Newest MS change and future of dvc Resales

[KANSAS]

The Transfer of points, was very flexible/appealing part of DVC membership!


now that it no longer is a viable option for a DVC MEmber, to conveniently get points,
or get economic value, for his/her DVC points, that are not going to be used that year.

Has DVC taken away from potential DVC resale candidates,
something, that will cause them to rethink, the purchase of a DVC resale cotnract,especially a large DVC Contract.


If you have large DVC Contract+ you are not going to use your points that year. Will someone take all of your DVC points from you? or will this one transfer per year, rule change
make that much more difficult.

 

[Chuck S]

It really isn't a rule "change", but an enforcement of the rules put forth in our documents. Someone should never have purchased DVC with the sole intent of renting/transferring on a regular basis in the first place.

 

[CarolA]

I can't see this impacting resales. The only two groups I see affected are the "buy 50 points" and then rent in what I need. (And it appears that Disney has become more agressive in snapping those sales up when presented for ROFR) and the I bought 1000 points to run a small business. Since NOTHING in your documents set you up as a small business I don't feel to sorry for you.

I have always felt that buying ANY timeshare including DVC as a money making investment was risky and not well advised....

 

[Anjelica]

This won't affect those that don't rent right? Like if I need to transfer from one year to another (obviously following the rules). Like if I decide to bank from one year and then borrow from the future year - that doesn't count as as a transfer right? (Sorry - haven't gotten through all my documentation yet - just got it all in the mail this past weekend).

 

[Chuck S]

This won't affect those that don't rent right? Like if I need to transfer from one year to another (obviously following the rules). Like if I decide to bank from one year and then borrow from the future year - that doesn't count as as a transfer right? (Sorry - haven't gotten through all my documentation yet - just got it all in the mail this past weekend).

Banking and borrowing are not transfers. Transfers are points going from one account of contract to another.

For instance, let us say you have 100 points at VWL with a June use year, and 100 points at BCV with a December use year. You would have two member numbers (because of the different use years). You could "transfer" points between those contracts once per year and in one direction. Or transfers can be "member to member."

Banking and borrowing within the same account is not affected.

 

[utahkennedys]

Ok, I somehow missed this, what is the new "rule"?

 

[RobDoc]

I would look at it as a situation where some may actually purchase an add-on if they find it more challenging to "rent" or "transfer" points from another member. If a member finds he/she is short a few points each year and has been able to secure those points thru transfer- he/she may now find it advantageous to purchase more points thru add-on.


I know that there have been several using our Rent/Trade Board to have points transferred into their accounts (multiple times) and then offer points for rental to others. Due to the frequency of those threads, I would assume that they are renting those points for more than they paid for the transfers and that might make them fit someone's definition of "commercial". I expect that these members will be adversely affected by the current enforcement of policy.

There are also some who have purchased more points than they will use with the intent of renting accommodations. These members may also be adversely affected- but their plan was seriously contrary to all comments in the documents in the first place.

It will be interesting to see what affect, if any, this will have on rentals.

 

[JimMIA]

As Chuck said, it's not a new rule. It's a return to enforcement of a rule that's always been there -- only one transfer per year.

 

[JimMIA]

I can't imagine this change having any effect on resale prices. Transferring is a negligible feature for most owners. It's a nice thing to have on that one off chance I might want to use it, but not something I'd pay extra for.

 

[LIFERBABE]

But won't this enforcement of the rules just shift us from a point based currency to a reservation based rental system?

The reservation is going to be worth more than the sum of its points.

One thing DVC cannot stop is the ability to make multiple reservations. Those with large contracts will now just book Sun-Thur for the popular times of the year and rent them.

Most timeshares work like this anyway weeks for rent not points.

As for resale prices, No I dont think this will effect the prices at all. The small contracts will remain popular as true add-ons for existing members. New members may not be as interested in micro-contracts because of the rule.
New members will now be geared towards the larger contracts due the rule.
Plus isnt DVC starting to charge closing costs to new members? Another reason for a new member to purchase an adequate # of points the first time.

 

[greenban]

I can't imagine this change having any effect on resale prices. Transferring is a negligible feature for most owners. It's a nice thing to have on that one off chance I might want to use it, but not something I'd pay extra for.

I agree.

Only those looking to 'game' the system will be affected. If banking and borrowing (to get you 3 years worth of points) won't reserve what you need, you either need to buy more points, pay for some cash nights, or rent from me at some unreasonably high price. <==== Kidding, really!

The 25 and 50 point memberships are gonna get hammered, unless they were addons.

We also haven't lost anything. MS is enforcing an existing, written policy. I agree with others, that a little warning may have been nicer, but we still have the same once-per-year transfer rights.

Here is my question.....

What happens when MS decided to once-again enforce occupancy limits, especially all the families of 5 (myself included), who were directly told by their Guides, that a 1 Bedroom would be enough for their family?

I feel it's comming soon.

-Tony

 

[utahkennedys]

I guess I only see this as impacting negatively members who do not "rent for profit" etc. since now it seems if you have extra points you have to rent them (which is riskier to members if a renter backs out, as opposed to a transfer that is done when it's done), try to find someone to transfer all of your extra points in a given UY, or risk losing some points. Yes, it may end those who have points transferred in and then rent at a higher price, but my guess is there aren't too many of those types around out of the 80,000 plus members.

I thought the transfer feature was a good one for members since it allowed people to augment their contract or transfer points they didn't need in a particular year. I think it would be almost impossible to have a contract where you used exactly the allotment of points every year, unless you stay in the same size unit, at the same resort, in the same week every year...and I thought the flexibility of DVC was to be able to stay at different resorts, in different size units, at different times of the year?

 

[greenban]

But won't this enforcement of the rules just shift us from a point based currency to a reservation based rental system?

The reservation is going to be worth more than the sum of its points.

One thing DVC cannot stop is the ability to make multiple reservations. Those with large contracts will now just book Sun-Thur for the popular times of the year and rent them.

Most timeshares work like this anyway weeks for rent not points.

GREAT QUESTION Liferbabe!

My answer is Yes/No/Maybe!

I feel we switched to a reservation for rent system when membership went from 70,000 to over 100,000. Not blaming it on a specific resort (Really, I'm not flamming here), but on sheer numbers. So you are right, the week will increasing become that which matters. And based on banking deadlines and borrowing tendencies, it may even become, take it or leave it, I'm not trimming the last day off of my existing ressie for you. I (hypothetical Owner, not me specifically) can't bank or transfer them, so if you want this ressie, it will be as is!

Multiple reservations on spec, will (and should IMHO) lead to a return to the December Lottery of yore.

-Tony

 

[littlestar]

Maybe it will slow down all the E-bay commercial point renters. I saw some ads yesterday on E-bay where they advised their renters to call Member Services after they change their names on the reservations to set up all the things they want on their vacation.

This is a different topic, but I can't believe how many Interval International exchanges that I see on E-bay on a regular basis for Disneys and Marriotts that people are trying to sell. They list the $95.00 fee for the Disney DVC's and then tell them to call the 1-800 numbers to set everything up. That's against II's rules to rent an exchange. You can usually tell those apart by them being 7 day rentals instead of 5 days. There was one a few weeks ago on E-bay that probably had 15 Disney exchanges they were renting. But I think that one got shut down by E-bay because when I tried to pull it up later, the auction had been pulled. I guess either people don't know not to rent an exchange or don't care. I would think those people renting those exchanges would run the risk of losing their Interval account if they got caught. Seems like a pretty dumb thing to be doing. Can you imagine showing up at a DVC front desk and finding out you bought an Interval exchange illegally off of E-bay? Not good.

 

[LisaS]

I thought the transfer feature was a good one for members since it allowed people to augment their contract or transfer points they didn't need in a particular year. I think it would be almost impossible to have a contract where you used exactly the allotment of points every year, unless you stay in the same size unit, at the same resort, in the same week every year...and I thought the flexibility of DVC was to be able to stay at different resorts, in different size units, at different times of the year?

But you can still stay in different resorts, different size units at different times of the year. Dh and I do, and I've never transferred in any points. We have already taken (or have plans in place for) trips in Jan, May, Oct and Dec, at 3 different resorts, in studios, 1BRs and one stay in a 2BR, and have managed to make it all work within the points we own. Our first Use Year we had to borrow points to make the trips we wanted to make, the next Use Year we had points left over which is good because the following Use Year we're going three times and I need those banked points! It's very do-able, provided you own enough points to cover your typical travel plans.

I think if you have plans for something that's out of the ordinary, say a one-time trip involving lots of extra family members that requires transferring points from another member, you will have to start looking early and shop around for someone with close to the number of points you need. You may no longer be able to negotiate for the exact number of points you want -- you will probably have to buy more points than required and figure out what to do with the excess. We would like to treat DH's brother's family to a stay in a year or so, and I will need extra points for that trip -- I'll just have to calculate carefully since I will only have one shot at getting the right number of points transferred in, and allow plenty of time.

 

[Inkmahm]

I think if you have plans for something that's out of the ordinary, say a one-time trip involving lots of extra family members that requires transferring points from another member, you will have to start looking early and shop around for someone with close to the number of points you need. You may no longer be able to negotiate for the exact number of points you want -- you will probably have to buy more points than required and figure out what to do with the excess. We would like to treat DH's brother's family to a stay in a year or so, and I will need extra points for that trip -- I'll just have to calculate carefully since I will only have one shot at getting the right number of points transferred in, and allow plenty of time.

That's exactly what I'll be facing soon. We've invited my husband's whole family to come to DVC with us in December, 2007. I will need my BWV points from 2006 UY banked, 2007 UY and 2008 UY borrowed PLUS I know I will need to transfer in more points to cover all the rooms. There will be 5 couples, one with two kids. Now I'm going to have to pin down the family members WAY in advance to which days exactly they can go so that I can figure out how many points I need to transfer in long before the 11 month window opens next January. The only safety net I can see is if I purposely transfer in TOO MANY points before January and then if I have too many in the end, I borrow fewer from 2008 than 100% of my UY points.

 

[Beca]

That's exactly what I'll be facing soon. We've invited my husband's whole family to come to DVC with us in December, 2007. I will need my BWV points from 2006 UY banked, 2007 UY and 2008 UY borrowed PLUS I know I will need to transfer in more points to cover all the rooms. There will be 5 couples, one with two kids. Now I'm going to have to pin down the family members WAY in advance to which days exactly they can go so that I can figure out how many points I need to transfer in long before the 11 month window opens next January. The only safety net I can see is if I purposely transfer in TOO MANY points before January and then if I have too many in the end, I borrow fewer from 2008 than 100% of my UY points.

And, finding a person who can transfer all of the points that you need at the time you are looking might be a challenge. You will probably not find someone who has EXACTLY the number of points you need, so you will have to figure in the extra cost of buying more points than you need. Also, if you need a large amount, be prepared to pay more per point. There will probably be very few people on the dis who will have a large number of points available for transfer, and might ask a premium for them. You could probably rent some of the rooms from another member, but the ability to transfer and "control" your ressie is going to come at a premium price. It's funny....this change may negatively affect members who need extra points more than it will affect non-members who regularly rent.

I would suggest either:
1) Transfer a lesser number than you actually need if you can find these points at a good price, and then rent a room from a member for the rest, or

2) Start looking for transferrable points EARLY. Plan to buy more points than you need, and then borrow fewer than you had originally planned.

Good luck,


Beca

 

[kimberh]

I fear we will be forced to searching out AP codes again to get what we need in a case of needing several rooms.

 

[Plutofan]

That's exactly what I'll be facing soon. We've invited my husband's whole family to come to DVC with us in December, 2007. I will need my BWV points from 2006 UY banked, 2007 UY and 2008 UY borrowed PLUS I know I will need to transfer in more points to cover all the rooms. There will be 5 couples, one with two kids. Now I'm going to have to pin down the family members WAY in advance to which days exactly they can go so that I can figure out how many points I need to transfer in long before the 11 month window opens next January. The only safety net I can see is if I purposely transfer in TOO MANY points before January and then if I have too many in the end, I borrow fewer from 2008 than 100% of my UY points.

Is the transfer limitation by calender year or use year? If I had a December use year could I have someone transfer 2006 Boardwalk points into my 2006 Boardwalk account. Then bank 50% of the points depending on the size of my contract and then the next day find someone with December 2007 points that would go into my December 2007 boardwalk account. I could then borrow the points if needed. I would use up my 2006 and 2007 transfer rights but this way if I needed a lot of points I could get them from two different members. Any thoughts? Am I missing something.

 

[Beca]

Is the transfer limitation by calender year or use year? If I had a December use year could I have someone transfer 2006 Boardwalk points into my 2006 Boardwalk account. Then bank 50% of the points depending on the size of my contract and then the next day find someone with December 2007 points that would go into my December 2007 boardwalk account. I could then borrow the points if needed. I would use up my 2006 and 2007 transfer rights but this way if I needed a lot of points I could get them from two different members. Any thoughts? Am I missing something.

It is per calendar use year, per use year (or member number). So, yes...your plan would work.

VERY creative, BTW!!! See....we're learning to work the new "system" already!!!

Beca