Our 1st SW flight & I have only one complaint

[MOMTOMOOTOO]

I had purchased 3 seats for myself, dd 3 & dd 6. We arrived early and recievd an A boarding pass. Then when we got to the counter, I was told I could preboard with the kids. OK great!
Now for my complaint. People traveling with babies, that are not ticketed also get to preboard. They then proceed to spread out in the first few rows really tying up so many seats. How do I know they were not ticketed? Beacuse no car seats. On the flight down, a woman with a 5month old had the 1st row, she on the aisle, the baby in the middle and a blanket on the window seat. So she paid for one seat and got 3 seats. Now on the way home, a woman with her mother, an 18mo old and 6mo old twins, they paid for 2 seats but took up 6!. I even turned to her and said I thugh babies were supposed to be in a car seat, and she said that all three kids did not have tickets, they were just keeping their fingers crossed. Now, people boarding, see all the stuff on the seats, and pass right by. It just made be so mad and I needed to share.

Another thing, we have been traveling since my 1st born was 4 months old and I would never not purchase a seat. It is just too dangerous. A small price to pay for peace of mind.

Laura

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

I understand your chagrin, but, if the plane was not full, then there is not much that can be done. If that plane was full you can bet there would be some adjustments.
I cannot imagine not buying a seat for my child and I can only imagine what a handful an 18 month old and 6 mo. twins can be.
There should be a limit of how many a person can bring on without an adult with them for free. Well, I take that back, there is a limit. One child per adult.

 

[NotUrsula]

If you had really wanted one of those "saved" seats, you could have taken one. If you really wanted a front seat, why not just go into the row, hand the blanket back to the mother, and say, excuse me, is this yours? If she bought one seat, therefore the others were open.

Seat-saving happens on SWA, but it works on the kindness of strangers system; many people preboarding w/ kids save seats for the other adults in their parties, and many people travelling without children let them do it because they hope that some day, when they need to save, someone will be kind and let them do it, too. (Of course, there are also a LOT of people who don't want to sit next to babies on planes, seat location notwithstanding.) There is no rule that says that other passengers must let the seat-saving happen, and I assure you, no one gets to keep a free seat if SWA has a buyer for that seat.

In the situation you saw, it is likely that the party had paid for the seats they were spreading into, or at least some of them; they were probably saving them for other adults who were boarding later. (They limit how many adults can pre-board with the children.) As Gail pointed out, you only get one free lap-baby per ticket purchased.

Just FYI, there actually IS an FAA rule that no more than one lap child is allowed in a single row of occupied seats. This is because there is only one extra oxygen mask in each row. On a full plane, if one family has multiple lap children, then that family has to spread out over at least 2 rows.

 

[MOMTOMOOTOO]

Originally posted by NotUrsula
In the situation you saw, it is likely that the party had paid for the seats they were spreading into, or at least some of them; they were probably saving them for other adults who were boarding later.

Nope no other adults.

Also, I didn't want the seat but if I did I would not have hesitated to ask. My point was that they were spread out so it looked like they were occupied. Thats it.

 

[jjarman]

Originally posted by MOMTOMOOTOO
I had purchased 3 seats for myself, dd 3 & dd 6. We arrived early and recievd an A boarding pass. Then when we got to the counter, I was told I could preboard with the kids. OK great!
Now for my complaint. People traveling with babies, that are not ticketed also get to preboard. They then proceed to spread out in the first few rows really tying up so many seats. How do I know they were not ticketed? Beacuse no car seats. On the flight down, a woman with a 5month old had the 1st row, she on the aisle, the baby in the middle and a blanket on the window seat. So she paid for one seat and got 3 seats. Now on the way home, a woman with her mother, an 18mo old and 6mo old twins, they paid for 2 seats but took up 6!. I even turned to her and said I thugh babies were supposed to be in a car seat, and she said that all three kids did not have tickets, they were just keeping their fingers crossed. Now, people boarding, see all the stuff on the seats, and pass right by. It just made be so mad and I needed to share.

Another thing, we have been traveling since my 1st born was 4 months old and I would never not purchase a seat. It is just too dangerous. A small price to pay for peace of mind.

Laura

Sorry to get huffy here but did it really inconvenience you to have to go back one more row on the plane? One reason I always flew with SW when my son was small was the preboarding for parents with children. It is so much easier to get settled in without having to hold up people in the aisles.

And, no, I never bought my son a ticket until he was 2. Once, when he was 2 weeks old we flew and there was room for his car seat between me and my husband but other times I held him. I mean, I don't want to sound morbid or anything but chances are if you are in a plane crash a car seat is not going to help that much. I felt safer with him in my arms anyway.

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by jjarman
Sorry to get huffy here but did it really inconvenience you to have to go back one more row on the plane? One reason I always flew with SW when my son was small was the preboarding for parents with children. It is so much easier to get settled in without having to hold up people in the aisles.

And, no, I never bought my son a ticket until he was 2. Once, when he was 2 weeks old we flew and there was room for his car seat between me and my husband but other times I held him. I mean, I don't want to sound morbid or anything but chances are if you are in a plane crash a car seat is not going to help that much. I felt safer with him in my arms anyway.

Car seats are of more import than plane crashes. Stong winds can cause extreamly dangerous situations in the plane, and sometimes you cannot hold your child. Also, it keeps the child in one place and you don't need to wrestle with the child to keep him/her in their seat. The FAA thinks it wise to use a car seat for a lot of reasons, not just crashes. If the FAA thinks it is important, then I have to agree. To not purchase a seat for your child, IMHO, is just plain uncaring of the child's safety, the safety of the other pax and the comfort of the aforementioned.

 

[mousey]

We had the same experience Laura flying from Cleveland to St. Louis. We were first in line with the A passes for SW and ended up in row 10 due to all the preboards. Even after the flight attendant made an announcement stating the plane was close to full, the first 9 rows made no attempt to free up any of those seats. Believe me, my kids were small once and I know how handy that extra seat comes in--but I think a few people are ruining it for everybody. If SW gets enough complaints, those requesting extra "free" seats might find themselves in the back of the plane.

 

[MOMTOMOOTOO]

Originally posted by jjarman
Sorry to get huffy here but did it really inconvenience you to have to go back one more row on the plane? One reason I always flew with SW when my son was small was the preboarding for parents with children. It is so much easier to get settled in without having to hold up people in the aisles.
And, no, I never bought my son a ticket until he was 2. Once, when he was 2 weeks old we flew and there was room for his car seat between me and my husband but other times I held him. I mean, I don't want to sound morbid or anything but chances are if you are in a plane crash a car seat is not going to help that much. I felt safer with him in my arms anyway.

It certainly did not inconvenience me as I was able to preboard with my children who had PAID tickets. Perhaps though it did inconvenience the 70 y/o couple who waited on line withn their PAID tickets and wound up in the back of the plane seperated.
I am sure it appeared that all the choice seats were PAID for and taken, when this was not the case. I think people traveling with infants should just be more courteous.

As far as you not buying your babies a seat that certainly is your right, although I would never do such a thing. I mean why put them in harms way on purpose? As Gail pointed out it is not just for a plane crash, it is for the safety and comfort of all passengers.

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by mousey
We had the same experience Laura flying from Cleveland to St. Louis. We were first in line with the A passes for SW and ended up in row 10 due to all the preboards. Even after the flight attendant made an announcement stating the plane was close to full, the first 9 rows made no attempt to free up any of those seats. Believe me, my kids were small once and I know how handy that extra seat comes in--but I think a few people are ruining it for everybody. If SW gets enough complaints, those requesting extra "free" seats might find themselves in the back of the plane.

Mousey, If the plane had indeed been full and the seats were needed, you can bet that the FA would have made those folks move. I have seen that happen on many occassions. You can request free seats all you want, but, unless they are truly not occupied, you can bet you will need to move.

I do wish, and I will be hung for this one, that SWA would go the way of Delta on this an not allow preboarding for folks with small children. They seem to board much faster this way. On the occassions that they did not allow preboarding for small kids on a few of the SWA flights I have taken, the boarding process went much faster, perhaps because the folks with little kids felt like they really needed to move and get it done.

 

[dcfromva]

Laura,
I, too am surprised that FAA has not made it a requirement for ALL passengers to have seats... I agree with you, but it is still left up to the parents to decide. The ironic thing is that many airlines charge a greatly reduced fare for infants.

The point NotUrsula was making was if that lady had two adults and 3 babies under the age of two in her party, the lady would have paid for at least 1 of the babies --even if they didn't use the child restraint seat option. Also, they can not have more than 1 lap baby per bank of 3 seats as NotUrsula has previously mentioned--they have to have an oxygen mask for everyone and there are only 4 per bank of 3 seats. (3 passengers plus 1 lap baby)--so, in that case, they sort of did have to spread out a bit.

This is from SWA's web site:
One child over 14 days and under two (2) years of age, not occupying a seat, may be carried free with a Customer paying the applicable adult fare. Affordable Infant Fares are also available that enable a Customer to reserve a seat for an infant and use his/her FAA approved car seat. A birth certificate is required to validate age of all infants under age two. A medical release for travel is required for any infant under 14 days old. Accompanied children ages two through 11 will be charged the applicable Child's Fare for the flight (does not apply to unaccompanied children ages five through 11). Link to SWA airlines for more details.

-DC

 

[ducklite]

Maybe SW should only allow preboarding of people with young children who have paid for a seat for that child...seems that it would resolve the entire issue.

Anne

 

[Lewisc]

Originally posted by GAIL HAYDEN
SWA would go the way of Delta on this an not allow preboarding for folks with small children. They seem to board much faster this way. On the occassions that they did not allow preboarding for small kids on a few of the SWA flights I have taken, the boarding process went much faster, perhaps because the folks with little kids felt like they really needed to move and get it done.

Really can't split up parents and young children regardless of what letter boarding pass they get. I'd rather they reserve the back few rows and let the pre-boards sit there. Allow them to take their time setting up their car seats and the like.

Won't work when SW starts using their new Y gates.

 

[MOMTOMOOTOO]

Originally posted by ducklite
Maybe SW should only allow preboarding of people with young children who have paid for a seat for that child...seems that it would resolve the entire issue.

Anne

I agree 100% with you. If the infant doesn't have a ticket, why should preboarding matter? Its only 1 seat the person would need anyway.

This really shouldn't affect me as I'm sure we won't be on SW anytime soon. As much as I really did like the airline and the price was right, it really was a long haul to the airport. I think I'll just suck up the price and fly from newark.

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by ducklite
Maybe SW should only allow preboarding of people with young children who have paid for a seat for that child...seems that it would resolve the entire issue.

Anne

Works for me.

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by dcfromva
Laura,
I, too am surprised that FAA has not made it a requirement for ALL passengers to have seats... I agree with you, but it is still left up to the parents to decide. The ironic thing is that many airlines charge a greatly reduced fare for infants.

The point NotUrsula was making was if that lady had two adults and 3 babies under the age of two in her party, the lady would have paid for at least 1 of the babies --even if they didn't use the child restraint seat option. Also, they can not have more than 1 lap baby per bank of 3 seats as NotUrsula has previously mentioned--they have to have an oxygen mask for everyone and there are only 4 per bank of 3 seats. (3 passengers plus 1 lap baby)--so, in that case, they sort of did have to spread out a bit.

This is from SWA's web site:
One child over 14 days and under two (2) years of age, not occupying a seat, may be carried free with a Customer paying the applicable adult fare. Affordable Infant Fares are also available that enable a Customer to reserve a seat for an infant and use his/her FAA approved car seat. A birth certificate is required to validate age of all infants under age two. A medical release for travel is required for any infant under 14 days old. Accompanied children ages two through 11 will be charged the applicable Child's Fare for the flight (does not apply to unaccompanied children ages five through 11). Link to SWA airlines for more details.

-DC

What I get from the OP is that there was 2 adults and 3 lap children. Of course, we don't know if the 18 mo. old paid or not or if SWA let it slide. Obviously, someone let something slide or there would not have been 2 lap children in the same row.

 

[GAIL HAYDEN]

Originally posted by Lewisc
Really can't split up parents and young children regardless of what letter boarding pass they get. I'd rather they reserve the back few rows and let the pre-boards sit there. Allow them to take their time setting up their car seats and the like.

Won't work when SW starts using their new Y gates.

What is a Y gate?

 

[MOMTOMOOTOO]

Originally posted by GAIL HAYDEN
What I get from the OP is that there was 2 adults and 3 lap children. Of course, we don't know if the 18 mo. old paid or not or if SWA let it slide. Obviously, someone let something slide or there would not have been 2 lap children in the same row.

There were 2 adults and 3 children. According to the mother they all did not have a ticket. I don't know why she would lie. If it were me I certainly wouldn't.

 

[NotUrsula]

I have to agree on pre-boarding lap children; I can't see why it would be necessary to do so, unless the person does have another (paid) young child along to be responsible for. I do think that parents with paid children under age 5 should have some of the first dibs on seats, because a child that age is not safe sitting without a responsible adult, and re-arranging after the fact to make it possible for a parent to sit with a young child only delays everyone else. (If you want to use a carseat in a seat you have *not* paid for, you should have to go last, after all the paid seats have been filled. Paid seats for carseats should always get preboard privileges.)

BTW: If there was an elderly couple with mobility issues, they should have been preboarded first; before the people with children. Anytime I fly SWA, they always preboard mobility-impaired passengers first of all. Of course, the person has to ask.

There are all sorts of possible solutions, but the one I usually like best is to board the aircraft from back to front, unless you have a disability that makes walking difficult. So you get on first, and the FA standing in the exit row tells you to keep walking until you get to an empty seat at the rear of the plane. People who want to sit in the exit rows should be able to get a FCFS seat pass from the gate agent (because the agent has to verify that they are physically able to handle opening the door.) This way, if sitting together is most important to you, you get first dibs on banks of open seats at the back; if sitting up front is most important to you, you wait until last and take the chance of having to sit alone.

One thing I really would like to enforce is no dumping carryon bags at the front of the plane in a bin over someone else's seat. If a passenger sitting in that row can't get a bag in, and the other passengers in the adjacent rows don't claim the bag; then the FA's should put the bag off the plane. That would break bin-hogs of that habit in a hurry! If you can't carry the dang thing back to your own seat, then don't bring it on board.

 

[MOMTOMOOTOO]

Originally posted by NotUrsula

BTW: If there was an elderly couple with mobility issues, they should have been preboarded first; before the people with children. Anytime I fly SWA, they always preboard mobility-impaired passengers first of all. Of course, the person has to ask.

I never said the couple had mobility issues. I merely stated that they were inconvenienced by the people taking up seats they weren't entitled to. I am sure this couple would have much preferred to sit together near the front, however, they were not given the opportunity.

 

[onecoolmama]

They should load the plane from back to front..it makes sense. That way, people that take a while ( me for example that has to set up two car seats and get two children ages 2 and 1) to get settled and not bother or hold up the line. If we can all make disney change their policies about dinning reservations and such..maybe we can get southwest to change the way they board!