Principal 'paddling' first grader for damaging computer

Which part? The part where we try to find different ways to correct behavior?
Yes. Because now kids have nothing to feel consequences, no God in school or society and no structure or effective discipline. As long as you balance love with discipline then there is nothing wrong with a spank. At different ages different things work. But, the fear of dad coming home and giving you a good swat keeps any kid in line.
 
Yes. Because now kids have nothing to feel consequences, no God in school or society and no structure or effective discipline. As long as you balance love with discipline then there is nothing wrong with a spank. At different ages different things work. But, the fear of dad coming home and giving you a good swat keeps any kid in line.
Yeah..not touching the religion part

I won't disagree that there has been overcompensating for past things in some respects and for some parents. But I consider it progress that more and more we care for the whys behind. Why is the child misbehaving, why did they do this or that. Before there really wasn't tolerance or care into why. Just do this and that's that. If correcting the behavior is the goal finding out why the behavior occurred in the first place sounds like they would go hand in hand, they just didn't as much before. I suppose that would all depend on the goal. If the goal was to exert power and authority over someone (as an example) yeah you might have a different viewpoint on not caring why the child is acting out. I do think most of us think the paddling in the video is wrong (but I do say most).

I didn't respond to get into a debate over whether there is something wrong with a swat or a spank but just to bring up that our viewpoints are becoming more complex on the issue. I personally don't think that's a problem, I find the opposite to have been the problem. And remember the parents most often talked about right now are the ones raised by parents who didn't see much of an issue with spanking and whatnot, I have to wonder if in general that tactic had the intended effect. Just like it's often forgotten that many millennials were raised by boomers (and I seldom use the actual generational cohorts like that).
 
Two abusers. How fun! One to hit a child, one to watch.

How can you even find one person to partake in such an act, especially in a school setting?

Easily, because at the time, corporal punishment of kids was normal in the US, both at school and at home. Perceptions of what constitutes "cruel" have changed exponentially over the past half-century plus, and they still differ enormously by culture.

I don’t think permission from the parent was always the case. Must depend on where you lived. My dad didn’t know any of these stories until I was full grown and told him. I remember my stepmother finding out they paddled my stepbrother and marching into the school full on Mama Bear. It was a sight to behold.

It wasn't. In most parts of the US, corporal punishment or one sort or another was usual in schools up until the 1960s, and it hung on longer in religious schools. Wooden paddles were once standard Principal's office decor; they were usually kept hung on the outer wall just where kids could see them, as a visual deterrent. What a lot of people now don't realize is that many kids were given the choice of being paddled, and chose it deliberately. The way that it usually was presented was that you could take the "licks" immediately, then go back to class and nothing more would be said, and your parents would not be notified of what you had done. However, if you chose not to take the "licks", then your parents would be notified, and then THEY would be free to come up with whatever creative punishment they could think of. Most kids were way more scared of how angry their parents would be, vs. the known quantity of a specified number of licks from the paddle. Most common infractions rated 2-4 licks; in the districts where I attended there was a set list that specified the maximum allowed.

When the tide started to change I was in grade school, & I can clearly remember having to bring home a form that allowed my parents to opt out of paddling. By the time I hit high school the form was reversed; you had to sign to opt in and allow it.

(BTW, when I was in grade school the standard rumor was that our principal had an electric paddle; a frame that you supposedly stood in that could be set at a certain force. The rowdier kids reveled in scaring the bejeezus out of the goodie-good kids with that one. In actuality, the one special "innovation" that existed were drilled paddles; they had air holes to reduce wind resistance. (As I remember it, that model tended to be preferred by Principals who had come up via the gym-teacher route.))

PS, to be clear: Am I defending it? No. Eliminating paddling is a triumph of enlightment over ignorance, but where that was accomplished it was done so calmly, with reason and with data, and without trying to demonize parents who accepted it.
 
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Easily, because at the time, corporal punishment of kids was normal in the US, both at school and at home. Perceptions of what constitutes "cruel" have changed exponentially over the past half-century plus, and they still differ enormously by culture.

Well, I just watched a 2021 video of two women in Florida working together to abuse a 6 year old. Looks like nothing has changed.
 

Yes. Because now kids have nothing to feel consequences, no God in school or society and no structure or effective discipline. As long as you balance love with discipline then there is nothing wrong with a spank. At different ages different things work. But, the fear of dad coming home and giving you a good swat keeps any kid in line.
You think it’s a good thing for kids to be afraid of a parent?
 
Never hit my kids... no spanking...no pinching.. no slapping.... Nope.

Yes there was plenty of discipline.We used time outs... loss of privileges... loss of toys/electronics etc..

I am very thankful for the kind and wonderful people my children have grown up to be. They did not need fear of me, their father.... or a God/Goddess to teach them that.

IMHO... a parent using physical abuse against a child is a loss of control.
 
My views on spanking have changed over time. I did use spanking with my first two children, but when I started to actually evaluate what the purpose was and whether it was accomplishing anything I changed my behavior. "That's what parents have always done" and "I turned out fine" are not valid reasons in my opinion to continue doing something.

I simply do not believe that a light swat on the bottom over clothing is effective at anything. Another poster mentioned kids choosing to be paddled, and I remember kids choosing that even in the 90s when I was going to school in FL. Two or three light smacks on the behind was really no big deal compared to getting grounded or having your parents upset with you. I have seen kids get a light spanking, roll their eyes, and go right back to whatever they were doing.

The only way a spanking works as a deterrent is if the child is afraid enough to not repeat the behavior because they want to avoid being hit again. A light swat that "leaves no marks" would not accomplish this for most children, especially not a child that is very strong-willed. So you would need to hit the child harder or be more intimidating/angry for the spanking to be effective.

One thing that has never made any sense to me is that there is always a cut off for the age that a spanking is deemed appropriate. Everyone I know who supports spanking believes that it should end before the teen years. If it's just an effective and non-harming form of discipline, why is it okay for small children but not for teens/adults? There are religious groups in the US that advocate husbands spanking their wives as a form of discipline, but I would bet that most on this thread would consider a husband hitting his wife to be abuse. This is where the logic to me becomes blurred. Why is it abusive to hit your wife but perfectly acceptable (and even encouraged) to hit your two year old?

I think that comes from the false idea that respect is tied to fear.
I think you are correct. I can't even count the number of parents that I have heard say this.

I respect my husband more than any person on the planet, but I have NEVER been afraid of him.

IMHO... a parent using physical abuse against a child is a loss of control.
I agree. I have never seen anyone in my entire life spank a child (myself included) who was not angry/emotional and had lost their composure.
 
I partially agree. She wants to stay under the radar but this has forced her into the public scrutiny. Two years ago I had a student who left his school flute in the car. The car was broken into and the flute was stolen. It took him 2 weeks to finally admit he wasn't forgetting his flute, but what had happened. Mom didn't report it stolen because she was afraid that her status would become known.

However, if mom had retaliated right there, the principal would have had her arrested. That would be an immediate consequence because she is undocumented and was charges with a crime. If she even made it to trial she would never be able to become documented because of the charges, even if she was found innocent. Any type of charges make in incredibly difficult to get documentation or even citizenship.

Mom was in a no win situation.
By undocumented you mean illegal. She needs to be deported.
 
I was paddled in the first grade. This girl kept talking to me and I asked her to please stop. The teacher paddled *me* because I was “talking.” I was an extremely shy and introverted kid. What I learned was that trying to do the right thing will get you in trouble, teachers were mean and scary and not to be trusted. I also had an English teacher smack me across the head for pronouncing a word wrong. My husband was put in a box daily for the duration of class because he “wasn’t paying attention.”

I could go on and on about the abuse teachers doled out to us in the 70s and 80s and it was just accepted. Some wear that like a badge of pride. Made them “tough” but I can tell you at 53 they are things that stick with me to this day. I’m hyper vigilant when it comes to my kids and school (thankfully with the exception of one or two they’ve had great teachers). There is NO WAY I could stand there and watch someone hit my kid. I would lose my crap and probably end up in jail.

I am sorry that this happened when you were in school. I too was paddled because my "Row" was talking. The whole row got paddled. The sub had a list and at the end of the day everyone was paddled that was on the list.

When I was in elementary school, there were a couple of boys who obviously has some sort of attention disorder but at the time it was not diagnosed as such, and they would be put in the corner or at the blackboard with their nose in a white chalk circle. I also remember that in high school our principal was notorious for having a paddle with holes in it and it supposedly hurt worse than a regular paddle.

By the time my kids were in school, you didn't hear much about paddling, but it was still happening. I made it clear to the school that I did not want them paddling my children.

Oh yea, I remember one time I was in a class of only about 10 students and 3 of them were going to get paddled at the end of the day. They knew it all day. I am sure they dreaded it all day..... anyway, when it was time for paddling, the teacher had to have a "witness" and there was no other teacher available at the time and so the teacher told me and another student to go into the hall with her and we were "witnesses" to her paddling the three students. It was a very uncomfortable situation and I am sure very demeaning to the three who were paddled.

I could tell more stories about things that were used as punishment back then-I am 51 just to give timeline, but I am sure some of you have similar experiences.
 
Yes. Because now kids have nothing to feel consequences, no God in school or society and no structure or effective discipline. As long as you balance love with discipline then there is nothing wrong with a spank. At different ages different things work. But, the fear of dad coming home and giving you a good swat keeps any kid in line.
You know what? Never mind. Not worth it.
 
...just staying that both growing up, and in my home now, there has never been fear of being spanked to keep anyone in line. The “Dad Voice” works just fine.
 
My views on spanking have changed over time. I did use spanking with my first two children, but when I started to actually evaluate what the purpose was and whether it was accomplishing anything I changed my behavior. "That's what parents have always done" and "I turned out fine" are not valid reasons in my opinion to continue doing something.

I simply do not believe that a light swat on the bottom over clothing is effective at anything. Another poster mentioned kids choosing to be paddled, and I remember kids choosing that even in the 90s when I was going to school in FL. Two or three light smacks on the behind was really no big deal compared to getting grounded or having your parents upset with you. I have seen kids get a light spanking, roll their eyes, and go right back to whatever they were doing.

The only way a spanking works as a deterrent is if the child is afraid enough to not repeat the behavior because they want to avoid being hit again. A light swat that "leaves no marks" would not accomplish this for most children, especially not a child that is very strong-willed. So you would need to hit the child harder or be more intimidating/angry for the spanking to be effective.

One thing that has never made any sense to me is that there is always a cut off for the age that a spanking is deemed appropriate. Everyone I know who supports spanking believes that it should end before the teen years. If it's just an effective and non-harming form of discipline, why is it okay for small children but not for teens/adults? There are religious groups in the US that advocate husbands spanking their wives as a form of discipline, but I would bet that most on this thread would consider a husband hitting his wife to be abuse. This is where the logic to me becomes blurred. Why is it abusive to hit your wife but perfectly acceptable (and even encouraged) to hit your two year old?


I think you are correct. I can't even count the number of parents that I have heard say this.

I respect my husband more than any person on the planet, but I have NEVER been afraid of him.


I agree. I have never seen anyone in my entire life spank a child (myself included) who was not angry/emotional and had lost their composure.

Okay, if one of my children bit someone and I saw it....I was not mad, angry or emotional when I swatted their behind. I was ensuring they know it is bad to bite. If I saw my kid take a hot wheel track and slap his sister with it.... again, not mad not angry - but I am going to spank him-now when the kids got older, grounding was punishment enough and lasted longer than a couple of swats on the bottom.
 
Okay, if one of my children bit someone and I saw it....I was not mad, angry or emotional when I swatted their behind. I was ensuring they know it is bad to bite. If I saw my kid take a hot wheel track and slap his sister with it.... again, not mad not angry - but I am going to spank him-now when the kids got older, grounding was punishment enough and lasted longer than a couple of swats on the bottom.
so your punishment for your child hitting another child... is you hitting (spanking) them? Yup... no confusion here... me (child hit) = bad... parent hit = good
 
so your punishment for your child hitting another child... is you hitting (spanking) them? Yup... no confusion here...
rather ... would it have not been more effective just to take away the toy? Clear message.
 












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