Shareholders want Disney to Endorse "Ex-Gays"

[DVC~OKW~96]

For someone so full of apologies, you certainly have put much effort into beating this dead horse.

I for one do not believe, nor accept the "ex-gay" nonsense. Either you are gay, heterosexual, bisexual, asexual or not. Period.

If you deny an aspect of yourself, so be it. Some call that celebacy. Have at it.

If you put yourself in a situation to cause comment on your decision to step outside who and what you are, then that is your matter to deal with.

If someone who claims to be ex-gay wants to live a peaceful life, why clamor on about it? Isn't that what we are always criticized for; banging on about being gay, lesbian, bi, transgendered...?

Please, you come here as it moves you with your pontifications. I hope they make you feel good, because what you share here is not meant to be loving, accepting, conducive to tolerance or sharing the joy of being gay.

It is a thinly (and not so thin sometimes) veiled proselytyzing.

Now, come back and tell me how my intolerance of your point of view is "no better" than any other form of intolerance.

As I've said here and will continue to say, I will not allow challenges such as your's go without comment.

There are many polite, and understanding gay folk here. I am not one of them.

 

[mickeyfan1]

Dr M, you just don't get it. From the website:
First Stone's primary purpose is to lead the sexually and relationally broken into a liberating relationship with Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord. Discipleship and restoration in every area of one's life is stressed; however, there is detailed emphasis on overcoming all forms of sexual brokenness including homosexuality, sexual abuse and addiction to pornography.

So sorry, but my gay friends are not broken. Many of them have a deep and meaningful relationship with God, many are devout Christians. First Stone Misnistries, by promoting "healing of those broken sexually" is np doffernt than saying Black people can become Chinese, if they only accept our teachings. This church preaches hate and intollerance. Your are entitled to your own opinion. but like the PP, I don't have to like it and feel no remorse in calling you on it.

 

[Dr. M]

I for one do not believe, nor accept the "ex-gay" nonsense. Either you are gay, heterosexual, bisexual, asexual or not. Period.

If you deny an aspect of yourself, so be it. Some call that celebacy. Have at it.

If you put yourself in a situation to cause comment on your decision to step outside who and what you are, then that is your matter to deal with.

If someone who claims to be ex-gay wants to live a peaceful life, why clamor on about it? Isn't that what we are always criticized for; banging on about being gay, lesbian, bi, transgendered...?

Now, come back and tell me how my intolerance of your point of view is "no better" than any other form of intolerance.


There are many polite, and understanding gay folk here. I am not one of them.

Case and point


My ex-gay friends (And I decided not to put these words in quotations anymore--because they do exist. I was told, that there's about a 50 of them who meet at a church in Oklahoma City every Thursday, for support and fellowship. I've never been, but now, I think I might visit) My friends deal with this type of combative attitude from the gay community that they used to be a part of.

And by the way, I really didn't think any kind of legislation was necessary to protect the rights of ex-gays, until this thread came out. I had never even heard of PFOX. But the kind of animosity exhibited here towards ex-gays, Now I think I might be for it.

 

[Dr. M]

Dr M, you just don't get it. From the website:
First Stone's primary purpose is to lead the sexually and relationally broken into a liberating relationship with Jesus Christ as Savior and Lord. Discipleship and restoration in every area of one's life is stressed; however, there is detailed emphasis on overcoming all forms of sexual brokenness including homosexuality, sexual abuse and addiction to pornography.

So sorry, but my gay friends are not broken. Many of them have a deep and meaningful relationship with God, many are devout Christians. First Stone Misnistries, by promoting "healing of those broken sexually" is np doffernt than saying Black people can become Chinese, if they only accept our teachings. This church preaches hate and intollerance. Your are entitled to your own opinion. but like the PP, I don't have to like it and feel no remorse in calling you on it.

My point was not to discuss Christianity or personal beliefs, as I'm sure that would be shut down immediately. My point was to stay on topic and comment on ex-gay discrimination. As amply demonstrated by this thread and the attitudes exhibited by some, as well as recent discussions with my ex-gay friends, I have no doubt that ex-gays need some form of protection just like gays. And you are right--You don't have to like my friends, and you don't have to like my opinion.

 

[OrlandoMike]

Are we really comparing a cold shoulder at a Cocktail Party to the discrimination the gay community faces on a daily basis?

I'm sure the "ex-gays" have issues, but I really have a hard time believing they are being discriminated against! Just my opinion.....

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Seriously? Ex-gay? Are there people who experimented with gay sexual encounters? Of course there are. Are there people who are so afraid of identifying with being gay that they force themselves to live a life of denial? Absolutely. What's your point? That they are discriminated against by the gay community? No. Get your definitions right. It's not discrimination, more like disbelief that someone who is truly gay can decide not to be. Go ahead and decide not to be a part of the minority that you allude to. You can say it, you can probably even change your appearance, but it won't change the reality. You are what you are.

So are there protections from discrimination for the ex-heterosexuals? You know, those people who realized that they were gay after living as heterosexuals for some time? You know? Those same people who now, because they are gay cannot marry the person of their choosing, cannot be treated with respect on a simple Disney chat board, cannot be certain that they won't be physically attacked depending upon the area in which they live or visit? Cannot be sure they won't be fired if it is learned that they are gay. Cannot openly serve their country. Hell, cannot even silently serve their country without constant fear of being outed and then discharged. Surely you are familiar with those ex-heterosexuals?

I'll warrant a guess, and yes it would be just that; a guess, that there are far more ex-heterosexuals who experience discrimination than those people identifying as ex-gay.

You don't have to like my opinion either.

 

[Dr. M]

That they are discriminated against by the gay community?

I now believe that they are discriminated against by both the heterosexual and gay communities. It's a double whammy. Refer to my references of discrimination in my previous posts. I was not aware of this, till now. I thought most discrimination was merely social, but apparently one person was beat up and one lost their job for being ex-gay. According to my friends, the ex-gay community is growing and some want them to be considered a minority group for protection.


So are there protections from discrimination for the ex-heterosexuals? You know, those people who realized that they were gay after living as heterosexuals for some time? Surely you are familiar with those ex-heterosexuals?

Of course. I want protection for all people groups. How do you not get this? we were friends when she was lesbian, before becoming ex-gay. Of course I would want her protected no matter what she identified herself as.

I'll warrant a guess, and yes it would be just that; a guess, that there are far more ex-heterosexuals who experience discrimination than those people identifying as ex-gay.

you are probably right . But just because there are more gays than ex-gays, does that mean they should be any less protected?

,

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

I'm going to ask you a question, to which you certainly do not have to respond.

What is your purpose in coming to this board? What are you trying to accomplish? What are you hoping to gain, to learn, to teach, to share, to take away?

 

[Dr. M]

By the way, homophobic people discriminate against gays, and ex-gays alike. If you've ever had a relationship with someone of the same sex, most homophobes don't differentiate between gay, bi, trans, or used-to-be gay, bi, trans. They hate you all the same. Why not band together. Why refuse protection to the even the smallest group amongst you? Why can they not be protected for what they used to be, whether you believe their lifestyle now is being true to themselves or not?

 

[Dr. M]

I'm going to ask you a question, to which you certainly do not have to respond.

What is your purpose in coming to this board? What are you trying to accomplish? What are you hoping to gain, to learn, to teach, to share, to take away?

Truth.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

Truth about what? Being gay? Your way of thinkning? Truth about what?

Band together? That suggestion alone displays a complete lack of understanding of the diversity of the gay community.

That, is truth.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

But I should at least give you this; you come to the right place to seek truth.

This is one of the most truthful gay communities I've ever had the pleasure of knowing (the regulars of this board).

A further truth is, this board's gay community is made up of gay, lesbian, bisexual, and heterosexuals. To be part of a given community does not mean that the whole has to have the same characteristics of a given part.

 

[mickeyfan1]

Sorry, still don't buy it. You came here saying your ex gay friends were being discriminated against, but then back pedaled to social discrimination. You brought the church into it. You want everyone to band together against hate, yet your friends attend a very anti gay church, perhaps you should start with them. The whole idea of ex gays being discrimiated against is damn far fetched. What these groups want is to be able to preach their "You can heal, you can become ex gay, if you just accept our teachings and help" with out fear of reprisal. They want to be porotected but not because people dislike them, but because they want things to be thier way only. The truth is that Gays are legally discriminated against, not ex gays, not people of colour, not women, not illegal aliens, just gays. The truth is that this is shameful and has no place in this country or any where else.

 

[OrlandoMike]

By the way, homophobic people discriminate against gays, and ex-gays alike.

OK I just gotta ask....How does anyone know that anyone is ex-gay?

Do people really walk up to other people and say "Hi, my name is John, and I'm married to Suzzie here, but before that I was sleeping with a guy named Tom!"

This whole argument is mute!

Once again, just my opinion...

 

[Dr. M]

Truth about what? Being gay? Your way of thinkning? Truth about what?

Band together? That suggestion alone displays a complete lack of understanding of the diversity of the gay community.

That, is truth.

Suggesting that banding together demonstrates a lack of understanding of diversity??????What????

Like I've said before, I can't say that I can understand the level of discrimination a gay person feels, bacause I'm not gay. But I can try to empathize (though your attitude is making it difficult) I'm merely suggesting that perhaps your enemy's enemy could be your friend. If the gay community and the ex-gay community and the minority community all experience intolerance, why not band together? How could you possibly argue against that?

 

[OrlandoMike]

If the gay community and the ex-gay community and the minority community all experience intolerance, why not band together? How could you possibly argue against that?

We did, remember November? It was cold, but we shared the fire wood!

 

[mickeyfan1]

OK I just gotta ask....How does anyone know that anyone is ex-gay?

Do people really walk up to other people and say "Hi, my name is John, and I'm married to Suzzie here, but before that I was sleeping with a guy named Tom!"

This whole argument is mute!

Once again, just my opinion...

Well, maybe there is something to the don't ask, don't tell policy of old.

But was Suzie sleeping with Tom or Tomasina before? Inquiring minds and all that.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

You didn't answer my question, does that mean you aren't going to? Perfectly fine if you refuse...

What truth are you seeking?

With regard to "my attitude" as I said early on, I am not going to ignore attacks, regardless of how they are couched.

Uh, and thank you NO. I don't susbscribe to that particularly weird double think of befriending enemies.

 

[DVC~OKW~96]

We did, remember November? It was cold, but we shared the fire wood!

Ayuh. And one fine June we shared the righteous indignation of refusing to accept further harrassment and discrimination.

 

[Dr. M]

OK I just gotta ask....How does anyone know that anyone is ex-gay?

Do people really walk up to other people and say "Hi, my name is John, and I'm married to Suzzie here, but before that I was sleeping with a guy named Tom!"

This whole argument is mute!

Once again, just my opinion...

Things may be different in Orlando, where you live, but here in Oklahoma, where there are many small communities, and suburbs, where everyone knows everyone and ones personal dealings can become public knowledge very easily.

I imagine WDW castmembers are somewhat a similar small community, where most people know who is gay, who isn't.