Problem in education

[sorul82?]

Eww!! You are either a troll or someone who might benefit from kindergarten level special education services.

....although you know what? Your not worth my money-I think I'd rather give it to Goofyluver's kid-even though he's no longer progressing, my guess is his level of class and dignity are much more advanced than this guy!

 

[sorul82?]

Here is a great article that a fellow DISer shared with me:

www.nypost.com/seven/12132008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/outlawing_boyhood_144034.htm

 

[Pembo]

No one has mentioned the lessons that the child with a disability teaches the typical child. The typical child is learning patience, tolerance, humility and empathy among other things. These children will grow up understanding difference and will embrace it not try to hide it...as in the past.

 

[sorul82?]

Wait, so you mean if my mum hadn't died and, thus condemned me to growing up without both a mummy and daddy (how selfish of her), I could be doing so much better in terms of education?? I wouldn't have to settle for a lowly PhD?

Wow - generalize much?

So many snarky and inappropriate thoughts are running through my mind. I will refrain and say, just think, if you had both parents around, you could have been a god.

 

[castleview]

No one has mentioned the lessons that the child with a disability teaches the typical child. The typical child is learning patience, tolerance, humility and empathy among other things. These children will grow up understanding difference and will embrace it not try to hide it...as in the past.

While that is true, the typical child is also there to reach their academic ability. Tolerance and empathy are wonderful, but not an excuse to put the needs of the other children in the class on the back burner.

 

[Goofyluver]

Goofyluver, I wanted to thank you for answering and everything you said does makes sense. I really never gave much thought about what an IEP does for students and you have enlightened me. I was asking my dd who is in an inclusion class this year and she said that someo f the IEP students are taken out of class but some remain during certain lessons. She said they go to the cafeteria so I guess they don't have an actual classroom (obvious budget issues), but some of them are seperated from the other students. My son is also in the inclusion class for his grade and he says the students do not leave the classroom
I do know that some extreme cases have to be transferred out of our school to a school with a self contained classroom, we do not have one.

You are welcome.

I've been watching this conversation. I'm curious what electives you are talking about. If I had a special needs child, I know I'd fight for everything that you do. But I do understand the concerns of mainstream parents who want to make sure their kids' education isn't watered down to achieve this.

I think many people would be surprised at how well these children can adapt and participate in these classrooms.

This semester my DS has home ec and a computer class. He gets to cook and learn to use computers just like everyone else.

Last semester, he had art and computers.

We choose electives which he will be able to participate in.

Participation in mainstreamed classrooms is very important for these children. More so than typically developing children.

 

[mickeyboat]

Participation in mainstreamed classrooms is very important for these children. More so than typically developing children.

Can you elaborate, please?

 

[sorul82?]

I really hope you never have to eat your words. Every child deserves an education. There isn't one person here who couldn't end up disabled tomorrow, nor their children. I think compassion is seriously underrated.

I was thinking the same thing. I remember this guy in high school who would constantly make fun of the special needs kids. I remember in English one day, this girl made a really dumb statement and he said, "such and such, you are so retarded, why don't you get a wheel chair and go join the rest of the drooling retards." It was non stop with him. He picked on somebody everyday. Well, he is now married and has a wheel chair bound child (I think with spinal bifida).

 

[freckles and boo]

Can you elaborate, please?

I don't know about her child, but my daughter has autism. Autistic kids almost universally need to be taught the social skills that other kids learn naturally. The more "typical" peers they are around the more they learn what is "typical" behavior. Making friends is also very difficult for kids with autism. By being around typical kids now, in first grade, when they are less judgmental and cruel, she has the opportunity to be accepted for who she is. When she gets to sixth grade (and by then I believe she will be ready to be completely in a regular education setting) these kids will not be thinking "Who is that weird girl?" but instead "Oh, that is Shannon". Right now she takes gym, library, art, music, and computers with a regular first graders and is having a blast.

 

[sorul82?]

I don't know about her child, but my daughter has autism. Autistic kids almost universally need to be taught the social skills that other kids learn naturally. The more "typical" peers they are around the more they learn what is "typical" behavior. Making friends is also very difficult for kids with autism. By being around typical kids now, in first grade, when they are less judgmental and cruel, she has the opportunity to be accepted for who she is. When she gets to sixth grade (and by then I believe she will be ready to be completely in a regular education setting) these kids will not be thinking "Who is that weird girl?" but instead "Oh, that is Shannon". Right now she takes gym, library, art, music, and computers with a regular first graders and is having a blast.

Hopefully, things will be different for your daughter, but my 6th grade Aspberger son was more accepted in 1st grade than he is now. I'm trying to leave him in public school as long as possible with those "common" kids so he can learn "life." BTW, the kid who is bullying him the most comes from a two parent, well to do family. Yet this kid is constantly in trouble and his grades aren't the best. I'm not really sure why he's even in the advanced classes.

 

[Goofyluver]

Can you elaborate, please?

Absolutely.

These children need to be around their peers in order to learn appropriate social, emotional, cognitive, and physical behaviors. By surrounding these kiddos with what we call "typically developing peers", they are able to learn and imitate behaviors that are typical for their age group. Socialization is an amazing teacher. Children can often learn better from their peers.

Correspondingly, typically developing children can learn much from their peers with special needs.

 

[Colleen27]

What? Everything was peachy until NCLB?

No, but NCLB was one of those things where the cure ios worse than the disease, IMO. Now on top off all the issues they had before NCLB, schools have the additional expense of testing, the addition time-demand of extensive test prep, and the constant pressure to improve even upon success. We have excellent schools in my area failing to make AYP now because of their special ed subgroup. NCLB's goal is admirable but impossible - not all children are capable of performing at the mandated level, and in many, many cases that is not the fault of the schools.

 

[Mommy2three]

In my opinion the teachers today have no training and in dealing with kids with special needs. I have had to pull my two oldest, 8 and 7 out of school to homeschool them now because the teachers have no idea how to handle them. They have psychological special needs. I think now a days teachers need more training on special needs, and not just ADD and ADHD. Both of my kids have ADHD, bipolar, and my daughter has both of those along with DID, schizophrenia, odd, ocd, and the teacher had no idea how to deal with any of those problems when they would arise, she would start crying and they would tell her she could do whatever she wanted to do because they were afraid of her problems and not knowing how to deal with it, even though her teacher last year gave them suggestions, and she was the greatest teacher, and I had given suggestions every week to the teacher, but she just didnt want to listen.

 

[castleview]

In my opinion the teachers today have no training and in dealing with kids with special needs. I have had to pull my two oldest, 8 and 7 out of school to homeschool them now because the teachers have no idea how to handle them. They have psychological special needs. I think now a days teachers need more training on special needs, and not just ADD and ADHD. Both of my kids have ADHD, bipolar, and my daughter has both of those along with DID, schizophrenia, odd, ocd, and the teacher had no idea how to deal with any of those problems when they would arise, she would start crying and they would tell her she could do whatever she wanted to do because they were afraid of her problems and not knowing how to deal with it, even though her teacher last year gave them suggestions, and she was the greatest teacher, and I had given suggestions every week to the teacher, but she just didnt want to listen.

Does your daughter have an aide? It sounds like she needs specialized attention from someone trained with a medical background. I wouldn't expect that of people hired to teach math and language. While I don't have a problem with a school providing for this, I think it's unfair to have the teacher solely responsible.

 

[sorul82?]

So, you're pro-choice if the woman is single.

Interesting theory.

What does that have to do with anything?
I am at a loss concerning the above.

Because, Edward, you say that a kid needs both parents. So, if a woman is raped and finds herself pregnant, she should abort or marry the rapist. You made your black and white point very clear.

 

[Goofyluver]

Because, Edward, you say that a kid needs both parents. So, if a woman is raped and finds herself pregnant, she should abort or marry the rapist. You made your black and white point very clear.

Stop. Making. Sense.

Your turn Edward.

 

[freckles and boo]

Hopefully, things will be different for your daughter, but my 6th grade Aspberger son was more accepted in 1st grade than he is now. I'm trying to leave him in public school as long as possible with those "common" kids so he can learn "life." BTW, the kid who is bullying him the most comes from a two parent, well to do family. Yet this kid is constantly in trouble and his grades aren't the best. I'm not really sure why he's even in the advanced classes.

I am sorry your son is being targeted. This is one of the things that I lose sleep over. Nobody should be bullied.

 

[Goofyluver]

I am sorry your son is being targeted. This is one of the things that I lose sleep over. Nobody should be bullied.

Unfortunately, these children have targets on their back.

Funny...I wonder if these nasty kids learn some of this behavior from their parents?

 

[sorul82?]

I went to a private school until 6th grade. My monthly friend arrived in the 4th grade, 4th GRADE and I started wearing a bra in 5th. I was picked on everyday by these so-called high class, rich, church going, two parent kids (which I was one of). They were brutal. Not to just me, but to the girl whose mom shopped at K-Mart and to the kids who didn't own a 22' boat nor a condo at the beach. Half of those kids aren't functional in society today. A few are pot or crack heads, one is dead from OD-ing, one an alcoholic, one in a mental institution. These kids were sheltered from the real world and they were not prepared for the butt kicking they received. SO maybe it was good that my parents divorced? After all, I do have an MBA and have never been arrested.

 

[jcc0621]

There were lots of things that I could poste here, but since I don't want to get banned I think I will keep my mouth shut. Others before me have pretty much stated what I wanted to say (Goofyluvr and Sorul82 ), but I did need to comment on this.

What would happen if schools were run by CEO's and run like a business? I seem to remember reading of districts that had done this.

They did that here in our district and it was a COMPLETE disaster. 1/2 the schools have been taken back by the Board of Education becasue the so called Educator/CEO's took the money, did absolutely nothing and the drop out rate in those schools tripled. Anothher third were just so poorly managed that when they were audited they couldn't even tell you what they spent money on (i.e books, computers). Another 1/3 are doing ok....the one's that are doing "ok" are the single sex schools, which makes me laugh because there was actually a big to-do when these schools were first proposed. People calling it sexist, etc. However, the non-coed schools I believe reiterate the point made in the article posted by sorul82 several pages back!