Pandemic?

[LuvOrlando]

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[pansmermaidzlagoon]

Wondering if the 23-month old from Texas had been to Mexico or if picked it up from someone in the US?

Sad.

Not thrilled that DH will be flying on business next week. Airports, planes, hotel, convention....oh my.

Also, how long for test results to come back? I'm watching the news and some states are waiting on test results for more cases to be confirmed. Seems like they've been saying that for a couple of days.

from what I understand, they have had to wait for the tests to be sent to centers - Atlanta, I believe. Yesterday they mentioned they are getting the testing equipment or whatever out to the states so they can do it faster.

 

[pansmermaidzlagoon]

I have to disagree here. Worry does have value, as long as it isn't self destructive. Worry keeps many of us from making incredibly bad decisions because it acts as a deterrent. One of my favorite authors Gavin DeBecker, named one of his books "The Gift or Fear" because fear really does make a valid contribution to our survival.

Here is an example of worry being an advantage:
If a person worries about about the possibility of being hit by a car walking at night he or she will likely exercise some caution staying inside the pedestrian walkway, wearing brighter color clothing, and crossing at appropriate intersections. On the flip side you have the individual that refuses to see danger and meanders across the yellow line while wearing a black hoodie and jeans when the idea that a jay walk will save time flashes as a great idea. If you really do not see that one approach is better than another some of you are just on a different page than those who are like me.

Life isn't always pretty, and life isn't always easy but I look at it straight in the eye, deal with whatever is in my path then move on. At the moment this mess is right in front of me so I am dealing with it by collecting as much information as I can and by preparing my family in the best way I am able.

exactly! (I also have that book!) Especially if you do not ignore the worry as paranoia or as unfounded (I do not mean let it lead you to panic).....the worry can lead you to stay informed and to take action when necessary.

 

[laurie31]

exactly! (I also have that book!) Especially if you do not ignore the worry as paranoia or as unfounded (I do not mean let it lead you to panic).....the worry can lead you to stay informed and to take action when necessary.

I think we're talking about two different kinds of worry.

The beneficial kind is more a realistic awareness of danger. Such as the example of walking at night and taking proper precautions to be visible.

The "bad" kind is the wringing your hands, terrified something bad is going to happen, yet not doing anything to affect whether it does or not.

Another example: car wrecks, the number one killer of children in this country.
Almost 21% of childhood deaths are due to car wrecks, and 1 of every 60 children born today will die (eventually) in a car accident Over 12,000 kids die in car wrecks in the US every year.

Good "worry" - my children ride properly restrained in the back seat.

Bad worry: if I was afraid to let them get in a car, or if I drove around thinking "ohgosh-ohgosh-ohgosh-I hope no one runs into us - ohgosh-ohgosh-ohgosh" to the point where it negatively affects my own driving.

So learning how to protect yourself in a pandemic and taking basic prudent steps to do so is the "good" worry. Freaking out that we're all going to die a horrible death is the "bad worry."

It's terribly tragic about the child in Texas, but of course it's very sad when a child dies for any reason. Over 30 children in the US will die in car wrecks TODAY. Where is the panic for that?

(just playing Devil's Advocate. I don't think we need to panic, just properly restrain our kids, and ourselves and putting a little perspective on the current threat of dying from swine flu)

 

[Colleen27]

experts - virologists,etc - were looking for it. Laurie Garrett stated on Charlie Rose that they had a H1N1 case in Texas in Sept and two in Cal in March and that then they knew they were looking at something going on. She also stated at the same time an H1N1 strain that is not sensitive to Tamiflu also developed. These people were fully tested and there is no conjecture to that. Did local authorities make this mistake, sure. However the experts have been following it.

I think your point though is to say there is no sense in closing the border - and the experts seem to be in agreement with that!

Yeah, I was thinking of front-line medical staff, not the experts who are always looking for this sort of thing. If someone walked into a doctors office two weeks ago with flu symptoms, it would have been a nasal swab to confirm influenza, a prescription for Tamiflu, and instructions to go home and rest, drink lots of fluid, etc. There wouldn't have been any sending samples off to the CDC for genetic analysis or any of that.

But yeah, my point was that there's no sense in closing the borders, particularly now that it has been identified in so many countries.

 

[Christine]

I think we're talking about two different kinds of worry.

The beneficial kind is more a realistic awareness of danger. Such as the example of walking at night and taking proper precautions to be visible.

The "bad" kind is the wringing your hands, terrified something bad is going to happen, yet not doing anything to affect whether it does or not.

Another example: car wrecks, the number one killer of children in this country.
Almost 21% of childhood deaths are due to car wrecks, and 1 of every 60 children born today will die (eventually) in a car accident Over 12,000 kids die in car wreck in the US every year.

Good "worry" - my children ride properly restrained in the back seat.

Bad worry: if I was afraid to let them get in a car, or if I drove around thinking "ohgosh-ohgosh-ohgosh-I hope no one runs into us - ohgosh-ohgosh-ohgosh" to the point where it negatively affects my own driving.

So learning how to protect yourself in a pandemic and taking basic prudent steps to do so is the "good" worry. Freaking out that we're all going to die a horrible death is the "bad worry."

It's terribly tragic about the child in Texas, but of course it's very sad when a child dies for any reason. Over 300 children in the US will die in car wrecks TODAY. Where is the panic for that?

(just playing Devil's Advocate. I don't think we need to panic, just properly restrain our kids, and ourselves and putting a little perspective on the current threat of dying from swine flu)

Great points!

The "regular" flu kills roughly 36,000 people per year. I don't think this variant is showing itself to be any different here in the U.S. (statistically) but the jury is still out. I'm not overly worried about it but, dang, I thought we only had to go through ONE flu season a year and we just got out of it last month. This thing is going to run through and peak and go out just like all the others. Hopefully, the nice weather and people being outdoors will keep the number infected smaller than in winter time. As for Mexico, I have read that the reason for the high numbers and higher death rate was due to crowded living situations and poor health/self-care for most of the cases.

 

[pansmermaidzlagoon]

I think we're talking about two different kinds of worry.

I agree there are different types of worry and different degrees!

as long as the worry is founded on fact and leads you to positive/reasoned response.......then it is all good.

 

[rie'smom]

not one thing you say here is a correct interpretation of the points i was making. point 1. the media increases our anxiety. point 2. people tend to feed off of each others fears. point 3. worrying about future events cannot have an impact on them. point 4. as they say, this to shall pass. i never said anyone here is panicking. i never said reading the posts bothers me. as far as the statement about protesting to much, that buzz phrase is used when someone complains to cover up the fact that they really like the thing they are complaining about. that would suggest that in your opinion i really like the flu.

Brush up on Shakespeare.It is a misquote from Hamlet,"The lady doth protest too much, methinks". It means that when someone protests too strongly that they usually feel the opposite, in other words, those complaining about the panic are actually more worried than they want others to believe.

 

[Planogirl]

I agree with some of you that worrying about this situation too much is counterproductive. However, it's also possible to be a bit too blase too. The ostrich head in the sand approach seems to be potentially just as counterproductive. I think that it's best to stay informed and follow guidelines and go on about your daily life.

 

[brerrabbit]

The child that died is from Mexico and the parents got him to Brownsville and from there he was transfered to Houston where he died. That is what is being reported by the Houston Chronicle this morning.

 

[legalsea]

Great points!

The "regular" flu kills roughly 36,000 people per year. I don't think this variant is showing itself to be any different here in the U.S. (statistically) but the jury is still out. I'm not overly worried about it but, dang, I thought we only had to go through ONE flu season a year and we just got out of it last month. This thing is going to run through and peak and go out just like all the others. Hopefully, the nice weather and people being outdoors will keep the number infected smaller than in winter time. As for Mexico, I have read that the reason for the high numbers and higher death rate was due to crowded living situations and poor health/self-care for most of the cases.

I agree. I can see why the CDC tries to avoid using the term Pandemic, since some people here in the USA are already starting to freak out.

Let us be glad that this strain of flu is apparently very mild here, and responds well to treatment.

I think it probably correct that down in Mexico many people simply do not have a history of getting flu-prevention shots, and so their immune system is more easily overwhelmed by this flu. After all, it is interesting to read that in a real pandemic the elderly do better than the young, since the elderly have built up a lifetime of immunity to various flus.

 

[Planogirl]

Someone brought up the point that many sick people in Mexico might try to come into the US for treatment. Good point and I don't blame them if they do so.

 

[LuvOrlando]

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[Planogirl]

So does anyone know if there have been any deaths where the person was under the best healthcare available and still passed away because there was nothing they could do?

At this point it looks to me like the losses stemmed from people who only sought medical treatment after things got out way of hand if they sought help at all. I wish the papers would tell me more about the people who did pass away, put an identity to the number instead of making them a variable into which anyone could easily slide themselves. Did they rest? Were they already ill from something else? Did they have access to regular medicine like antibiotics? Did they have access to oxygen tanks when they couldn't breathe?

Seriously, what on earth are our reporters doing these days? Isn't there anyone out there who can actually behave like a journalist willing to 'get the story'??? Are the only folks left working at newspapers glory hounds and paparazzi following Madonna around while she does her latest Vogue shoot? If I want to know who Miley Cyrus is dating I can find it everywhere I look, if I was interested in a stars eating disorder I can get their best friends to spill the most intimate secrets to me & millions of others. BUT if I am interested in anything that remotely approaches relevant I get nothing. All the while the newspapers can't figure out why no-one cares what they have to say anymore Really, could it be more obvious?

I agree!!!

I heard that someone Obama met while he was in Mexico died fromt the flu and that this guy was an architect. I've never heard anything else about this person though.

An architect wouldn't likely be poor but still could have waited to get medical care. If this is even true.

 

[Christine]

So does anyone know if there have been any deaths where the person was under the best healthcare available and still passed away because there was nothing they could do?

At this point it looks to me like the losses stemmed from people who only sought medical treatment after things got out way of hand if they sought help at all. I wish the papers would tell me more about the people who did pass away, put an identity to the number instead of making them a variable into which anyone could easily slide themselves. Did they rest? Were they already ill from something else? Did they have access to regular medicine like antibiotics? Did they have access to oxygen tanks when they couldn't breathe?

Seriously, what on earth are our reporters doing these days? Isn't there anyone out there who can actually behave like a journalist willing to 'get the story'??? Are the only folks left working at newspapers glory hounds and paparazzi following Madonna around while she does her latest Vogue shoot? If I want to know who Miley Cyrus is dating I can find it everywhere I look, if I was interested in a stars eating disorder I can get their best friends to spill the most intimate secrets to me & millions of others. BUT if I am interested in anything that remotely approaches relevant I get nothing. All the while the newspapers can't figure out why no-one cares what they have to say anymore Really, could it be more obvious?

I understand some answers will take time but I am so frustrated with the lack of information about things that we SHOULD know.

luvorlando,

My local news did verbally report that the higher numbers of deaths reported in Mexico were due to the victims not seeking medical care and treatment nor did it appear that they had good "home" care.

The news also reported that the symptoms here in the U.S. appeared to be like those of any other flu strain, not more serious or harder on the body than what we've seen with our typical A and B strains here in the U.S. But, as you know, even with these normal factors, there will always be a certain percentage of people who will succomb to the flu. This past winter, I believe we had 9 reports of child deaths due to the flu that was going around. So it does happen, and will happen with this one. Right now, it does not appear to be a killer strain here in the U.S.

 

[LuvOrlando]

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[mommy*RN]

So does anyone know if there have been any deaths where the person was under the best healthcare available and still passed away because there was nothing they could do?

At this point it looks to me like the losses stemmed from people who only sought medical treatment after things got out way of hand if they sought help at all. I wish the papers would tell me more about the people who did pass away, put an identity to the number instead of making them a variable into which anyone could easily slide themselves. Did they rest? Were they already ill from something else? Did they have access to regular medicine like antibiotics? Did they have access to oxygen tanks when they couldn't breathe?

Seriously, what on earth are our reporters doing these days? Isn't there anyone out there who can actually behave like a journalist willing to 'get the story'??? Are the only folks left working at newspapers glory hounds and paparazzi following Madonna around while she does her latest Vogue shoot? If I want to know who Miley Cyrus is dating I can find it everywhere I look, if I was interested in a stars eating disorder I can get their best friends to spill the most intimate secrets to me & millions of others. BUT if I am interested in anything that remotely approaches relevant I get nothing. All the while the newspapers can't figure out why no-one cares what they have to say anymore Really, could it be more obvious?

I understand some answers will take time but I am so frustrated with the lack of information about things that we SHOULD know.

Unfortunately for the freelance reporters there is more money in finding out what size jeans Miley wears and taking pictures of Brittany shaving her beard. The big magazines will pay big bucks for "those" types of stories. I also think because this hit quickly in Mexico the information just isn't there. I don't know how their government works, but I'm guessing they weren't in any way prepared for the onslaught and therefore things are probably all mishmashed - that would definitely account for the numbers being sooooo off.

I don't know if any of the people who passed away from this newest type of flu sought any medical attention early on...but a lot of people who have died from the "regular" flu throughout the years have had the best of medical care. As you can guess they are most often the elderly, very young and immune surpressed people. Once pneumonia (a disease that can result from the flu) starts running rampid in these folks their bodies just can't handle it and no amount of medications can stop the process.

I have to say you ask some very good questions. I'd love for you to be in the audience at one of those press conferences because you'd probably ask better questions than the current journalists. They just want to use the big buzz word, "PANDEMIC". I feel your frustration as I'd like some of these questions answered too instead of counting the numbers of infected, watching those numbers grow and using the newest buzz word on the block.

 

[EMom]

Great points!

The "regular" flu kills roughly 36,000 people per year. I don't think this variant is showing itself to be any different here in the U.S. (statistically) but the jury is still out. I'm not overly worried about it but, dang, I thought we only had to go through ONE flu season a year and we just got out of it last month. This thing is going to run through and peak and go out just like all the others. Hopefully, the nice weather and people being outdoors will keep the number infected smaller than in winter time. As for Mexico, I have read that the reason for the high numbers and higher death rate was due to crowded living situations and poor health/self-care for most of the cases.

Yes.....But of those 36,000 deaths, many are from the strains covered by the annual flu shot.....They're just victims who failed to get the flu shot. So MILLIONS of Americans didn't contract the flu in the first place because the immunization protected them. Meaning, millions and millions of Americans were are minimal risk (due to the vaccine) of ever even falling into that group of 36,000. Almost all that 36,000 consists of people who received no flu shot.

This swine flu has no vaccine, so all those vaccinated millions we normally factor out every year as being "safe" and at virtually no risk of dying can no longer be factored out. The "at risk" pool for contracting this flu has just gone up by millions, in the US alone. Then you take whatever percentage of unvaccinated people normally die from the flu they contract and I think the numbers have the potential to be MUCH higher than 36,000. It all depends on just how nasty this strain turns out to be. The lack of vaccine is key. Right now, we're sitting ducks.....We just don't know what's taking aim at us. A bullet or a foam dart?

 

[legalsea]

Yes.....But of those 36,000 deaths, many are from the strains covered by the annual flu shot.....They're just victims who failed to get the flu shot. So MILLIONS of Americans didn't contract the flu in the first place because the immunization protected them. Meaning, millions and millions of Americans were are minimal risk (due to the vaccine) of ever even falling into that group of 36,000. Almost all that 36,000 consists of people who received no flu shot.

This swine flu has no vaccine, so all those vaccinated millions we normally factor out every year as being "safe" and at virtually no risk of dying can no longer be factored out. The "at risk" pool for contracting this flu has just gone up by millions, in the US alone. Then you take whatever percentage of unvaccinated people normally die from the flu they contract and I think the numbers have the potential to be MUCH higher than 36,000. It all depends on just how nasty this strain turns out to be. The lack of vaccine is key. Right now, we're sitting ducks.....We just don't know what's taking aim at us. A bullet or a foam dart?

We are not sitting ducks. It is actually unknown as yet whether any of the flu prevention shots people have had over the years (I am 53 and have had quite a few) is responsible for the mild strain creeping in the USA. Remember, in pandemics the very young and the elderly tend to do better (as a group) than the young and healthy.

I mean, they are not even sure this is a 'swine' flu. Hence last night one CDC official stated that they were thinking of changing the name to the North American Flu.

 

[Christine]

Yes.....But of those 36,000 deaths, many are from the strains covered by the annual flu shot.....They're just victims who failed to get the flu shot. So MILLIONS of Americans didn't contract the flu in the first place because the immunization protected them. Meaning, millions and millions of Americans were are minimal risk (due to the vaccine) of ever even falling into that group of 36,000. Almost all that 36,000 consists of people who received no flu shot.

This swine flu has no vaccine, so all those vaccinated millions we normally factor out every year as being "safe" and at virtually no risk of dying can no longer be factored out. The "at risk" pool for contracting this flu has just gone up by millions, in the US alone. Then you take whatever percentage of unvaccinated people normally die from the flu they contract and I think the numbers have the potential to be MUCH higher than 36,000. It all depends on just how nasty this strain turns out to be. The lack of vaccine is key. Right now, we're sitting ducks.....We just don't know what's taking aim at us. A bullet or a foam dart?

All true points and as a mother of a son who has pretty severe asthma, of course, I'm worry about him.

The vaccine always does make people feel better but even it's effectiveness is not 100% or even 90%. Some years it has found not be effective at all and even when that happens we don't get some massive death rate.

I'm certainly not belittling your concerns as I am one of the biggest hypochondriacs ever and I, too, just hate the thought of trying to dodge another flu season!! But I am trying to put it into proper perspective. Of the cases that have been confirmed in the U.S., it has appeared to be a fairly mild flu as flu bugs go. It does STINK to be an asthmatic (like my son) and now feel unprotected.