Should churches change security in wake of recent events?

[Wishing on a star]

I will agree.... I think most everyone would.
However, that still leaves a lot of leeway, because I do strongly believe in our right to bear arms.

If a person is deemed to much of a risk to just go out and buy weapons on their own, due to some level of insanity, they will still be able to find a way to do evil.

The thing is... Guns aren't the problem
Hatred, evil in the human heart, that is the problem.

 

[LYSE]

Doesn't everyone agree that people who are certifiably insane shouldn't have access to guns?

Yes, and you won't find anywhere in the US that allows certifiably insane people to legally own firearms.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

What about security in churches? If you attend church, has yours done anything for added security? Any cameras, monitoring of doors, or employing security guards? Because as it stands right now, ours is a security nightmare...as in there is absolutely no prevention in place, and all the parishioners sit with their backs to the entrances.

I don't know if the church I used to go to has done any more security measures but it is one that has a school attached to it. While that church did have money when I last attended (their school and church cost over $1million) I don't know what the numbers of attendees and if it is in their ability or desire nowadays to implement security measures such as security guards and metal detectors that have been mentioned in this thread.

I def. understand your concern as it does appear what we hear more and more about is incidents at churches but I honestly don't know that it's feasible to do this to every church everywhere in the nation. I mean did anyone think a small church in TX would have this occur to them? Doubtful. So then do we do this to all the thousands of churches out there?

 

[EveDallas]

Iceland has 336,000 people are as opposed to 324 million in the US. Canada has 35 million to our 324 million. Ireland - 5 million. England - 63 million. It stands to reason that the more people in a country, the greater the chance for violence. It doesn't mean that we're a bunch of trigger happy yokels waiting to pounce.

 

[SaintsManiac]

Shooter is Devon Patrick Kelly, age 26. Church members say he was an ex marine known to the congregation and a recent convert to Islam. A "manifesto" he wrote is now appearing in social media.

Fake news

 

[jalapeno_pretzel]

Isn't the United States one of the safest countries in the world? As long as you don't drive too much it is pretty safe.

Actually it's ranked #55 on one list I see, and doesn't make the top 25 on any I found. So, tons of places more safe to enjoy!

 

[NYCgrrl]

No talk, but an interesting and accurate graphic that suggests the mere presence of firearms is not the issue.

The reason so many Swiss have guns is rooted in their history. The Swiss have a smaller standing army (and a mountain that open up and jets fly out of it. Really!) and all male citizens are required to serve in the military for about 20 years; women can join voluntarily. They keep their registered guns and uniforms (but not ammo) at home so they can join up for 2-3 months every year. Someone is always being deployed every weekend and someone is always coming back home. The Swiss also have to register any TVs and radios they have as an aside. Lived there for almost 3 years and it was interesting. My best friend's husband is a tank commander and unfortunately she and I giggle every time it's mentioned. OK truth be known even he has a sheepish smile when the topic comes up.

 

[neverlandsky]

T&Ps. Breaks my already heavy heart to hear this again and again.

As far as what to do: Retail/grocery is going towards more eCommerce. Schools are already going virtual. Movies are being released digitally within 90 days of theater release. Churches will go more virtual before any anything is done with gun control. Security unfortunately is too expensive for churches. Where virtual streaming of services will be more economical. Unfortunately, no amount of gun control will not stop a person's free will to do harm. We're already seeing it with vehicles.

 

[jalapeno_pretzel]

Iceland has 336,000 people are as opposed to 324 million in the US. Canada has 35 million to our 324 million. Ireland - 5 million. England - 63 million. It stands to reason that the more people in a country, the greater the chance for violence. It doesn't mean that we're a bunch of trigger happy yokels waiting to pounce.

Homicide / crime statistics are done on a Per Capita basis, meaning they equalize the population. So, for every 1000 people, there are X number of homicides, X number of muggings, etc. This makes the comparison relevant.

 

[bcla]

Iceland has 336,000 people are as opposed to 324 million in the US. Canada has 35 million to our 324 million. Ireland - 5 million. England - 63 million. It stands to reason that the more people in a country, the greater the chance for violence. It doesn't mean that we're a bunch of trigger happy yokels waiting to pounce.

The crime numbers are generally mentioned per capita, and Iceland's crime rate is extremely low. There's also population density and Iceland is near the bottom. However, so is Canada's, but that's more a matter of a few people living in extremely cold areas.

 

[AustinMommyofThree]

Homicide / crime statistics are done on a Per Capita basis, meaning they equalize the population. So, for every 1000 people, there are X number of homicides, X number of muggings, etc. This makes the comparison relevant.

Thank you for pointing out what I'd always assumed was obvious.

 

[mom2rtk]

Actually it's ranked #55 on one list I see, and doesn't make the top 25 on any I found. So, tons of places more safe to enjoy!

I wonder what the rate would be if corrected for people who don't frequent gang infested neighborhoods.

 

[jalapeno_pretzel]

Isn't the United States one of the safest countries in the world? As long as you don't drive too much it is pretty safe.

And, don't get me wrong, it's not like I'm scared of the US ... I live here after all, and have no plans to change that. I want to travel internationally anyway, it's long overdue. The crime / homicide / random gun violence statistics are just one more tick mark in favor of doing that.

 

[Hikergirl]

Doesn't everyone agree that people who are certifiably insane shouldn't have access to guns?

I'm sure they do, but since I'm not a mind reader I have no idea if that is what the pp meant.

 

[AustinMommyofThree]

I wonder what the rate would be if corrected for people who don't frequent gang infested neighborhoods.

I think it stands to reason that if you remove dangerous areas from any nation's statistics, it's going to be safer, but you would then need to do the same thing for other nations (take the drug turf wars out of Mexico's calculations and it's a remarkably safe nation). But considering that more than 5% of a small town's population was murdered today, and nearly 60 people were killed in what is considered a very safe area of Las Vegas a few weeks ago, and Sandy Hook Elementary School is in a profoundly safe community, and Aurora, Colorado is an upscale suburb that is hardly "gang infested," it's fair to say that no place in this country is immune to violence.

 

[Owlpost23]

You take risk no matter what you do. There is no way to safe to guard every move you make. you can't there is no way.

Gee,other countries sure manage.

 

[mom2rtk]

I think it stands to reason that if you remove dangerous areas from any nation's statistics, it's going to be safer, but you would then need to do the same thing for other nations (take the drug turf wars out of Mexico's calculations and it's a remarkably safe nation). But considering that more than 5% of a small town's population was murdered today, and nearly 60 people were killed in what is considered a very safe area of Las Vegas a few weeks ago, and Sandy Hook Elementary School is in a profoundly safe community, and Aurora, Colorado is an upscale suburb that is hardly "gang infested," it's fair to say that no place in this country is immune to violence.

I'm not saying violence is exclusive to the rough neighborhoods. Just not to the scale those listed incidents seem to make you believe, especially when compared with the huge total population of our country.

And sure other countries have troubled areas. But I'd sure like to see that all quantified. I don't think you can make blanket statements without correcting for that factor. Across the board.

 

[wgeo]

I will agree.... I think most everyone would.
However, that still leaves a lot of leeway, because I do strongly believe in our right to bear arms.

If a person is deemed to much of a risk to just go out and buy weapons on their own, due to some level of insanity, they will still be able to find a way to do evil.

The thing is... Guns aren't the problem
Hatred, evil in the human heart, that is the problem.

But let's look at car accidents the same way.

Cars aren't really the problem, it's the drivers that are the problem.

But yet we still do things - we try to make cars safer, if people are convicted of drunk driving we take away their driver's license. And yes, some people drive without a license -but that doesn't mean we quit trying to stop them.


Guns are ONE part of the bigger problem, and they should be looked at just like every other part of the problem to see what we could do to help.

 

[Mizzoufan]

Gee,other countries sure manage.

no country can safe guard for everything.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Part of it is that in general, the US is safe and the vast majority of people don't really have concerns about being victims of violent crime. In countries like Yemen or Iraq, I'm pretty sure that people are numb to this sort of thing and just kind of accept that it happens.

These high-profile events basically just pop the bubble. There's always the potential for this sort of thing because we feel it's generally safe enough that we don't worry too hard about it.

I do agree with that. I was also speaking, in relation to my where you live in the U.S. comment, in regards to the political make up, to an extent the history of that area, the citizens' views, etc. not just incidents of crime because all those things can impact when speaking about gun issues. It's why the us vs them...doesn't work towards all. There are 50 states in the U.S. all with different laws including different gun laws, different make ups of their citizens, different political environments, different issues, etc.

Heck my metro encompasses two different states and the laws aren't the exact same in each state, each state is also of a different overall political make up and each state also has its own issues they have.