New RIV Listing

DougEMG

DIS Veteran
DVC Gold
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
I don’t think they can adjust the booking, but I think that this document allows them to treat resale buyers differently. Someone mentioned that they couldn’t lift restrictions on RIV but not the other way or allow one to pay and not the others.

I think the document would allow for that, And, it states at the top...which I just noticed that these rules, have been approved by the Florida Bureua of Timeshaess and are now part of the BVTC documents.

I’ll go back and read again, but I believe @CarolMN is correct and that there is no language regarding booking windows being different...only Resort Restrictions and Limitations listed in 1 and 2.
That's good to know. If I were to ever buy RIV resale, I could live with the current restriction around booking else where as I already have enough unrestricted points. Just wouldn't like it if they could add other stuff after the fact.
 

Sandisw

DVC Forums
Moderator
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
That's good to know. If I were to ever buy RIV resale, I could live with the current restriction around booking else where as I already have enough unrestricted points. Just wouldn't like it if they could add other stuff after the fact.
I just re read most of it and it definitely says nothing like this in the information regarding different rules for booking. I think it is just related to them having the ability to do something in reference to restrictions if they need or want to down the road,

As long as sales continue, I think it will be many years before anything is even considered to be needed.
 

DVC BLT

Mouseketeer
Joined
Aug 13, 2011
That's good to know. If I were to ever buy RIV resale, I could live with the current restriction around booking else where as I already have enough unrestricted points. Just wouldn't like it if they could add other stuff after the fact.
I would not mind buying RIV resale as we love the resort, but if that's the thinking, the current pricing in 170's (with incentives) is not bad to have unrestricted points.
 

tjkraz

<img src="http://www.wdwinfo.com/images/silver.jpg
Joined
Feb 4, 2002
I think there's a lot of willful ignoring of actual geographic distance on the part of people who want to focus on time-of-travel instead. It's a huge benefit to me to look over and see MK or Epcot right out my back door, to feel the proximity. If Riv had a rocket ship which delivered me to MK in 0.4sec, I'd still prefer looking across the lagoon from Poly.
75% of the villas at Walt Disney World don't have a specific view to write home about, so it's a little disingenuous to cherry pick a Poly view of MK as an example of what DVC owners want.

Even from resorts close to parks like BoardWalk and Beach Club, the view of a Disney theme park isn't all that great in many cases. Certainly no better than the Riviera preferred view which overlooks the world showcase. Most resorts have "standard" views which are very popular among guests--including the Poly itself. Saratoga Springs and Old Key West are the two biggest resorts and, at best, they offer some view of Disney Springs.

The image outside my balcony isn't particularly important to me. But getting around Walt Disney World efficiently is a HUGE benefit for any resort, regardless of whether the method is monorail, bus, boat, skyliner or foot.
 

mustinjourney

DIS Veteran
Joined
May 8, 2016
I agree it's just silly and I'd hit the ignore button because a reasonable discussion can't be had. Not only can you not walk to a park from Riv, you CAN'T WALK ANYWHERE except Caribbean Beach. The monorail trip from VGF is not the same as the skyliner trip to any Park but people say it is.

As I said in another thread Riv owners think if they had a hyperspeed tunnel from Tampa Bay that got to DHS in 20 minutes that means the location is good...they aren't the same thing and anyone who is of a reasonable mind, riviera owner or not, agrees.

I didn't hear a lot of "great location" talk about Caribbean beach prior to Riviera being build...
I'm sorry -- I own at VGF, RIV and BCV. I have stayed at all three in the last few months since the skyliner has opened. Can you say the same?

I have timed my trips from various spots multiple times.

I get it -- you hate RIV. But you don't need to act like its location is awful.

Yes -- the monorail trip from VGF to Mk is about 5 mins ONCE YOU GET ON. But guess what -- the same trip coming home is 15 minutes. And that's assuming the monorail isn't broken...and that doesn't account for wait times.

And you can't really see MK from VGF...but I could easily see TOT and spaceship earth from my balcony at RIV. So I'm not sure what the hell your point is.

Tell me how VGF is anymore MK than RIV is Epcot...nevermind DHS as well. How long does it take to get from VGF to epcot?

CBR didn't have the skyliner before RIV was built. Ignoring the skyliner is asinine and completely undercuts your credibility.

Be honest. You're mad at the restrictions and are letting that taint your world view.
 
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mustinjourney

DIS Veteran
Joined
May 8, 2016
I think there's a lot of willful ignoring of actual geographic distance on the part of people who want to focus on time-of-travel instead. It's a huge benefit to me to look over and see MK or Epcot right out my back door, to feel the proximity. If Riv had a rocket ship which delivered me to MK in 0.4sec, I'd still prefer looking across the lagoon from Poly.
First -- it's not willful ignorance. It's simply how different people value different things. You apparently like to sit at the resort and look across the lake. Other people value their time in how they are getting across said lake. YOU might value the view -- but there are a ton of people that don't give a rat's *** about the view. Views do not account for whether something is an MK or epcot "area" resort though. Otherwise, standard view rooms at BLT, VGF, and Poly wouldn't be considered MK area...same for BWV standard and P&G view.

So basically -- view of the park is not really relevant to whether a resort is MK or epcot area.


As far a "proximity" to the parks -- do you realize how close you PHYSICALLY are to epcot and DHS? I'll give you a hint -- you are PHYSICALLY closer to world showcase than the swan or dolphin is. As far as sightlines go -- you're pretty damn close. And since you only care about sightlines -- you can actually get a MUCH better view of Epcot fireworks from RIV rooms than either BWV or BCV.

Nevermind the travel times from RIV are pretty stellar. And for me -- the time of travel (as well as mode of travel) is kind of important to me since that is how I will be travelling.

You value sightlines more than ease of transportation. That's fine. But not everyone thinks like you...and to outright dismiss others' opinions b/c they feel differently is even more "willful ignorance."
 
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mustinjourney

DIS Veteran
Joined
May 8, 2016
It's not a matter of opinion that I may get stuck on a wire for an hour or longer in Florida heat with the Skyliner. And that makes BCV/BWV a better location. I just don't see how anyone could logically argue otherwise. Having an emergency defecation bag doesn't even the score.
I'm a skyliner fan -- and this is a legitimate argument as a major con.

However, 99% of the time -- you aren't getting "stuck" for more than 1 to 2 minutes while they're stopping the line for an EVC. Yes -- it has stopped for a long time -- but it has only happened once.

The monorail has also had issues.

Walking is certainly less likely to have major issues -- but you could suffer a really bad sprained ankle or get attacked by a rogue squirrel. :-)

*ETA -- rule #1 of the skyliner is to never enter the skyliner without having first used the restroom. This is especially important for young children. Or if you just had a bunch of different foods at World Showcase. Some food cocktails can be...."explosive."
 
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mustinjourney

DIS Veteran
Joined
May 8, 2016
I got stuck on the monorail in January for over 20 minutes and had to go backward to the GF? Does that negate its close to MK?

To me, the word better is a subjective word and BWV and BCV are only better if you find them better. For years, they were better for me and DH. Now, they are not and I am selling my 2nd BWV contract because RIV is a better place, all the way around, for my family.

That doesnt make it better for others, thst is for sure, and as I said, many will see those areas as better if walking is a big plus.
Exactly. the monorails have actually had more reliability issues than the skyliners -- but I suspect that not that many people routinely ride the monorails. In Dec of 2018 -- everytime I tried to catch a monorail to MK in the evenings, the lines were so backed up due to the monorails being full (MVMCP and guests resort hopping), that it took 20 minutes before I even boarded the monorail. It was insane.
 

RaymOOOnd

Mouseketeer
Joined
Jun 14, 2015
First -- it's not willful ignorance. It's simply how different people value different things. You apparently like to sit at the resort and look across the lake. Other people value their time in how they are getting across said lake. YOU might value the view -- but there are a ton of people that don't give a rat's *** about the view. Views do not account for whether something is an MK or epcot "area" resort though. Otherwise, standard view rooms at BLT, VGF, and Poly wouldn't be considered MK area...same for BWV standard and P&G view.

So basically -- view of the park is not really relevant to whether a resort is MK or epcot area.


As far a "proximity" to the parks -- do you realize how close you PHYSICALLY are to epcot and DHS? I'll give you a hint -- you are PHYSICALLY closer to world showcase than the swan or dolphin is. As far as sightlines go -- you're pretty damn close. And since you only care about sightlines -- you can actually get a MUCH better view of Epcot fireworks from RIV rooms than either BWV or BCV.

Nevermind the travel times from RIV are pretty stellar. And for me -- the time of travel (as well as mode of travel) is kind of important to me since that is how I will be travelling.

You value sightlines more than ease of transportation. That's fine. But not everyone thinks like you...and to outright dismiss others' opinions b/c they feel differently is even more "willful ignorance."
Whew! I must have hit pretty close to the mark here.
 

sethschroeder

DIS Veteran
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
I get it -- you hate RIV. But you don't need to act like its location is awful.
Nope just know being within walking distance of Epcot/HS and having a boat there as well is a superior location to RIV.

I'm sorry -- I own at VGF, RIV and BCV. I have stayed at all three in the last few months since the skyliner has opened. Can you say the same?
Not the person you responded to and no I can not. I have been on the skyliner.

I also don't need to live in 4-5 different condos to know the one that is 4 blocks from "the place in town" is better than the one that is 1 stop on the train away.

Sorry there just is no legitimate claim to how Riviera has a better location. You can claim it has superior transportation because of the skyliner. The skyliner is a mode of transportation though not the attraction (well not at least to 99% of people likely).
 

Sandisw

DVC Forums
Moderator
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
Nope just know being within walking distance of Epcot/HS and having a boat there as well is a superior location to RIV.



Not the person you responded to and no I can not. I have been on the skyliner.

I also don't need to live in 4-5 different condos to know the one that is 4 blocks from "the place in town" is better than the one that is 1 stop on the train away.

Sorry there just is no legitimate claim to how Riviera has a better location. You can claim it has superior transportation because of the skyliner. The skyliner is a mode of transportation though not the attraction (well not at least to 99% of people likely).
i have t read many that say it’s better. Most simply state that it is an equally good location for people who want to stay in the area.

For you, its not An equal choice and that’s okay. But, you can’t say there is no legitimate reason to disagree. I’m selling BWV because I realize between RIV, and having just stayed at BCV in December, they both offer more to me than it does.
 

sethschroeder

DIS Veteran
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
My point is that they can do just that, They gave themselves the right to give RIV resale buyers different rules than resale buyers at L14...all there in black and white in the contracts. Specifically says they can give some members rights others don’t have.
I just go back to the thought process that you can write whatever you want in to a contract. It doesn't make it legal.

I just can't see a one way door being opened in the end. In theory based on that document they could make it so everyone who purchases resale is locked in to only their resort.

As an example it doesn't state you are locked out of future resorts although its expected to be implemented like that. When we get closer to the next resort opening I guess we will see how they start to choose to amend that if not sooner.
 

sethschroeder

DIS Veteran
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
i have t read many that say it’s better. Most simply state that it is an equally good location for people who want to stay in the area.

For you, its not An equal choice and that’s okay. But, you can’t say there is no legitimate reason to disagree. I’m selling BWV because I realize between RIV, and having just stayed at BCV in December, they both offer more to me than it does.
Again they can offer more. I am not saying RIV is not newer, doesn't have some better options, and has a nice skyliner access.

That doesn't have to do with the location.

Location is independent to the buildings of the resort. If you demolished BWV moved everything about RIV on top of that land, you would see a bonus of better location.

It seems it happens a bunch on here but you are confusing the resort and its amenities with the physical location.

A great example think if Topolino's was on top of the Boardwalk today. Wouldnt that be a crazy amazing view of the fireworks at Epcot because of the new location?
 

Sandisw

DVC Forums
Moderator
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
I just go back to the thought process that you can write whatever you want in to a contract. It doesn't make it legal.

I just can't see a one way door being opened in the end. In theory based on that document they could make it so everyone who purchases resale is locked in to only their resort.

As an example it doesn't state you are locked out of future resorts although its expected to be implemented like that. When we get closer to the next resort opening I guess we will see how they start to choose to amend that if not sooner.
The document and the changes were approved by Florida Timeshare Bureau so I would say it’s got some good legal standing behind it,

In terms of future resorts, that is in another section of the POS..I didn’t post that because I was just sharing the info regarding adjustments to the restrictions. But, just like all other resorts, it says there is no guarantee they will build future resorts that will be part of the program, including Reflections

Like it said, I don’t know if they would ever change one and not the other, but they certainly can and I can see it being applied to a RIV points before others,

They covered the bases to amend for any reason they see fit,
 

JETSDAD

DIS Veteran
Joined
Jan 7, 2016
As an example it doesn't state you are locked out of future resorts although its expected to be implemented like that. When we get closer to the next resort opening I guess we will see how they start to choose to amend that if not sooner.
It does state that resale buyers will only be able to use the points at their home resort....future resorts are not their home resort.

ETA, it actually does mention future resorts.

Club Members who purchase an Ownership Interest at Riviera Resort from a third party other than directly from DVD or other seller approved by DVD, are not permitted to convert their Riviera Resort Home Resort Vacation Points related to that Ownership Interest to DVC Vacation Points for the purpose of reserving Vacation Homes at any other DVC Resort, including any future DVC Resorts, through the DVC Reservation Component. Purchasers should refer to the DVC Resort Agreement for details.
 

Sandisw

DVC Forums
Moderator
Joined
Nov 15, 2008
Again they can offer more. I am not saying RIV is not newer, doesn't have some better options, and has a nice skyliner access.

That doesn't have to do with the location.

Location is independent to the buildings of the resort. If you demolished BWV moved everything about RIV on top of that land, you would see a bonus of better location.

It seems it happens a bunch on here but you are confusing the resort and its amenities with the physical location.

A great example think if Topolino's was on top of the Boardwalk today. Wouldnt that be a crazy amazing view of the fireworks at Epcot because of the new location?
I am not confusing the two. I think that area and RIV with the Skyliner are all equally good locations to be for trips to Epcot And HS, If the New BWV was a carbon copy of RIV, Id still say that they are all equally good choices for location.

That is my opinion and while you don’t have to agree, you cant say I’m wrong to think that way.
 
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mustinjourney

DIS Veteran
Joined
May 8, 2016
Nope just know being within walking distance of Epcot/HS and having a boat there as well is a superior location to RIV.



Not the person you responded to and no I can not. I have been on the skyliner.

I also don't need to live in 4-5 different condos to know the one that is 4 blocks from "the place in town" is better than the one that is 1 stop on the train away.

Sorry there just is no legitimate claim to how Riviera has a better location. You can claim it has superior transportation because of the skyliner. The skyliner is a mode of transportation though not the attraction (well not at least to 99% of people likely).
I said it was COMPARABLE.
 

€lairebear

Mouseketeer
Joined
Sep 12, 2019
I have to agree this is too high. I would much rather buy direct at that price. With incentives the price will be comparable or even less on top of the missing 2019 points. I suppose the seller is trying to get back as much as they can with what they spent on riviera. We own at riviera and I won’t even pay that price in the resale market. This one will be sitting in the resale market for a while. The seller is in no rush to sell since they cannot close until after July 13.
 

sethschroeder

DIS Veteran
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
It does state that resale buyers will only be able to use the points at their home resort....future resorts are not their home resort.

ETA, it actually does mention future resorts.

Club Members who purchase an Ownership Interest at Riviera Resort from a third party other than directly from DVD or other seller approved by DVD, are not permitted to convert their Riviera Resort Home Resort Vacation Points related to that Ownership Interest to DVC Vacation Points for the purpose of reserving Vacation Homes at any other DVC Resort, including any future DVC Resorts, through the DVC Reservation Component. Purchasers should refer to the DVC Resort Agreement for details.
Stating for those who are not owners of RIV but another resort via resale.
 

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