So frustrated right now - school start date change

[maxiesmom]

I'm fairly certain that most posters would prefer to keep their children in school. I just don't think it's unreasonable to expect a school year calendar at least six months in advance.

I don't think I would say it is unreasonable either. But past performance is a good indicator of future results. Has the school typically put out their calender 4/6/8 months in advance? If not, then it is unreasonable to suddenly expect them to to accommodate your (in general) needs. Trust me, I get what a pain it is to try and plan around school schedules. I've tried to plan a trip with my sister and her family when there was ONE week the whole year all 3 kids were free. ONE. Even over Christmas there were sports expectations.

 

[Disneylover99]

I don't think I would say it is unreasonable either. But past performance is a good indicator of future results. Has the school typically put out their calender 4/6/8 months in advance? If not, then it is unreasonable to suddenly expect them to to accommodate your (in general) needs. Trust me, I get what a pain it is to try and plan around school schedules. I've tried to plan a trip with my sister and her family when there was ONE week the whole year all 3 kids were free. ONE. Even over Christmas there were sports expectations.

Exactly. And that's why it's not unreasonable to think school shouldn't happen before labour day, if it typically starts after labour day every year. The problem is, many people still won't know for sure for another month or two.

 

[sam_gordon]

I don't think I would say it is unreasonable either. But past performance is a good indicator of future results. Has the school typically put out their calender 4/6/8 months in advance? If not, then it is unreasonable to suddenly expect them to to accommodate your (in general) needs. Trust me, I get what a pain it is to try and plan around school schedules. I've tried to plan a trip with my sister and her family when there was ONE week the whole year all 3 kids were free. ONE. Even over Christmas there were sports expectations.

But who is EXPECTING the schools to change the way they're doing things? Those of us complaining think they SHOULD change, but that doesn't mean we expect them to.

 

[Colleen27]

And I get that but you (general you) can still manage to plan a vacation that you can afford if your school calender comes out in July. If your kids aren't missing school then (I assume) the first long break they have is Thanksgiving or Christmas, so you could still plan a vacation then if you get your schedule as late as July.

Sure, but then you're going from value season with great discounts in late Aug to rack rate at peak season over a holiday break. That's a huge cost difference on just about every element of the trip. Not having the calendar sooner is what makes that difference - if the calendar is out, you can plan for those late Aug dates (at least those of us in the later-starting north can). If it isn't, and you err on the side of caution as some posters here insist all parents should do, you're limiting yourself to the most expensive times to travel.

Well, to be fair, this is a Disney board and a Disney vacation takes a lot of planning. DVC rooms are usually booked somewhere around 11 months out, or 7 months for a shot at a non-home resort. My vacation is in 6 months or so and the types of rooms I booked are no longer available. If I waited for the school to get its calendar out, there would be nothing left.

I think the "only Disney" argument is vastly overstated. As I mentioned earlier, some of the Michigan accommodations we wanted for our August vacation were booked solid when I started planning our vacation in January. We're a family of five and when you get away from major markets the options for larger families are pretty slim to begin with, so without planning well in advance it isn't unusual to run into difficulty finding suitable accommodations. I could book a last-minute weekend in a major city, no problem - all the big chains have their mini-suite lines that work for us - but when you're going to an area with only a handful of hotels, half of which might have a handful of rooms large enough for five, you need to plan ahead.

And that doesn't touch airfare costs. For domestic airfare you can do pretty well on shorter notice - the "sweet spot" for booking Detroit or Flint to Orlando is 6-8 weeks in advance in my experience - but for overseas travel the recommendations are for much longer lead times. CheapAir's survey of European flights puts that "sweet spot" at 8-10 months in advance, and says that after the 7 month mark fares rise rapidly.

But who is EXPECTING the schools to change the way they're doing things? Those of us complaining think they SHOULD change, but that doesn't mean we expect them to.

Exactly. I know our schools WON'T change. They used to put the calendars out in batches of several years at a time, and they did so well in advance. When DS started K (11 years ago) I went on the school site and looked over 3 years' worth of calendars, penciling in the best times to vacation that minimized missed school while working around DH's schedule and our financial limitations. Now they handle contracts on a year-to-year basis and can't publish the schedule until that process is complete... A few years ago, it was very early in the year (Jan or Feb) and not so bad, then it crept later and later until now it usually comes in June. I wish they'd go back to the old way but they claim they can't because of uncertainty in state funding, this year's potential to start the school year without a finalized schedule being a rather extreme illustration of the "new normal". But I do think it is unreasonable to simultaneously delay the release of the calendar further and further into the year and more strongly discourage missed school days for vacation, which is the combo we're seeing in our district. I can better deal with the short notice from the private schools my girls attend because they have more flexible absence/vacation policies so planning around their schedules isn't as essential.

 

[*NikkiBell*]

Schools set the calendars once the budget is finalized and appropriate measures are taken. In my opinion, I think that five months is enough of advanced notice.

When it comes to the classroom, I can assure you that things are never the same in terms of making work up as the same level of experience and understanding won't be there. As for the first week of school, I agree with the others who said that it is very important. I've had students miss it, and they struggled to get acclimated after they came back. I would reschedule or cancel the trip if I were you.

 

[clori]

Without an official school calendar most of the schedule is still known. This year the start is tricky since I don't know if we are starting the last week of August as usual or the Tuesday before Labor Day as usual which happens to fall in September. For vacation purposes I'm going with the last Tuesday in August. The end date is never really determined until the snow days end so June is tricky. The other vacation times are pretty well set such as the days from Dec 24th to Jan 1st, President's Day week in February, and Patriot's Day/Marathon week in April.

What can change is when teacher workshop days are. We always have 3 but the high school and k-8 schools may not match up (and now I have one child at both levels). k-8 had election days off for teacher workshop days since they are used for polling. Over time religious holidays off can change (they have here). Also our calendar is subject to approval by the teacher's union and they won't approve more than 1 year at a time even though it is pretty much the same most years.

If we plan a vacation that doesn't involve flying and a hotel with 24 hour cancellation we will chance the last week of June which was an awesome week for Niagara Falls Canada when we went. If we are flying I'm a bit more cautious in scheduling vacation time.

 

[Styx Fan]

Reading these wacky calendar situations makes me even more glad than I was that Michigan passed a new law a few years ago. By law, public schools in MI cannot begin the new year before Labor Day. Back in the stone age when I students (class of '82), school always started the day after Labor Day. But when my son started (he is a senior) I found out things had changed and we went back the end of August. I always hated it. The law was actually passed to help protect MI tourism. The northern parts of the state are a wonderful place to vacation, but the season is short. Normally, I wouldn't like a law that was made favoring business over students, but the kids end up in school the same number of days and we always know when school will start

 

[kaytieeldr]

Getting the calendar out early costs the school NOTHING. Getting the calendar out late costs us money. How it is that you don't consider this worthy of a rant on a discussion board is a mystery to me.

Edit: just checked our favorite beach destination & the first week of August is $85 per night cheaper than the 3rd week of July. Personally, if the latter date is a date we CAN be off, I would like to know. As is, I'm stuck paying the $85/night "insurance policy" by booking the earlier date so I can avoid an issue with the school. I can't speak for you, but I find no value in just giving money away that I may or may not need to spend.

When does school start now, and what is it about that date that makes you even consider that school could start earlier? If your schools start in mid-August - like it sounds - clearly they don't allow Labor Day to affect that.

 

[Colleen27]

Without an official school calendar most of the schedule is still known. This year the start is tricky since I don't know if we are starting the last week of August as usual or the Tuesday before Labor Day as usual which happens to fall in September. For vacation purposes I'm going with the last Tuesday in August. The end date is never really determined until the snow days end so June is tricky. The other vacation times are pretty well set such as the days from Dec 24th to Jan 1st, President's Day week in February, and Patriot's Day/Marathon week in April.

Ours is unfortunately not that predictable. For decades the first weekend of deer season was a long weekend, but that isn't a given any more; the teacher inservice that used to justify it roams a bit now, sometimes giving us a random long weekend in Oct and sometimes falling in early Nov. Thanksgiving break, over the last 10 years, has been just Thurs & Friday some years and a full week in others. President's Day has been anything from a 3 to 5 day weekend. Spring break is sometimes the week before Easter, sometimes the week after, and sometimes unrelated to Easter (with Easter being a separate 3 day weekend). Christmas break is the only one that doesn't show much variation, though if the holidays fall mid-week it is anyone's guess when the start/finish will be. Sometimes it feels like they don't want to let breaks get too set because then parents will have the expectation of having certain times off and be upset if the next iteration of the calendar takes those days away.

For the public schools, the start date is really the only thing that is fixed from year to year because of the law requiring a post Labor Day start. For the private schools, the religious-based breaks (spring break is always the Friday of & week after Easter) are fixed but the others shift around depending on when the year starts because they like to align minor breaks with ends of quarters.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

When does school start now, and what is it about that date that makes you even consider that school could start earlier? If your schools start in mid-August - like it sounds - clearly they don't allow Labor Day to affect that.

I don't know when this year's start date is. This past year it was 08/21 IIRC. But, it floats forward & back by several days from year to year.

I wouldn't say Labor Day has no effect though. We always get a week + in before Labor Day. In years when Labor Day is very late, they may push start date back a few days. Or, they may not. It seems pretty random.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Schools set the calendars once the budget is finalized and appropriate measures are taken. In my opinion, I think that five months is enough of advanced notice.

When it comes to the classroom, I can assure you that things are never the same in terms of making work up as the same level of experience and understanding won't be there. As for the first week of school, I agree with the others who said that it is very important. I've had students miss it, and they struggled to get acclimated after they came back. I would reschedule or cancel the trip if I were you.

I think using the budget as an excuse is just that - an excuse. They know many years in advance exactly how many instruction days & how many workshop days are in each & every school year. The start date has no impact on the budget.

 

[allison443]

OP says their start date has flipped flopped over the past five years between starting before and starting after labor day (so it was always a real possibility of school conflicts, especially with such a late labor day this year)...and apparently these dates are the only dates that can work because of cost...so even if the school calendar was out and you had known that this year's start date was pre-labor day, what would you have done then?
(1) booked the bounce back dates anyway and have your kids miss school? or
(2) booked an earlier higher cost trip to be finished before school starts? or
(3) not taken your trip this year at all, since other times are too expensive?
That will probably be a good predicter of what your decision will be (take the trip, reschedule, or cancel)

I'm sure you will make the right decision for your family!

 

[the guardian]

This might have already been mentioned but, if you are talking about missing 4 days of school (not to mention the first 4 days of school), why not take 5 days off and go later in the value season.

 

[*NikkiBell*]

I think using the budget as an excuse is just that - an excuse. They know many years in advance exactly how many instruction days & how many workshop days are in each & every school year. The start date has no impact on the budget.

Incorrect.

They can not announce a full calendar without building in professional development days which rely on funds and state requirements. For example, the roll out of the new PARCC test required a certain amount of training. This could not be scheduled until the state department gave each district the specifics; unfortunately, that doesn't always happen as quickly as some may deem feasible. Similarly, the budget is needed to fund professional development opportunities and days as well as programs which affect the calendar.

In addition, parent-teacher conferences and holidays need to be scheduled. This cannot always be done based off of the previous year's calendar. Many factors go into this including busing. Some districts share buses to cut down on costs; if one declares a day off and the other doesn't, there is a major issue. Negotiating this has to happen as a result. I can imagine a thread posted right here with people complaining about a calendar that did not have information about holidays, conference schedules, etc. You can't have it both ways.

Personally, I'm stunned that so many people are upset with the school, a place that is responsible for educating children, because it is cutting into potential vacation time. I'd think that education would be first.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

Incorrect.

They can not announce a full calendar without building in professional development days which rely on funds and state requirements. For example, the roll out of the new PARCC test required a certain amount of training. This could not be scheduled until the state department gave each district the specifics; unfortunately, that doesn't always happen as quickly as some may deem feasible. Similarly, the budget is needed to fund professional development opportunities and days as well as programs which affect the calendar.

In addition, parent-teacher conferences and holidays need to be scheduled. This cannot always be done based off of the previous year's calendar. Many factors go into this including busing. Some districts share buses to cut down on costs; if one declares a day off and the other doesn't, there is a major issue. Negotiating this has to happen as a result. I can imagine a thread posted right here with people complaining about a calendar that did not have information about holidays, conference schedules, etc. You can't have it both ways.

Personally, I'm stunned that so many people are upset with the school, a place that is responsible for educating children, because it is cutting into potential vacation time. I'd think that education would be first.

Our district knows the # of those days well in advance. The only variables are things like:

*Length of Spring Break - if there is one
*Length & start date of Christmas break
*Number of extra days (if any) tacked onto development days

The 3 "possible" calendars were sent to staff many months ago & there is zero variation on # & dates of the development days.

Now, some years the start date is the same in all 3 "possibles". Some years (this being one), there are at least 2 possible start dates & they can be as much as a week apart.

Side note: the staff votes on the 3 calendars & every year when the new calendar is published, nobody can find anyone who actually voted for the version that ended up approved LOL

 

[msjprincess]

I feel your pain. We have never started school before Labor Day. Our calendar came out last month and we were starting the day after Labor day. Then last week they changed it and we are now staring the week before Labor Day. We already have a trip booked for that week.

They should be able to release a tentative schedule way in advance and not wait until after people have already made plans and bought nonrefundable plane tickets.

 

[ReneeA]

I'd be upset, too. We live in Michigan & my kids go to public schools, so we always start after Labor Day per state law. Since 2005, we've gone on vacation every year the last week of August through Labor Day. There's a few reason that's our week to go - the biggest being DH's work is typically slower and he can get a week off. We normally go to WDW that week annually, and it's a great time to go - lower crowds, really good deals to be had, and it's the beginning of value season, so typically not much is under refurbishment.

I have one kid who really struggles in school and one that doesn't, so I wouldn't have them skip because I know it'd be hard for one to catch up. If not, I would consider pulling them out for a few days...we've never done it in the past, but I might think about out in your case.

 

[havaneselover]

Reading these wacky calendar situations makes me even more glad than I was that Michigan passed a new law a few years ago. By law, public schools in MI cannot begin the new year before Labor Day. Back in the stone age when I students (class of '82), school always started the day after Labor Day. But when my son started (he is a senior) I found out things had changed and we went back the end of August. I always hated it. The law was actually passed to help protect MI tourism. The northern parts of the state are a wonderful place to vacation, but the season is short. Normally, I wouldn't like a law that was made favoring business over students, but the kids end up in school the same number of days and we always know when school will start

Virginia is the same way. I like the predictability.

We spend the week before Labor Day in Petoskey. It's a long drive so the extra day off is a huge help. But honestly Northern Michigan seems deserted by that point and my parents (who live there) say how most people have already left for the summer.

 

[mnrose]

I just checked our district's calendar, and the calendar for 2015-16 will NOT be available until early April, as it is every year. Obviously, we know when this year ends, but we don't know for sure when next year begins....by law, schools generally start after labor day, but a district can apply for an exception to that based on a number of factors. We planned our summer vacation for a time we KNOW we will be off. I've left "free" the last full week in August precisely because it is possible, if not probable given how "late" Labor Day is this year, that we would start early. Better safe than sorry. I NEVER plan for spring break until the calendar is out. That is way too risky, IMO.

I would NOT want my kids to miss the first days of school after elementary school. Heck, my DD (9th grader) is loathe to miss a class even for a doctor's appointment. Too much happens in class to miss more than you absolutely have to. For me, a vacation is NOT that reason once they reach the age of middle/high school level course work.

 

[msjprincess]

I just checked our district's calendar, and the calendar for 2015-16 will NOT be available until early April, as it is every year. Obviously, we know when this year ends, but we don't know for sure when next year begins....by law, schools generally start after labor day, but a district can apply for an exception to that based on a number of factors. We planned our summer vacation for a time we KNOW we will be off. I've left "free" the last full week in August precisely because it is possible, if not probable given how "late" Labor Day is this year, that we would start early. Better safe than sorry. I NEVER plan for spring break until the calendar is out. That is way too risky, IMO.

I would NOT want my kids to miss the first days of school after elementary school. Heck, my DD (9th grader) is loathe to miss a class even for a doctor's appointment. Too much happens in class to miss more than you absolutely have to. For me, a vacation is NOT that reason once they reach the age of middle/high school level course work.

I can't speak for the OP. But the reason I picked that week's vacation is school has never started before Labor Day here in the 50 years I've been alive. We always go on vacation the week before Labor Day. It never crossed my mind that school would be starting the week before Labor Day. Labor Day was also on 9/7 in 2009 and we started school on Tuesday 9/8.