S/O: Angel Trees- Long, winded VENT

[brighteyes]

I have not read all of the many pages of the posts here but have read quite a few pages. I understand the view that these children or family on the angel tree could use and need other things.

Has anyone thought that the wish list comes from a child usually asking "Santa" for these gifts. Maybe the parent has tried to find out some inexpensive items that the child wants for Christmas and was met with only those wants that the OP deems uneccessary. Even when my child had expensive items on his letter to Santa, I never told him to put something else on his list. If I could not afford it, he did not get it.

The family may need other things, but if the child is asked what they want for Christmas, I highly doubt the parent(s) told the child,"Since I can't afford to buy you Christmas gifts this year, or very much, kind PEOPLE are buying these gifts for you, not Santa."

Or on the other hand, maybe the parent can afford to buy mitten and scarfs or the basic needs but cannot afford the wants of the child at Christmas. Now maybe the family in need has provided for the NEEDS of the child, but because of this has no money for the wants of the child. I understand not wanting to spend so much money for a Wii for the family, but the children probably do not know what the list is for.

Like previous posters said, the child probably does not realize they are a struggling family. The child probably wrote out his Christmas list to Santa and the parents did not revise it at all. Maybe the parents feel that although expensive it would give their family some fun together. I realize there are cheaper options but it is a "wish" after all.

Stephanie

 

[livndisney]

It's all about deserving- yes, feeling like "Well, these kids should be happy with a coloring book, or hannah montana doll and some mittens" And, If my own kid doesn't have a Wii-how ridiculous-that this kid wants/wishes for one. Well- MHO- is that these kids are more DESERVING than the kids who have warm homes, good meals,parents to love/care for them,take them to WDW,nice clothes etc. These are KIDS who are wishing for what ALL KIDS want this year! These kids are living day to day what I wouldn't wish on anyone-making someones most magical wish come true-someone; a child-is the true meaning of Christmas.

Well you may consider my opinion "ridiculous". And as I have said before to each their own. Personally I give to "These kids are living day to day what I wouldn't wish on anyone" to make their day to day life better. Yes, I could go buy 1 Wii or I can feed a family for a month. I think they DESERVE food. I think these children DESERVE a chance at education. So I help set up schools and get needed supplies. And I even help get them what kids really wish for- a family.

 

[cruellababy]

Well you may consider my opinion "ridiculous". And as I have said before to each their own. Personally I give to "These kids are living day to day what I wouldn't wish on anyone" to make their day to day life better. Yes, I could go buy 1 Wii or I can feed a family for a month. I think they DESERVE food. I think these children DESERVE a chance at education. So I help set up schools and get needed supplies. And I even help get them what kids really wish for- a family.[/QUOTE

I totally agree with what you're saying; and I also donate extra supplies to different groups, and food all year long- my point- and JMHO- is it's Christmas time and these gifts are for kids; and shouldn't they have a magical wish from Santa come true?

 

[Kit'smommy]

I think some of the posters overestimate the naivete of a lot of these children too as to the price of some of their wishes. Now a toddler obviously has no comprehension of cost, but most of the school age children I know understand something being expensive.

We were not very well off at all when I was growing up but always had a safe and clean home, warm clothing, adequate food and a modest but ok gifts. One year we had a little more money than usual and my dad stood in line most of the night to get us a very early generation Atari. I was only 6 at the time and very sheltered, but was aware the gaming system was very expensive and that it would be pretty much the only thing my brother and I would be getting for Christmas. My child is not quite 5 and already understands that some things might be too expensive for Mommy and Daddy, his grandparents or even Santa to get for him.

 

[bethy]

As someone involved in this process, many of the parents do not understand the value of money either. For many of them, that's why their family is in the financial straits they are in.

(There are families that have lost jobs and things, more this year than before.)

The kids don't understand because the parents don't understand, it's a cycle of poverty. The families that have lost jobs are the kids and families more likely to get out of poverty because they know what it's like not to live that way. For others, it never occurs to them that there's any other way to live.

Lots of them can't pay their bills because they have bought 60 inch tvs and brand name clothes on credit.They don't have the tools they need to make it through life.

I work (volunteer) quite intimately with families like this and must agree with the above statement. Sometimes I get frustrated as a volunteer because I don't feel appreciated. It's not like I want someone on their knees grovelling to me but I do perceive a strong sense of entitlement or at least unawareness on the part of the families we help. I try and focus on the fact that we are helping the kids more than anything. For example, without our group's before school program many of these kids would be dropped off at their school an hour early to wait unsupervised outside in the cold. So it feels good to help the kids but then I realize that the parents are these kids' role models and the cycle is starting itself all over again.

Sigh.

On a brighter note, our family (as in DH, me, and our two DD's) adopts a family through this organization every year. This year all the requests were shoes, winter coats, jeans and a very small, very modest toy (like a hot wheels car). So it felt good to fulfill those requests.

 

[livndisney]

Well you may consider my opinion "ridiculous". And as I have said before to each their own. Personally I give to "These kids are living day to day what I wouldn't wish on anyone" to make their day to day life better. Yes, I could go buy 1 Wii or I can feed a family for a month. I think they DESERVE food. I think these children DESERVE a chance at education. So I help set up schools and get needed supplies. And I even help get them what kids really wish for- a family.[/QUOTE

I totally agree with what you're saying; and I also donate extra supplies to different groups, and food all year long- my point- and JMHO- is it's Christmas time and these gifts are for kids; and shouldn't they have a magical wish from Santa come true?

I am not saying a child should not have a "magical wish" from Santa. Believe me I have looked into the eyes of children that have NOTHING and wanted to give them EVERYTHING. I have a very long history of helping to create magic. But sometimes it is not possible or practical to make the magic. What if the choice is "nothing or a Barbie". Surely waking up Christmas morning to a Barbie is better than no present.

Again, I think it goes back to "to each their own". One person may want to make 1 "wish" come true. The next person may want to stetch their giving as much as possible to give to more children.

If it were possible to create a magical Christmas for every child-I would be the first in line. Until then, I do the best I can with what I have and what I can give.

Merry Christmas!

 

[carmie3377]

I have not read through all the posts, but understand. I know these are just kids who are asking and what kid really asks for clothes at Christmas....but

The 1st year I became a visiting nurse (I have been at this for 4 years now, I go into peoples homes after they have come home from the hospital to teach them about meds, do wound care and so on) it was Xmas time and I went to see a patient. She is on hemo dialysis and her daughter was her primary care giver, although the daughter was not there that day, she was at the Toys for Tots pick up place to get Xmas gifts for her children. Ok fine, I understand that people get down on their luck and it's great that things like that are there to help (esp the children who shouldnt have to pay for their parents choices). Then I start to look around.....they have a BIG screen tv (I'm talking 60in), a leather couch set, a dell computer, as well as a laptop, a nice radio system. Then the daughter comes home (the mother of the children) with their TFT bags and tips on her nails in a leather coat in Tommy Hillfigger clothes!!! WHAT!!!!

They can afford a big screen tv, a laptop, a leather couch, high end clothes, and your nails done every week BUT you can't afford to buy your child gifts? Sadly, after that year I won't donate to TFT. I do donate in many other ways where I can SEE who is getting a gift (so that I can SEE that it goes to people who truly need it, not those who choose to spend their money on things other than their children).

This makes me sick. Sure, perhaps the TV and couches were bought when times were better. But the nails were not! If someone can afford to keep their nail up, then they could afford to buy Christmas for their kids. Put the money away for the nails every time and save up for Christmas a bit at a time throughout the year like a lot of us.

This is one reason I feel so torn about the Angel trees. I know that there are many kids (most of them) on those trees that need to be there. But I also know that there are some that shouldn't be, like the above. And with as many programs there are, how many of these programs do the families participate in?

Then, the expensive requests. If someone does actually buy these kids a Wii or Xbox, how can these families (if truly in need) buy games and accessories?

Now, I didn't read all the posts but I know some you said you don't participate in Angel trees (or similar programs) because you don't know who truly needs help. How about contacting local children's hospitals? There are so many families that fall hard on luck when a child is sick. One of the parents has to quit a job to care for the sick child, then they have travel expenses. The family suffers not only emotionally, but also financially. For example, my brother-in-law's cousin has a child with leukemia. They have 2 other children. The mother had to quit her job to care for the sick child. The hospital is an hour away from where they live. The kids are too young to understand that "young Johnny" is sick and that is why they can't afford Christmas. This happens every day, everywhere.

Now, I'm not a scrooge. I feel there are children in need. We just choose to donate to sick or abused children. And although we can't afford to now, DH and I have discussed sponsoring an entire family (food, clothing, gifts for all - even parents) for Christmas some day when he is done with residency. He will be a pediatric cardiology in 3 1/2 years and we will choose one of his patient's family, where a parent had to quite their job to care for a sick child. I wish we could do it now, but we can't.

 

[HopingToGetEngaged]

MODS: Can we please lock this thread? I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks!

 

[chris1gill]

For people who like to donate clothes and necessities, I will say what I said on another thread. Our schools (the nurse in particular) take these items, new or used, and hand them out to kids who do not have them. The school generally knows which family's are struggling and which one's are not. There are kids literally walking around in zero degree temperatures with no coat.

If you have these types of things, please call your local schools, they may have a similar program to ours.

And as for Christmas, my kids ask for things they will never get, doesn't keep them from asking, but they don't get exactly what they asked for, particularly my daughter who seems to have no concept of money yet....

 

[Kickapoo Joie Juice]

For those of you that live in the Atlanta area and would like another alternative, I found the Children's Health Care of Atlanta, a non profit hospital, is doing a toy donation for those families with sick kids in the hospital where the parents don't feel they can go out and go shopping because they don't want to leave their sick child's side, or that the cost of treatment is eating up all of their money leaving none for presents:

http://www.choa.org/default.aspx?id=3699

One way you know that the stuff you're giving will truly be appreciated, I think...

 

[wall*e2008]

MODS: Can we please lock this thread? I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks!

Why lock it?
Why could you greatly appreciate it being locked?

 

[rparmfamily]

For people who like to donate clothes and necessities, I will say what I said on another thread. Our schools (the nurse in particular) take these items, new or used, and hand them out to kids who do not have them. The school generally knows which family's are struggling and which one's are not. There are kids literally walking around in zero degree temperatures with no coat.

If you have these types of things, please call your local schools, they may have a similar program to ours.

And as for Christmas, my kids ask for things they will never get, doesn't keep them from asking, but they don't get exactly what they asked for, particularly my daughter who seems to have no concept of money yet....

I was going to suggest the school too. I donate to the school and they usually know which students can't buy uniforms/need supplies,etc (ours is a public school that requires uniforms) and know who to pass the items to. I do this with school supplies, especially for the incoming transfer families, because they are having to buy school supplies twice basically (at their old school and now the new school.)

I also enjoy donating to the Fisher House, which is the military version of the Ronald McDonald House basically. Helping families having medical emergencies and returning vets and their families who are learning to live with some serious injuries,etc. http://fisherhouse.org/ There are Fisher Houses across the country. Often the children are with them or the child is the patient.

 

[hentob]

MODS: Can we please lock this thread? I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks!

Why? Adults are having a conversation. Not everyone is agreeing. That is life.

 

[Anjelica]

I also enjoy donating to the Fisher House, which is the military version of the Ronald McDonald House basically. Helping families having medical emergencies and returning vets and their families who are learning to live with some serious injuries,etc. http://fisherhouse.org/ There are Fisher Houses across the country. Often the children are with them or the child is the patient.

I did not intend to add anything more to this thread as I think its gone through its cycle and I'm sure many people don't want to see anymore of it but I had to respond to this with a huge THANK YOU for this suggestion!!!!!

I also wanted to add that there is a program called Heroes for Miles which allows folks to donate their frequent flyer miles so that these soldiers and their family members can fly to be with their soldiers during the recovery process at the Fisher Houses (Walter Reed, Brooks, etc.). It's a great program and a wonderful way to "dispose" of either expiring frequent flyer miles or if you no longer use them.

I hate to say that I have experience with the Heroes for Miles program and while I did not stay in the Fisher House (my brother is at the Malogne house at Walter Reed recovering from his injuries) it really is a great help to those soldiers and families there to support them through a very difficult physical but most importantly emotional struggle (the things you see firsthand will break your heart).

 

[ilovemyjj]

I had to add to this...I know how things Are these days, and my kids have been on those trees, but the angel tree does not say list your needs..yes you write clothing sizes on there, but the other spot and they will even tell you, does your child want any toys? A Bike? No the kids do not need these items to live, and i think the people who write wii's. ps3's and such are wrong, because then they can go home tell the kids what they put up there, then when Christmas day comes..sorry hunny..santa didn't come thru. In that sense it is wrong. However, I don't see anything wrong of a child wanting a board game or the one year the one I picked wanted angel things. Kids today just wanna fit in, and to fit in they want to be like there friends, that is why they feel the need to want those big ticket items, so..if you feel there too greedy then dont pull that ticket..but don't just not do it because there are a few "greedy people" on the tree. Because when it comes down to it, the kids are the ones that have to pay the price.
I have taught my children, we take them on a mini vacation, and they get a few presents under the tree, but this is the season of giving..on the 24th all 3 of my children will be serving the homeless dinner. They need to see the need, and be a part of it, they are using some of there money to buy the homeless some clothing, so they give and receive, and I believe that is the way it should be.

 

[brighteyes]

I had to add to this...I know how things Are these days, and my kids have been on those trees, but the angel tree does not say list your needs..yes you write clothing sizes on there, but the other spot and they will even tell you, does your child want any toys? A Bike? No the kids do not need these items to live, and i think the people who write wii's. ps3's and such are wrong, because then they can go home tell the kids what they put up there, then when Christmas day comes..sorry hunny..santa didn't come thru. In that sense it is wrong. However, I don't see anything wrong of a child wanting a board game or the one year the one I picked wanted angel things. Kids today just wanna fit in, and to fit in they want to be like there friends, that is why they feel the need to want those big ticket items, so..if you feel there too greedy then dont pull that ticket..but don't just not do it because there are a few "greedy people" on the tree. Because when it comes down to it, the kids are the ones that have to pay the price.
I have taught my children, we take them on a mini vacation, and they get a few presents under the tree, but this is the season of giving..on the 24th all 3 of my children will be serving the homeless dinner. They need to see the need, and be a part of it, they are using some of there money to buy the homeless some clothing, so they give and receive, and I believe that is the way it should be.

ITA. Even when my DS was young, he got so many toys from me and family (when times were good) that he actually packed up some of his brand new toys he jst receceived that day and sent them off to the community centre and then he went accross the hall and gave his little friend one of his brand new toys.

Then again a few short years later times were really really tough, and we were one of those sponsored families. I received way too many gifts for him, as well as groceries and gently used clothing in very good condition. I literally cried when the family just kept bringing the stuff. I did not expect that much. I could not stop crying and I asked for their names so that I could tell my son where it all came from so he would understand how thankful we should be. But the lady said no way Merry Christmas from Santa.

It was a very moving experience and I will never forget it.So I see what you are saying but there are some families that really do appreciate it and need it. And maybe there is no way in heck that this family could never afford a Wii, but maybe that is why they asked for it. Or even just a less expensive system??

Sorry for the vent, but this is something I see both sides too.

Stephanie

 

[C.Ann]

ITA. Even when my DS was young, he got so many toys from me and family (when times were good) that he actually packed up some of his brand new toys he jst receceived that day and sent them off to the community centre and then he went accross the hall and gave his little friend one of his brand new toys.

Then again a few short years later times were really really tough, and we were one of those sponsored families. I received way too many gifts for him, as well as groceries and gently used clothing in very good condition. I literally cried when the family just kept bringing the stuff. I did not expect that much. I could not stop crying and I asked for their names so that I could tell my son where it all came from so he would understand how thankful we should be. But the lady said no way Merry Christmas from Santa.

It was a very moving experience and I will never forget it.So I see what you are saying but there are some families that really do appreciate it and need it. And maybe there is no way in heck that this family could never afford a Wii, but maybe that is why they asked for it. Or even just a less expensive system??

Sorry for the vent, but this is something I see both sides too.

Stephanie

-------------------------------

Thank you for sharing your story from "both" sides of the fence..

I realize that people have been "burnt" in the past - and it makes them jaded or cynical - but I will never understand why a child should be punished for their parents poor choices..

While many may not be able to afford to donate a Wii, there are plenty of other electronics that can be purchased for a song (if you watch the ads and are a careful shopper) and would bring a great deal of joy to some child on Christmas morning.. I don't go the "mittens and scarf" route because I believe there are many other sources where children can receive those items for nothing (or next to nothing) and "Coats For Kids" pass out coats that are just like brand new..

Christmas is a magical time for kids - a time for the fun things that are not available to them at any other time of the year - thus the "Wish List".. I've yet to meet a kid - poor or otherwise - who thought "mittens and a scarf" were "fun"..

 

[arminnie]

My world is different from that of most of the posters. First of all - hats, mittens, coats are really not needed in a temperate climate like in the cold nothern areas.

In my area I would NEVER give high dollar electronic items, gift cards or anything that could be easily converted to cash. Because the chances of the a child getting to keep it would be close to zero. The child would end up with nothing while the parent spent the cash on themselves. Tragic but true.

I work with some groups that collect toys. We are instructed not to leave on tags that would allow the toy to be returned to a store for money. All too often the child will not get to keep the toy if there was anyway for mom to get cash for it.

My sister is very poor. One year she really sacrified to buy gifts for a family. We risked life and limb to deliver these items during a horrible ice storm. The mom and older teenaged daughters (no small children) had way more stuff and a much higher standard of living than my poor sister. I really felt sorry for my sister as she ended up feeling scammed instead of helpful (although she never complained - I could just read it in her demeanor).

I do feel sorry for these kids. The only thing worse than not getting what they wish for is actually getting it and having mom go sell it for cash for her own indulgences.

I just don't do this Christmas stuff very much anymore (except for a few toys I put in a box). Oh I do have a rule that I always put at least a dollar in when I pass a kettle.

But I am not heartless. When I took my retirement as a lump sum I took a significant amount and created a charitable trust. I make donations year round from this trust. I just don't give particular attention to the holiday season.

 

[nana2tots]

I was going to do the same thing, except when i saw what they were asking for, gift cards, Bikes, large, large expensive items, i thought, hum, dunno!!!!

 

[Darcy03231]

I think you make a good point that is being overlooked by a lot of posters. Many posters have said they want to help, they want to donate, but maybe they planned to give $25 or $50 at this time, to this particular cause. Then they see the angel tree is asking for wii, playstation, diamond earrings...they feel like their intended contribution is "meager" or not good enough. So they don't donate at all to the angel tree...it just seems like the organizers should have enough sense not to turn away any donations, kwim? (Okay, the crackers and taco sauce should definitely have been turned away! )

I have to agree here. While we've cut back this year I was still planning to sponsor a child off the Angel Tree. Well in looking at the tags they were all for things I really couldn't afford to buy. The end result was that I didn't take one. The organizers of these drives should realize that there are those of us that want to give but also have limited budgets and can't afford to buy expensive game systems, Ipods, phones, etc. I know I'm not the only one who would have taken a tag and didn't. Several people in the mall that stopped at the same time I did commented that they couldn't afford to buy what was asked for and didn't take a tag either. I would think it would be better to make the requests more reasonable and have more people buying than list a lot of expensive things and having people skip it. I ended up taking the money I would have spent and bought food items and donated to my local food pantry and made a donation to our local Humane Society. Both of these are things I would have done anyway, I just donated more to both.