Should a religious song be banned from a school talent show?

[Rock'n Robin]

I know for a fact that some kids who do go to church regularly are afraid to say so because the "cool" people either don't go or won't admit it. Luckily that is where I work. Where I live, we have a very active youth group and a well attended midweek youth service, and some of the "coolest" kids in the HS go to church and volunteer regularly, so there is no stigma about it here.
Robin M.

 

[momof2inPA]

I'm too lazy to read all the posts, but a talent show is for entertainment, not education. If the second grade girl knows that difficultly worded song the whole way through, she should be proud of her talent and allowed to show it off at the school talent show.

My son is in second grade, and he's lucky if he knows any song the entire way through, so this might very well be the only or one of just a couple songs the girl knows. Since she's in the choir at church, she might only know religious songs. I think the principal is being pretty mean. The kid is in second grade for heaven's sake. Trust me, after the song has been sung, the other second graders will not be contemplating its deep meaning, they will be deciding whether or not their classmate had a good voice.

 

[Chuck S]

Assuming this is "talent contest" with prizes and 1st, 2nd, 3rd place rankings etc...and it is being held on school property as a school sponsored extra-curricular activity then I think a religious song would be inappropriate. But, for the sake of arguement, supposed the song was allowed. And also suppose that the girl won the talent contest...how do you know the judges were actually rewarding the girl for her vocal skills or perhaps the judges also shared the girls religious beliefs and gave her the award because of the song she selected to make a statement to "put God back in school"...

How could you be guaranteed that wouldn't happen? By not allowing her to sing a religious song.

 

[momof2inPA]

And also suppose that the girl won the talent contest...how do you know the judges were actually rewarding the girl for her vocal skills or perhaps the judges also shared the girls religious beliefs and gave her the award because of the song she selected to make a statement to "put God back in school"...

How could you be guaranteed that wouldn't happen? By not allowing her to sing a religious song.

Everyone there would know if the kid was a good singer or not. It's second grade.

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

Assuming this is "talent contest" with prizes and 1st, 2nd, 3rd place rankings etc...and it is being held on school property as a school sponsored extra-curricular activity then I think a religious song would be inappropriate. But, for the sake of arguement, supposed the song was allowed. And also suppose that the girl won the talent contest...how do you know the judges were actually rewarding the girl for her vocal skills or perhaps the judges also shared the girls religious beliefs and gave her the award because of the song she selected to make a statement to "put God back in school"...

How could you be guaranteed that wouldn't happen? By not allowing her to sing a religious song.

A judge could reward her because she picked a song that the judge's mom sung to him when he was little and still cherishes. You have to trust the judges no matter what songs are song.

 

[Aidensmom]

Assuming this is "talent contest" with prizes and 1st, 2nd, 3rd place rankings etc...and it is being held on school property as a school sponsored extra-curricular activity then I think a religious song would be inappropriate. But, for the sake of arguement, supposed the song was allowed. And also suppose that the girl won the talent contest...how do you know the judges were actually rewarding the girl for her vocal skills or perhaps the judges also shared the girls religious beliefs and gave her the award because of the song she selected to make a statement to "put God back in school"...

How could you be guaranteed that wouldn't happen? By not allowing her to sing a religious song.

On what planet would a second grader winning a school talent contest "put God back in school?"

 

[rcyannacci]

Well, I guess it's obvious that the schools are going to be our political battlegrounds for the foreseeable future...

OK, a few days ago, septbride2000 posted a thread about a school newspaper that was censored from publishing an article with interviews from gay students. In this case, as I remember, most of the conservative posters said that it was the principle's decision and we shouldn't question his right to make decisions as he say fit regarding the wellfare of his school.

So, why isn't this principle being given the same consideration here?


Personally, I'd be fine with the girl singing the song. It's what she chose to express herself, it's not part of the school curriculum, it's fine (terrible song, IMO, but if that's the way she wants her school colleagues to know her, fine. She'll have to deal with the aftereffects. Kids are brutal when it comes to talent shows...one kid in our school sang something from "Oliver!" and he never lived it down). So, just as I supported the rights of the lesbian/gay students to tell their stories in their school newspaper, I support this girls decision to sing the song she feels best expresses herself.

As the OP mentioned before, music is an art, and if schools are going to censor all religious art to cover their butts, then students will be the poorer for it. A good portion of the Western canon of art is made up of masterworks with religious subject matter. I think we are selling both students and teachers short when we assume they can't study this type of material without it becoming a sermon.

Essentially, I think certain political elements have raised religious debate to such a fevered pitch recently, that reasonable responses to such situations have been thrown out the window.

 

[Chuck S]

Everyone there would know if the kid was a good singer or not. It's second grade.

Of course everyone would know...but what would that change if the judges awarded her the prize? Would a majority of parents say "That kid shouldn't have won?" Would you take the prize away from an 8 yo after it was awarded?

 

[6_Time_Momma]

I think it is pretty ridiculous to not have allowed her to sing the song.

 

[Chuck S]

On what planet would a second grader winning a school talent contest "put God back in school?"

How about in the Deep South? It certainly would be promoted as doing such on conservative websites, just as NOT allowing her do sing it seems to be offending some folks on this board saying there is NOT a seperation between church and state.

After all, her parents hav filed a lawsuit to ALLOW her to sing it, if it is "just a school talent show" then why couldn't she have chosen another song? They are being represented by a conservative legal group with an agenda.

 

[chadfromdallas]

OK, a few days ago, septbride2000 posted a thread about a school newspaper that was censored from publishing an article with interviews from gay students. In this case, as I remember, most of the conservative posters said that it was the principle's decision and we shouldn't question his right to make decisions as he say fit regarding the wellfare of his school.

So, why isn't this principle being given the same consideration here?.

Ah ha! This is what I mentioned in one of my other posts. I wasn't sure what exactly it was about, but remembered it involved high school students!

Its not really hard to figure out why conservative posters are acting a bit different in this situation: Religion

A bit hyprocritical perhaps? of course

 

[lyeag]

Assuming this is "talent contest" with prizes and 1st, 2nd, 3rd place rankings etc...and it is being held on school property as a school sponsored extra-curricular activity then I think a religious song would be inappropriate. But, for the sake of arguement, supposed the song was allowed. And also suppose that the girl won the talent contest...how do you know the judges were actually rewarding the girl for her vocal skills or perhaps the judges also shared the girls religious beliefs and gave her the award because of the song she selected to make a statement to "put God back in school"...

How could you be guaranteed that wouldn't happen? By not allowing her to sing a religious song.[/QUOTE

I rarely do this, BUT PLEASE...

 

[lyeag]

Ah ha! This is what I mentioned in one of my other posts. I wasn't sure what exactly it was about, but remembered it involved high school students!

Its not really hard to figure out why conservative posters are acting a bit different in this situation: Religion

A bit hyprocritical perhaps? of course

Depends on what was actually in the article. Was the paper distributed during school hours? At a lot of schools the newspaper is an actual class. Then it would be a different case. It would be part of the education process and part of the curriculum. (this is all contingent on what the article actually said.) If the article had nothing explicit in it, and a student wants to state they are homosexual fine, although I am not sure they would be able to handle the ramifications from the student body. Kids can be pretty mean...as well as adults...

 

[Charade]

Assuming this is "talent contest" with prizes and 1st, 2nd, 3rd place rankings etc...and it is being held on school property as a school sponsored extra-curricular activity then I think a religious song would be inappropriate. But, for the sake of argument, supposed the song was allowed. And also suppose that the girl won the talent contest...how do you know the judges were actually rewarding the girl for her vocal skills or perhaps the judges also shared the girls religious beliefs and gave her the award because of the song she selected to make a statement to "put God back in school"...

How could you be guaranteed that wouldn't happen? By not allowing her to sing a religious song.

Are you trying to imply that the judges (all of them??) would have picked this kid in some underhanded way to promote (or endorse) their religion?

Who's to say that the judges weren't bribed to pick the kid that sounded like nails on a chalkboard?

The possibilities for improprieties are nearly endless but because of the "r" word, that possibility must be removed beforehand so there's no chance of that happening.

 

[Chuck S]

Assuming this is "talent contest" with prizes and 1st, 2nd, 3rd place rankings etc...and it is being held on school property as a school sponsored extra-curricular activity then I think a religious song would be inappropriate. But, for the sake of arguement, supposed the song was allowed. And also suppose that the girl won the talent contest...how do you know the judges were actually rewarding the girl for her vocal skills or perhaps the judges also shared the girls religious beliefs and gave her the award because of the song she selected to make a statement to "put God back in school"...

How could you be guaranteed that wouldn't happen? By not allowing her to sing a religious song.

I rarely do this, BUT PLEASE...

Funny, there is a blog on her legal teams website billing this as the "Awesome God-less Talent Show"...sounds like a statement to me.

 

[lyeag]

Funny, there is a blog on her legal teams website billing this as the "Awesone God-less Talent Show"...sounds like a statement to me.

Well, isn't that what they are trying to make sure it is? Would there be a blog at all if the principal had just let the little kid have 2 minutes on stage to sing a song? The God issue is an issue because the principal was afraid of people like you having no tolerance for some little kid singing a song. Afraid of a threat of a lawsuit over a school talent show. I certainly wouldn't care if a kid got up and did Buddhist chants, or did Vegan cooking. Do I follow those things? No. Do I find them offensive, no.

Again I say to the masses- TOUGHEN UP BUTTERCUPS

 

[momof2inPA]

Well, I guess it's obvious that the schools are going to be our political battlegrounds for the foreseeable future...

OK, a few days ago, septbride2000 posted a thread about a school newspaper that was censored from publishing an article with interviews from gay students. In this case, as I remember, most of the conservative posters said that it was the principle's decision and we shouldn't question his right to make decisions as he say fit regarding the wellfare of his school.

So, why isn't this principle being given the same consideration here?


Personally, I'd be fine with the girl singing the song. It's what she chose to express herself, it's not part of the school curriculum, it's fine (terrible song, IMO, but if that's the way she wants her school colleagues to know her, fine. She'll have to deal with the aftereffects. Kids are brutal when it comes to talent shows...one kid in our school sang something from "Oliver!" and he never lived it down). So, just as I supported the rights of the lesbian/gay students to tell their stories in their school newspaper, I support this girls decision to sing the song she feels best expresses herself.

As the OP mentioned before, music is an art, and if schools are going to censor all religious art to cover their butts, then students will be the poorer for it. A good portion of the Western canon of art is made up of masterworks with religious subject matter. I think we are selling both students and teachers short when we assume they can't study this type of material without it becoming a sermon.

Essentially, I think certain political elements have raised religious debate to such a fevered pitch recently, that reasonable responses to such situations have been thrown out the window.

My guess is that the girl who sings about God will receive less ridicule than the gay kids who come out in the school newspaper, but for their sakes, I hope none are treated badly and that the school would discourage any backlash. I like "Oliver." I sang "Just a Spoonful of Sugar" in the second grade school show.

 

[Charade]

Funny, there is a blog on her legal teams website billing this as the "Awesome God-less Talent Show"...sounds like a statement to me.

Funny? How so? And so what? That's after the fact. Unless you think that it was a plot from the beginning that somehow the parents knew they would get this reaction from the school when they submitted the song and was already prepared for a legal battle.

 

[powellrj]

Just wanted to add, that most "talent shows" in grade shows and middle schools are more talent showcases where the kids show their talent and don't win prizes. My kids were both in them for their grade and middle schools last week and no prizes were given.

Ok, back to the debate!

 

[Chuck S]

Are you trying to imply that the judges (all of them??) would have picked this kid in some underhanded way to promote (or endorse) their religion?

Who's to say that the judges weren't bribed to pick the kid that sounded like nails on a chalkboard?

The possibilities for improprieties are nearly endless but because of the "r" word, that possibility must be removed beforehand so there's no chance of that happening.

I'm not implying anything about their judges, never met them. What I am saying is the possibility exists in these situations. Yet you seem to think that because other possibilities for prejudicial judging exist, this one should, too.

Now, don't these circumstances seem a bit contrived...talent contest for school (while not officially during school hours, a school sponsored event, none the less). Girl wants to sing religious song...principal says it is inappropriate. BOOM, parents immediately file suit for an "emergency" motion to allow her to sing it, with the help of a religious legal group based 3000 miles away. Sounds more and more like a planned set-up.

I mean, would the average reasonable parent contact one of these groups if their intention was NOT to make a political statement? Or unless they were some sort of wacked-out stage parent thinking this silly contest would be a stepping stone to "American Idol"