Standby lines- before and after

[JimmyV]

But I'm seeing posts about people circling back to a ride when the SB line is shorter. So doesn't this negate the premise that Legacy FP required more zig zagging through the park than FP+?

An interesting observation. Perhaps the app has something to do with it. Before, one might have to wander around the park looking for short lines. Now, people can look at the app while in Adventureland and learn that there are short waits in Tomorrowland. They endure the same zig-zagging, but now they are doing so with a purpose and with a predictable payoff, so perhaps it seems less like meandering.

 

[Disneylover99]

Thank your for all the replies!!! Please lets just keep this thread to answering the question and not debating with each other about what THEIR experience was. There are other threads to debate on. Thank you so much!

But there needs to be debate. Otherwise we don't know always know why people feel the way they do. Maybe you should have just created a poll instead.

 

[Cormoran]

Not necessarily. Our strategy has always been to pick the low-hanging fruit in a specific radius from where we were. So if IASW was busy, we'd find something with a short wait in the same area and circle back. If there wasn't, we'd head to an area of the park with several rides on relatively short waits. So circling back doesn't have to take a lot of time. In parks with fewer rides, you obviously can't always pick an attraction in the same area with a lower wait, but there is often lots of stuff to do in the area that doesn't work on a waiting line basis -- you do some of that and check back on the line, again you are not zipping around the park in order to ride when the lines are low.

Agree, but I read a lot of posts saying that FP+ has eliminating the zig zagging throughout the parks, but I don't think this is a fair characterization. If guests want to avoid long SB waits, they may choose to go on a different attraction and then revisit or "zig zag" back to the original attraction when the SB wait is shorter.

 

[SmithSmith]

Attendance is up, so it would be difficult to pinpoint these increases as claimed to just being caused by FP+. I know folks wish to correlate the two and conclude a cause, but even basic scientific method would not permit the result to be valid without controlling for all variables. (I don't proclaim to know how one does control, but unless these sites are doing that in their analysis, their conclusions are no more or less valid than anyone else's observations.)

Just wanted to point out to everyone that there have been many times Josh at Easy WDW has said something like this when discussing wait times:

Things are pretty rough crowd wise at Magic Kingdom these days as international visitors “help” push up attendance during what is historically “the low season.” Wait times over the course of January 20th:

I don't ever recall him ever placing full blame on FP+ for increased wait times, he's always quick to point out that attendance is up and the "slow season" doesn't really exist anymore.

 

[Disneylover99]

Just wanted to point out to everyone that there have been many times Josh at Easy WDW has said something like this when discussing wait times:

Things are pretty rough crowd wise at Magic Kingdom these days as international visitors “help” push up attendance during what is historically “the low season.” Wait times over the course of January 20th:

I don't ever recall him ever placing full blame on FP+ for increased wait times, he's always quick to point out that attendance is up and the "slow season" don't really exist anymore.

I do agree that wait times are up due to increased crowds. I just don't get that some people will say increased wait times at secondary rides have nothing to do with the implementation of FP+.

 

[JimmyV]

Attendance is up, so it would be difficult to pinpoint these increases as claimed to just being caused by FP+.

Maybe the 2014 numbers will tell a different story, but as between 2012 and 2013....

• Epcot up 1.5%
• DHS up 2%
• AK up 2%

It seems difficult to imagine that these increases can account for any actual or perceived differences in wait times. (Though with massive closure of attractions at DHS, I suppose that we should be seeing a shift in line dynamics there.)

As for the MK, there was a 6% increase in attendance. But when you think about how many people are, at any one point in time, in the Be Our Guest restaurant, in line at the 7DMT, in line at Voyage of the Little Mermaid, in line to see A&E, and in line to see ETWB, it would seem that this 6% increase in attendance should have been easily absorbed by NFL such that the rest of the MK should be seeing little to no change.

 

[MrInfinity]

What I find really interesting is that people have pointed out one of the negatives about legacy was going and obtaining a FP at the attraction and then returning later to use the FP. In other words a lot of zig zagging through the parks.

But I'm seeing posts about people circling back to a ride when the SB line is shorter. So doesn't this negate the premise that Legacy FP required more zig zagging through the park than FP+?

I think you're crossing two different scenarios. In the first case, ppl are taking about secondary rides like IASW. You pass these if the line is too long. In the latter case, it's the FP- based rides of old. To get these, you had to go to them, get a ticket, and come back later. In the case of a ride like Soarin, this is a long walk depending where you are in the park, and a long walk to come back to it a second time.

People have always toured the secondary rides like this. i.e. going when the line is short enough that you're willing to wait that much. Not much has changed here.

But there needs to be debate. Otherwise we don't know always know why people feel the way they do. Maybe you should have just created a poll instead.

Agreed, debate is good, until one starts debating anothers' experience. If I post my experience with lines being about the same, that's my experience. It is pointless to come out and go nu-uh they were longer. Even if you were there at the same time. All this points to is the lines being varied... so touring smart is your best plan.

 

[Dr Gevil]

Um... Jimmy, the OP's question was: Do you feel that the wait on standby lines has increased, decreased or stayed the same since FastPass+ has been implemented?

Not sure why you're attempting to pick apart my post, as if to say ha-HA! Your opinion is wrong. It's what I feel, and that's what the OP asked. I've been in both periods. I got on about the same in both periods -- and we ride a lot. There is so much wrong in your counter, but I'm not sure that a debate between you and I is appropriate for the OP's thread which was more of a poll. We've already hashed out that you were unable to replicate several days created by several people, using FP-. So there is definitely time savings to be had there.

Do I feel lines are longer, shorter, or about the same?: About the same, but a little longer due to higher attendance. If you have a different answer, why not state your opinion instead of attempting to dismantle mine?

Mr I, you have to remember that all threads must be converted to FP+ vs FP- wars. No exceptions!

 

[Disneylover99]

Agreed, debate is good, until one starts debating anothers' experience. If I post my experience with lines being about the same, that's my experience. It is pointless to come out and go nu-uh they were longer. Even if you were there at the same time. All this points to is the lines being varied... so touring smart is your best plan.

Yes, of course. But when you give a definitive answer as to why your experience occurred.....attendance is up, or it's because of FP+, then it becomes a debate. And we've both done that.

 

[cakebaker]

But you said in a previous post that the SB line was too long on IASW so you went and rode the carousel and returned to IASW when the line was shorter. Isn't that zig zagging? Isn't that the thing you hated about Legacy?

I can't possibly give you our step by step movements on a vacation that occurred 6 months ago. What I said was we went past iasw, the line was long. We went to ride the carousel because in whatever route we going in for whatever reason, that's what we walked by next that had no line. At some point during the day we were back in the area of iasw, line was short, we rode it. We don't zigzag back and forth across the park hunting for short lines.

 

[wisblue]

But you said in a previous post that the SB line was too long on IASW so you went and rode the carousel and returned to IASW when the line was shorter. Isn't that zig zagging? Isn't that the thing you hated about Legacy?

When two things are as close together as the carousel and IASW that is not zig zagging in my book.

 

[Cormoran]

I think you're crossing two different scenarios. In the first case, ppl are taking about secondary rides like IASW. You pass these if the line is too long. In the latter case, it's the FP- based rides of old. To get these, you had to go to them, get a ticket, and come back later. In the case of a ride like Soarin, this is a long walk depending where you are in the park, and a long walk to come back to it a second time.
People have always toured the secondary rides like this. i.e. going when the line is short enough that you're willing to wait that much. Not much has changed here.

Well, based on my experience the wait times for secondary attractions before FP+ never required that I move on to a different attraction and return later. Basically, the secondary attractions always had SB times of less than 20 minutes. So with legacy, I never zig zagged throughout the parks. All I'm saying is that some of the assertions made about Legacy FP can also be applied to FP+.

 

[Planogirl]

I bet that FP+ and increased crowds might BOTH be contributing to longer wait times.

All I know is that there do seem to be longer wait times and that's good information. I would love to know the specific rides affected but I imagine that it's a little early to judge that.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I do agree that wait times are up due to increased crowds. I just don't get that some people will say increased wait times at secondary rides have nothing to do with the implementation of FP+.

That has not been claimed.
What is disputed is that the fault lies with FP+ and claims that these waits did not exist prior and this currently are due to FP+.

 

[cakebaker]

Well, based on my experience the wait times for secondary attractions before FP+ never required that I move on to a different attraction and return later. Basically, the secondary attractions always had SB times of less than 20 minutes. So with legacy, I never zig zagged throughout the parks. All I'm saying is that some of the assertions made about Legacy FP can also be applied to FP+.

Let me make sure I understand you ...

You're claiming that prior to fp+ you never, not once encountered a line longer than 20 minutes on secondary attractions?

I guess my question is, what rides do you consider secondary and at what time of year did you visit?

 

[cakebaker]

When two things are as close together as the carousel and IASW that is not zig zagging in my book.

Mine either. lol

 

[Cormoran]

When two things are as close together as the carousel and IASW that is not zig zagging in my book.

I'm glad you don't think this is zig zagging, but you are in fact showing up at a ride, realizing the standby is too long, leaving , and then returning later. It still qualifies as zig Zagging. You may find it more acceptable with FP+, but zig zagging still exists.
FP+ has created longer SB lines for secondary attractions in my experience. So if we don't have a FP for the secondary attraction and the wait time is too long IMO we have to ride something else and return later. Therefore it is the same back and forth that has always been a part of visiting a theme park.

 

[SmithSmith]

I do agree that wait times are up due to increased crowds. I just don't get that some people will say increased wait times at secondary rides have nothing to do with the implementation of FP+.

Who has claimed this?

 

[Cormoran]

Let me make sure I understand you ...

You're claiming that prior to fp+ you never, not once encountered a line longer than 20 minutes on secondary attractions?

I guess my question is, what rides do you consider secondary and at what time of year did you visit?

Toured in the beginning of December, but mostly in April and the crowd levels were always between a 4-5. Never during Spring break.
And no, to answer you question SB rides for secondary attractions were never longer than 20 minutes: HM, IASW, POTC, SE,ST.

 

[JimmyV]

I'm glad you don't think this is zig zagging, but you are in fact showing up at a ride, realizing the standby is too long, leaving , and then returning later. It still qualifies as zig Zagging. You may find it more acceptable with FP+, but zig zagging still exists.

Can't you get this straight? Zig-zagging is what people did under FP-. Now, when you pass by an attraction and find a long line and circle back to return at a later time, that is called strategic touring. If you can't see the difference, then you aren't allowed to play in this sandbox.