Sarah Palin as POTUS.

[bicker]

Good point, and I suppose GWB is the biggest socialist of all, since he's "nationalizing" banks.

 

[tedhowe]

There's got to be something else. I don't buy for one minute these claims that "I was going to vote for McCain but then he choose Sara". I find it very hard to believe that you originally thought that McCain was the best choice but since SP doesn't believe in abortion you would rather have a socialistic government that's probably going to try and control just about every aspect of your life and your going to vote for Obama.

How is Obama not trying to force his beliefs on all of America? I sure as heck don't believe in Socialism. He does, and he is going to with the help of Pelosi and Reid impose his beliefs on me and every other American.

Tina

Believe it or not. It's what many of us who are independents believe, and even some prominent conservative Republicans agree.

As Ken Adelman (neocon stalwart, longtime advisor/member of several Republican administrations, dating back at least to Gerald Ford) put it - far better than I've been able to:

The most important decision John McCain made in his long campaign was deciding on a running mate.

That decision showed appalling lack of judgment. Not only is Sarah Palin not close to being acceptable in high office—I would not have hired her for even a mid-level post in the arms-control agency. But that selection contradicted McCain’s main two, and best two, themes for his campaign—Country First, and experience counts. Neither can he credibly claim, post-Palin pick.

My vote was swayed from McCain to Obama not so much by Palin herself, as by the choice of her as VP when there are far more qualified, moderate Republicans that I felt would have been a better choice.

I don't know if I place as much emphasis on the "heartbeat away from the president" issue as Bicker does, but it is a concern. And it should have been a concern of McCain's in my opinion.

 

[dvcgirl]

Good point, and I suppose GWB is the biggest socialist of all, since he's "nationalizing" banks.

LOL! I know, here we're witnessing the Bank of Ben and Hank imposing socialism on a grand scale........

And still most of America is worried about poor Joe the Plumber and this insane idea that he'll have to pay more in taxes when he buys his imaginary plumbing business.

I mean, the *arrogance* of Obama....to want to help poor Joe the Plumber, who sees himself as a Titan of Plumbing, when he's really not a plumber at all.

Joe, if you're out there....just get the license, borrow the money, grow the business and at least get remotely close to the point where you're earning 250K.....when you get there, then you can worry about paying that extra 4% that you earn *above* 250K a year.

Or, you can just sit around and keep earning 40K a year because you're worried about paying that extra 4% over the 250K that you may earn....someday.

Yep, makes perfect sense to me. In fact, I think DH and I will try to earn less this year. We won't work as hard....begin slacking off a bit, to get that salary under 250K....just so we don't have to pay that extra 4%.

 

[rwdavis2]

Believe it Tina,
I was initially going to vote republican (I'm registered independant), no way am I going to vote for John McCain wth SP on the ticket. As I said she is too extreme for me.

And Obama is not? The most liberal voting record in the Senate. Considering all the people crazy/radical/criminal people Obama has been associated with in his past you have to ask, not why he associated with them, but why they wanted to be associated with him? Is it because he disagreed with their beliefs or agendas or they found him compatible with their beliefs?
BD

 

[joviroxx]

Well for a "hockey mom "as she would like us to see she is sure spending a lot of money in times that many Americans suffer ore even live on the street.


http://www.kcet.org/socal/2008/09/foreclosure-alley.html

Her "spending" joy promises a lot for the future.

And you have no issue spending $600 million for a campaign? In these hard times for lower and middle class people, $600 million? When you could have opted for $84 already existing money? How many people could have been taken off the streets. You really need to buy 30 minutes of prime time air on 3 major networks? Please, use a different argument. The "money well spent" argument isn't cutting it for $600 million, that's $6,000,000.

 

[beckmrk04]

Obama is not a socialist, that's just more garbage talking points from the right. It always amazes me how people just buy this stuff without looking into some of the facts.

It seems like no matter how many times it gets repeated, people still don't get it.

Socialism is when the government controls all aspects of daily living- where you live, what you do, where you go to the doctor, etc.

Just because Obama wants to make sure all Americans have ACCESS to affordable health care does NOT make him a socialist. IMO it makes him empathetic and morally-driven. It's telling the big-pocketed insurance companies that they can't deny someone coverage due to pre-existing conditions. It doesn't do any good to have a $5000 tax credit when you can't find an insurer to cover you! Not to mention that if you do, you'll be paying a heck of a lot more than $5k. Personally- I would be fine with seeing my premiums increase knowing that people were getting access to health care. I mean- either way you're paying for it because those very same people with no insurance end up in the hospital or ER's and guess who foots the bill? Tax payers.

There was a thread on here a while back explaining socialism that I think everyone should read.

 

[beckmrk04]

And you have no issue spending $600 million for a campaign? In these hard times for lower and middle class people, $600 million? When you could have opted for $84 already existing money? How many people could have been taken off the streets. You really need to buy 30 minutes of prime time air on 3 major networks? Please, use a different argument. The "money well spent" argument isn't cutting it for $600 million, that's $6,000,000.

No, I have no issue with it because even in these hard times, I donated to his campaign. And I can assure you that I am on the lower end of the income totem pole. But, it's a cause I and MANY MANY other people believe in enough that when everyone gives a little bit, it adds up to a whole lot.

 

[eliza61]

And Obama is not? The most liberal voting record in the Senate. Considering all the people crazy/radical/criminal people Obama has been associated with in his past you have to ask, not why he associated with them, but why they wanted to be associated with him? Is it because he disagreed with their beliefs or agendas or they found him compatible with their beliefs?
BD

Oh you get no argument from me. I've always stated, I'm not crazy about either candidates and I can't believe out of every body in this country these are the best candidates we could come up with. I'm simply voting for the lesser of 2 evils IMO. Right now SP & the radical religous right would do a heck of a lot more damage than a 1960's washed up has been.

 

[rwdavis2]

It seems like no matter how many times it gets repeated, people still don't get it.

Socialism is when the government controls all aspects of daily living- where you live, what you do, where you go to the doctor, etc.

Just because Obama wants to make sure all Americans have ACCESS to affordable health care does NOT make him a socialist. IMO it makes him empathetic and morally-driven. It's telling the big-pocketed insurance companies that they can't deny someone coverage due to pre-existing conditions. It doesn't do any good to have a $5000 tax credit when you can't find an insurer to cover you! Not to mention that if you do, you'll be paying a heck of a lot more than $5k. Personally- I would be fine with seeing my premiums increase knowing that people were getting access to health care. I mean- either way you're paying for it because those very same people with no insurance end up in the hospital or ER's and guess who foots the bill? Tax payers.

There was a thread on here a while back explaining socialism that I think everyone should read.

The socialist tag is for him admitting he "wants to spread the wealth around". That's not controlling you're entire life, for that you have communism.

Socialism is practiced in much of Europe. Most countries there have unemployment rates approaching 10% an higher. You want that here? Europe makes it very costly to hire, and if necessary fire, workers. Therefore people don't get hired in the first place. They make it hard to start a business.

I have big problems with giving money earned one group of people directly to another group that did not. I am not against welfare on a temporary basis. But once you go down the road to transfer of wealth this way where does it stop? Once people realize they can vote themselves money at what point to the most productive among us just stop being so? Obama claims it's $250K and above but that's just a start once they see that's not enough money for all the giveaways.
BD

 

[Nancyg56]

There's got to be something else. I don't buy for one minute these claims that "I was going to vote for McCain but then he choose Sara". I find it very hard to believe that you originally thought that McCain was the best choice but since SP doesn't believe in abortion you would rather have a socialistic government that's probably going to try and control just about every aspect of your life and your going to vote for Obama.

Believe it Tina,
I was initially going to vote republican (I'm registered independant), no way am I going to vote for John McCain wth SP on the ticket. As I said she is too extreme for me.

Me too. I have been on the fence but leaning toward McCain and was waiting for the VP pick to decide. My DH as well, neither of us really wanted to vote for Republican this year but were not terribly with Obama alone. Once the VP choices were announce I decided that there was no way I could vote McCain/Palin. Biden a heartbeat away for the Presidency was easier to live with than Palin.

DH and I always include out thoughts about VP in our votes, it is too important for us to disregard.

Personal freedom is worth more than money.

Both parties suck. Both candidates suck. McCain (alone) sucked a little less than Obama (alone). McCain/Palin sucks a lot more than Obama/Biden.

I agree. No good vote this time. The truth is that I am very afraid of Sarah Palin, after the Anti American speech I am now disgusted. Since when is a difference in political ideology a basis for being called anti-American? Since Sarah Palin said so.

 

[TCPluto]

There's got to be something else. I don't buy for one minute these claims that "I was going to vote for McCain but then he choose Sara". I find it very hard to believe that you originally thought that McCain was the best choice but since SP doesn't believe in abortion you would rather have a socialistic government that's probably going to try and control just about every aspect of your life and your going to vote for Obama.

How is Obama not trying to force his beliefs on all of America? I sure as heck don't believe in Socialism. He does, and he is going to with the help of Pelosi and Reid impose his beliefs on me and every other American.

Tina

Nobody's buying it.....

The issues he mentions are issues of philosphy olny. None of them have a chance of being changed. None.

 

[LotsOfQuestions]

I'm tired of these threads about Sarah Palin being POTUS. A) She's not running for President. B) She does have the experience just in case, God forbid, something happens to McCain...lemme tell you why. Conservatives back me up...I feel my flame suit getting hit hard today.

I don't understand why people would be scared if Palin became POTUS. First off, Palin has about 8 years of executive experience as mayor and governor. Obama has none. I think Obama in there is absolutely terrifying. At least she has SOME experience...he has done ABSOLUTELY nothing! Palin runs the Alaska National Guard and she was in Alaska trying to reform it, breaking HUGE spending and giving it out to the people. And he has NO foreign policy experience...only if you count a trip to Pakistan during college and a rock tour in Europe and the Middle East.

But Palin had to deal with foreign affairs everyday as Alaska is a major place for im/exporting and oil IS the major industry of the Alaska which involves dealing with many foreign government and businesses. But I really don't wanna get into it cause the more I type the more I'll get flamed. But this isn't my opinion...these are facts. So, yes, I feel she is qualified to be C-in-C.

Pete

She does not run the National Guard.

She is running for POTUS, just as Biden is running. They are the backups, the backup quarterbacks in a sense. Any voter who does not look at them as potential Presidential candidates are not doing their duty as voters.

And, if she has so much experience to be VP, let alone President, how come, 13 days out from the possibility of being elected VP, she doesn't even know the constitutional duties of the VP? (Check her answer to 3rd graders last week.)

Unfortunately, your opinion that she is ready is not being reflected in the polls . As of yesterday's polls, for the first time more people think Palin has hurt McCain. It used to be following Bush's policies that were the top concern.

More and more top Republicans are calling out McCain's choice of Palin, stating that she is completely unqualified.

Politically, she is an embarrassment to the Republican party.

 

[Zippa D Doodah]

She does not run the National Guard.

She is running for POTUS, just as Biden is running. They are the backups, the backup quarterbacks in a sense. Any voter who does not look at them as potential Presidential candidates are not doing their duty as voters.

And, if she has so much experience to be VP, let alone President, how come, 13 days out from the possibility of being elected VP, she doesn't even know the constitutional duties of the VP? (Check her answer to 3rd graders last week.)

Unfortunately, your opinion that she is ready is not being reflected in the polls . As of yesterday's polls, for the first time more people think Palin has hurt McCain. It used to be following Bush's policies that were the top concern.

More and more top Republicans are calling out McCain's choice of Palin, stating that she is completely unqualified.

Politically, she is an embarrassment to the Republican party.

and why... I'll bet she doesn't spell "potato" correctly either.

 

[LotsOfQuestions]

There's got to be something else. I don't buy for one minute these claims that "I was going to vote for McCain but then he choose Sara". I find it very hard to believe that you originally thought that McCain was the best choice but since SP doesn't believe in abortion you would rather have a socialistic government that's probably going to try and control just about every aspect of your life and your going to vote for Obama.

How is Obama not trying to force his beliefs on all of America? I sure as heck don't believe in Socialism. He does, and he is going to with the help of Pelosi and Reid impose his beliefs on me and every other American.

Tina

You may not believe these claims, but for me, it is 100% true.

And it is based more on her knowledge of how this country works, or extreme lack thereof, than her extreme right wing views. Although those do come into play.

From day one, she has not been able to answer any questions correctly about what a VP does, what newspapers she reads, etc. And she is not making any effort to learn, as evidenced by her answer to third graders.

This bothers me. If she is going to be VP, her first priority should have been to learn exactly what a VP does.

McCain lost my vote when he chose a completely incompetent person to be second in command. That was his first big decision and he made it shooting from the hip without proper vetting. Tells me how he will run the country and that is not what I want.

Obama chose Biden, who, with his experience, supports the areas where Obama may be weak. That is what I want to see in a president - somebody who surrounds themselves with experienced, knowledgeable people who are ready to give sound advice to the President.

I can't imagine Palin being able to advise McCain on anything.

 

[MAKmom]

There's got to be something else. I don't buy for one minute these claims that "I was going to vote for McCain but then he choose Sara". I find it very hard to believe that you originally thought that McCain was the best choice but since SP doesn't believe in abortion you would rather have a socialistic government that's probably going to try and control just about every aspect of your life and your going to vote for Obama.

How is Obama not trying to force his beliefs on all of America? I sure as heck don't believe in Socialism. He does, and he is going to with the help of Pelosi and Reid impose his beliefs on me and every other American.

Tina

I don't buy that any reasonable person thinks she is a good choice on this ticket.

If McCain looses this election Sarah Palin will be the reason why. It was a huge mistake on his part.

I'm not happy with any of the choices in this election but Obama is brilliant & well educated. Palins makes him look so much better to many voters.

We have just had 8 years with a POTUS that most American wanted to have a beer with & it was a disaster. She is another trainwreck waiting to happen.

Is there anyone who REALLY thinks she is a great choice? If you could turn back time would you want him to pick her again?

 

[LotsOfQuestions]

and why... I'll bet she doesn't spell "potato" correctly either.

You don't think a person should know the job they are taking on, they shouldn't be aware of the constitution of the United States of America, especially when it is the second most important job in the free world?

Especially when she is 13 days out from possibly getting that job?

To me, that is a disgrace.

Obama may not have executive experience (just like McCain), but he is a Constitutional scholar. He has published books about the Constitution and he has lectured as a professor on the Constitution.

I will take intellect over small town experience any day. You betcha!

 

[Disneyadore]

And you have no issue spending $600 million for a campaign? In these hard times for lower and middle class people, $600 million? When you could have opted for $84 already existing money? How many people could have been taken off the streets. You really need to buy 30 minutes of prime time air on 3 major networks? Please, use a different argument. The "money well spent" argument isn't cutting it for $600 million, that's $6,000,000.

Spending money on a campaign is a public thing. Spending that amount of money on your own and than just throw it away by saying :" it goes to charity" is like sp.... in the peoples face.

I can see already some poor bag ladies shoving there cart around in clothes from Saks

 

[bicker]

And Obama is not?

No, he's not. Not by a long-shot. AFAIC, compared to McCain, Obama is "just as dangerous -- no more, no less"; while Palin is "very substantially more dangerous". That's the point. Palin brought McCain's candidacy down instead of what a Vice Presidential pick is supposed to do, i.e., bring a candidacy up.

 

[DisFlan]

From day one, she has not been able to answer any questions correctly about what a VP does, what newspapers she reads, etc. And she is not making any effort to learn, as evidenced by her answer to third graders.

This bothers me. If she is going to be VP, her first priority should have been to learn exactly what a VP does.

This bothers me, too. A lot. (And I'm a Republican.) She's given the same, wrong answer about the "job" a number of times. This tells me Ms. Palin is less than casually acquainted with the constitution - something a VP candidate should have at least read.

I'd think that someone in McCain's campaign would have explained this to her by this time. Which leads me to think that things aren't very well organized in the McCain camp (and he's had nearly two years to get it in order). Would his administration be any better?

DisFlan

 

[bicker]

The socialist tag is for him admitting he "wants to spread the wealth around".

That's not socialism. I'm not Christian, but it sounds to me like calling Obama's less absolute form of responsible citizenry "socialism" is pretty-much calling Jesus a socialist as well. Jesus said: "You must go home, sell all that you own and distribute your wealth among the poor." Jesus also said "give unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s and give unto God that which is God’s”. Taxes are Caesar’s. Compassion for the poor is God’s.

Beyond that, what I hear more and more from a lot of the folks (still) supporting McCain is that they don't think that they have any obligation towards the less fortunate. That's immoral, AFAIC, and unequivocally contrary to compassionate conservatism. Compassionate conservatism doesn't preclude the responsibility of those with means to ensure, "the effective provision of social services" to those who are not with means. (That quote came from Bush, via speechwriter Gerson.) So even if you disagree with the method (i.e., taxation and government programs), the end-result is still an acknowledged responsibility.

And in a pluralistic society, no one is supposed to get things their way; especially given our nation is split 36% Democrat, 27% Republican, 37% Independent, it isn't reasonable to expect the "the effective provision of social services" to be effected 100% via the ultra-conservative model.