Petition to Remove Dumbo

[Welsh_Dragon]

They seem to have willingly participated as entertainment, at least into their adult lives. They could afford a retirement and health insurance. I wouldn't fault anyone for choosing to earn a living in whatever way they could since they weren't doing anything illegal.

They started performing when they were just 3 years old. Can you imagine taking that to a best interest/welfare meeting and submitting that it is in the best interest of the child?
I am not finding fault with the brothers‘ behaviour, but their parents/guardians must have been real !

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

I don't think I've ever known of a statue erected in lieu of a social initiative, or even in support of some social cause, LOL. The ones I've seen are just historical tributes.

The closest thing we have to this is artwork by Banksy. His paintings ‘appear’ overnight on the side of buildings and walls and usually make a political statement and/ or highlight social injustice. Usually the artwork is preserved. No one knows the true identity of the artist. https://banksy.co.uk/out.asp

Or Ecce ****... https://www.amnesty.org.uk/mark-wallinger-ecce-****-statue-st-pauls-cathedral
NB the link won’t work because of the name of the statue but here is a photograph.

 

[JimMIA]

I'm still concerned with what Disney is gonna do about Mickey and Minnie!

 

[littlejimmy]

and what about peter pan?

 

[spiders]

People are standing up and saying enough.

Such heroes. They added their name to a website against a cartoon elephant. So brave. Not all heroes wear capes, some have keyboards.

 

[JimMIA]

Such heroes. They added their name to a website against a cartoon elephant. So brave. Not all heroes wear capes, some have keyboards.

There should be a Hero app...

 

[bcla]

They started performing when they were just 3 years old. Can you imagine taking that to a best interest/welfare meeting and submitting that it is in the best interest of the child?
I am not finding fault with the brothers‘ behaviour, but their parents/guardians must have been real !

When they were children that was certainly something where I'd think they couldn't exactly engage in consent. However, it did keep their family housed.

Have you ever heard about the Dionne quintuplets? Now that was just wrong how the provincial government of Ontario passed a law to make them their wards, where they were turned into a tourist attraction. The parents did have their babies shown, but in exchange for funding and medical care that they couldn't otherwise afford. In the 90s there was a TV miniseries about their experience. One scene in the movie was about the same baby being taken out and brought back in and then back out where it was the same baby but claimed to be a different quint.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dionne_quintuplets

 

[CdnCarrie]

Obviously all statues are statements -- memorials usually to something or someone believed to be important. They are also put in place legally.

I don't think I've ever known of a statue erected in lieu of a social initiative, or even in support of some social cause, LOL. The ones I've seen are just either historical tributes or works of art.

The other thing about the 1960's is that -- well, they were SIXTY YEARS AGO.

There are some good lessons to learn from the US Civil Rights movement in the 1950's and 1960's, though. One is that symbolic acts were important in creating awareness of things that needed to change.

And the other, as I mentioned above, is that most of the REAL change was done through hard work changing laws...not taking selfies. That real work took a number of years and a great deal of effort by a lot of people working together.

the funny thing about the people pulling down statutes are they are individuals. LOL
Yet you like to brush them all with “not wanting to do the work...” dodo.
This is a START. A BEGINNING.
Be supportive or you’re just part of the problem.

and don’t be coy. You know that confederate statutes were put up in the south as backlash against civil rights movement.

Laws can get changed from grassroots movements like this. Give it time.

 

[Welsh_Dragon]

When they were children that was certainly something where I'd think they couldn't exactly engage in consent. However, it did keep their family housed.

Have you ever heard about the Dionne quintuplets? Now that was just wrong how the provincial government of Ontario passed a law to make them their wards, where they were turned into a tourist attraction. The parents did have their babies shown, but in exchange for funding and medical care that they couldn't otherwise afford. In the 90s there was a TV miniseries about their experience. One scene in the movie was about the same baby being taken out and brought back in and then back out where it was the same baby but claimed to be a different quint.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dionne_quintuplets

That’s a sad story indeed.

 

[JimMIA]

the funny thing about the people pulling down statutes are they are individuals. LOL
Yet you like to brush them all with “not wanting to do the work...” dodo.
This is a START. A BEGINNING
Be supportive or you’re just part of the problem..

I've been a part of both aspects of the solution back in the day -- both in demonstrations, and in the hard governmental work of making actual change. That gives me a little different viewpoint, because I know for a fact that there are people who will really work (and actually risk and lose their lives), and those who won't.

Unfortunately, in today's society there are people who would rather "stand up" for correcting cartoon elephant affronts than do the real work.

When you watch news video of today's demonstrations, what do you see? You see people videoing, live-streaming their righteousness, and taking selfies. You see them violating laws for their own self-importance.

You also see some of them (a few) protecting businesses from looters and working constructively -- but a LOT more of them are just there for the Snapchat moment.

and don’t be coy. You know that confederate statutes were put up in the south as backlash against civil rights movement.

I'm not being coy. Tell me which statue you are talking about, where it's located, and when it was erected, and I'll give you my honest opinion (for whatever it's worth) of what the motivation was.

I strongly suspect you don't have a clue when most of the statues you're thinking of were actually put in place, or why.

 

[Jennasis]

Such heroes. They added their name to a website against a cartoon elephant. So brave. Not all heroes wear capes, some have keyboards.

I wasn't referring to just the petition. Though, you have no idea what those people have done other than sign that petition.

 

[RamblingMad]

Seriously! What's next? The Hamilton musical?

Yep. I just saw an article about Hamilton in this context today.

 

[RamblingMad]

I'm still concerned with what Disney is gonna do about Mickey and Minnie!

Did they ever have kids or get married? Scandalous.

 

[3DisneyBuggs]

Dumb Dum Dum Dum DUMBO!!!

 

[TLSnell1981]

OMG is there no end? Let's just burn the entire park to the ground since Mickey & Minnie are rodents and their pals are animals. I'm sure that's offensive in some way that I can't think of yet.

Seems to be the end game. Chip away...it's never enough.

 

[GreatLakes]

I could understand, not agree but understand, if the crows were somehow a part of the attraction. I think protesting, petitioning, whatevering because a scene or scenes not even referenced in the ride may or may not be problematic is just looking for something to complain about. YMMV.

 

[bcla]

While I'm not sure this is going anywhere, I'm not upset that there's a conversation going on about this. I think that's a good thing.

 

[RamblingMad]

While I'm not sure this is going anywhere, I'm not upset that there's a conversation going on about this. I think that's a good thing.

Have you heard about the author of Alice and Wonderland?

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/lewis-carrolls-shifting-reputation-9432378/

 

[RamblingMad]

Seems to be the end game. Chip away...it's never enough.

Reminds me of Demolition Man. Sadly, looks like our future.

 

[chasgoose]

Obviously all statues are statements -- memorials usually to something or someone believed to be important. They are also put in place legally.

I don't think I've ever known of a statue erected in lieu of a social initiative, or even in support of some social cause, LOL. The ones I've seen are just either historical tributes or works of art.

The other thing about the 1960's is that -- well, they were SIXTY YEARS AGO.

There are some good lessons to learn from the US Civil Rights movement in the 1950's and 1960's, though. One is that symbolic acts were important in creating awareness of things that needed to change.

And the other, as I mentioned above, is that most of the REAL change was done through hard work changing laws...not taking selfies. That real work took a number of years and a great deal of effort by a lot of people working together.

Maybe instead of being so concerned about "erasing history" you should learn some. The vast majority of Confederate monuments were erected in support of the "social cause" of White supremacy. They were intentionally put there (with donations from groups like the Daughters of the Confederacy or the KKK, but also with taxpayer money, including the taxpayer money of the Black people they were erected to oppress) with the intent of intimidating Black people and endorsing the state-sponsored terrorism of the Jim Crow South. For example, Confederate monuments currently being removed in Richmond were erected in connection with a new real estate development that explicitly prohibited Black people from owning property there and the monuments were installed to further enforce that image. These monuments might have been put in place legally but that doesn't mean they weren't put in place with the goal of promoting White supremacy and literally rewriting history to fit into the fallacious "Lost Cause" narrative. The statues themselves aren't necessary to remind us of the history of the Civil War. We can just get rid of them altogether and make sure that history books acknowledge that there was once a time where we tolerated monuments that were built with the sole purpose of intimidating Black people and "putting them in their place." No one is going to forget who Robert E. Lee or Stonewall Jackson or Jefferson Davis is and there is no reason for those monuments to stand or even be sent to some graveyard museum where the only visitors will be current White supremacists who will ignore any attempt to place them in context. We can learn about the history of these monuments without needing to allow them to exist.