My daughter was beaten up at school Another UPDATE PAGE 15

[Disney Doll]

I don't think that I am overgeneralizing. The US is the most litigous country in the world and on a number of different boards there is always someone who suggests a lawsuit. I didn't say people in the US are terrible people just that there is a tendency to use lawyers and the courts system to solve problems.

I did encourage the op to press charges against the girls who attacked her daughter. IMO that sends a stronger message than sueing the school/school district. As parents I feel we need to work with our schools instead of blaming them for everything that is wrong.



I'm glad you tried to work out a solution to your situation. The reason that I stated that it seemed confrontational is because the way in which you suggested things happen. For example, tell them that there would be a meeting tomorrow and demand certain people be there. If they are not, sit and wait until they arrive and not take no for an answer. It may be an old sales technique but you would not be selling anything to me using that technique.

Your lawsuit and others may not be asking for a financial settlement but there is still a cost involved. That is money that would need to be diverted in order to pay the costs of the lawyers and other peole involved. I don't have any first hand knowledge of your schools but in Canada every dollar than can be spent in the schools needs to be be spent there.

To those of you who disagree with me, I am not saying that you should never use the legal system, just that it doesn't always need to be the first resort. In ducklite's case, obviously it wasn't.

Quite frankly, if the same thing happened to my child, I would be following ducklite's advice to the letter. You say that I would not be selling anything to you if I sat in your office waiting for a meeting to occur. My response...wanna bet?

Guess what...the school failed this child. They failed her big time. And they failed the other children too, by not impressing upon them what is and is not acceptable behavior. And guess what else...the school knows it. And if they didn't know it, they would very shortly, because I would be following ducklite's advice and I would be hiring an attorney.

As far as the cost...well, if the school had done it's job in the first place and properly protected the children that are in it's care, then there would be no "cost", now would there?

So who is really responsible for the added "cost"? Not the victim, who finally snaps and does what they have to do to get some restitution. The school is responsible for the added "cost" because they didn't do what they know they should have been doing all along.

I agree that as much money as possible should be given to education, but not at the cost of my child's health or safety, when the situaiton could have and should have been prevented in the first place. Schools know their job and their responsibility.

 

[phisigprincess]

That absolutely turns my stomach. Hugs and prayers to your DD.

 

[ducklite]

So who is really responsible for the added "cost"? Not the victim, who finally snaps and does what they have to do to get some restitution. The school is responsible for the added "cost" because they didn't do what they know they should have been doing all along.

I agree that as much money as possible should be given to education, but not at the cost of my child's health or safety, when the situaiton could have and should have been prevented in the first place. Schools know their job and their responsibility.

And school administration is responsible to the school board who is responsible to the taxpayers/voters. In my whole many years long trials and tribulations I took one of my issues to the school board during an open meeting. Shocked a few parents in attendence, and raised a few eyebrows on the board. Guess what? Things were resolved within 48 hours. The district was breaking Federal Education Law (it's called the "Blue Book"). The Board had no idea that things were going on. I made it clear that if things weren't changed immediately, no more excuses, no more BS, that I'd go to the press--and this was shortly before many of them were up for reelection.

It shouldn't have taken that, the school should have had the common sense to follow the law to begin with. It had gotten pitifully ridiculous by that point. Having a meeting with some administrator every other week to make sure your child is getting the education afforded to them is ridiculous, which is why I finally decided to end it once and for all and took the to court.

If you can't run with the big dogs, then stay on the porch. As a parent, you are obligated to get off that porch and run for your child.

Anne

 

[DISNEYFANRI]

HI Jenny - just sending good thoughts for your daughter today.

 

[momrek06]

That is the beauty of a good private school. It's not to say that bad stuff doesn't happen at private schools, because it does. But private schools have a lot more control over what they can do to students who break the rules.

I can recall when I started high school (barely, but I do have a faint memory ) at a private parochial school. The first day of school, the Dean of Discipline (yes, that was his actual title!!!!! ) stood in front of the entire student body and said "Your parents are paying a lot of money for you to be here. If you do not follow the rules, we are going to assume you don't want to be here, and we will assist your parents in saving their money and remove you from the school. There are 500 kids on a waiting list dying to come here". And he was quite serious. And there was a very long waiting list for the school. And it was a very effective speech. And he did not hesitate to make an example of the kids who tried to "test" him. It was very clear in the student handbook which offenses were punishable and to what degree. If you committed an "expel-able"offense, you were expelled. We had a couple of kids whose parents were big contributors to the school, so I guess they assumed they were "above" the disciplinary measures. They quickly found out that they weren't.

Meanwhile, there wasn't a lot of trouble at the school either. It was a nice learning environment, with pleasant, respectful people, you didn't always have to be watching your back.

DISNEY DOLL: That sounds EXACTLY like the speech my DS's, YES, "Dean of Discipline" gave DS' school the FIRST day. I am telling you this FIGHT happened about ONE week into school and my DS was just stunned by the whole incident. BUT everyone standing around watching the girls beat each other up and then seeing the exchange of words from the HeadMaster "GET YOUR BOOKS"...man, that was a REAL learning experience for all in that hallway that day. And can you imagine the disappointment as the parents now learn their child is no longer ALLOWED at this school. ZERO TOLERANCE needs to be and should be practiced more often today at any and all schools.

 

[declansdad]

First off, I never once said I agreed with the way the school handled the situation. Both of these girls should be expelled and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. The op's daughter needs to feel safe at school and a 5 day suspension is not going to do that.

My comment about what you referred to as a sales technique was about it being used to sell something not to get a meeting with your school administration. I totally agree with you when you list the people that need to be at the meeting and the meeting should not occur until they are all there. My comment was that the method you suggested to get this accomplished, to me, would seem confrontational.

Schools have a great responsibility when it comes to our children and as a society we have placed a greater burden on them than ever before. When they fail many people jump all over them. Are schools perfect? No. Could they do a better job? Yes. As a society, both in the US and Canada, can we do more to help them? You bet we can. Schools have been attacked for so long it is only natural for them to go on the defensive. That doesn't make it right but that is the reality of our world. I find it sad that as another poster stated, sometimes the phrase "I will be calling my attorney" is the only thing that gets action. The only way to change this is to pressure the people who make the decisions, ie. the governments and school districts/boards. They are the ones who set the direction, the school administrators and teachers and working within their system.

I am sorry of you feel that just because I don't live in your country that I can't understand what is going on and I shouldn' t make any comments. Our countries are not that different and the one statement that I made about the US being the most litigous country in the world is true. It also saddens me to see that Canada is quickly following suit.

This is just my opinion, I'm not trying to attack or belittle anyone.

 

[andromedaslove]

kids today ughhhhh
I just don't know what they are thinking. Best of luck.

See, the thing is.... it isn't just kids today. I remember getting the crap kicked outta me as a kid. I was in a neighborhood of bullies in a rural area, and everyone thought it was ok to pick on me. My mom tried to stop it, but couldn't protect me every minute of the day, and back then the cops wouldn't do anything. It wasn't until Junior High when I finally fought back (and kicked the crap outta them for once I am glad to say) that it finally stopped. I hate to condone violence, and have raised my children that fighting isn't right and doesn't solve many things, but my kids have also been told that if anyone ever lays a hand on you that you beat the mess outta them. I had custody of my cousin for 4 years and I told him the same thing when he started having problems at school. I also went to the principal as soon as I found out and let them know that if this boy touched him again that he had my permission to fight back with everything he had and that if the school suspended him for protecting himself I would be at the school board. As soon as I told the principal that, she called in the kids parents and told them everything, and my cousin luckily didn't have to deal with it.

Ok, I know I am rambling .... I just have such a hard time hearing about kids getting bullied. Because I went through it so much as a child.

To the OP: I am SO Sorry to hear about what your daughter has been through. I, like other posters, would definately suggest getting her into martial arts because it will make her more self confident about herself and if she ever runs into anything like this again she will be able to protect herself. I am GLAD she wants to return to school and I definately think she should. She sounds like a very strong little girl, and I hope she doesn't have to deal with this again.

 

[ducklite]

My comment about what you referred to as a sales technique was about it being used to sell something not to get a meeting with your school administration. I totally agree with you when you list the people that need to be at the meeting and the meeting should not occur until they are all there. My comment was that the method you suggested to get this accomplished, to me, would seem confrontational.

It's psychology 101. It is used in sales, but it's got other uses, this would be one of them. Sitting there, arms crossed, letting them know that the meeting won't begin until all parties are there will make them scramble to get them there. It's taking the offensive and asserting yourself.

The school new about an ongoing and pervasive systemic harrassment of Jenny's daughter, They failed int heir duty when given ample opportunity to resolve the issues before somebody got hurt. Now Jenny needs to take the tiger by the tail and wrap it around it's throat until it chokes. And they WILL choke, sputter, sweat, and stew. Been there, done that.

Oh, and the best part is when they start to play the blame game and pass the buck around the table. I had a couple times I could barely keep from snickering at the Laurel and Hardy scene playing out in front of me. It was simply pathetic in a very perverse way.

Anne

 

[rigs32]

I don't think that I am overgeneralizing. The US is the most litigous country in the world and on a number of different boards there is always someone who suggests a lawsuit. I didn't say people in the US are terrible people just that there is a tendency to use lawyers and the courts system to solve problems.

The above it true, BUT it is a misleading statement. Other countries have laws and regulations such that many conflicts never have to reach the courts. As an example, product liability laws might set a strict standard that, if met, the company must pay out. It never goes to court.

People always cite the McDonalds case, forgetting that all the woman wanted was reimbursement of her medical bills because her pants *fused* to her private parts as a result of the spill.

Yes, it is a different system - one with pros and cons. But just because the US has more lawsuits doesn't mean anything in and of itself. Our lawmakers have simply made a choice to not legislate much regulation on many topics.

It goes to the role of government. The US has a relatively low tax rate when compared with many other developed countries, but it also provides a lot fewer services. Many of the people crying out for tax relief also want government services - but they go hand in hand. A higher tax rate usually equals more "free" services, but the money has to come from someplace. In countries with universal healthcare, it is considered a right that all citizens are entitled to. In the US, if you want healthcare, you can get a job and pay for it. (Can you tell which I prefer???)

 

[ducklite]

But just because the US has more lawsuits doesn't mean anything in and of itself.

We've also got ten times the population of Canada, five times the population of the UK, double the population of Japan, and five times the population of France. (These were just random industrialized nations pulled from teh CIA World Factbook, and all are rough)

Suffice to say that with that big of a difference in population alone we'd have that many more lawsuits. And I'm not very good with math...

Anne

 

[VSL]

People always cite the McDonalds case, forgetting that all the woman wanted was reimbursement of her medical bills because her pants *fused* to her private parts as a result of the spill.

Getting OT, but where can I read about that?!

I've never heard of it but it sounds weird.. and I'm interested

 

[CathrynRose]

That is the beauty of a good private school. It's not to say that bad stuff doesn't happen at private schools, because it does. But private schools have a lot more control over what they can do to students who break the rules.
.

I agree 100%

I think it's a shame that public schools cant do the same thing. My opinion is that if you *mess up* at a free - school, well... it looks like Mommy and Daddy are gonna have to find an alternative for you pal. Why should tax money go to children who disrupt and bully others?

Can you imagine going to work everydayin that sort of enviroment? Start a physical fight at work - think you'd be there any longer??

Unreal.

Im so sorry for your daughter.

 

[rigs32]

Here are some links to the facts of the McD's coffee case. They all say the same stuff.

http://www.centerjd.org/free/mythbusters-free/MB_mcdonalds.htm

(If you read about the phone booth case at the bottom, that was actually a fact pattern on my torts exam. I had no idea until today it was based on a real case. I guess law students in 20 years will get the coffee case on exams and not realized it was real.)

http://www.gtla.org/public/cases/mcdonalds.html

 

[VSL]

Thanks!

 

[Aidensmom]

I'm so sorry, my heart goes out to you and your daughter. Please keep us updated.

 

[Alice's Mom]

I have been away from my computer for a couple days and I hate that this thread is here. I am so sorry to you and your daughter...bullies think they can get away with this kind of stuff. This girl should be expelled.

I remember about 10 or so years ago a kid was stabbed and killed in school all because of bullying. This smaller 14 year old boy was constantly being bullied and assaulted...thrown into trash cans, beat up, stolen from...by another boy. He told his counselors and teachers and nothing would be done. So he one day brought a knife to school to stand up to the kid and a fight ensued and the bully was stabbed and later died. The kid ended up in juvenile hall til he was 18. If the school had taken action none of that would have happened. Schools need to be proactive and protect their students so that all students make it to graduation safely.

Best wishes to your family

 

[FergieTCat]

I agree 100%

I think it's a shame that public schools cant do the same thing. My opinion is that if you *mess up* at a free - school, well... it looks like Mommy and Daddy are gonna have to find an alternative for you pal. Why should tax money go to children who disrupt and bully others?

Here's the part that makes me mad. Those vicious little brats were suspended for five days before this. In that period of time, didn't the parents even bother to tell them in no uncertain terms what would happen if they did it again? Probably not. Military school sounds like a perfect environment for those little darlings.

 

[mbw12]

I haven't read the entire thread yet, just your first post...so I do not know if their have been any updates yet. Just wanted to give you a HUGE .....please keep us posted!!!!

 

[luvsmickeymouse]

Take it as far as you can! Hugs to your family, these brats did this because they knew their parents wouldnt do anything and they probley wont again now, but the school must and the police should. They would be expelled if that happened around here. (I think alot of us can say we would rather be in jail for something than face our parents if we got in trouble growing up, unfortunatley that was never instilled in these brats!)

Edited to add: Make sure the parents of the brats split your costs on the emergency room and such also! They might not care much but it might get their attention when they are paying your DD's bill for it!

I think that the school district has to pay the bills. It wouldn't hurt to try. We have a terrible bullying problem in our school also. Everyone says, oh, not in a small New Hampshire town, yeah right! We also have an 80% drug use. Both of my sons' have been bullied. I have one in college and one in h.s. I can't wait until he is done with high school. The policies in the school aren't inforced. I really feel for your daughter. I hope she never loses sight of who she is, and how much better she is then those girls. Remember , strength in numbers.

 

[mommyceratops]

I am so sorry!! Please keep us posted. That is just awful, kids are so mean!!!