PETE went too far re: PETA as Domestic Terrorists

[superme80]

I have a legitimate question, and to be honest, I don't care to spend time googling it, so hoping someone has a straightforward answer:
Why are sea world being condemned for all of this but zoos aren't?
Surely zoos fall directly into the same category?
Why aren't the crazy PETA members picketing every single zoo in the world?

This is MY personal guess. They go after the biggest ones first. It is the domino effect. Take out the biggest one and the rest will fall. One of the zoos by my home has animals that cannot be released into the wild. Now I am sure PETA could argue that they belong in a sanctuary and not on display. But I see how they do a lot of good.

 

[godders]

So I haven't heard the podcast myself but I'm an anthrozoologist so I basically look at human-animal interactions from zoos to animals rights to pet keeping and so on so I thought this was a very interesting debate to throw my 2 cents in

The legacy of animal rights groups such as PETA is unfortunately a negative one due to violent activities by some sections. One particular group here in the UK, were picketing a factory farm and stole the dead remains of the family's grandmother for example. Similarly I'm sure many people who perform animal testing will report that they have been sent death threats and been physically threatened by people claiming allegiance to animal rights groups. So while I personally would never describe PETA as terrorists, there are some groups who do attempt to stop cruelty to animals through violence and the spreading of fear and so arguably the word could be used to apply to them.

To answer @Princess Jes

Campaigns for certain megafauna (e.g. tigers, pandas, lions) come round in circles as incidents happen that bring them back into the forefront of the public eye. Trophy hunting/canned hunting for example has been being campaigned against for years and was even the subject of a huge court case in South Africa in the early 2000s (if memory serves but it may be earlier - I'd have to dig out my notes) where they were trying to get it banned for lions as large hunters (such as Cheetahs & Leopards) but the hunting industry successfully argued that lions scavenge more of their meals than they hunt themselves and therefore should not be counted in new legislation that would've prevented them from being used in canned hunts (just a summery - there were many nuances to the case). Anyway, the shooting of Cecil the lion made huge news around the world and led to a jump in awareness of lions bred for canned hunting and now lots of Lion charities are getting a lot more attention than 2 years ago. Same thing happened with SeaWorld and Blackfish. Many people around the world are always campaigning against zoos, wildlife parks, captive breeding and so on, they're just not in mainstream public awareness, hard as they may try. That is why it seems like only SeaWorld is being targeted. They aren't but as @superme80 said they are the big fish

 

[samsteele]

I give up

No response to the OP is going to lead to constructive debate as the OP has no interest in debating his position.

The OP has posted similar threads elsewhere on the Boards eg the Epcot Killing Baby Alligators thread. This is done for a purpose and intelligent, thoughtful debate ain't it.

The OP has an agenda. He should be transparent about why he is creating these threads. When he chooses not to be forthcoming, there is a reason. His reason isn't a simple exercise of free speech.

think PJ and others figured this out a while back. Just a heads up for anyone else who hasn't or is joining this thread late.

 

[SirDuff]

Not sure what you are talking about. I made a mistake. I admitted it. I believe Pete made a mistake, the question is will he admit it?

The difference is that you actually made an error - your fact was wrong. Pete didn't state a fact, he stated an opinion. You may disagree with it, but you cannot prove him wrong.

 

[pontikes67]

I'm with Pete. I think PETA's agenda is to bully you into submission as they see THEIR way is the ONLY way. In that way, they ARE like ISIS. They're not killing people, of course, but they threaten and sabotage and propagandize to destroy you or your well being.

On the DL show they noted that we don't see PETA going after some one-off aquarium that doesn't have name recognition or money but has multiple animals sharing a tank smaller than SeaWorld uses to house one animal. Their outrage is hypocritical.

And yes they terrorize because you are made to fear what lengths they'll go to, to make their point and through this fear you are made to act in a manner they have unilaterally determined is ethical and right. If you don't do what they say, they'll attack you, slander you, threaten you. Sounds like terrorism to me.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

I did some research to try to understand the specific definition of "terrorist" and the challenge is that there isn't one agreed upon definition. In fact Bruce Hoffman who held the RAND Corporate Chair in Counterterrorism and Counterinsurgency and was a commissioner on the 9/11 Review Commission has stated that "the decision to call someone or label some organization 'terrorist' becomes almost unavoidably subjective" - so while I think it is fair to disagree with Pete, I think it is hard to say he is wrong or made a mistake - that is his view of PETA. I will say timing was not great to use that term in light of the atrocities in Brussels as there is a difference (at least in scale) of what PETA is and does and ISIS

I do think they use fear-mongering and propaganda to advance their agenda and target entities that will get them the most publicity and of all the entities to go after I think it is sad that Sea World is the one as they do a lot of good that doesn't get publicity - I see a lot more stories of Sea World employees helping beached animals, etc. than PETA members

On a somewhat related note, I really appreciate your input @godders and when I start up my hair metal band I am going to name it "Megafauna"

 

[KingLlama]

 

[TheMaxRebo]

good thought @KingLlama - inserting Michael Jackson into the discussion should make things less controversial

 

[KingLlama]

Um, excuse me, that is Captain EO in my photo. Who is "Michael Jackson"?

 

[godders]

On a somewhat related note, I really appreciate your input @godders and when I start up my hair metal band I am going to name it "Megafauna"

No worries. People get so passionate about the animals (as I do myself sometimes) it becomes very difficult to see both sides. I should just say the official term is "charismatic megafauna" but it's not quite such a good band name haha

 

[pontikes67]

No worries. People get so passionate about the animals (as I do myself sometimes) it becomes very difficult to see both sides. I should just say the official term is "charismatic megafauna" but it's not quite such a good band name haha

Wasn't Dave Mustaine the lead singer in Megafauna? Man I loved them. #PostToBeDeletedAsItIsNotOnTopic #longhashtags #wedonothashtagondisboardsmuchdowe

 

[SorcererHeidi]

Thanks. They are safe and were able to drive to Amsterdam to leave the next day. Terrorism is a very serious word, not to be used lightly, or thrown around against people that you disagree with based on political views.

Glad your brother and SIL are safe.

 

[Hunterr]

 

[Diz Duck]

No response to the OP is going to lead to constructive debate as the OP has no interest in debating his position.

The OP has posted similar threads elsewhere on the Boards eg the Epcot Killing Baby Alligators thread. This is done for a purpose and intelligent, thoughtful debate ain't it.

The OP has an agenda. He should be transparent about why he is creating these threads. When he chooses not to be forthcoming, there is a reason. His reason isn't a simple exercise of free speech.

think PJ and others figured this out a while back. Just a heads up for anyone else who hasn't or is joining this thread late.

Thanks for contributing to the conversation. I do have an agenda, wait for it, make the world a better place - just like Walt Disney had an agenda. We are bigger and better than the apparent bullying language use by many of the posters on this thread. I didn't call anyone domestic terrorists, and I'm not trying to sideline anyone from the conversation. I don't think anyone should be sidelined from the conversation.

 

[samsteele]

Thanks for contributing to the conversation. I do have an agenda, wait for it, make the world a better place - just like Walt Disney had an agenda. We are bigger and better than the apparent bullying language use by many of the posters on this thread. I didn't call anyone domestic terrorists, and I'm not trying to sideline anyone from the conversation. I don't think anyone should be sidelined from the conversation.

rumbled much?

 

[Diz Duck]

rumbled much?

Again. Thanks for contribution to the conversation.

 

[*NikkiBell*]

Everyone here is allowed to state an opinion as long as posting guidelines are adhered to; this includes both sides of the conversation related to this topic.

Please keep it kind, folks.

 

[Tonyz]

Thanks for contributing to the conversation. I do have an agenda, wait for it, make the world a better place - just like Walt Disney had an agenda. We are bigger and better than the apparent bullying language use by many of the posters on this thread. I didn't call anyone domestic terrorists, and I'm not trying to sideline anyone from the conversation. I don't think anyone should be sidelined from the conversation.

Hahaha! Yeah you're just like Walt!

 

[DisneyKevin]

if we are going to worry about anything, lets worry about the bees.

Without bees, we all starve to death fairly quickly.

 

[TheMaxRebo]

if we are going to worry about anything, lets worry about the bees.

Without bees, we all starve to death fairly quickly.

Beads?!?!?