POT (Proof of Time) Race Equivalency Cutoff Confirmed Times

DopeyBadger

Imagathoner
Joined
Oct 15, 2015
Admittedly, I did not read every post in this thread, but are these times still accurate 2 years later? We are doing the Princess Half in February (2020) and it's looking like corral A, but (I think someone already posted this) those times seem REALLY slow for an A corral.
So as soon as I submitted my post it kicked me to the end of the thread and I found the updated chart. It appears the times are still the same, so disregard my first question!
Yes, I do believe the 1:50 cutoff for the HM is still going to be accurate. If anything, it would likely get slower, not faster. But I don't think based on what they've been doing for the last 1.5 years that they'll make a dramatic change. For a reference for Princess 2019 Weekend:

420926
420927

There were 709 bibs in corral A for the HM. In total, there were 25594 bibs. So the A corral made up only 2.7% of the entire field. Additionally, they launch the corrals based on time. So I'd venture to guess the time between Corral A and B is only about 2 min. Whereas, the time between F and G might be on the order of 15-20 min.

But with runDisney's new corraling system (mini waves + less corrals, rather than more corrals of equal sizes), it sometimes creates corrals with a small number of runners. But the mini-waves sort of evens everything out.

Also, we signed up for the 5k with all of our children, the youngest of whom is 6 years old and alternates between a "blazing fast" 9-minute mile and something slower than a turtle. We entered our estimated time on the 5k with this in mind. Will that change our corrals for the 1/2 or are those solely based on your POT?
The 5k estimated finish will have no impact on the HM corrals. In the past, the only time a 5k corral is impacted by a race choice is the Dopey Challenge (5k, 10k, HM, and M). But I believe starting with Marathon Weekend 2019 that is no longer the case because it now has you submit estimated paces for the 5k and 10k for Dopey Challenge runners.
 

UK_Disney_Dopey_Hopeful

Earning My Ears
Joined
Jun 9, 2019
Hey @DopeyBadger. Firstly..... loving all your work on these estimated corral timings!. thank for updating too. it interesting to see the slight differences.

I notice for the DIsney princess times you have a Bib range (Presumably thats how may are actually within that Corral?) Do you have a similar bib range for the Disney HM and M?
 

DopeyBadger

Imagathoner
Joined
Oct 15, 2015
Hey @DopeyBadger. Firstly..... loving all your work on these estimated corral timings!. thank for updating too. it interesting to see the slight differences.

I notice for the DIsney princess times you have a Bib range (Presumably thats how may are actually within that Corral?) Do you have a similar bib range for the Disney HM and M?
Here you go! Here are the 2018 and 2019 Marathon Weekend Corral breakdowns:

Screen Shot 2019-04-30 at 8.16.29 AM.png



Screen Shot 2019-04-30 at 8.16.33 AM.png
 
  • UK_Disney_Dopey_Hopeful

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Jun 9, 2019
    Just a quick note on these "Mini Corrals" as well if anyone can help. If im Corral D (For example) is there a D1, D2, D3 etc... placing or is it that everybody in Corral D just heads for the Corral and the earlier you are, the nearer the front you get
     

    camaker

    Anything worth doing is worth overdoing
    Joined
    May 8, 2015
    Just a quick note on these "Mini Corrals" as well if anyone can help. If im Corral D (For example) is there a D1, D2, D3 etc... placing or is it that everybody in Corral D just heads for the Corral and the earlier you are, the nearer the front you get
    Everyone in D (or any other letter) will be in one large corral. Runners sort themselves out after they get into the corral and the mini-wave points aren’t really defined until the corral gets moved up to the start line.
     

    camaker

    Anything worth doing is worth overdoing
    Joined
    May 8, 2015
    Quick question for @DopeyBadger or anyone else who can answer. How do the corral cutoff time work out if you submit a marathon time for a half marathon/challenge? I’m considering signing up for SWRR and right now it looks like a marathon may well be my best time available. The time will most likely be between 4:00 and 4:18. I’m just trying to see whether I’m good as is, or if I need to find a good 10k to run for PoT sometime soon.
     
  • DopeyBadger

    Imagathoner
    Joined
    Oct 15, 2015
    Quick question for @DopeyBadger or anyone else who can answer. How do the corral cutoff time work out if you submit a marathon time for a half marathon/challenge? I’m considering signing up for SWRR and right now it looks like a marathon may well be my best time available. The time will most likely be between 4:00 and 4:18. I’m just trying to see whether I’m good as is, or if I need to find a good 10k to run for PoT sometime soon.
    I only know of one other example:


    They used a 1.112 Riegel value which is extremely generous and the runner was placed far higher in conversion than expected.

    This might be a good case of emailing Trackshack directly for guidance.
     

    ame6405

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Aug 22, 2018
    OK, so here's a different sort of question. For the Princess 1/2, is there really a difference in the length of the lines for the pictures for someone in corral A vs corral B? My POT today was not what I was hoping for and I am 10 slower than the corral A time posted in the spectacular charts you've made. I am trying to decided if I settle on corral B or knock out a 1/2 and possibly another 10k and hope for a better time to get into corral A.
     

    DopeyBadger

    Imagathoner
    Joined
    Oct 15, 2015
    OK, so here's a different sort of question. For the Princess 1/2, is there really a difference in the length of the lines for the pictures for someone in corral A vs corral B? My POT today was not what I was hoping for and I am 10 slower than the corral A time posted in the spectacular charts you've made. I am trying to decided if I settle on corral B or knock out a 1/2 and possibly another 10k and hope for a better time to get into corral A.
    There was about 2.7% of the field in corral A of the Princess HM in 2019. B had about another 2.7%. So in theory, if you start at the front of A, there are 0 people starting in front of you. If you start at the front of B, you're looking at 2.7% (or 709 runners) ahead of you (and another 2.7% with you). The time difference between A and B starting is something on the order of 1-2 min. So in reality, there is very little difference between being in A or B due to the low number of runners in A and because they start at nearly the same time. Certainly a difference, but objectively I'd say it's on the order of a few extra seconds wait per character photo.
     

    Kerry1957

    Will run for Hefeweizen
    Joined
    Oct 7, 2017
    Another factor that may play into it is that I would guess that many (but certainly not all) of the corral A runners are actually running the race trying to get a good time (and thus not stopping for pics) as opposed to the rest of us (I'm in D or E for most of the runDisney races) that view the race as a sort of fun run and know finish times will be longer than normal.
     
  • steph0808

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Apr 25, 2012
    There was about 2.7% of the field in corral A of the Princess HM in 2019. B had about another 2.7%. So in theory, if you start at the front of A, there are 0 people starting in front of you. If you start at the front of B, you're looking at 2.7% (or 709 runners) ahead of you (and another 2.7% with you). The time difference between A and B starting is something on the order of 1-2 min. So in reality, there is very little difference between being in A or B due to the low number of runners in A and because they start at nearly the same time. Certainly a difference, but objectively I'd say it's on the order of a few extra seconds wait per character photo.
    From a purely personal perspective, I started at the front of B for this year's half marathon at marathon weekend, so not Princess. But my experience was that the lines were blissfully short! It was amazing! I was also running about a 9:30-10:00 minute/mile pace when I wasn't stopping for photos, which helped me keep in front of a lot of runners.

    I'll be at the front of C (most likely) for this year's marathon (i really wanted B but missed the dopeybadger suggested cutoff by 30 seconds), and I'm still hoping for lines that aren't too terrible. But it will be 2k runners in front of me instead of 1k.

    I started at the back of D in the 2018 Marathon - and the lines were pretty long, especially for group photos.
     

    MissLiss279

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Jul 10, 2015
    From a purely personal perspective, I started at the front of B for this year's half marathon at marathon weekend, so not Princess. But my experience was that the lines were blissfully short! It was amazing! I was also running about a 9:30-10:00 minute/mile pace when I wasn't stopping for photos, which helped me keep in front of a lot of runners.

    I'll be at the front of C (most likely) for this year's marathon (i really wanted B but missed the dopeybadger suggested cutoff by 30 seconds), and I'm still hoping for lines that aren't too terrible. But it will be 2k runners in front of me instead of 1k.

    I started at the back of D in the 2018 Marathon - and the lines were pretty long, especially for group photos.
    FYI
    One year my POT was something like 2:15:17 and the corral charts came out, and the 2:15 was the cutoff for one corral. I was expecting to be in the next corral; however, when we actually got our bib numbers, I ended up being in the earlier corral. So there’s still a chance you could be in B. I do think this was before they started using the giant no-POT corrals (when they had many smaller corrals), so they may have changed their philosophy since then.
     

    ame6405

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Aug 22, 2018
    Another factor that may play into it is that I would guess that many (but certainly not

    I never thought of that. I guess I just assumed everyone who ran a D
    From a purely personal perspective, I started at the front of B for this year's half marathon at marathon weekend, so not Princess. But my experience was that the lines were blissfully short! It was amazing! I was also running about a 9:30-10:00 minute/mile pace when I wasn't stopping for photos, which helped me keep in front of a lot of runners.

    I'll be at the front of C (most likely) for this year's marathon (i really wanted B but missed the dopeybadger suggested cutoff by 30 seconds), and I'm still hoping for lines that aren't too terrible. But it will be 2k runners in front of me instead of 1k.

    I started at the back of D in the 2018 Marathon - and the lines were pretty long, especially for group photos.
    That is great information! I have only run Dopey once and did not bother to put a time in so was back in corral P and we definitely did a lot of waiting although I think most of the waiting was just to start. Normally I wouldn't be all that concerned, but we are trusting our oldest son to babysit his younger siblings during the race so I want to get back in time to do breakfast with them. There is only so long the Disney Channel can keep them entertained! Thanks for the insight!

    Aimee
     

    ame6405

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Aug 22, 2018
    FYI
    One year my POT was something like 2:15:17 and the corral charts came out, and the 2:15 was the cutoff for one corral. I was expecting to be in the next corral; however, when we actually got our bib numbers, I ended up being in the earlier corral. So there’s still a chance you could be in B. I do think this was before they started using the giant no-POT corrals (when they had many smaller corrals), so they may have changed their philosophy since then.
    So with a 50.25 instead of the charts 50:15 I could be in the same boat and end up in A anyway. It is getting harder and harder to convince myself to do that 1/2! Haha!
     

    DopeyBadger

    Imagathoner
    Joined
    Oct 15, 2015
    FYI
    One year my POT was something like 2:15:17 and the corral charts came out, and the 2:15 was the cutoff for one corral. I was expecting to be in the next corral; however, when we actually got our bib numbers, I ended up being in the earlier corral. So there’s still a chance you could be in B. I do think this was before they started using the giant no-POT corrals (when they had many smaller corrals), so they may have changed their philosophy since then.
    This was back in the days of the "get X number of runners per corral". So when they posted a cutoff of "2:17" it was "around 2:17" and whatever it took to get 2000 runners/bibs in that particular corral. It annoyed people (causing emails) and was probably one of the reasons for changing the system. So I do think they changed philosophies since then.

    So with a 50.25 instead of the charts 50:15 I could be in the same boat and end up in A anyway. It is getting harder and harder to convince myself to do that 1/2! Haha!
    The 50:25 10k is very very close. Here is a good example of where that cutoff was for this particular race:

    Random Data point for you Billy. Noah and I submitted a 50:14 and 50:15 10k POTs for the Princess challenge this year. He was in A and I was in B for the half. Our bibs were 20699 and 20273 respectively. I was surprised that a 1 second difference would have that big of an impact.
    Here is an example of the exact cutoff for Princess A vs B in 2019. Father and son were 50:14 vs 50:15 and one was A vs the other B.
     

    ame6405

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Aug 22, 2018
    This was back in the days of the "get X number of runners per corral". So when they posted a cutoff of "2:17" it was "around 2:17" and whatever it took to get 2000 runners/bibs in that particular corral. It annoyed people (causing emails) and was probably one of the reasons for changing the system. So I do think they changed philosophies since then.



    The 50:25 10k is very very close. Here is a good example of where that cutoff was for this particular race:



    Here is an example of the exact cutoff for Princess A vs B in 2019. Father and son were 50:14 vs 50:15 and one was A vs the other B.
    *sigh* I guess I sign up for that 1/2...probably good anyway since it will be the only time I run that distance until the Princess 1/2! Thanks for all this info!

    Aimee
     

    UK_Disney_Dopey_Hopeful

    Earning My Ears
    Joined
    Jun 9, 2019
    Hi everyone,

    So I’m wondering if somebody can help with another P.O.T. Questions please

    This weekend in a 10km I ran a “race” or “gun” time of 50:18 (just over the predicted Coral A of Disney HM). However, my chip time was 48:31 (within the predicted Coral A cut off times)

    When I supply a time to Disney, do they look at Race/Gun time or Chip time?.

    I’m a bit of a non believer in myself so prefer just to shuffle in at the back and pick my way through people rather than try and barge my way to the front and watch tens of people pass by me!

    Do I need to be more ruthless or will Disney take Chip time

    (For clarification the race website lists BOTH times but the finishing order is listed by gun time)

    Hope this all makes sense!.

    Thanks

    Alistair
     

    huskies90

    DIS Veteran
    Joined
    Oct 28, 2004
    Hi everyone,

    So I’m wondering if somebody can help with another P.O.T. Questions please

    This weekend in a 10km I ran a “race” or “gun” time of 50:18 (just over the predicted Coral A of Disney HM). However, my chip time was 48:31 (within the predicted Coral A cut off times)

    When I supply a time to Disney, do they look at Race/Gun time or Chip time?.

    I’m a bit of a non believer in myself so prefer just to shuffle in at the back and pick my way through people rather than try and barge my way to the front and watch tens of people pass by me!

    Do I need to be more ruthless or will Disney take Chip time

    (For clarification the race website lists BOTH times but the finishing order is listed by gun time)

    Hope this all makes sense!.

    Thanks

    Alistair
    Chip time.
     

    Thecouch

    Mouseketeer
    Joined
    Jul 13, 2019
    how does the 10k start ? do they just have different start group for sub 8min ,8-12min and over 12min mile . my 15yo son is doing 10km star wars weekend next year ( im doing the 21km )
     

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