Sports: Deflate-Gate

[kaytieeldr]

I'm not a big fan of the automatic off-handed dismissal of any statistic by saying "There are lies, damn lies, and statistics" or "You can make stats prove anything you want", etc. Instead I think a better expression is "You can make a set of data confess to whatever you want it to... if you torture it enough!" This at least obligates the naysayer to explain how the numbers are being abused.

They explained why they they selected non-dome teams for their analysis... It's recognized that controlled indoor environments (no snow, no rain, no cold) make for fewer fumbles. It's an attempt to compare like-for-like... not exactly applying the thumbscrews in my book! And yes, the Pats run more plays, they pointed that out, which adds more interest that even with a heck of a lot more plays, they didn't cough up a ball at home this season.

But you're right, it might just be "nothing" or a mere coincidence... or it might be like back in the 90's when people noticed that some MLB players were hitting balls a heck of a lot further more often than other guys!

Yup. There's a graph on my FaceBook feed showing the correlation between autism and organic food usage. Completely invalid, but a perfect example of the bolded.

 

[kaytieeldr]

More to lighten the mood a little http://www.buzzfeed.com/tanyarayfox/10-things-that-prove-the-new-england-patriots-are-1530e?s=mobile

 

[Jellybass]

More to lighten the mood a little http://www.buzzfeed.com/tanyarayfox/10-things-that-prove-the-new-england-patriots-are-1530e?s=mobile

The funniest part of that link is their reference to Foxboro. It really is in the middle of nowhere with a 2 lane road in and out, terrible place to get out of after a game or concert.

 

[TAX GUY]

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-...piecing-it-all-together-on-deflated-footballs


We have the evidence and they've found that some of the footballs were underinflated or deflated. But to figure out the process, who's responsible, why this happened, my understanding is that it's been difficult for the league to ascertain those facts so far.


Interesting point here...

Some more information and transparency from the NFL on what they have, what they're looking for, and their process (pregame, during the game, postgame) would add critical context to the discussion at a time when personal reputations and the brand of one of its franchises are at stake. That is, unless the NFL likes the idea that talk of deflated footballs is leading national network newscasts and adds an element of drama in the build-up to Super Bowl XLIX.

 

[TAX GUY]

Interesting. Is this why the NFL has been silent so far?

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Okay so what has "come out" that is factual? The balls lost air - fact, what else? Who - when - where - how? It's like a game of Clue? Was it Brady in the locker room with a needle or was it Belichik in the office with a syringe - ooh maybe it was Stork on the sidelines & he sat on them - yep that's it.

I can't deny the fact the balls were underinflated, per the league specs. HOW they got that way is the million dollar question. Honestly, if Belichick gave the order or Brady gave the order, it still wouldn't bother me. They're my home team and I'll still like them. If it was Manning or Harbaugh or Rex Ryan, I'd call for their heads! This will have little to no impact on Pats fans.

Brady and Belichick are already labeled in the league. IF they had any part of it, it won't change anything for either one of them, other than giving those that already hate them something else to reference in the future.

My original post was that if cheating took place, "They would have won anyway" is not a defense.

I have no idea if cheating took place.

But 2psi is an awful lot to lose on 11 balls in a consistent manner.
And as more comes out in this silly discussion, the person crowing that they would have won anyway now seems interested in the mystery if who the balls got that way.

What happened?
No idea.

But if it was cheating, doesn't matter if the outcome would have been the same.

Take other sports like any in the Olympics. Performance enhancing drugs are banned and certain medications are banned. An athlete taking them *may* have won anyway. But since they won doing something prohibited, there is no way to guarantee the outcome would have been the same. Because the sport was not played following the rules.

I look forward for the SNL sketch that is produced from this debacle.

 

[leebee]

I'm starting to find all this ball talk funny. It was pretty hilarious when Brady said something like (can't remember exactly) " some guys like old balls".
Immature, yes but seriously all this talk about feeling and handling balls...

Yeah, I'm waiting to see what Saturday Night Live does with all this! I'm sure it'll be a hoot!
I also loved the backdrop to Brady's press conference: "Gilette's FLEXBALL"! Really? Don't they have media specialists or someone who should have noticed that??

 

[MickeySP]

More to lighten the mood a little http://www.buzzfeed.com/tanyarayfox/10-things-that-prove-the-new-england-patriots-are-1530e?s=mobile

I especially like that we broke Peyton

 

[TAX GUY]

Its been resolved!!!!!!!! Colts OVER inflated and the cooler temps caused drops in the PSI..


http://nesn.com/2015/01/boston-college-professor-weather-had-to-play-role-in-deflategate/

A natural decrease in temperature would have caused the New England Patriots’ footballs to become under-inflated Sunday, a Boston College physics professor says.

Michael Naughton, chair of the physics department at BC, said in a press release “it’s not possible for weather not to have played a role” in the DeflateGate controversy. He claimed footballs always lose or gain pressure depending on the conditions.

“Say you inflate the ball to 12.5 PSI — the NFL minimum — in a room at 70 degrees, and then used the ball outside where it was 50 degrees. That 12.5 PSI would eventually become 11.5 PSI,” Naughton said. “If you inflate the ball to 12.5 PSI in an even warmer room where it was, say, 80 degrees, and then played outdoors at 40 degrees, that 12.5 PSI would become 10.5 PSI — a drop of two PSIs.”

The temperature at kickoff Sunday in Foxboro, Mass., hovered around 50 degrees — not very cold, but presumably colder than the room in which the balls were inflated and checked by officials two hours before the game.

As for the Colts’ footballs being within the legal PSI range, Naughton has an easy explanation for that, too: If those balls were more inflated to begin with (maybe even above the legal maximum), they could have lost air pressure and still stayed above the minimum.

By the way, don’t accuse Naughton of being a homer, either: He’s a Buffalo Bills fan, according to the release, which means he’s also an expert in things falling under pressure in big games.

 

[lustergirl]

You do realize this is the DIS and at no time will reality/facts affect the opinions posted.

Thanks. I almost forgot

 

[lustergirl]

Nice Speaking of his royal highness, does anyone know how his arm is doing?

 

[undertheradar]

Its been resolved!!!!!!!! Colts OVER inflated and the cooler temps caused drops in the PSI..


http://nesn.com/2015/01/boston-college-professor-weather-had-to-play-role-in-deflategate/

A natural decrease in temperature would have caused the New England Patriots’ footballs to become under-inflated Sunday, a Boston College physics professor says.

Michael Naughton, chair of the physics department at BC, said in a press release “it’s not possible for weather not to have played a role” in the DeflateGate controversy. He claimed footballs always lose or gain pressure depending on the conditions.

“Say you inflate the ball to 12.5 PSI — the NFL minimum — in a room at 70 degrees, and then used the ball outside where it was 50 degrees. That 12.5 PSI would eventually become 11.5 PSI,” Naughton said. “If you inflate the ball to 12.5 PSI in an even warmer room where it was, say, 80 degrees, and then played outdoors at 40 degrees, that 12.5 PSI would become 10.5 PSI — a drop of two PSIs.”

The temperature at kickoff Sunday in Foxboro, Mass., hovered around 50 degrees — not very cold, but presumably colder than the room in which the balls were inflated and checked by officials two hours before the game.

As for the Colts’ footballs being within the legal PSI range, Naughton has an easy explanation for that, too: If those balls were more inflated to begin with (maybe even above the legal maximum), they could have lost air pressure and still stayed above the minimum.

By the way, don’t accuse Naughton of being a homer, either: He’s a Buffalo Bills fan, according to the release, which means he’s also an expert in things falling under pressure in big games.

Guess the NFL VP, the special attorney hired to investigate, and the forensics investigation specialists just hired by the NFL can all stop the investigation. Wonder why the loss of psi doesn't occur as rapidly in other stadiums, be they pro, college, high school or youth ball?

 

[bcla]

Guess the NFL VP, the special attorney hired to investigate, and the forensics investigation specialists just hired by the NFL can all stop the investigation. Wonder why the loss of psi doesn't occur as rapidly in other stadiums, be they pro, college, high school or youth ball?

I've read different numbers. One claim by a professor was that a 2 PSI difference could be explained if they were inflated at 70 deg F and then checked again at 11 deg F. If anything, it should have been maybe a 0.6 PSI difference, and I'm not even sure that typical gauges can measure that precisely.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Guess the NFL VP, the special attorney hired to investigate, and the forensics investigation specialists just hired by the NFL can all stop the investigation. Wonder why the loss of psi doesn't occur as rapidly in other stadiums, be they pro, college, high school or youth ball?

And, it only happens to 11 out of 12 balls?

 

[BlovesC]

Nice Speaking of his royal highness, does anyone know how his arm is doing?

He's sore but 100% expected to play in the SB, along with Thomas.

 

[Hrhpd]

He's sore but 100% expected to play in the SB, along with Thomas.

I just got a news feed that due to the injury, his play is going to be limited.

 

[BlovesC]

I just got a news feed that due to the injury, his play is going to be limited.

That's not what Pete Carroll said in today's press conference. And although I'd expect him to not be back at 100%, I doubt they'll admit to that before the game.

 

[NFLDERS]

And, it only happens to 11 out of 12 balls?

That ball was huddled no maybe, cuddled by all the others.

A..men this de-ballcle is hopefully solved (by scientific explanation); now I for one can enjoy the superbowl.

 

[TAX GUY]

And the plot thickens. Belichick and most of the rest of the world seem to have had enough of the allegations that they intentionally deflated the balls and tried to gain some advantage.

 

[TAX GUY]

Guess the NFL VP, the special attorney hired to investigate, and the forensics investigation specialists just hired by the NFL can all stop the investigation. Wonder why the loss of psi doesn't occur as rapidly in other stadiums, be they pro, college, high school or youth ball?

Perhaps they should so they don't continue to waste their time. Then again, because of the way this story has been blown out of proportion and catapulted as the top news story, they have no other options but to exhaust all avenues. I'm confident they won't fine anything that proves they had anything to do with it.