasons.
How are you going to charge $$$ when they can’t guarantee the attraction won’t breakdown. I can see the most valuable line to pay for would be the one everybody is standing in at Guest Services to complain. Their aren’t enough comp FP ‘s available for this scenario!

I also think Disney is going to discover that many families will now be signing up for the VIP Tour Guide since they have announced they will have access to the newer attractions… I expect Disney is going to keep a close eye on the results of this announcement…I hear they are booking up and better get your VIP money out of the bank or just throw it on the credit card… VIP= $$$ and happy guests

You think the average family is going to happily shell out between $3000 and $5600 for a single day of VIP touring ($425 - $800 per hour, 7 hour minimum)… ON TOP of park admission, food, souvenirs etc….just because Disney added guaranteed access to ROTR? Ha! People have been losing their minds at the prospect of paying $10 per person per ride to skip the lines. If the average family can drop thousands for a single day why would they put up a fuss at a nominal fee to skip lines? You could buy each member of a family of 4, 75 FastPasses at an assumed cost of $10 per ride instead of shelling out $3000 for 1 day.

 

[npatellye]

Although clearly Disney would want this, it is not feasible during busy times unless the reduce capacity limits. These limits assume the large percentage of people waiting in standby lines. Imagine Christmas week.

It might be feasible if they had everyone get scanned in like they do for the DAS and mixed it with boarding groups. Then people would just get a boarding group to wait for (with perhaps an estimated return time) and could easily shop, eat, or head to some of the large capacity attractions and shows.

They would still have FP+ and DAS running concurrently and using the FP line. They could let people select however many FPs they assign (I’m just going to absurd and say Deluxe 5, Moderate 4, Value 3) at 60 days out and then go to boarding groups like ROTR but based on when the CM scans your band/phone/card and gives you the return time. So instead of logging on at 7 am to grab boarding groups, you would just get scanned in and get a number. People with DAS and FPs would still report at their times but everyone else would wait for a boarding group notification and perhaps they would ideally have a rough idea of when that group would be called to line up.

 

[Wandering Oaken]

The posted wait times are calculated on a daily basis the Fastpass won’t change that.
What is does change is how long you are waiting (not the posted time). If you are in the Standby line and the Fastpass line is feeding into your line people are getting in front of you. If there is no Fastpass line the Standby line will continue to move without additional people.

Marginally. Not enough to make a difference.

 

[Mle8308]

Marginally. Not enough to make a difference.

The CM at the merge point can also make a big difference in managing the two lines. If they manage it properly, FP moves quickly and standby is steady. I don’t see that happen too often now. I have to bite my tongue and keep walking - it’s not my place anymore!

 

[Karin1984]

I think Disney will not be in a hurry to offer the pay for Fastpass for more than just these 3 reasons.
How are you going to charge $$$ when they can’t guarantee the attraction won’t breakdown. I can see the most valuable line to pay for would be the one everybody is standing in at Guest Services to complain. Their aren’t enough comp FP ‘s available for this scenario!

I also think Disney is going to discover that many families will now be signing up for the VIP Tour Guide since they have announced they will have access to the newer attractions… I expect Disney is going to keep a close eye on the results of this announcement…I hear they are booking up and better get your VIP money out of the bank or just throw it on the credit card… VIP= $$$ and happy guests

It's the other way around, a pay per FP system will take away people from the VIP tours. There have been more and more guests using the VIP tours, making it not as VIP anymore as it once was. I guess for most people a VIP guide is just a walking FP anyway. This system is ideal for people who would like to use VIP guides but think it's too expensive or only want premium access for a handful of rides.
This system will make more premium guests happy, and make the VIP tours more exclusive again.
I wouldn't be surprised if this was implemented in the US that the price of VIP tours goes up.

 

[Wandering Oaken]

It's the other way around, a pay per FP system will take away people from the VIP tours. There have been more and more guests using the VIP tours, making it not as VIP anymore as it once was. I guess for most people a VIP guide is just a walking FP anyway. This system is ideal for people who would like to use VIP guides but think it's too expensive or only want premium access for a handful of rides.
This system will make more premium guests happy, and make the VIP tours more exclusive again.
I wouldn't be surprised if this was implemented in the US that the price of VIP tours goes up.

I'm not saying you're wrong because I have never and will never take a VIP tour but what kind of psychopaths pay over $400 per day per person just for fast passes?

 

[justdoip]

Disney already has a sample of this with the virtual Q for ROTR … have you seen all the guests hanging around with nothing to do at Hollywood Studios?

And Chapek seems VERY enthusiastic about it. I mean, he basically said this is the direction they are going. The only question is will it just be for the biggest headliners or will it trickle down to almost everything?

 

[Karin1984]

I'm not saying you're wrong because I have never and will never take a VIP tour but what kind of psychopaths pay over $400 per day per person just for fast passes?

The person that might be limited on time. I heard that people who have their own business are a fan of VIP tours because it allows them to do more in less time. Less vacation days = less days away from the business.
Next to that, I can imagine that people also object against VIP tours because it means having a stranger be part of or present at your family memories. Also for those this is a better solution.
People who want to splurge, anniversaries, honeymoons, other special occasions.
Small groups, VIP tours get a better value if you are with a big group. If it's just two or four people, then pay per ride FP passes make more sense than a VIP tour.

 

[ATL Gator]

The posted wait times used to be calculated by guests going through the stand by line. The CM at the queue entrance would scan a card and then ask a guest entering the line to take it with them, then hand it to the last CM they see. That final CM would scan the card and it would calculate the time spent in line. This is normally done 4 to 5 times per hour. There is usually some type of buffer built in, so it may automatically add 10 minutes to the time. That buffer can be determined by management & adjusted as necessary. FP distribution & wait times are as much of an art as science!

When and why did they stop doing this? We've noticed over the last couple years that we never got handed one of those cards on a lanyard any more. We also noticed last year that whatever the posted wait time was you knocked 25% off and it was very close. Why would they not want to be as accurate as possible? I would think adding a "buffer" to the estimate would cause more grumbling.