Okay, I'll ask the ? here...

[Mickey Fliers]

Quick question, don't transferred points retain their home resort? So, if someone had two differnt contracts, one at OKW and one at VWL, they couldn't transfer their OKW points to the VWL account and use them all for the booking advantage. Correct? Or, were people transferring BCV points from another member into their SSR account so they could book at 11 months?

Just curious.

If the later is true, then I think the recent announcement that exisiting regulations regarding transfers will be enforced, would be welcome news to those own at much sought after resorts.

 

[RobDoc]

I already replied to your question in another threadm but will repeat the answer here:

That's exactly how it is stated in our documents and how it is supposed to work, but the reality is that DVC is either unable or unwilling to actually track the transferred points and they end up just being lumped in with other points in the contract where the now reside. If you owned a 50 point contract at BCV and found a VB owner who would transfer 500 VB points into your account- you'd now have 550 BCV points to be used 11 months ahead to make reservations. Until this week, if you found 20 VB members willing to transfer points into your BCV account you could amass as many points as you could find and they magically turned into BCV points ... AND they assumed your Use Year even if they would normally have expired a week later.

All that has changed this week is that the BCV member with the 50 point contract can only have one transfer of those VB points - so it needs to be a BIG one if he plans to commercially rent those points. The VB points will still become BCV points and will still assume the new Use Year. Hopefully, DVC will find the ability or the energy to correct that issue soon too.

 

[dianeschlicht]

Yep, that's how it works.

 

[Spine_DR]

On other threads, forums and talking to people I know the scenario described above doesn't always happen, but probalbly happens way more than it should, from what I understand there is a modifier added to the transfered points in the computer, but nothing to stop MS rep from using them as BCV points, now if the MS rep notices it or evan cares about it is another story. Basically this could work for someone one time and not the next depending on the MS rep they get.

 

[mydogdrew]

I already replied to your question in another threadm but will repeat the answer here:

That's exactly how it is stated in our documents and how it is supposed to work, but the reality is that DVC is either unable or unwilling to actually track the transferred points and they end up just being lumped in with other points in the contract where the now reside. If you owned a 50 point contract at BCV and found a VB owner who would transfer 500 VB points into your account- you'd now have 550 BCV points to be used 11 months ahead to make reservations. Until this week, if you found 20 VB members willing to transfer points into your BCV account you could amass as many points as you could find and they magically turned into BCV points ... AND they assumed your Use Year even if they would normally have expired a week later.

All that has changed this week is that the BCV member with the 50 point contract can only have one transfer of those VB points - so it needs to be a BIG one if he plans to commercially rent those points. The VB points will still become BCV points and will still assume the new Use Year. Hopefully, DVC will find the ability or the energy to correct that issue soon too.

This is my understanding as well except that if, in your example, the BCV member who received the VB points wanted to use the points to book VB at 11 months it can be done but it is problematic. Initially they tell you you can't and then you get the supervisor, etc...

I worked with another member on an issue like this that was eventually resolved but not without some heartburn. The bottom line is DVC must accomodate this fact pattern as it is the correct answer (only x points at each resort each year and that should not be changed by transfers).

Bottom line is that you can currently have it both ways, which needs to be corrected by DVC.

 

[Mickey Fliers]

I already replied to your question in another threadm but will repeat the answer here:

That's exactly how it is stated in our documents and how it is supposed to work, but the reality is that DVC is either unable or unwilling to actually track the transferred points and they end up just being lumped in with other points in the contract where the now reside. If you owned a 50 point contract at BCV and found a VB owner who would transfer 500 VB points into your account- you'd now have 550 BCV points to be used 11 months ahead to make reservations. Until this week, if you found 20 VB members willing to transfer points into your BCV account you could amass as many points as you could find and they magically turned into BCV points ... AND they assumed your Use Year even if they would normally have expired a week later.

All that has changed this week is that the BCV member with the 50 point contract can only have one transfer of those VB points - so it needs to be a BIG one if he plans to commercially rent those points. The VB points will still become BCV points and will still assume the new Use Year. Hopefully, DVC will find the ability or the energy to correct that issue soon too.

Thanks for the info. I didn't see the reply on the other thread, so please excuse by redundancy (and spelling ).

See now I think this is where DVC should be enforcing the rules. MS should really make sure that transferred points retain their home resort. This is exactly how point structures become completely unbalanced. Right now, I could buy a VWL 25 pt. add on and then transfer my large SSR contract into the other so I can book early Dec. at VWL. That absolutely negates having a limited amount of points to purchase .

If MS is going to start enforcing the transfer policy, thus punishing members who only need a few points to comlete their vacation or want to get rid of a couple so they don't expire, they should also make sure someone can't "magically" turn their OKW points into BCV points with one simple transfer!!!

 

[Caskbill]

Thanks for the info. I didn't see the reply on the other thread, so please excuse by redundancy (and spelling ).

See now I think this is where DVC should be enforcing the rules. MS should really make sure that transferred points retain their home resort. This is exactly how point structures become completely unbalanced. Right now, I could buy a VWL 25 pt. add on and then transfer my large SSR contract into the other so I can book early Dec. at VWL. That absolutely negates having a limited amount of points to purchase .

If MS is going to start enforcing the transfer policy, thus punishing members who only need a few points to comlete their vacation or want to get rid of a couple so they don't expire, they should also make sure someone can't "magically" turn their OKW points into BCV points with one simple transfer!!!

As stated, DVC can only track points by using manual notations in the computer. I haven't heard anything official, but I'll bet that internally the CM's have been instructed to check more carefully for manual notations and note anything about point transfers, and not allow points to 'adopt' a new resort and use year. Just IMO.

 

[LisaS]

Right now, I could buy a VWL 25 pt. add on and then transfer my large SSR contract into the other so I can book early Dec. at VWL.

Actually with a 25 point add on, you could not do this. An add-on is like a subcontract under your master contract. You cannot transfer points between them. You can just combine the points at the 7 month window to make a reservation without having to transfer points.

To do what you describe, the 25-point contract has to be a separate master contract. Since Disney requires a 150-point minimum purchase for master contracts, you would either have to add on 25 points to your existing master and then sell the master contract, leaving the 25 pointer as the new master, or buy a 25 point contract on the resale market, in a different Use Year than your master contract to ensure that MS doesn't enter it into the system as an add on rather than a second master contract.

 

[Mickey Fliers]

Actually with a 25 point add on, you could not do this. An add-on is like a subcontract under your master contract. You cannot transfer points between them. You can just combine the points at the 7 month window to make a reservation without having to transfer points.

To do what you describe, the 25-point contract has to be a separate master contract. Since Disney requires a 150-point minimum purchase for master contracts, you would either have to add on 25 points to your existing master and then sell the master contract, leaving the 25 pointer as the new master, or buy a 25 point contract on the resale market, in a different Use Year than your master contract to ensure that MS doesn't enter it into the system as an add on rather than a second master contract.

I totally understand what you are saying, however, if I bought a 50/100 pt. contract resale, or as an add-on with a different UY, my scenario is completely plausible given the way MS is tracking transfers at present. Am I not correct with this?

You are right, though, and I certainly don't want to confuse new or potential DVCers.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[LisaS]

I totally understand what you are saying, however, if I bought a 50/100 pt. contract resale, or as an add-on with a different UY, my scenario is completely plausible given the way MS is tracking transfers at present. Am I not correct with this?

We're talking terminology here. You are using the term "add-on" in a generic way to mean "a second contract" but the term add-on usually refers to a specific type of contract -- a subcontract under a master contract, with the same base contract number with a ".001" extension and must be the same Use Year as the master contract. So when you talk about "an add-on with a different UY", that scenario doesn't exist -- an add-on must have the same UY as the master contract. And, you cannot transfer points between the master and any of its add-ons.

So the scenario you are describing requires either two master contracts and you transfer points between them, or just one master contract and you transfer in points from another member and yes, in those situations the points generally take on the home resort of the contract into which they are transferred. And I'll add on the usual warning: this is a loophole and someday (hopefully!!) DVC will close it.

Sorry to be such a stickler for terminology, but I've seen a fair number of posts here on the boards already about "when I combine points from my master and add-on contracts, is that a transfer?" that I was just trying to keep the record straight. I am going to put down my chalk now.

 

[*elaine*]

We're talking terminology here. You are using the term "add-on" in a generic way to mean "a second contract" but the term add-on usually refers to a specific type of contract -- a subcontract under a master contract, with the same base contract number with a ".001" extension and must be the same Use Year as the master contract. So when you talk about "an add-on with a different UY", that scenario doesn't exist -- an add-on must have the same UY as the master contract. And, you cannot transfer points between the master and any of its add-ons.

So the scenario you are describing requires either two master contracts and you transfer points between them, or just one master contract and you transfer in points from another member and yes, in those situations the points generally take on the home resort of the contract into which they are transferred. And I'll add on the usual warning: this is a loophole and someday (hopefully!!) DVC will close it.

Sorry to be such a stickler for terminology, but I've seen a fair number of posts here on the boards already about "when I combine points from my master and add-on contracts, is that a transfer?" that I was just trying to keep the record straight. I am going to put down my chalk now.

But my understanding was that now that I am a member, I can buy additional points from Disney (25 points at a time minimum) and they CAN be a different UY or a different resort. So, wouldn't that be a separate contract with less than the 150 minimum for any contract that you mentioned in an earlier post? I thought I understood how it worked, but now I am growing more and more confused.

 

[Dean]

But my understanding was that now that I am a member, I can buy additional points from Disney (25 points at a time minimum) and they CAN be a different UY or a different resort. So, wouldn't that be a separate contract with less than the 150 minimum for any contract that you mentioned in an earlier post? I thought I understood how it worked, but now I am growing more and more confused.

That is not correct. DVC will only sell you the same use year and registration for add on sizes as you already own. It can be any resort they have to offer you. You could buy a different use year for 150 pts of more.

 

[*elaine*]

That is not correct. DVC will only sell you the same use year and registration for add on sizes as you already own. It can be any resort they have to offer you. You could buy a different use year for 150 pts of more.

Thanks for clearing that up for me, Dean! I was misinformed or confused or, more likely, BOTH!

 

[LisaS]

But my understanding was that now that I am a member, I can buy additional points from Disney (25 points at a time minimum) and they CAN be a different UY or a different resort. So, wouldn't that be a separate contract with less than the 150 minimum for any contract that you mentioned in an earlier post? I thought I understood how it worked, but now I am growing more and more confused.

Yes, absolutely, you can buy additional points from Disney. Minimum purchase is 25 points (50 points if financed) and can be at any resort but must be the same Use Year.

If you really want to buy more points with a different Use Year, Disney lets you do that but you must buy at least 150 points and they set up those points as a new master contract, not as an add-on contract and I believe you even get an additional membership number to go with it. With two master contracts (rather than a master and an add-on), you cannot simply combine points at 7 months to make a reservation, you have to either transfer points from one of your master contracts to the other, or reserve some nights with points from one master contract and the rest of your nights with points from the other master contract. It's harder to manage your points that way, but several DISers do it.

Hope that helps!

 

[*elaine*]

Thank you, Lisa!

 

[Mickey Fliers]

Thank you Lisa and Dean for the clarification on terminology.

I still think this transfer loophole needs to be eliminated if DVC wants to maintain the integrity of the resorts.

Hopefully, this will changed soon, as well.

 

[Dean]

Thank you Lisa and Dean for the clarification on terminology.

I still think this transfer loophole needs to be eliminated if DVC wants to maintain the integrity of the resorts.

Hopefully, this will changed soon, as well.

I doubt it will change for years, if ever.

 

[deedeetoo]

I have one question that I don't think has been answered here.

If I buy a resale contract that is the same use year as my original contract does Disney treat that as a single contract so that I don't need to transfer between them to make reservations. Or will they keep the two seperate contract numbers and make me do a transfer to make a large reservation.

 

[Dean]

I have one question that I don't think has been answered here.

If I buy a resale contract that is the same use year as my original contract does Disney treat that as a single contract so that I don't need to transfer between them to make reservations. Or will they keep the two seperate contract numbers and make me do a transfer to make a large reservation.

The answer it, it depends. It is Disney's intention to add any new contracts to your existing master contract. But if they don't realize it they might not and I've been told they won't go back and fix it later. And if the registration is at all different on the new contract, it will have to be totally separate. So if one is buying and wants them combined you need to have it exactly the same registration and use year plus make sure DVC knows you want them together. If you don't want them combined, obviously there are ways to easily do this as well. And if one were inclined to buy a lot of points for renting, it might be better to have some in one's name and others in the spouse's name so you could get as many as 10,000 pts if you wanted per couple.

 

[LisaS]

Thank you Lisa and Dean for the clarification on terminology.

I still think this transfer loophole needs to be eliminated if DVC wants to maintain the integrity of the resorts.

Hopefully, this will changed soon, as well.

I agree they should fix this. Since that will involve software changes which would cost a significant amount of money it appears they taken the least expensive path -- reducing rather than eliminating the problem by limiting transfers and looking for patterns of activity to target the biggest abusers.