New policy for reservations based on check IN date

[jdg345]

My goodness - what hotels do this? I haven't been restricted like this on a reservation that I can ever think of and that would include stays in places ranging from Minneapolis to Hawaii to Europe. Or maybe I just find places that don't have such restrictions or else I don't book? I always pay attention to cancellation policies but can't say that I've ever noticed the restrictions you are talking about unless it was with a package including air and car also. And I have made changes so I think I should have noticed it.

And why would hotels do this? I think it's very few if any that keep waitlists so even if it is a cancel and rebook would it matter? Or are you speaking of timeshare hotel accomodations?

Well, I can tell you that CRO certainly does not do this. In fact, you can cancel, no penalty, up to 5 days from arrival. Inside of that, I believe you eat a day. You can run up as many reservations as you look, at as many resorts as you like, for more than 7 days in one call.

 

[robinb]

For instance, say there are 100 studios at a resort.

60 people call on day 1 and book a 7 night studio stay.
On day 2, 30 people call and book a 7 day studio stay, that means 30 studios for your day 8 are out.
20 people call on day 3 and book a 7 night studio stay, now were down to only 1/2 the studios being available.
Day 4, 30 more people call, and another 30 studios are gone, leaving 20.
On day 5, 20 people reserve a 7 night stay in a studio. All gone. If you wait until day 6 to extend, you are out of luck.

So unless you call daily, Day 1, Day 2, Day 3 and Day 4 to book a 10 night stay, you could easily wind up with holes in the middle.

Nope, that's not how it works.

100 Studios available on Day 1:
Day 1: 60 people call to book D1 - D7, 40 Studios remain for check-ins between Day 2 - Day 7.
Day 2: 30 people call to book D2 - D8, 10 Studios remain for check-ins between Day 3 - Day 7.
Day 3: 20 people call to book D3 - D9 but only 10 of them can book because all the people who called on Day 1 and Day 2 already have the other 90 units booked. No Studios remain for check-ins between D4 - D7.
Day 4: 30 people call to book D4 - D10, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins between D5 - D7.
Day 5: 20 people call to book D5 - D11, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins between D6 - D7.
Day 6: 20 people call to book D6 - D12, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins starting D7.
Day 6: pyrxtc calls to extend her reservation made on Day 1, booking D8-D12. That unit would come from the 60 Studio pool booked on Day 1 and blocked from being booked on D2 - D6 by new guests.

 

[jade1]

Will you still love it when you can't get your first day because people booked it up solid a week before you even had a chance?

Remember, just like you can extend forward and 'guarantee' more than 7 days, so can everyone else do so before you plan to check in. If they don't allow you to walk outside of 11 months, it just gives leverage to those with more points.

You might be fine, you might not. I think right now everyone is assuming that you'll be able to call your first day like you did before and have it available (like DBD). The difference is that before, the full quantity of rooms were available, now there might very well be none. Sure, folks have had success now, but it's not as busy a time, and many many members don't know about the change.

Personally, I wonder how many people who love this new system will change their tune when they realize it actually hurts their chances of getting a reservation during busy times or when they can't change their dates because of a new future rule put in place that they requested.

Exactly, that "IF" I get my first day is 99% of this thread IMO. Everyone would love this change "IF" they get that first day-who wouldn't?

 

[Chuck S]

Nope, that's not how it works.

100 Studios available on Day 1:
Day 1: 60 people call to book D1 - D7, 40 Studios remain for check-ins between Day 2 - Day 7.
Day 2: 30 people call to book D2 - D8, 10 Studios remain for check-ins between Day 3 - Day 7.
Day 3: 20 people call to book D3 - D9 but only 10 of them can book because all the people who called on Day 1 and Day 2 already have the other 90 units booked. No Studios remain for check-ins between D4 - D7.
Day 4: 30 people call to book D4 - D10, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins between D5 - D7.
Day 5: 20 people call to book D5 - D11, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins between D6 - D7.
Day 6: 20 people call to book D6 - D12, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins starting D7.
Day 6: pyrxtc calls to extend her reservation made on Day 1, booking D8-D12. That unit would come from the 60 Studio pool booked on Day 1 and blocked from being booked on D2 - D6 by new guests.

So people wanting shorter stays could also be completely blocked out by people booking full weeks, because even though the rooms will be available, DVC won't release them to be reserved by members?

 

[BroganMc]

Exactly, that "IF" I get my first day is 99% of this thread IMO. Everyone would love this change "IF" they get that first day-who wouldn't?

I guess then we need to review how well that worked on the previous system. For instance, when calling February 1 for a NYE booking, how long in the day was it before people were put on wait lists?

That's a true testament to how well or not a booking system works.

My guess is the first time the system crashes for high demand days there will be such a cry from membership and member services we'll see a return to the old system. Probably the only change will be reservations made from check-in instead of check-out. They (MS) already seem to be taking an active interest in people's responses.

 

[jade1]

how would you all feel if they went back to the old rules but enforced the not calling before your final checkout, thus eliminating your option of calling DBD. Then you would not be able to call til the end and someone could still have left before you and taken your room. .

Elated compared to this new still unexplained mess.

It is perfectly acceptable to call for one day reservations (hence the points per day per room we all have noticed as members). If I call at 9AM each day of check out 7 (or 5 or 10) days in a row at VWL, then they can force me out to a new room each day-and then clean each room every day and store/move our luggage. But guess what, the first thing they will do is link each ressie to simply avoid that. Either way, I can begin comparing airfare, working out schedules and days off, make ADR's, plan events with the group of us going, and most of all-not hang myself from 6 months of 20 below and 2 feet of snow without a sanity break, at least until my last DD finishes school. Then we can go in January and laugh and point at the rest that cant because "it doesn't effect me, I actually like it".

 

[jade1]

I guess then we need to review how well that worked on the previous system. For instance, when calling February 1 for a NYE booking, how long in the day was it before people were put on wait lists?

That's a true testament to how well or not a booking system works.

My guess is the first time the system crashes for high demand days there will be such a cry from membership and member services we'll see a return to the old system. Probably the only change will be reservations made from check-in instead of check-out. They (MS) already seem to be taking an active interest in people's responses.

I agree, maybe it was brutal and we just never heard about it. Or maybe they jumped the gun with what looked like a good idea (which it does) and things may be worse. All I can say is we booked 2BR Dedicated BCV (only 25 avail?) with no problem, but it was right away in the AM. I can tell you the year before VWL was not sold out (at least 1BR units) on day one XMAS EVE or XMAS Day, and that is small and high demand.

 

[LisaS]

Exactly, that "IF" I get my first day is 99% of this thread IMO. Everyone would love this change "IF" they get that first day-who wouldn't?

I can see pyrxtc's point. We stayed AKV Concierge back in late April. I would like to do it again sometime but figured my chances of getting all my nights booking DBD were iffy. There are already reports of people who got all but their middle night (or nights) because although they called right at 9am, they got a slow CM that day. If I ended up with a "Swiss cheese" reservation, I might WL for a while but would probably end up cancelling rather than risk having to move rooms, especially more than once during my stay.

With the new system, I might try for Concierge again. Maybe I won't get it due to others booking earlier than me but if I do get it, I get it all in one call and I like that. If I don't get it, I'm no worse off than if I had called DBD, had a hole or two in my reservation, WL'ed for a while, gave up and tried to get all my nights in a Savanna View room instead.

 

[Laurabearz]

I can see pyrxtc's point. We stayed AKV Concierge back in late April. I would like to do it again sometime but figured my chances of getting all my nights booking DBD were iffy. There are already reports of people who got all but their middle night (or nights) because although they called right at 9am, they got a slow CM that day. If I ended up with a "Swiss cheese" reservation, I might WL for a while but would probably end up cancelling rather than risk having to move rooms, especially more than once during my stay.

With the new system, I might try for Concierge again. Maybe I won't get it due to others booking earlier than me but if I do get it, I get it all in one call and I like that. If I don't get it, I'm no worse off than if I had called DBD, had a hole or two in my reservation, WL'ed for a while, gave up and tried to get all my nights in a Savanna View room instead.

Right and IMO this is a great thing for AKV Concierge people. If you can't get the Concierge, book anoterh room and waitlist...

Sadly HA rooms at most resorts are equally in demand as the AKV Conceirge rooms and they dont have the option of booking somewhere else (unless they own at two resorts) and from what I hear HA dont waitlist very well. aka once they are booked, the people dont cancel.

I am really really afraid DVC will try and fix this by making any change to any reservation a cancel and rebook, which would be devastating to the majority of members to say the least.

Someone tossed out a 14 day hold.. I like that, you book it, you can't change it for 14 days without canceling and rebooking the whole thing. I think that would stop walkers, and it allows those of us who tweek flights to add or drop a day as needed.

Of course I would really prefer the old calling DBD system back!!

 

[dvcdisney]

The disagreements between those who prefer the old system with those who are happy about the new system is the idea of fairness. I think we are all seeing it at different angles.

But, technically, in this case, fair means everyone has the same OPPORTUNITY to book their rooms.

For those who prefer the old system, (like myself), we all believe that DBD booking allows everyone (no matter who you are or your circumstances) to call at 9am on the first day you can book. I know a lot of people have different reasons why they will or will not call at 9am. But this is irrelevant in terms of fairness. Everyone has something or other they have to deal with, but that really doesn't have anything to do with FAIRNESS. If I cannot call because of my employment/family issues etc, it doesn't mean that it's not fair that someone else can, it just means that I have other responsibilities that supersede calling at 9am (and that is perfectly fine), but that doesn't mean it's not fair. It is fair. I made the CHOICE to not call.

With the new system, those who like the idea like it because they do not want to have "holes" in their reservation and booking for the whole 7 nights sounds great. But the fact that I cannot get all the days on my reservation because I didn't call early enough to get it, doesn't mean it's not fair. It's annoying and frustrating. But fairness has nothing to do with it.

And I still cannot understand how this is something that DVC should fix. Everyone has their own personal circumstance. This should be irrelevant to the policy. The policy should be fair for everyone.

I cannot believe that DVC even considered the new policy just because members said that they don't like the idea that someone else can get their "room" before they can call and thus leave "holes" or waitlists in their reservation. Again, it's not DVC's problem or responsibilty that I couldn't call because I had a meeting or an appointment. It's mine.

On top of that, it's creating such a mess that many are considering (or have already done so) "walking" their reservation. With the old system, DVC had a policy that was clearly fair. EVERYONE has the opportunity to call, whether you did or not is not the issue. The issue is that it's available for EVERYONE. Priority wasn't given to someone just because they have a vacation a few days before yours.

With the old system, I can honestly agree that it is annoying, frustrating, and upsetting to have "holes" or waitlists in my reservation. But this has nothing to do with FAIRNESS. If I'm upset about this, it is not the fault of DVC or other members. It has everything to do with the CHOICE I made in handling/managing my reservation.

With the new system, I'm blaming DVC for implementing an unfair policy in response to "selfish" complaints.

 

[pyrxtc]

But that's not a feature of the new system - you could have done exactly that with the old system.

I couldn't do that with the old system, that's why I ahve to change rooms twice in December because on my 2nd day, someone called before me and took the room out before I could. If they had this new rule already, I could ahve booked the room I wanted for the next 3 night and been secure instead of calling DBD to "try".

 

[pyrxtc]

Again, not exactly.

If you do not day by day to add your additional nights, someone else could call and book new 7 day reservations during that time, taking your desired room past your original 7 day reservation. This change does not eliminate day by day calling, it simply shifts to check-in day instead of check-out day.

For instance, say there are 100 studios at a resort. 60 people call on day 1 and book a 7 night studio stay. On day 2, 30 people call and book a 7 day studio stay, that means 30 studios for your day 8 are out. 20 people call on day 3 and book a 7 night studio stay, now were down to only 1/2 the studios being available. Day 4, 30 more people call, and another 30 studios are gone, leaving 20. On day 5, 20 people reserve a 7 night stay in a studio. All gone. If you wait until day 6 to extend, you are out of luck.

So unless you call daily, Day 1, Day 2, Day 3 and Day 4 to book a 10 night stay, you could easily wind up with holes in the middle.

It doesn't work like that cuz "my" studio cannot be filled until I am out of it. So someone coming in while I'm there can only be givena different studio and not switching rooms. Nobody can get into "my" studio until I leave. If I book 7-14, nobody can book my room til 14. If they call on the 13th to start a new ressie, they will be staying next door to me, not IN my room.

 

[pyrxtc]

I was also told that they were "aware" of a thread online at our boards when she asked how I had heard about the changes.

So Big Brother is watching and waiting .......

 

[robinb]

Originally Posted by robinb
Nope, that's not how it works.

100 Studios available on Day 1:
Day 1: 60 people call to book D1 - D7, 40 Studios remain for check-ins between Day 2 - Day 7.
Day 2: 30 people call to book D2 - D8, 10 Studios remain for check-ins between Day 3 - Day 7.
Day 3: 20 people call to book D3 - D9 but only 10 of them can book because all the people who called on Day 1 and Day 2 already have the other 90 units booked. No Studios remain for check-ins between D4 - D7.
Day 4: 30 people call to book D4 - D10, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins between D5 - D7.
Day 5: 20 people call to book D5 - D11, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins between D6 - D7.
Day 6: 20 people call to book D6 - D12, none of them can book, no Studios remain for check-ins starting D7.
Day 6: pyrxtc calls to extend her reservation made on Day 1, booking D8-D12. That unit would come from the 60 Studio pool booked on Day 1 and blocked from being booked on D2 - D6 by new guests.

So people wanting shorter stays could also be completely blocked out by people booking full weeks, because even though the rooms will be available, DVC won't release them to be reserved by members?

But the rooms are not available. If everyone who checks in on Day 1, Day 2 and Day 3 book full weeks there is NO AVAILABILITY for check-ins on Day 4 - Day 7. In practice, some people will book for fewer that 7 days on Day 1 - Day 3 and availability will open up for new guests in mid-week.

 

[CarolMN]

I think Disney will have to do such things to "fix" the new system.

I agree with you.

At some point, however, Disney should remember that the whole point of the system was to make things better.

Nope, don't agree with that. I strongly believe the point was to decrease the number of calls to MS and thus decrease costs to Disney. (They only get 12% of the budget for administration, including MS. If it costs more, they eat it. If it costs less, they keep it). "Making it better" for us is just their spin. It's about money - theirs, not ours.

You've now got the problems of the new system, plus a whole host of new problems you get from the changes you need to make to fix the new system. If the net result of all the changes isn't better than the old system, they should admit defeat and retreat to the old system.

Should. Odds are not in favor of that. Unlike the recent coffee mugs vs Styrofoam issue, there is no "outside force" (like the environment/green movement) that will embarrass them into reversal.

Unfortunately, from my years in corporate America, I know this isn't how corporations think. Folks will pile on layer after layer of "fixes" to any change without every considering the idea that it was a mistake in the first place.

My experience mirrors yours. Obviously, this change was poorly thought out since they did not even anticipate the questions. They didn't make sure all of the CMs knew about the change before they just went ahead and did it. They apparently don't even know why they were getting the DBD calls if the first place. So there is no reason to believe the inevitable "fixes" will be implemented with any better results. Depressing.

But again, the change only affects those who want high demand units during high demand times. That does not describe a large percentage of DVC members. So I do not think they will reverse their decision.

 

[Chuck S]

It doesn't work like that cuz "my" studio cannot be filled until I am out of it. So someone coming in while I'm there can only be givena different studio and not switching rooms. Nobody can get into "my" studio until I leave. If I book 7-14, nobody can book my room til 14. If they call on the 13th to start a new ressie, they will be staying next door to me, not IN my room.

OK, now I see what you're saying. It still seems odd, but I understand the theory of why they won't be available.

So if I wait until, say day 4, to book a 10 night reservation, as long as the first 3 nights are still available, I should have no problem. But it would be to my advantage to call on day 1, book 7 days, then call again during to book the next 3 days. So in essence, instead of calling day to day, if I would normally book DBD, I call twice. But if I normally would call once, on my final check-out day, there is now a greater chance of not having any availability? So it really is to my advantage to call and book 7 + 3?

 

[maminnie]

Starr W:

Referencing your post back on page 95 or 96, I am not looking for a "twinkie for not pulling my kids out of school" as your post stated. I believe your words were something like "give yourself a twinkie for not pulling your kids out of school." It is not a twinkie I am looking for but rather a reservation system that puts me on the same playing field as those that do choose to take their children out of school days ahead of a busy vacation week just to secure a desired DVC reservation. I also am looking for a reservation system that resembles the system when I purchased my DVC contracts. I would not have purchased DVC if it was not flexible and fair and I certainly would not have purchased an add-on at a different resort.

maminnie

 

[pyrxtc]

OK, now I see what you're saying. It still seems odd, but I understand the theory of why they won't be available.

So if I wait until, say day 4, to book a 10 night reservation, as long as the first 3 nights are still available, I should have no problem. But it would be to my advantage to call on day 1, book 7 days, then call again during to book the next 3 days. So in essence, instead of calling day to day, if I would normally book DBD, I call twice. But if I normally would call once, on my final check-out day, there is now a greater chance of not having any availability? So it really is to my advantage to call and book 7 + 3?

Yes, it is better to get 7 days, then call 3 days later and add the rest on. Nobody will be able to get your room and you won't have to move.

 

[SuzanneSLO]

. . . But if I normally would call once, on my final check-out day, there is now a greater chance of not having any availability? So it really is to my advantage to call and book 7 + 3?

It is also to your advantage to book early in case when you call on Day 1, there is no availability. You can WL that one day and be at the top of the WL and then you can call back the next day to book Days 2-8. Then, if Day 2 is not available, you can WL that day (no one is sure if its linked to the Day 1 WL or a separate DBD WL) and call back the next day to try to book Days 3-9. And so on.

This seems to generate neither fewer calls to MS nor a higher level of member satisfaction. -- Suzanne

 

[LisaS]

It is also to your advantage to book early in case when you call on Day 1, there is no availability. You can WL that one day and be at the top of the WL and then you can call back the next day to book Days 2-8. Then, if Day 2 is not available, you can WL that day (no one is sure if its linked to the Day 1 WL or a separate DBD WL) and call back the next day to try to book Days 3-9. And so on.

This seems to generate neither fewer calls to MS nor a higher level of member satisfaction. -- Suzanne

Based on what robinb reported, if you call the first day and if there is no availability you can WL up to 7 nights on that first call. You can call back the next day and if nights 2-8 are available, you can book them, filling in that part of your own WL, leaving you with a WL for just your first night. If night 2 is not available on that call, you don't have to WL for it because you already did that on your first call.