Rude or just socially unaware?

[kamik86]

And for the other posters who mention being on the spectrum or having social anxiety issues, I would have never guessed. I've read many of your posts in the past and always find them insightful, informative, well thought out and articulate. No signs of social anxiety come through to me.

Since I haven't made too many posts I'm probably not included in this but no one would tell from posts. The only person I have ever had think anything was wrong from what I have said on the internet was a woman I used to talk to that was dyslexic, had two dyslexic children, and was an educator for dyslexic children. She thought I might by dyslexic due to the way I phrased certain things. I'm not sure if I am or not if I am its really mild becasue I was reading at 4 and only have issues when I get really tired (at which points numbers and letters start reordering themselves as I read them lol).

I think many people I know in person would even be surpised by this if they knew. They just think I'm standoffish or rude because I seem to not try. (My husband has heard this from others) because I graduated high school as valedictorian. Received High honors while taking classes in an honors program for an engineering degree and I'm currently working on my masters while working full time in a leadership program. What people don't realize is that the acedemics come incrediably easy and what I really have had to work hard for is the social aspects for the leadership stuff (which I only manage because I do really well with those that are younger then me, I organized a full competition for all the high schools in the area, and the hardest part was talking to the teachers whenever I couldn't do it by email.)

 

[daisyyy]

OP - I think you might be talking about my uncle's ex girlfriend! (j/k) A lot of the same behaviors, like the taking of food when it's not technically a leftover yet, etc. We all tried to like her, honestly, but some of the things she said were downright rude, and she had a tendency to make off hand comments about my large family, although hers was just as large!

To other pp's....thanks for telling your side of things....it definitely helps when you look at things from the perspective of whether or not it's something that can be helped.

I was gonna say the same thing... OP.. we have a neighbor who does alot of those same things... and we're always like, don't she get it? But... look on the bright side, if you keep inviting her to the pot luck dinners etc, as soon as she leaves, the rest of you all have something to talk about.

 

[PrincessKsMom]

Since I haven't made too many posts I'm probably not included in this but no one would tell from posts. The only person I have ever had think anything was wrong from what I have said on the internet was a woman I used to talk to that was dyslexic, had two dyslexic children, and was an educator for dyslexic children. She thought I might by dyslexic due to the way I phrased certain things. I'm not sure if I am or not if I am its really mild becasue I was reading at 4 and only have issues when I get really tired (at which points numbers and letters start reordering themselves as I read them lol).

I think many people I know in person would even be surpised by this if they knew. They just think I'm standoffish or rude because I seem to not try. (My husband has heard this from others) because I graduated high school as valedictorian. Received High honors while taking classes in an honors program for an engineering degree and I'm currently working on my masters while working full time in a leadership program. What people don't realize is that the acedemics come incrediably easy and what I really have had to work hard for is the social aspects for the leadership stuff (which I only manage because I do really well with those that are younger then me, I organized a full competition for all the high schools in the area, and the hardest part was talking to the teachers whenever I couldn't do it by email.)

Kamik, your post has given me pause to consider the way I see others. I automatically assume they are just rude or abbrasive, without giving consideration to an actual cause. I can't imagine what it must be like to navigate the world without being able to pick up on cues. Now don't get me wrong, I have a tendancy to not shut up sometimes and I'm sure people are throwing hints my way , but to honestly be uncomfortable in the most mundane circumstances would be truly debilitating and frightening. I agree with the others, you know your behavior may be somewhat outside the "norm" but you are aware of it. Maybe if you were able to confide in someone in your office, you could use them as a sounding board in certain circumstances? Anyway, just wanted to say that I think you are very brave in sharing your circumstances with us. Hopefully no one will give you cause to regret your decision to do so.

 

[Wish I lived in Fl]

My husband helped teach me some of the social rules that had passed me by. Such as never asking if someone got their haircut unless it was to compliment them.

Hearing other people verbalize why they were doing things has helped me learn other behaviors such as standing to the side until people have exited elevators or trying to move over to the middle lane so others can enter a highway more easily.

There are also books now for explicit instruction in social skills. "Teaching Your Child the Language of Social Success", "How Children Make Friends".

Lexapro has been extremely helpful for social anxiety.

My friends have all been kind people who probably cut me a lot of slack.

 

[FireDancer]

I have only read the OP but the person described sounds both socially unaware and rude, they are not mutually exclusive. I think the former is merely an excuse for the later, not a substitute for it. Personally, I think she sounds like a nut job.

Some people are just oblivious which is also not an excuse. If no one has taught you how to behave in society do a little Google searching on social grace and etiquette. Christ on a Pony people.

 

[tasha99]

From here, we can't tell if she is rude, socially unaware, or on the autism spectrum. I would tend to give her the benefit of the doubt and assume she is doing her best, though. I think I'd actually try to kindly point out what she could do to be more socially adept (I would really like it if you rang my doorbell after 7 a.m. because I could be sleeping, etc.) If she's unaware or autistic, explicitly stating the "rules" could help, and if she's rude, who cares if she considers your advice rude back?

She could easily be on the spectrum though. I spent much of today working with kids whose speech therapy for the day was things like practicing winning and losing a game gracefully, remembering to say hello and goodbye, and staying in their space while standing in line--things that most kids pick up through example or being told once, but we go over, read social stories about and practice first with me and then with peers.

 

[Carl Fredricksen]

I also think some of the rude behavior is a byproduct of the "it's all about me" mentality that is rampant in the US-who cares if there aren't enough tarts for everyone else-we got here first.

I agree. Our society today is very "all about me" and some people just take it to the extreme. I would distance myself from her just to have less stress. Just because she lives close doesn't mean you have to interact. And if she asked, I wouldn't be shy to tell her why I didn't want anything to do with her.

 

[Katy Belle]

OP here. Sorry to disappear...my time difference and all...had to go to bed!

Well it is very interesting reading the posts of people who know they have difficulties in social situations. Honestly, I don't think Jan knows that she has issues. As to whether it is self centered-ness or something else...I'm not sure I will ever know.

I know I've been perceived as rude before...but its more of a "shy in new situations" kind of issue. I have a very hard time meeting new people, especially in a large group. I guess we all have our issues and need to realize that EVERYONE does.

As for Jan, I've limited my contact for some time now and will continue. I will be aware that the request for transport for Boy Scouts will come next year, and tell her when she can drive. As for the early mail call.... I will be ready for that too and will ask her to please just put it under DHs windshield wiper, as the doorbell wakes up the children before their alarm clocks. And I will try to think faster on my feet!

Very interesting insight everyone! I think we all learned something.

 

[Katy Belle]

Repeat post! Sorry!

 

[scrapquitler]

Some people are just wierd.

 

[ohanaMAMA]

wow. Id say she was socially unaware..No one really MEANS to be that rude. At least I cant imagine anyone trying to be that way. Makes me want to make DOUBLE sure that my kids are AWARE of others and thier actions.

 

[NotUrsula]

See today's (5/12/2010) Doonesbury for an example of unaware:
http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/

Trudeau is having fun with this, but the business about the smell is actually true. The MIT Libraries have a big issue with the smell of the main study areas during finals.

Some people are just oblivious which is also not an excuse. If no one has taught you how to behave in society do a little Google searching on social grace and etiquette. Christ on a Pony people.

That works for some people who are just anxious or who grew up isolated, but it isn't a solution for the autistic. With most folks on the spectrum, that's like asking an alcoholic to do his own intervention. They do not understand that they are the ones causing the other person's reaction. They just assume that the other person is the one with the problem, if indeed they see a problem at all. DS has a classmate who he often refers to as a friend, but the boy in question has told quite a few people (including his mother, who apologetically told me) that he cannot stand DS and thinks he is a freak. Their very brusque necessary interactions appear normal to DS, because everyone he knows other than close family speak to him exactly the same way.

 

[ZeitgeistDuck]

I have only read the OP but the person described sounds both socially unaware and rude, they are not mutually exclusive. I think the former is merely an excuse for the later, not a substitute for it. Personally, I think she sounds like a nut job.

Some people are just oblivious which is also not an excuse. If no one has taught you how to behave in society do a little Google searching on social grace and etiquette. Christ on a Pony people.

I'm a little irritated that someone who has never dealt with social awkwardness likes to stigmatize those with possible asperger's and autism as "nut jobs" and thinks they can google their way out of it. I would say the intolerance is more nutty and, you know, you should google that and get some sensitivity.
\

 

[kirstenb1]

See today's (5/12/2010) Doonesbury for an example of unaware:
http://www.gocomics.com/doonesbury/

Trudeau is having fun with this, but the business about the smell is actually true. The MIT Libraries have a big issue with the smell of the main study areas during finals.



That works for some people who are just anxious or who grew up isolated, but it isn't a solution for the autistic. With most folks on the spectrum, that's like asking an alcoholic to do his own intervention. They do not understand that they are the ones causing the other person's reaction. They just assume that the other person is the one with the problem, if indeed they see a problem at all. DS has a classmate who he often refers to as a friend, but the boy in question has told quite a few people (including his mother, who apologetically told me) that he cannot stand DS and thinks he is a freak. Their very brusque necessary interactions appear normal to DS, because everyone he knows other than close family speak to him exactly the same way.

 

[FireDancer]

I'm a little irritated that someone who has never dealt with social awkwardness likes to stigmatize those with possible asperger's and autism as "nut jobs" and thinks they can google their way out of it. I would say the intolerance is more nutty and, you know, you should google that and get some sensitivity.
\

My hypothesis was based on the information in the OP, which didn't mention anything about asperger's or autism. If anyone asked me to my face if they could use me, which is what I would consider the boy scouts request in the OP to be, I would think them a weirdo and respond with a laugh and door slam.

I love how on all of these threads people jump to these weird conclusions that the person in question has <insert disease or ailment here>. These people are the minority and while it is possible, the OP made no suggestion that the people had any of these ailments. Until I am presented with something that leads me to the conclusion that the person doesn't fall into the fat middle of the society curve I will make the rational assumption that they are a part of the majority and not an unsubstantiated minority.

 

[tasha99]

My hypothesis was based on the information in the OP, which didn't mention anything about asperger's or autism. If anyone asked me to my face if they could use me, which is what I would consider the boy scouts request in the OP to be, I would think them a weirdo and respond with a laugh and door slam.

I love how on all of these threads people jump to these weird conclusions that the person in question has <insert disease or ailment here>. These people are the minority and while it is possible, the OP made no suggestion that the people had any of these ailments. Until I am presented with something that leads me to the conclusion that the person doesn't fall into the fat middle of the society curve I will make the rational assumption that they are a part of the majority and not an unsubstantiated minority.

Well, none of us knows whether this woman has issues or not, but it isn't unreasonable to think she might. A very small number of typical people would behave the way she has, but a large number of people with Asperger Syndrome would.

 

[FireDancer]

Well, none of us knows whether this woman has issues or not, but it isn't unreasonable to think she might. A very small number of typical people would behave the way she has, but a large number of people with Asperger Syndrome would.

While that is true I have encountered enough people who are perfectly normal and completely oblivious to jump to the Asperger conclusion without more evidence.

Even a small percentage of a large population is often greater then a large percentage of a small population and I would hypothesize that there are more normal oblivious people walking the Earth then people with a condition that makes them incapable of acting differently.

My nut job statement was in reference to the former not the later so I am sorry if there was any misunderstanding.

 

[cheermom1]

Well, none of us knows whether this woman has issues or not, but it isn't unreasonable to think she might. A very small number of typical people would behave the way she has, but a large number of people with Asperger Syndrome would.

I defiantly agree as I have child with this. I have to tell you his dad is the same way or was. His dad is so much better as the people in his life has helped but since his mom didn;t do anything and let him do what he wanted it was a struggle for him as an adult. These type of people tend to mature at a much slower rate as well. Things just don;t click to them, they really don;t understand what the deal is or what they are doing is wrong or even that it is a big deal. Hygiene is a HUGE issue with them as well b/c they really don't understand that if you stink that it effects other people and not just them. They seem to be in their own world and can;t seem to think beyond their world either. BUT they are some of the smartest people I have ever been around. My son can just listen to a teacher and he seems to be in another world but he can tell you word for word what that teacher said. All his teachers tell me the same thing he is sooooo very smart but he struggles with interacting with the other kids. They have to be told over and over what to do in social settings and how to act and not act.

I don't know if this lady has this or not but I can tell you my experience with my son.

 

[freckles and boo]

While that is true I have encountered enough people who are perfectly normal and completely oblivious to jump to the Asperger conclusion without more evidence.

Even a small percentage of a large population is often greater then a large percentage of a small population and I would hypothesize that there are more normal oblivious people walking the Earth then people with a condition that makes them incapable of acting differently.

My nut job statement was in reference to the former not the later so I am sorry if there was any misunderstanding.

The OP stated that this appeared to be a pattern of behavior and for those of us who are familiar with autism, and Asperger's in particular, red flags went up. None of us know the neighbor nor are we psychologists, but we know autism all too well. The fact is, I am prepared for insensitive, clueless people to assume my kid is a "nut-job" or "weird". She just turned eight and she is doing very well. She is very smart and funny and everyone who takes the time to know her finds her charming. However, I am sure she will encounter people who will judge her before they know her and assume that her "rudeness" is intentional instead of the manifestation of her struggles with theory of mind. We are doing our very best to prepare her for this world but the world is also going to have to take a step back and realize that there is an ARMY of autistic children marching toward adulthood.

 

[ZeitgeistDuck]

While that is true I have encountered enough people who are perfectly normal and completely oblivious to jump to the Asperger conclusion without more evidence.

Even a small percentage of a large population is often greater then a large percentage of a small population and I would hypothesize that there are more normal oblivious people walking the Earth then people with a condition that makes them incapable of acting differently.

My nut job statement was in reference to the former not the later so I am sorry if there was any misunderstanding.

How do you know these people are not simply undiagnosed? Among adults in the 30+ age range neuro issues like Asperger's went largely undiagosed in childhood.

Really, my irritation about your post is that some of the earlier posters really opened up about thier own struggles and they feared someone EXACTLY LIKE YOU coming along and judging. Its reactions EXACTLY LIKE THIS that lead to isolation. Not to mention all the parents that posted with socially challenged children. For a person with anxiety about social akwardness hearing people throw around phrases like 'nut job' is devestating. You really should read before you post.