My neighbor says he is going to sue us..UPDATE pg 8

[bicker]

Great point... disturbing the peaceful enjoyment of one's home shouldn't be so controversial, whether it is a dog barking or a child violating someone's property -- they're both disturbances that should be controlled.

 

[Tigger&Belle]

You missed my point. The issue raised by the earlier poster was how much she enjoys children playing. My point is that not everyone needs share her enjoyment, and so it isn't reasonable to expect the same level of tolerance for when such children's play "inadvertently" extends beyond their own yards.

Before you ask other people to lighten up, ask yourself if there is anything you object to that other people do, and are legally entitled to do. Perhaps you should lighten up about those things. Don't get me wrong: We all have our personal preferences, and are entitled to them, but our own personal preferences are indeed our own. They are never valid foundations for judging others.

When it comes to people doing their own thing, on their own property, within the boundries of the law (and I'll even throw in a mutual respect between others) then no, I don't have anything that I object to. Honestly, there are some nice weather days when I have my windows open and there are so many kids out playing (we have LOTS of kids in our neighborhood) that I have to turn up my tv or my music to hear it. I guess I could be bothered my that, but this would be the wrong neighborhood to live in if you are not able to tolerate the noise of kids. Well, I guess when our neighbors tie their yippy dog outside and leave it to bark and any and everything I get a bit annoyed. When they don't tie it and it runs into our yard, acting like it's going to attack us I get a bit more than annoyed. Even then, I don't let my anger get the best of me.

And I do think that people should respect each others feelings and do what they can to get along. That's being kind and respectful. And I remember growning up and having a grouchy neighbor and we knew to stay off her property and especially keep our toys out of her flower garden. Yes, we learned the hard way and it was a good lesson. The OP's neighbor seems over the top, however.

 

[Tigger&Belle]

Great point... disturbing the peaceful enjoyment of one's home shouldn't be so controversial, whether it is a dog barking or a child violating someone's property -- they're both disturbances that should be controlled.

I think that we actually agree more than we disagree. Respecting the property of others is important for kids (and adults) to learn. I also think that people who aren't crazy about having others on their propery need to take a deep breath and figure out how to be a bit flexible, too. In the OP's case, if I were the man, knowing that the OP is trying to do what she can and understands the issue would make a difference to my attitude. If he would use a few of his smile muscles he would be much more likely to get a plate of cookies out of them. If he had the feeling that she didn't give a crap about her kids being on his lawn, that would be a different matter. But she sure seems to care.

 

[Tarheel Tink]

Not the same situation but I have property issues that have made me the unpopular neighbor. I have an acre in a small subdivision of 5 homes, ours being the first one built 20 years ago. We have a 2 streams that are on our property and the neighborhood down the street sends their kids (and adults) to fish in it although the entrance to our subdivision is posted No Trespassing. We added another sign on our land saying no fishing/hunting/etc. Driving home we would find anywhere from 1-8 people fishing and parking their cars on our lawn! Found a Nazi knive, trash, dead fish, food wrappers, etc. left behind and someone was storing their tackle box there! May I add that we live in a coastal county with the ocean and numerous streams,rivers,lakes and ponds are everywhere.

One of our immediate neighbors complained to me that "the kids have always fished there" and wanted me to take down the sign (which my attorney told me to put up as I would be liable for any accidents). He changed his tune when his wife asked one of the kids to move his car so she could drive by and he called her a "insert profanity" and gave her the finger. He is now just fine with the sign (which periodically is ripped down).

I tell this story because, well, I get a chance to rant about it and also to say that perhaps things have happened before to this man in regards to his property and he has reached his limit so no matter how trivial the matter or sweet your children are, he is going to react. I grew up around some nutty neighbors and we avoided them like the plague.

 

[disykat]

There is a huge difference between playing in someone's yard and dashing in and out quickly to retrieve a ball that rolled 2 ft over the property line. I meant what I said about living in an adult community if you are unable to tolerate the presence of children. The OP was talking about supervised children who played in their own yard, only leaving to retrieve an occasional ball - not kids randomly climbing in his trees, etc.

I can't stand my neighbors and have even called the police on their teen for being on my property (in a parked car, AHEM, with a girl - in broad daylight), but they are certainly welcome to quickly retrieve a rolling basketball from my property.

When you share a property line with someone there has to be a little give. When I was growing up, we had a neighbor who would get upset if we accidently sprinkled part of his lawn with a sprinkler. We had to let the grass near his property die - he didn't like that either. I know there's another poster here somewhere who had a neighbor get angry because they mowed over the line. That's just silly. That neighbor needs to put up a fence, THEN he can be upset if anyone crosses.

 

[Lisa F]

Isn't there a saying about how good fences make good neighbors?

 

[dismom9761]

I really don't see the big deal if the ball goes into his yard every other day. It's not like you are leaving the ball there, and I imagine it's not there for more than a few seconds. From what I've read, we are talking about his land that is right next to your driveway, but his house is a distance away. It's not like your kids are playing in his yard. To be honest, it sounds like the guy just doesn't want to hear the noise your kids make when they play outside. Are your kids overly noisy? If they are, you might talk to them about being a little more quiet.

It makes sense to me that the kids play basketball in the driveway. You definitely shouldn't have to shell out money for a seperate basketball court or a new fence. If he has a problem, he should be the one to put up a fence.

I don't think my kids are overly noisy.They tend to get really loud on the trampoline but it is on the other side of the house.

 

[bicker]

Honestly, there are some nice weather days when I have my windows open and there are so many kids out playing (we have LOTS of kids in our neighborhood) that I have to turn up my tv or my music to hear it. I guess I could be bothered my that...

Maybe your music is disturbing them!

I think that we actually agree more than we disagree.

Not surprising; I'm a pretty reasonable guy!

Anyway, seriously....

There is a huge difference between playing in someone's yard and dashing in and out quickly to retrieve a ball that rolled 2 ft over the property line.

Legally, no. The property owner is liable for anyone getting hurt on the property owner's property, regardless of the context. There is no equivocation. The law doesn't even allow for releasing the property owner from that liability -- not even in writing.

When you share a property line with someone there has to be a little give.

True, and that give needs to be on the part of the tresspasser. The law is how it is for good reason.

 

[dismom9761]

It is interesting seeing how people are split down the middle on this issue, and especially interesting in the context of the article I read yesterday on MSNBC about how boorish Americans feel that they've become. I wonder how many of the folks trying to make this old guy look like a weirdo would have done so back in the days America was more polite. Children used to be taught respect for elders, and would be contrite whenever they failed to take proper care of their balls and such and they ended up on a neighbor's property; surely the children's parents wouldn't become beligerant about how the old man responded to the children's transgression.

Regardless, I'm not sure that this change in attitude is necessarily as bad as the folks interviewed in the MSNBC article tried to make it sound. Clearly, practicality is more important than gentility, and that's basically one way of looking at how this situation is handled has changed over the years. However, I believe strongly in integrity -- it is a moral virtue AFAIC. That means, to me, that while it is okay to disagree with the old man about how much respect you feel the children should have for him and his property, it is important at least that both parents and children recognize that variance from the 1950s model is a measure of disrespect, conscious and justified, at least in one's own mind, which is good enough, as long as it is legal, since there is no universal Truth. It's just like the recently posted issue about public displays of affection. They would never have taken place in the 1950s, but they're not illegal, and in our busy world, there is a benefit to enjoying your partner whenever, wherever. Just another example of conscious and justified variance from what others would want you to do.

I just wanted to stress that my children are extremely polite to ALL elders and my DH and I have never been anything but polite when he is upset with us.We have never raised our voices to him and have really tried to work things out.From what we have been told he calls my children disobedient because they are wasting time playing instead of doing something useful with their time.My children have apologized for going onto his property and are now terrified of him.

 

[dismom9761]

Some people just plain don't care for children. They wouldn't want to hear them and they certainly wouldn't want them in their yard on a regular basis.

Do the man and his wife have a garden? Or pets that might get upset? You also probably have no idea what type of family lived there before you. The kids might have been candidates for Super Nanny for all you know. Have you ever spoken with the wife?

I would try to work with the fellow. You never know, sometimes kindness goes a long way with grouches.

No garden.It is an empty lot between the houses.My house was just built right next to the line.No pets that I have ever seen.The person that lived here was a single man.He was my SIL's father.He died a year and a half ago.He did have grandchildren that visited.

 

[dismom9761]

I haven't read this whole thread but it sure makes me glad that my neighbors are my sister on one side and my parents on the other.

Good luck.

My brother is on my other side and I love it.

 

[dismom9761]

Well first someone mentioned that three times in a week is too much.Well that happened before he let us know that this was a problem.I was just trying to think back.He gave us no warning that this was disturbing him.Also someone mentioned that we do have 3 acres and that the children have plenty of room.Alot of that is woods and while they do play there sometimes they tend to stay closer to the house.I wish we could just move the house.

 

[Lyn5]

To the OP, I feel for you and your situation. I worked for years in a place where I dealt with complaints. Most often, the complaint started between neighbors over something petty and then excalated to all sorts of claims of illegal actions. Sometimes, I felt it really didn't matter what was right/wrong or fair/unfair when it came to the emotional aspect for the person being complained about, they still had the stress and hardship of trying to resolve an issue. Yes, sometimes it is harrasement, but that is also hard to prove since the person complaining will say they are taking the actions they need to enjoy their property.

My advice, from only my experince, is that you won't be able to get on his good side and anything you do will annoy him....as sad as it is. Unless there comes a time when he needs you for some kind of emergency, it might be really hard to change his heart. I would say stay away from his property, it is his, and write down all the times you tried to talk to him about the situation, what efforts you made to compromise and then write down his response. That way, if he stretches the truth to say you never tried to correct the problem or never tried to contact him, you would have your records.

He can accuse you and sue you, but it will cost time and money to defend yourself. Sorry to say, I would have my kids not play ball anymore if they can't keep the ball in your yard....it just isn't worth the stress. Good luck, I truely hopes it works out for you.

 

[Tigger&Belle]

Maybe your music is disturbing them!

LOL, I don't think so. Now maybe my teen's guitar playing, but that bothers me, too (and I tell him to use the headphones).

And besides that, half the time I'm playing music it's Disney CDs and if those bother my neighbors there is no hope.

 

[tiki23]

Isn't there a saying about how good fences make good neighbors?

There is much truth in that saying!

However, I've managed many rental homes and properties, and from experience I can tell you, installing the fence can be a major source of contention.

Advice to the OP, if you are considering a fence, check with the city/county to make sure you know what types of fences are allowed. Unless you can come to an agreement with the grumpy neighbor about a community fence, make sure that the fence is completely on your side of the property line - and that you are able to do the install from your side - the neighbor may not even give you permission to "trespass" to work on the fence.

Good Luck!!

 

[Tigger&Belle]

dismom9761, did you look at the portable fence that I mentioned in an earlier post?

 

[Chattyaholic]

Some folks, as they grow older, become less tolerant of children and the noise they create. I am only 48 and I am rapidly becoming that way. I can't imagine how intolerant I might be by the time I'm 80.

I have two grown children and when they were small their "noise" didn't bother me. But after they left home I kind of enjoyed the peace and quiet.

The OP said the former tenant of her house was a single man, no children. Probably the elderly couple next door enjoyed the peace and quiet, then the OP and her children moved in and now there is noise, and unwanted balls coming into their yard, to tolerate and they aren't tolerating it very well. But it is THEIR yard the balls are coming into and they have the RIGHT to try and put a stop to it.

I've read most of the responses on this thread and it seems that most of those who are calling the man a curmugeon, or crochety, have young children so they are used to the noise. Wait until YOU are old. Maybe YOU won't tolerate it as well as you do now.

I think the OP should put up a fence so the balls stop going onto his property, and have the children play on the opposite side of the house to try and cut down on the noise.

 

[Tigger&Belle]

I've read most of the responses on this thread and it seems that most of those who are calling the man a curmugeon, or crochety, have young children so they are used to the noise. Wait until YOU are old. Maybe YOU won't tolerate it as well as you do now.

I think the OP should put up a fence so the balls stop going onto his property, and have the children play on the opposite side of the house to try and cut down on the noise.

I thought that she said that his house is fairly far from her, so it doesn't seem as if the noise is that bad. The balls of course are a different issue.

Some people do get less tolerant of noise when they get older. As I'm hitting the age of menopause I sure notice noise more than I used to and I KNOW that my husband will be this way, or it certainly appears that way. My mother is not this way at all, though, and when she visits she seems to so enjoy the sounds of the kids. Maybe some elderly people get more sensitive to the noise, but she misses having the noise around. The silence that she lives with is deafening, excpet for that darn tv that she keeps on all waking hours . And of course the tv is her answer to the deafening quiet, which is kind of sad.

 

[dismom9761]

dismom9761, did you look at the portable fence that I mentioned in an earlier post?

Yes and I thank you for the link.I am waiting for my DH to look at it.

 

[Lessa of Pern]

problem is...he's old and cranky and intolerant of noise, but the noise level the OP's family has is within the bounds of normal. that makes it his problem, not hers -- her family doens't have to speak in whispers 24/7 because of their neighbor. he's the one who should put up a fence -- it would keep the kid sout of his yard, cut down on some of the noise, and make him a happier person.