New policy for reservations based on check IN date

[toyboy]

I will agree that the new system can work OK, but I would suggest a couple policies that other hotels or lodging establishments have used: 1) you cannot shorten your stay by taking days off the front end without cancelling and rebooking the reservation--this prevents "walking" a reservation but also allows more flexibility than a "no changes" policy; 2) apart from an initial reservation of the check-in plus 7 variety, no days may be booked prior to the eleven month window for that particular day. While there still may be some problems associated with GV's at some times and some associated with particular units with respect to BW views, I would think that even those would likely work out at most times. I don't like the philosophy behind allowing booking of NYE or other "hot" nights based on when you start your vacation, but a few policies to prevent/reduce abuse will likely even make that problem minimal for the most part. Of course, that assumes no morphing of points, but that is a whole different thread, LOL.

Rather than option #1 which causes you to loose your original booking, doesn't this whole thing get resolved if you put a 14 day lock out on reservation changes? Doesn't this prevent walking, but still also gives you the flexibility to modify a reservation if unforeseen circumstances arise? I don't want to penalize a person just because they may have to cancel a day here or there due to job, airlines, etc...

I do not support the current reservation change as it stands today because like many I think the ability to "walk" will force the booking of days that won't be used and will create the need for more waitlists during peak times. But I also think it could be made much better if you eliminate the ability to walk by placing a reservation hold. It still doesn't improve the advantage by those folks who are "legitimately" arriving earlier than you, but it will eliminate the folks who have booked arriving earlier than you just to walk to an arrival after you.

 

[kikiq]

Other than that, to me the two systems are a wash. I could use the new system or go back to the old system. I am just trying to point out that the real issue is supply and demand more than the booking system...

It is an issue of supply and demand. Disney has said that they made this change because of the negative response received by members. Most of the posters here are talking about small windows of time that are in HIGH DEMAND and their chances of getting their reservations. And most of the posters here know WHEN to work the system to get their reservations. But those posters are not the masses and Disney "said" that their stats show that the average stay is 4 days and folks didn't like the old system.(This from PP conversation with Disney) DVC operates 365 days a year, so I'm guessing they were listening to the members who stay the OTHER times of the year. I often wondered why I had to wait until 11 months from my checkout date because I was use to booking from my check in date when I made my vacation plans.(I did say that one time to MS)

I'm thinking that for most of the year this new system will work BUT for the high demand/limited choice room times the old system works better. Could we be seeing still another change addressing the high demand season/resort room reservations?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

I will agree that the new system can work OK, but I would suggest a couple policies that other hotels or lodging establishments have used: 1) you cannot shorten your stay by taking days off the front end without cancelling and rebooking the reservation--this prevents "walking" a reservation but also allows more flexibility than a "no changes" policy;

My goodness - what hotels do this? I haven't been restricted like this on a reservation that I can ever think of and that would include stays in places ranging from Minneapolis to Hawaii to Europe. Or maybe I just find places that don't have such restrictions or else I don't book? I always pay attention to cancellation policies but can't say that I've ever noticed the restrictions you are talking about unless it was with a package including air and car also. And I have made changes so I think I should have noticed it.

And why would hotels do this? I think it's very few if any that keep waitlists so even if it is a cancel and rebook would it matter? Or are you speaking of timeshare hotel accomodations?

 

[KAT4DISNEY]

It is an issue of supply and demand. Disney has said that they made this change because of the negative response received by members. Most of the posters here are talking about small windows of time that are in HIGH DEMAND and their chances of getting their reservations. And most of the posters here know WHEN to work the system to get their reservations. But those posters are not the masses and Disney "said" that their stats show that the average stay is 4 days and folks didn't like the old system.(This from PP conversation with Disney) DVC operates 365 days a year, so I'm guessing they were listening to the members who stay the OTHER times of the year. I often wondered why I had to wait until 11 months from my checkout date because I was use to booking from my check in date when I made my vacation plans.(I did say that one time to MS)
I'm thinking that for most of the year this new system will work BUT for the high demand/limited choice room times the old system works better. Could we be seeing still another change addressing the high demand season/resort room reservations?

Perhaps the reason is b/c way back in the 90's the DVC people thought of the problems with popular times (wasn't there even a lottery for Christmas?) and developed this system of booking based on check-out day PLUS allowing day by day in order to provide fairness to all their members and ease of use to those who didn't worry about it during lower demand times. Just a guess on my part.

 

[dvcdisney]

That's very interesting and laughable!
Two days ago, Sheila told me that the negative responses were outweighing the positive responses. I bet she was told to stop saying that and to just say that they are about equal. You can be sure that the negatives responses are outweighing the positives!

Last week I was told by Sheila that there were MORE positive responses to the new system. ????

She was so shocked that I wasn't happy with the changes and even after I explained to her the reasons (including possible abuse - "walking" the reservation), she seemed thoroughly confused that I would not like this policy. But as she heard more of my complaints, she began to use the "I will definitely report this to the Team" attitude, just to shut me up. That's when I realized, she wasn't really going to care if I said anything else.

 

[jeankeri]

Just got off the phone with Sheila. She was very nice, and did say a few times during our conversation, "I am writing this down as we talk", so I do think she is trying to get a sense of the feedback at this time. At the end of the conversation I did ask her where the member feedback that started these changes came from, was there a specific survey that asked this question, or were these unsolicited comments? She said they were comments, not answers to specific questions about how the membership felt about booking. I asked her if the next edition of the DisneyFiles, or the member website could have a survey that asked all members specifically what they thought of this new booking policy vs. DBD booking. I could more easily accept a new policy based on overwhelming member input if in fact it came from overwhelming member input.
I told her the reasons why I thought this new policy was unfair, ie it took rooms out of inventory before the 11 month window opened up for members, and put those members at a disadvantage (especially those without enough points to book Fri/Sat). Having the reservation policy explained to me prior to purchasing DVC made DBD booking an option IF I was choosing to travel during a specific season or desired a specific room, and is why I bought my points at BWV. Knowing now that without enough points to start my vacation on a Fri/Sat I would likely be shut out of the Sun-Thurs days, I would be less likely to add-on if I could not afford 100+ points, which is unlikely for many in this economy. Lastly, I let Sheila know that I bought DVC for its flexibility (no 7 day mandated stays), and knew no dates or rooms were guaranteed to be available. But, knowing the booking windows I could choose to call DBD if a specific day/room was personally important to me. I could also choose not to call in advance and just roll the dice- sometimes that worked too. But to not have everyone have an equal chance to book a room the first day it is available is unfair to most members.

 

[Deb & Bill]

Last week I was told by Sheila that there were MORE positive responses to the new system. ????

She was so shocked that I wasn't happy with the changes and even after I explained to her the reasons (including possible abuse - "walking" the reservation), she seemed thoroughly confused that I would not like this policy. But as she heard more of my complaints, she began to use the "I will definitely report this to the Team" attitude, just to shut me up. That's when I realized, she wasn't really going to care if I said anything else.

The person I talked to on Sunday said there were more negative responses than positive ones.

 

[robinb]

I will agree that the new system can work OK, but I would suggest a couple policies that other hotels or lodging establishments have used: 1) you cannot shorten your stay by taking days off the front end without cancelling and rebooking the reservation--this prevents "walking" a reservation but also allows more flexibility than a "no changes" policy; 2) apart from an initial reservation of the check-in plus 7 variety, no days may be booked prior to the eleven month window for that particular day.

I think that either one of those attempts to stop "walking" will make DVC even harder to use for everyone ... not just the "walkers". It's like swatting a fly with a 2x4.

 

[mrdiscranky]

how would you all feel if they went back to the old rules but enforced the not calling before your final checkout,

Why would th enforce a rule that never existed?

By all reasoning, DBD calling was cheating the system

DBD wasn't cheating the system. It was an integral part of the system.

I still may not get exactly what I want when I want but I'll know on that first day and won't be bouncing around the hotel evry night or two.

But that's not a feature of the new system - you could have done exactly that with the old system.

 

[bookwormde]

Chuck S

My primary objection is that depending on the reservation you are booking, number of points you have and if you are willing to walk your reservation some members get access to days before others.

Being a short reservation person the wait list issue is just a sideshow.

I am one who bought OKW partially based on having a level playing field for trying to book a 5 weekday GV

bookwormde

 

[Inkmahm]

well I too got a phone call from "Sheila" yesterday. I let her know that I liked the new changes, they work fine for me. I think it's just like booking a regular hotel now but we get a better deal on price owning the points and not paying cash.

I was also told that they have a new group that is watching specifically for canceling and rebooking (a.k.a. walking a reservation) and there will be new restrictions on that as soon as they see how many people try to use this method.

I hated having to call DBD, it didn't even guarantee that I got the room I wanted.

how would you all feel if they went back to the old rules but enforced the not calling before your final checkout, thus eliminating your option of calling DBD. Then you would not be able to call til the end and someone could still have left before you and taken your room. By all reasoning, DBD calling was cheating the system and the ability to makie ressies like that could be eliminated completely if they go back to the old rules.

I think what most of you want is the old rules back with the lack of enforcing the rules. I really don't see that happening.

Again, I like these new rules. I still may not get exactly what I want when I want but I'll know on that first day and won't be bouncing around the hotel evry night or two.

The CMs were the ones who SUGGESTED calling DBD! You seem to think DBD calling was against the old rules when it certainly was NOT.

I want the old rules back EXACTLY as they were. Period.

 

[Inkmahm]

I think Disney will have to do such things to "fix" the new system. At some point, however, Disney should remember that the whole point of the system was to make things better. You've now got the problems of the new system, plus a whole host of new problems you get from the changes you need to make to fix the new system. If the net result of all the changes isn't better than the old system, they should admit defeat and retreat to the old system.

Unfortunately, from my years in corporate America, I know this isn't how corporations think. Folks will pile on layer after layer of "fixes" to any change without every considering the idea that it was a mistake in the first place.

Amen to that!

 

[mrdiscranky]

I'll know that I have it because noone can book my room before i can for my extended dates. I can call on the 2nd or 3rd day of my ressie and add on my days (was told so by Sheila) until the days I want are done. Technically I can wait to add on day til the 6th night since noone can take MY room til the 7th. They can extend THEIR room dates but not take MY room. Thus it would eliminate any bouncing aroudn at all.

Hate to beat a dead horse, but as long as this is the case, there is absolutely no reason for limiting the initial reservation to 7 days. It accomplished nothing beyond requiring more phone calls. It's pretty clear Disney didn't think this through that well.

 

[jdg345]

well I too got a phone call from "Sheila" yesterday. I let her know that I liked the new changes, they work fine for me. I think it's just like booking a regular hotel now but we get a better deal on price owning the points and not paying cash.

I was also told that they have a new group that is watching specifically for canceling and rebooking (a.k.a. walking a reservation) and there will be new restrictions on that as soon as they see how many people try to use this method.

I hated having to call DBD, it didn't even guarantee that I got the room I wanted.

how would you all feel if they went back to the old rules but enforced the not calling before your final checkout, thus eliminating your option of calling DBD. Then you would not be able to call til the end and someone could still have left before you and taken your room. By all reasoning, DBD calling was cheating the system and the ability to makie ressies like that could be eliminated completely if they go back to the old rules.

I think what most of you want is the old rules back with the lack of enforcing the rules. I really don't see that happening.

Again, I like these new rules. I still may not get exactly what I want when I want but I'll know on that first day and won't be bouncing around the hotel evry night or two.

Well, with the new system, you may be competing with just as many, if not more people, than you were DBD.

DBD was not cheating the system, it was an option to help get your reservation. Just like walking is well within the rules as they exist today. If they prevent walking, then they'll likely make a mess of many others' vacations. Maybe even yours one day when you try to add/remove a day and find out your whole reservation was cancelled and triggered a waitlist and now you have nothing.

Also, I'm still walking that reservation I started more than a week ago. Not one negative comment so far.

 

[jdg345]

I believe you can just waitlist that one missing night. But if you were missing two or more contiguous nights, you would have to waitlist them as a block rather than individually as you could have done in the past.

That is how I understand it to work as well.

 

[mrdiscranky]

I'm thinking that for most of the year this new system will work BUT for the high demand/limited choice room times the old system works better.

The old system worked perfectly for most of the year too. It's the high demand / limited choice times and rooms that cause problems under both systems.

 

[jdg345]

I'll know that I have it because noone can book my room before i can for my extended dates. I can call on the 2nd or 3rd day of my ressie and add on my days (was told so by Sheila) until the days I want are done. Technically I can wait to add on day til the 6th night since noone can take MY room til the 7th. They can extend THEIR room dates but not take MY room. Thus it would eliminate any bouncing aroudn at all.

If I get my 2 bedroom concierge my first day, I can guarantee that I have it for the entire time I am there. Nobody can take it until I the day I check out. That is the joy of being able to make my ressies from the first day til the last. I won't end up in a 2 bed one night and only be able to get a 1 bed the rest like I have this December.

If I make my ressie for 7 days starting on the 1st , and Mary calls on the 4th wanting the same type of room and it is not available, she cannot waitlist the first few days and get the room on the 7th if I haven't called yet to add my nights. She will have to call every day to find out if ther is a room available for a ngiht she wants in the type of room she wants. If first date avail is the 9th, then she can waitlist from the 4th to the 9th for a cancelation and hope it comes thru and book from the 9th to the 11th.

that's why I LOVE this new way since if I get my first day, I am guaranteed the rest of my stay in the same room type until I want to check out. So long as I remember to call before the 7th day to extend my vacation.

Will you still love it when you can't get your first day because people booked it up solid a week before you even had a chance?

Remember, just like you can extend forward and 'guarantee' more than 7 days, so can everyone else do so before you plan to check in. If they don't allow you to walk outside of 11 months, it just gives leverage to those with more points.

You might be fine, you might not. I think right now everyone is assuming that you'll be able to call your first day like you did before and have it available (like DBD). The difference is that before, the full quantity of rooms were available, now there might very well be none. Sure, folks have had success now, but it's not as busy a time, and many many members don't know about the change.

Personally, I wonder how many people who love this new system will change their tune when they realize it actually hurts their chances of getting a reservation during busy times or when they can't change their dates because of a new future rule put in place that they requested.

 

[Chuck S]

Technically I can wait to add on day til the 6th night since noone can take MY room til the 7th.

Again, not exactly.

If you do not day by day to add your additional nights, someone else could call and book new 7 day reservations during that time, taking your desired room past your original 7 day reservation. This change does not eliminate day by day calling, it simply shifts to check-in day instead of check-out day.

For instance, say there are 100 studios at a resort. 60 people call on day 1 and book a 7 night studio stay. On day 2, 30 people call and book a 7 day studio stay, that means 30 studios for your day 8 are out. 20 people call on day 3 and book a 7 night studio stay, now were down to only 1/2 the studios being available. Day 4, 30 more people call, and another 30 studios are gone, leaving 20. On day 5, 20 people reserve a 7 night stay in a studio. All gone. If you wait until day 6 to extend, you are out of luck.

So unless you call daily, Day 1, Day 2, Day 3 and Day 4 to book a 10 night stay, you could easily wind up with holes in the middle.

 

[jdg345]

I think Disney will have to do such things to "fix" the new system. At some point, however, Disney should remember that the whole point of the system was to make things better. You've now got the problems of the new system, plus a whole host of new problems you get from the changes you need to make to fix the new system. If the net result of all the changes isn't better than the old system, they should admit defeat and retreat to the old system.

Unfortunately, from my years in corporate America, I know this isn't how corporations think. Folks will pile on layer after layer of "fixes" to any change without every considering the idea that it was a mistake in the first place.

Exactly!

By the time they're done, they may need to fix and keep refixing things to the point that it was just easier, more inexpensive, and simpler to have just left well enough alone.

 

[jdg345]

Rather than option #1 which causes you to loose your original booking, doesn't this whole thing get resolved if you put a 14 day lock out on reservation changes? Doesn't this prevent walking, but still also gives you the flexibility to modify a reservation if unforeseen circumstances arise? I don't want to penalize a person just because they may have to cancel a day here or there due to job, airlines, etc...

I do not support the current reservation change as it stands today because like many I think the ability to "walk" will force the booking of days that won't be used and will create the need for more waitlists during peak times. But I also think it could be made much better if you eliminate the ability to walk by placing a reservation hold. It still doesn't improve the advantage by those folks who are "legitimately" arriving earlier than you, but it will eliminate the folks who have booked arriving earlier than you just to walk to an arrival after you.

This hurts those trying to book more than 7 days as they won't be able to get days 8+ for 2 weeks after initially booking their reservation.

Plus, I'm sure there will be away around this too if you have enough points.