Rant: The DDP is ruining everything!

[kdzgon]

......I'm much too burnt out on this topic, and am now sticking to posting only sunny, happy threads, as I'm soon on my way!!

I'm not heading anywhere just yet, but I AM trying to get off this thread. I deleted it from my subscription list but keep getting an email every time someone posts (not just one until I visit - one for every post!). I have no clue what I am doing wrong. Can anyone please help me get off this thread??
Thanks!

 

[saschab]

Go to User CP, find List Subscriptions. That will show you all your subs and to the right will be boxes to add/subtract from email notification.

If you've done that and it's still following you....well, be afraid, be very afraid...

 

[kaytieeldr]

Vegas is definitely a fine dining destination and WDW was becomming one also.

I disagree. LAS Vegas is definitely a gambling destination, with added features such as shows and fine - along with all other levels of - dining options. Walt Disney World is a theme park destination with a variety of dining options/opportunities as well - but in NEITHER case is dining the FOCUS of the destination.

I do not begrudge anyone using the DDP. Disney has set up the program and everyone is welcome to use it. I don't understand what the objection to people on the DDP is to two menus. If Disney has come up with a way to let more people have TS meals and lays out what choices can be ordered on the plan, why would one have a problem with there being other menu items that are not included on DDP?

"Here you go, sir. For an investment of $38 per person per night, you may have one snack, one counter service meal, and one table service meal at which you get a salad; your choice of either a steak, a chicken breast, or spaghetti; and for dessert, a dish of ice cream. Oh, please, pay no attention to those Guests at the next table with actual menus, they're paying the menu price so they get a larger selection".
There are already many people who are unhappy with the Fantasmic! Dining Plan at Mama Melrose's because there is no appetizer choice - you have to take what's included - even though the ENTIRE BALANCE of the F!DP menu is IDENTICAL to the non-F!DP menu. How would incorporating a similar practice at ALL Disney restaurants be 'reasonable'?

Besides those not informing themselves on what they purchase (their fault), that is Disney's problem to solve. Even with DDP as it stands now, there is not enough info and not enough consistency. I'm hoping that will change.

Not every potential WDW Guest is aware of sites like wdwinfo.com and allearsnet.com and disboards.com which have, among other information, as up-to-date as possible WDW restaurant menus - so if those people don't know there's a way TO research menus in advance, how can it be their 'faults'?

My thoughts: Make the menus great again and either charge more for the dining plan or.....have a DDP menu that limits what they can order, dont punish the people wha are paying OOP

Yep. Punish the Guests who pay in advance, instead.

I did not think this at all, but there is one exception, CG, the new menu has really upset me, compared to the others is is just cheap, maybe they are trying to get enough complaints so they can pull out of the DDP

I don't get the big deal about this. If a diner at California Grill is on the DDP, they get an appetizer from the appetizer menu, an entree from the entree menu, and a dessert from the dessert menu. If a diner at CG is NOT on the Dining Plan, they can order whatever they want - just because an item is LISTED on the entree menu doesn't mean a non-DDP diner can't order it as their appetizer. A lot of people are complaining because they do go to Disney for the food; surely those Guests have been to enough restaurants in the past that they already know this?

 

[Amyrlin]

I I don't get the big deal about this. If a diner at California Grill is on the DDP, they get an appetizer from the appetizer menu, an entree from the entree menu, and a dessert from the dessert menu. If a diner at CG is NOT on the Dining Plan, they can order whatever they want - just because an item is LISTED on the entree menu doesn't mean a non-DDP diner can't order it as their appetizer. A lot of people are complaining because they do go to Disney for the food; surely those Guests have been to enough restaurants in the past that they already know this?

I am not talking about the changes in terms of categorising the dishes, such as an entree, if you look at the actual entreees that are avaible they have down graded a lot of them them, cheaper entrees with cheaper ingedients. This is a basic menu issue, they look like subtle changes but they make a difference on the food. I really enjoyed having a good quality meal at CG, the food will prob. still be good, but no longer that special.


If all you want is an appisiters,m an entree and a dessert, then why bother choosing any resturant, just be happy with what you get wherever you end up. CG is loosing a lot of its appeal becuse of the way it is changing.

 

[rie'smom]

I disagree. LAS Vegas is definitely a gambling destination, with added features such as shows and fine - along with all other levels of - dining options. Walt Disney World is a theme park destination with a variety of dining options/opportunities as well - but in NEITHER case is dining the FOCUS of the destination.
"Here you go, sir. For an investment of $38 per person per night, you may have one snack, one counter service meal, and one table service meal at which you get a salad; your choice of either a steak, a chicken breast, or spaghetti; and for dessert, a dish of ice cream. Oh, please, pay no attention to those Guests at the next table with actual menus, they're paying the menu price so they get a larger selection".
There are already many people who are unhappy with the Fantasmic! Dining Plan at Mama Melrose's because there is no appetizer choice - you have to take what's included - even though the ENTIRE BALANCE of the F!DP menu is IDENTICAL to the non-F!DP menu. How would incorporating a similar practice at ALL Disney restaurants be 'reasonable'?
Not every potential WDW Guest is aware of sites like wdwinfo.com and allearsnet.com and disboards.com which have, among other information, as up-to-date as possible WDW restaurant menus - so if those people don't know there's a way TO research menus in advance, how can it be their 'faults'?
Yep. Punish the Guests who pay in advance, instead.
I don't get the big deal about this. If a diner at California Grill is on the DDP, they get an appetizer from the appetizer menu, an entree from the entree menu, and a dessert from the dessert menu. If a diner at CG is NOT on the Dining Plan, they can order whatever they want - just because an item is LISTED on the entree menu doesn't mean a non-DDP diner can't order it as their appetizer. A lot of people are complaining because they do go to Disney for the food; surely those Guests have been to enough restaurants in the past that they already know this?

Many people who have been to WDW love to go there to enjoy the food. Some desire a relaxing trip and think of the restaurant experience as their vacation. I don't know what the Las Vegas thing has to do with WDW and frankly I have no desire to as that is one destination I have no intention of visiting.
If I'm paying menu price,why shouldn't I have a better selection? When I pay to stay in a deluxe hotel,I get to have table service and a nicer pool than if I paid to stay in a value hotel.
As for those who don't research their trips and the menus or restaurants,oh well. I don't think our trip should be less enjoyable because they don't pick up a guide book or google online WDW sites.
If people pay in advance for the DDP,that's a choice they make. If WDW does decide to do two tiered dining,again people would have a choice. Either pay for the plan and have a limited selection or pay the menu price OOP and have a larger selection.
I'm very sure that many of us have been to enough restaurants to know that we're being short-changed because the variety of menu choices has been cut to be able to have a DDP.

 

[CR Resort Fan 4 Life]

"Here you go, sir. For an investment of $38 per person per night, you may have one snack, one counter service meal, and one table service meal at which you get a salad; your choice of either a steak, a chicken breast, or spaghetti; and for dessert, a dish of ice cream. Oh, please, pay no attention to those Guests at the next table with actual menus, they're paying the menu price so they get a larger selection".
There are already many people who are unhappy with the Fantasmic! Dining Plan at Mama Melrose's because there is no appetizer choice - you have to take what's included - even though the ENTIRE BALANCE of the F!DP menu is IDENTICAL to the non-F!DP menu. How would incorporating a similar practice at ALL Disney restaurants be 'reasonable'?

If WDW were to have seperate menus for guests on the DDP & they see guests who are not on it with bigger portions of food, or eating something off the regular menu, then they should not complain about smaller food sizes & etc. They choose to take the DDP, so if you ask me guests who are not on the DDP are the ones who are treated as 2nd class citizens when it comes to menu items, portions sizes & feeling rushed to eat so the CM can turn the the table over for the next party of people that will need it. However since a lot of guests take the DDP, the restaurants have to accomodate their menus & services based on it, which is not fair to guests who are not on the DDP. So based on what I have said, I would be in favor for seperate menus for guests on the DDP & guests not on the DDP. I would like to end this by saying, why should we have to have a limited suggestion of food items & smaller portions just because of all other guests on the DDP?

 

[S.Poppins]

Wow, 13 pages! I apologize I was very wrong!

 

[Fairy_Tale_Bride]

If WDW were to have seperate menus for guests on the DDP & they see guests who are not on it with bigger portions of food, or eating something off the regular menu, then they should not complain about smaller food sizes & etc. They choose to take the DDP, so if you ask me guests who are not on the DDP are the ones who are treated as 2nd class citizens when it comes to menu items, portions sizes & feeling rushed to eat so the CM can turn the the table over for the next party of people that will need it. However since a lot of guests take the DDP, the restaurants have to accomodate their menus & services based on it, which is not fair to guests who are not on the DDP. So based on what I have said, I would be in favor for seperate menus for guests on the DDP & guests not on the DDP. I would like to end this by saying, why should we have to have a limited suggestion of food items & smaller portions just because of all other guests on the DDP?

AMEN!

 

[everest]

I wonder if somewhere Disney is having this debate “stay with the current plan or tweak the old way”
And if they are, what do you think their answer would be?

 

[disneyjunkie]

If they go with two menus, what's next?

Should those paying full rate to stay in a resort get more perks than those using a code or AP rate?

What about the Fantasmic Dinner Package? Shouldn't the people who book the package get the best seats in the house?

Let's not forget park passes. Some of us purchases passes from WDW. Others take advantage of discount prices from Ticketmanina. Should those who pay full price get more perks than those with discounted tickets?

 

[gina2000]

Well, early bird specials have limited menus and to me, the DDP gives me that feeling when I see how the menus have changed. I know you're getting a discounted meal. That's your choice. As an OOP restaurant goer, I know I'm not getting a discounted meal. That's MY choice. It doesn't work for me.

The way it stands right now, menu prices have stayed the same but reflect meals that no longer have the panache and originality they once did. Those original prices included a price for originality. Sure, if you look at the menu, you're getting a bargain on the DDP. And sure, you ARE getting a bargain by prepaying and using a meal plan. But you're NOT getting California Grill or any other restaurant at it's best and most creative. Sorry, that's a fact. The other fact is neither are those of us who aren't on the plan.

I'm figuring the Disney gurus want to show filled hotels at rack rates to their shareholders. The restaurants are taking the hit. They've created a restaurant menu based on an artificially low price and over time the restaurants have no choice but to provide food at that price without bankrupting themselves. Hence the menu changes. Beancounters are also trying to streamline restaurant costs and what better way to do so than buying in bulk as opposed to allowing their restaurant managers and chefs to buy the quality they seek at a price more closely aligned to the original menu prices. It leaves those of us off the plan with a certain feeling that our business isn't the business WDW currently courts. So, we go elsewhere. Guaranteed.

Over time, the DDP cost will rise until it's no longer a bargain. It may not rise in actual dollars and cents but in a decline in quality at the restaurants. For some people, that will work. But for many of us who have gone to WDW to enjoy fine dining, it won't. But that's okay. Orlando has some great restaurants as does the S/D.

It's obvious that WDW is no longer courting regular TS restaurant goers. We saw that as early as February 2006. It was obvious the quality had declined drastically at the WDW restaurants. It's a shame. But it is their choice.

 

[Lewisc]

If WDW were to have seperate menus for guests on the DDP & they see guests who are not on it with bigger portions of food, or eating something off the regular menu, then they should not complain about smaller food sizes & etc. They choose to take the DDP, so if you ask me guests who are not on the DDP are the ones who are treated as 2nd class citizens when it comes to menu items, portions sizes & feeling rushed to eat so the CM can turn the the table over for the next party of people that will need it. However since a lot of guests take the DDP, the restaurants have to accomodate their menus & services based on it, which is not fair to guests who are not on the DDP. So based on what I have said, I would be in favor for seperate menus for guests on the DDP & guests not on the DDP. I would like to end this by saying, why should we have to have a limited suggestion of food items & smaller portions just because of all other guests on the DDP?

NOTHING LIKE MAKING UP FACTS TO try and prove a point. There is no evidence the menu reduction and standardization is a result of the dining plan. The fact that Disney is doing the same thing to the bar menu is evidence to the contrary.

I'll agree moving the sushi to the entrée section of the menu is probably DDP driven but that doesn't have an impact on cash guests who can simply ask to have sushi served with the other appetizers.

Unless Disney changes the marketing material to explicitly state that dining guests order off a special, limited menu, DDP guests have a right to complain if they are limited.

Cash guests who don't like the menus have the option of eating in signature restaurants, Bistro, V&A and 2 or 3 restaurants in the Swan/Dolphin.

 

[IWISHFORDISNEY]

I have been going to Disney for 20 plus years and this will be our first time on the plan. I just kept doing the math for the places we like to eat and it was always cheaper to do the plan. We seemed to have booked mostly buffet type meals like Boma and Ohana and CP so hopefully the food is the same there as before. I really dont know if it is a good thing or a bad thing but I sort of felt forced into the plan for the sheer dollar fact. We were at the world in July. NO plan. Dinner for me, DH and DS (free 18 mo old) at Boma was $71 with tip. Now figure it would only be $5 more for the plan for both of us. It is way cheaper. Two drinks will run us that much. Much less our CS lunch we usually share. So I felt I had to get the plan even though we may actually loose some money. We always eat a TS meal but not always lunch. So we will probably end up with left over credits for CS.

How do we fix this dilema is my question?

 

[BillSears]

Disney already has started a 2 tier system seperating DDP patrons from those who pay OOP.

Currently Disney has implemented a three tier system for the HDDR. DDP users are only allowed to choose the lowest 2 tiers. So right now those DDP people go to the HDDR and get to see those paying OOP sitting in the better seats that they cannot get.

 

[dizfanz]

Disney already has started a 2 tier system seperating DDP patrons from those who pay OOP.

Currently Disney has implemented a three tier system for the HDDR. DDP users are only allowed to choose the lowest 2 tiers. So right now those DDP people go to the HDDR and get to see those paying OOP sitting in the better seats that they cannot get.

And I for one see nothing wrong with that. Give them the option to pay cash to get a better seating tier if they want. That's fair, right?

 

[BillSears]

And I for one see nothing wrong with that. Give them the option to pay cash to get a better seating tier if they want. That's fair, right?

I agree, you should get what you pay for. If you want to pay less you should get less. If you want to pay more then you should be able to get more expensive options.

 

[Local_Girl]

Well, early bird specials have limited menus and to me, the DDP gives me that feeling when I see how the menus have changed. I know you're getting a discounted meal. That's your choice. As an OOP restaurant goer, I know I'm not getting a discounted meal. That's MY choice. It doesn't work for me.

The way it stands right now, menu prices have stayed the same but reflect meals that no longer have the panache and originality they once did. Those original prices included a price for originality. Sure, if you look at the menu, you're getting a bargain on the DDP. And sure, you ARE getting a bargain by prepaying and using a meal plan. But you're NOT getting California Grill or any other restaurant at it's best and most creative. Sorry, that's a fact. The other fact is neither are those of us who aren't on the plan.

I'm figuring the Disney gurus want to show filled hotels at rack rates to their shareholders. The restaurants are taking the hit. They've created a restaurant menu based on an artificially low price and over time the restaurants have no choice but to provide food at that price without bankrupting themselves. Hence the menu changes. Beancounters are also trying to streamline restaurant costs and what better way to do so than buying in bulk as opposed to allowing their restaurant managers and chefs to buy the quality they seek at a price more closely aligned to the original menu prices. It leaves those of us off the plan with a certain feeling that our business isn't the business WDW currently courts. So, we go elsewhere. Guaranteed.

Over time, the DDP cost will rise until it's no longer a bargain. It may not rise in actual dollars and cents but in a decline in quality at the restaurants. For some people, that will work. But for many of us who have gone to WDW to enjoy fine dining, it won't. But that's okay. Orlando has some great restaurants as does the S/D.

It's obvious that WDW is no longer courting regular TS restaurant goers. We saw that as early as February 2006. It was obvious the quality had declined drastically at the WDW restaurants. It's a shame. But it is their choice.

Very well said.

 

[tinkerrn]

We have been to WDW several times over the last few years and have seen a huge difference in quality. This decline in quality and service has been obserevd in not only the restaurants, but also the resorts. We used to love to get away from the daily grind and go to WDW to relax and have fun. Well, it was far from fun or relaxing this last trip. It was just a a huge let down. The offerings at the restaurants were smaller and the quality was not even comparable to a Denny's or a Perkins. Not one table service meal was up to the Disney standard we have come to expect and love.

We always pay out of pocket and have never been on DDP. We want quality NOT quanity when we go to WDW. WDW used to be a splurge for us, now we need to either find a different time of year to go ( NOT during FREE dinning) or just wait until the service and quality return.

This past trip over a month ago was not like any other I have experienced at WDW. It was almost embarassing how things have changed. I am hoping that another time of the year will make a difference. Keep the DDP, I will eat outside of the park for qulaity food until things have change.

Sorry, to those of you who enjoyed the DDP. I understand that it can be a good thing for those with multiple people in their parties, but not for those who desire quality service and food.

 

[mickman1962]

I don't think you can say all the changes are Disney's fault and/or blame it exclusively on the DDP.

I think there is plenty of blame to put on those that abused the program from the begining, by paying $10.99 and feeding an adult lobster and steak on that.

I remember you and I getting slammed over and over again trying to make that point. It's sad to see it coming true.

 

[DCDisney]

My perception from these boards is that there are far more people sharing meals on the DDP than using kids credits for adult meals. If they started a sharing charge or a charge like in the family style places where each person has to use a credit I think it would make far more financial difference both on the DDP and off than worrying about the whole adult/kids mess beyond telling people not to do it.

I can't see the dining plan going away as now they are filling nearly every place every night where they weren't before. It seems like now they are just trying to maximize profits by decreasing portions and less expensive ingredients. Over time I'm sure there will be more to come--people have mentioned making more places have price fix meals. I can't see things going back especially if they can keep seats full even if they run off certain type of clients. Nearly doubling the price at CRT for example, they still fill every seat. As long as someone will take the seat in the restaurant Disney doesn't seem to care who it is and the DDP guarantees them a certain minimum profit.

Yvonne