More Dining Info from AllEars

[Nancyg56]

It's not necessarily about being gluttons and gaining 10 pounds... If you eat at almost ALL the character meals and one Signature restaurant with small kids (as the price is more reasonable), the DXDDP would pay for itself and SAVE you money. Do we eat all the food? No! Do we usually have CS credits left? Yes! Will I care that I'm wasting food? No, because it financially a good deal for families like mine who enjoy the TS for a break and as a great opportunity to see characters without standing in long lines at the parks.

And you can get the DDP with the AAA discount and NOT pay rack rate. You must book directly with AAA, however, to get both.

We felt the same way. My DGD loves the character meals and while she is young we will continue to add them on. We also like some of the signature dining Restaurants and the dinner shows so we add them on as well. We are not gluttons but we do enjoy the characters and we enjoy good meals and we schedule them into our plans. We know that there will come a day when we can't round up our family for a vacation together so we are taking advantage while we can. We have never used all of our CS credits, yet we have paid for meals OOP. We don't feel that we wasted money, the experiences we enjoyed were priceless to us.

 

[pilferk]

It's not necessarily about being gluttons and gaining 10 pounds... If you eat at almost ALL the character meals and one Signature restaurant with small kids (as the price is more reasonable), the DXDDP would pay for itself and SAVE you money. Do we eat all the food? No! Do we usually have CS credits left? Yes! Will I care that I'm wasting food? No, because it financially a good deal for families like mine who enjoy the TS for a break and as a great opportunity to see characters without standing in long lines at the parks.

And you can get the DDP with the AAA discount and NOT pay rack rate. You must book directly with AAA, however, to get both.

To add to that, you can also get DDP as a DVC member...and don't need to buy tickets or jump through any other hoops. So there's that perspective to add, too.

I'm hoping they allow DXDDP for DVC members. It won't "work" for this trip, but I THINK it might work for our NEXT trip (Dec '08)...when we'll really be there for the X-mas festivities and will want to do LOTS of resort visits, dinner shows (Hoop De doo), etc and less hardcore theme park touring. Our kids will be a bit older, too.

 

[pilferk]

While the numbers for doing 2 TS a day might make sense, I cannot see spending the time to do 2 TS a day. My family gets restless if we try to do 1 TS every day. Now if one was going to do dinner shows and signature restuarants, then I could see it. Just can't see taking 4 hours out of my day for 2 meals.

But just my two cents.

Agreed. That was one of our considerations too. Financials aren't EVERYTHING.

For us, it doesn't work out financially for this trip, either. But you expressed one of our concerns.....the amount of time TS's take.

I think DXDDP is going to be one of those things that you really have to think about, and plan around. One trip, it may not make any sense at all. Another, it might be a good idea.

For example, we're going in January. It's a "theme park" focused trip, and our first trip as DVC members. Looking at our itinerary for dining, and even adding and modding that itinerary slightly, it was both too cumbersome AND not a good "fit", costwise, for us.

For our possilble Dec 08 trip...that's another story. It's going to be a primarily X-mas festivity focused trip...meaning a slower theme park pace, probably, and much more resort visiting (and, likely, later nights). On THAT trip, it may just work out. We briefly looked last night, just for grins, and I THINK it will.

 

[ConnieB]

Lewisc touched on this, but I think it deserves more consideration.

IMHO, evaluating DDP is a trickier exercise than most folks do. Most people compare the cost of DDP (now + tip) to the menu prices of the food offered by DDP. That's a bogus comparison if you are trying to determine whether DDP saves you money. (There are other reasons to get DDP than saving money.)

The better comparison is to calculate approximately where and what you would eat if you were paying cash and compare that to the TOTAL cost of DDP. If the number for the TOTAL cost of DDP is less, you save money. If the TOTAL cost of DDP is more than you would normally spend, but less than the menu prices, then you can decide whether you are getting good value...but you are not saving money compared to what you would normally spend.

Keep in mind that the TOTAL cost of DDP includes the DDP price, tips, park tickets you have to buy but don't need (not a factor for everyone, but certainly for AP holders), plus the discounts on lodging you have to give up in order to be eligible for DDP. If you have to pay $30-40 per night more for your room to qualify, that's a COST of DDP, but most people don't include those costs in their calculations.

For our family (2A/1C, DVC members), DDP formerly resulted in a total savings of only about $75-100 per trip. And we didn't pay any more for our room and didn't have to buy park tickets.

I think if people really want to get an accurate idea of whether DDP is for them, they need to take a much closer look than most do. Most just listen to the marketing hype and spend a lot more than they would have normally.

I wholeheartedly agree with you! We are planning our first trip to WDW. We've done Disneyland for years, but are ready to venture to the other coast. While we've not stayed at the DLR hotels due to cost, and the fact that other, maybe even nicer, hotels were within a reasonable distance....we originally thought we wanted to stay onsite at WDW. Then we decided, hey, the DDP sounds cool...probably more than we would have spent on our own, because we'd probably never usually eat that much...but hey, it might be fun to try all those restaurants, so sure, why not. The ticket requirement didn't bother us, because we have to buy them anyway, though we may cash them in on APs.

Then I started crunching numbers to know how much money I needed to pull out of the budget......and wow, it racked up FAST. The onsite room was more, then the DDP was more than we've ever spent before on food at DLR.....and so we started checking off site hotels. There was savings, but not nearly as much as at DLR.......and then I checked some of the HOMES that you can rent. And my goodness.....the cost was HALF, the size of the homes was of course huge over a moderate WDW room (even a deluxe for that matter)....and they had full kitchens....and private pools.....and separate bedrooms, and REAL living rooms, so we can watch a little news or a movie at night without having to sit on the beds. And the adults could stay up a little more than children.........and on and on.

Even without considering the changes in the DDP or the rumored changes in the hotel rates weekend/weekday I simply can't justify spending twice as much money on food and hotel and getting less than half as much from it.

So....we won't be staying on site....and we'll be eating most of our meals off site as well. So Disney priced themselves out of our money. We'll probably still do a CS in the park because leaving in the middle of the day doesn't fit our style....but we'll breakfast in our big comfy kitchen and dining room and we'll dine on the local economy.

Our experience in WDW won't change I'm sure, because WDW is not about food to us....yes, there are certain food "musts" when we went to DLR, like the Monte Cristo sandwich and Dole Whips .....but as I'm typing this and trying to think of a third "must" food, I can't think of one. So I guess food isn't even as high up as I thought it was,

So...I've veered away from the Resort board and have been hanging out on the Orlando board more.....and getting some GREAT suggestions for restaurants off site that sound just as delicious as those in WDW.

Thanks to all you experienced Diser's who will make this first trip that much better for us by sharing your knowledge! Who knows...with the savings from this trip we may actually be able to come back a second time next year! But even then, I'm afraid all Disney will get of our money is tickets and souveniors and lunch.

 

[reeeoga]

I guess I just don't get the math. How do you get that many snacks for 2 a day x 4 people x 7 nights= 56?? Did I miss the total you get per day. It is late so maybe my brain just slipped!

Well if "I" had used the correct numbers for snacks then I would have gotten 56 also . Guess my calculator still had some other number in it. Sorry for the confusion. I need sleep also.

 

[ConnieB]

The only thing I will really miss is the convenience...I like knowing the food is paid for before we go.

.

Of course you don't have to lose this convenience, just plan differently for it. Using the same schedule as you'd normally do for making a payment to WDW, just put that money onto a prepaid VISA/MC or into Disney Dollars. Then you'll have the convenience of it all prepaid before you go....and if you put on a prepaid card, of having only one thing to carry. I don't want a wad of Disney Dollars, but I don't mind the prepaid card and can easily slip it into my laynard behind my AP.

If you do go the prepaid credit card, read the terms of the card you choose carefully....many of them take fees for "inactive" cards, or fees every time you add money to the card.......so you want one that won't take those fees while you're saving up! My bank doesn't, but it's a membership bank so you may have to shop around to find one that won't take away from you. Or....just open a free savings account and make your payments into THAT and then a week or two before you leave transfer all that money onto a card, so you avoid the refill and inactive fees altogether.

 

[pilferk]

Of course you don't have to lose this convenience, just plan differently for it. Using the same schedule as you'd normally do for making a payment to WDW, just put that money onto a prepaid VISA/MC or into Disney Dollars. Then you'll have the convenience of it all prepaid before you go....and if you put on a prepaid card, of having only one thing to carry. I don't want a wad of Disney Dollars, but I don't mind the prepaid card and can easily slip it into my laynard behind my AP.

If you do go the prepaid credit card, read the terms of the card you choose carefully....many of them take fees for "inactive" cards, or fees every time you add money to the card.......so you want one that won't take those fees while you're saving up! My bank doesn't, but it's a membership bank so you may have to shop around to find one that won't take away from you. Or....just open a free savings account and make your payments into THAT and then a week or two before you leave transfer all that money onto a card, so you avoid the refill and inactive fees altogether.

In that vein, many banks offer (free to customers) rechargeable, prepaid Amex cards. They're actually a branch of the travellers cheque system (and have many of the same benefits). Check with your bank to see if they do something like that.

 

[Diznut84]

Add me to the list of people who think that the new Deluxe plan is disgusting. If you've ever done the DDP (especially for a lengthy trip), you know it is a LOT of food. We had VERY LITTLE additional out-of-pocket food expenses with the previous DDP.

Now with the Deluxe plan, basically DOUBLE the amount of food. Of course, you don't have to eat it all (what a great lesson to teach kids: Throw away 60% of your food!), and then increase the price from $38.99 for those 10 and over to $69.99. Do the math for a 7+ day trip: No way is that affordable!

I think these proposed changes will have a significantly negative effect on the Disney restaurants, as well as on the resorts and the parks. Lots of people choose to stay on grounds because the eating is more affordable with DDP. When you take this away from people, you might as well stay off grounds if you now want to eat offgrounds as well. If you're going to stay offgrounds, maybe it's a good idea to go to SeaWorld and Universal as well. Maybe a day at the beach....

IMO, this proposed gutting of the DDP affects far more than just food at WDW.

 

[disneyjunkie]

Of course you don't have to lose this convenience, just plan differently for it. Using the same schedule as you'd normally do for making a payment to WDW, just put that money onto a prepaid VISA/MC or into Disney Dollars. Then you'll have the convenience of it all prepaid before you go....and if you put on a prepaid card, of having only one thing to carry. I don't want a wad of Disney Dollars, but I don't mind the prepaid card and can easily slip it into my laynard behind my AP.

What a great idea.

 

[DancingBear]

It also drove up sales in the restaurants. We had a couple of different CM's tell us that they were grateful for the DDP because otherwise, their restaurants would be empty.

People have to eat somewhere. If they weren't eating at these TS restaurants they'd be eating at CS restaurants on-property, or somewhere off-property. So employees would be needed somewhere.

Which brings up another benefit of the DDP--people tried (and maybe got hooked on) restaurants they wouldn't otherwise have considered. So whether they use the DDP or not, more people will probably consider at least some of the restaurants "must-do's" for future trips.

Or, people might have been turned off on restaurants because they experienced a restaurant that was much more crowded, rushed, with a dumbed-down menu.

 

[Lewisc]

Disgusting are the customers that make multiple trips to get "their monies worth" at buffets.

The new deluxe plan give guests 3 credits per day. That allows for a TS breakfast (or lunch) and a 2 credit dinner. Alternatively a guest could have a TS breakfast, a CS lunch and a regular one credit dinner. Getting an omlette at a TS restaurant isn't any more food then getting one of the those combos at a food court and is probably less "disgusting" then having a box of donuts, one snack credit, for breakfast.

I'm not sure if the new deluxe plan is cost effective but a plan that provides for 3 meals a day isn't disgusting. Guests that try to "max" out a buffet, all you care to eat meal or any dining plan are likely to gain pounds.

Add me to the list of people who think that the new Deluxe plan is disgusting. If you've ever done the DDP (especially for a lengthy trip), you know it is a LOT of food. We had VERY LITTLE additional out-of-pocket food expenses with the previous DDP.

 

[pilferk]

Add me to the list of people who think that the new Deluxe plan is disgusting. If you've ever done the DDP (especially for a lengthy trip), you know it is a LOT of food. We had VERY LITTLE additional out-of-pocket food expenses with the previous DDP.

Which means, for your family, it's not a good fit. Fine. But let's reserve making value judgements on the plan, and those USING the plan (because it IS a good fit for them), and simply say THAT: It's just not a good fit for you.

Now with the Deluxe plan, basically DOUBLE the amount of food. Of course, you don't have to eat it all (what a great lesson to teach kids: Throw away 60% of your food!), and then increase the price from $38.99 for those 10 and over to $69.99. Do the math for a 7+ day trip: No way is that affordable!

First off...not ordering food isn't "wasting it", which is what many people do. Again, lets not start making value judgements on other peoples parenting choices...and stick with our own situations, huh?

Second, it might not be affordable FOR YOU. Staying in a deluxe resort might not be affordable for Miss Sissy. Eating at Victoria and Alberts might not be affordable for Mr. Jones. For other people, people who do a lot of dinner shows, or like the signature dining, or who LIKE the idea of 3 TS meals while on a slow paced vaction.....the plan might be quite affordable. That's why it's an ADD ON, and not the basic plan. Because Disney, I would assume, knows that the DXDDP isn't the "best fit" for much of it's customer base.

I think these proposed changes will have a significantly negative effect on the Disney restaurants, as well as on the resorts and the parks. Lots of people choose to stay on grounds because the eating is more affordable with DDP. When you take this away from people, you might as well stay off grounds if you now want to eat offgrounds as well. If you're going to stay offgrounds, maybe it's a good idea to go to SeaWorld and Universal as well. Maybe a day at the beach....

IMO, this proposed gutting of the DDP affects far more than just food at WDW.

It very well may, though I think that's largely in how you define "negative". Maybe there will be a fall off in demand for TS restaurants...heck, maybe that's, from Disney's view, a "positive". Maybe it will drive down resort occupancy by a tick or two. Maybe it will lead to 2 or 3k guests per day not being in the park. I don't know....but I can see those scenarios.

So the question is: Do you think Disney knows that, too? And has projected exactly what effects it EXPECTS to see with the changing of the DDP plan? I'd bet they have. I'd bet they've thought all this through, with bucketloads of data, both from a business side and a guest survey side, looking at ALL the factors involved. They then decided the increased profitability was worth whatever "cost" they projected out.

Now, it's perfectly legit to say none of these new offerings work for you. I can certainly see that, for many people. Certainly, let Disney know that, via a letter (but wait until the official announcment is made!) and with your wallet. If ENOUGH people let Disney know, and they notice an issue/trend they didn't expect, they'll adjust the plan again (as they have before, as they likely will in the future).

 

[DancingBear]

Add me to the list of people who think that the new Deluxe plan is disgusting. If you've ever done the DDP (especially for a lengthy trip), you know it is a LOT of food. We had VERY LITTLE additional out-of-pocket food expenses with the previous DDP.

Now with the Deluxe plan, basically DOUBLE the amount of food. Of course, you don't have to eat it all (what a great lesson to teach kids: Throw away 60% of your food!), and then increase the price from $38.99 for those 10 and over to $69.99.

I don't understand this complaint. Since the Deluxe plan is an option, those who buy it will be the ones who want "more food", and who chose to spend the money. These folks aren't compelled to waste their food or their money, and presumably they could do both without the benefit of any plan at all.

Also, for those saying they will now rush off-site, I'd hold your horses for a bit. Disney still wants to fill its hotel rooms, they've just decided this is not the way to do it any more. So, unless for some reason they are suddenly able to maintain occupancy rates without offering some sort of discount, there should be some increased availability of room-only discounts, or some other type of package discount.

 

[pilferk]

I don't understand this complaint. Since the Deluxe plan is an option, those who buy it will be the ones who want "more food", and who chose to spend the money. These folks aren't compelled to waste their food or their money, and presumably they could do both without the benefit of any plan at all.

Also, for those saying they will now rush off-site, I'd hold your horses for a bit. Disney still wants to fill its hotel rooms, they've just decided this is not the way to do it any more. So, unless for some reason they are suddenly able to maintain occupancy rates without offering some sort of discount, there should be some increased availability of room-only discounts, or some other type of package discount.

I'd expect one of two things:

a) The new "non-seasoned" rumored resort rates show a discount, overall, to the current rates...and thus, end up being the impetus to stay on property (along with EMH and the other inherent benefits)

or

b) We return to the bygone days of more discount codes, more PIN's, etc. They'll fill rooms by making the RESORTS bear the brunt of the cost, rather than the DINING division bearing the costs.

Those are just my guesses.

One thing they wont' do, though, is try to compete with off site rooms, and condo/timeshare rentals. The fact is...there have ALWAYS been those offerings. They were there prior to the DDP, they'll be there long after the DDP has gone (or morphed into something completely unrecognizable). Disney has always managed to fill it's rooms. With last years numbers being STELLAR, by all accounts......the question is how much do they really need to "give" to a guest to fill the rooms now.... I don't know the answer, of course, but I'll bet Disney has a good idea. And the DDP changes would, obviously, have been part of that planning process.

 

[DancingBear]

I'd expect one of two things:

a) The new "non-seasoned" rumored resort rates show a discount, overall, to the current rates...and thus, end up being the impetus to stay on property (along with EMH and the other inherent benefits)

or

b) We return to the bygone days of more discount codes, more PIN's, etc. They'll fill rooms by making the RESORTS bear the brunt of the cost, rather than the DINING division bearing the costs.

I'm not sure that's an A OR B matter. We now demand fluctuates seasonally, so if they get rid of seasonal rates, then presumably they'll offer focused discounts to fill up the rooms in the lower demand periods.

 

[pilferk]

I'm not sure that's an A OR B matter. We now demand fluctuates seasonally, so if they get rid of seasonal rates, then presumably they'll offer focused discounts to fill up the rooms in the lower demand periods.

Agreed. It could be both.

I'm not sure they'll COMPLETELY remove seasons....that's what they'll say...but prices will still fluctuate with projected demand. So, in the end, summer weekdays will be more expensive than winter, non-holiday, non-vacation, week days. But weekends will be more expensive than weekdays, single holidays (MLK, Labor Day, 4th of July) will be more expensive than "normal" days, holiday weekends more expensive than "regular" weekends. You get what I mean. That's the "plan" I expect to see put in place...but we'll see.

Of course, that plan eliminates the "start in value season, get value season rates for the whole trip" thing, too.

 

[Nancyg56]

Add me to the list of people who think that the new Deluxe plan is disgusting. If you've ever done the DDP (especially for a lengthy trip), you know it is a LOT of food. We had VERY LITTLE additional out-of-pocket food expenses with the previous DDP.

Now with the Deluxe plan, basically DOUBLE the amount of food. Of course, you don't have to eat it all (what a great lesson to teach kids: Throw away 60% of your food!), and then increase the price from $38.99 for those 10 and over to $69.99. Do the math for a 7+ day trip: No way is that affordable!

I think these proposed changes will have a significantly negative effect on the Disney restaurants, as well as on the resorts and the parks. Lots of people choose to stay on grounds because the eating is more affordable with DDP. When you take this away from people, you might as well stay off grounds if you now want to eat offgrounds as well. If you're going to stay offgrounds, maybe it's a good idea to go to SeaWorld and Universal as well. Maybe a day at the beach....

IMO, this proposed gutting of the DDP affects far more than just food at WDW.

Perhaps this plan does not work for you and your family. I can respect that. It may be the plan I would like and that fits my family's vacation plans. I would ask that you respect my choice.

We used the old plan and liked the convenience. We did not waste food, we "wasted" CS credits. We went to extra character breakfasts so that we could all enjoy my DGD's interaction with them, and I confess I am a character junkie as well. We did not gorge on the food, it was the backdrop for us as we visited with each other while waiting for the characters to stop by. We also enjoy YS and CG as well as one dinner show per trip. With this plan I would probably not need to pay OOP for our evening meal along the way, and still find that the price is right for us.

At home we never have time to all sit for breakfast together. While I can haul my family with us my DH likes to all have a nice breakfast together. I never thought that we should feel that we are abusing our food becasue of it.

I don't know how the changes are going to affect Disney, I imagine the standard plan will have the most detractors, I know it will not work for me now. Whether Disney will find the negatives outweigh the positives will remain to be seen, but in the meantime it is interesting to "hear" others viewpoints. The best way to make yourself heard is through your purchasing habits, not by making unsavory observations about those whose decisions do not mirror your own.

 

[chipirrina2]

With these changes it makes more sense for us to stay off property and pay for whichever meals we feel like having.

 

[ConnieB]

I hear you there! My oldest twins will be on the 'adult' plan on our next trip because they will be age 10. That is *if* we decide to buy it.
I've been crunching numbers on the supposed rumored DDP changes and I have come up with a cost of a little over 2 grand just for the dining plan for the 10 days (3 'actual' adults and 4 'children' that will be ages 6,6,10,10). It cost us $965.58 for 6 days just two months ago.
Let me get this right.. For 4 extra days added to our next trip and my picky eating 'children' being considered adults..(adults according to Disney), we will need to pay over 2 grand for the dining plan alone, plus 15%-18% tip x's 10 days, minus the appetizer that we have enjoyed in the past--(I can't deal with no fried cheese at 50's Primetime )
Well, no thanks Disney...we may have to consider other less expensive options for our next trip! Such as Universal Studios and SeaWorld.
For two grand, my family of seven could eat for 10 WEEKS at home!! I think they should do away with free dining and leave the dining plan alone.

Wait....you forgot to figure in that you have to pay RACK RATE for your room as well....no discounted room codes allowed. I think that is a big hidden cost that people aren't calculating! From what I'm reading the codes often give you a 20 - 25% discount....

But...in Disney's defense...I don't think it quite fair to compare the cost of dining (on or off plan/site) while on vacation to the cost of groceries at home. I can't think of any vacation anywhere that didn't triple or better my food bill.....we eat frugally at home, but vacation isn't about tuna casseroles and hamburger helper, lol.

Hmmm....I'm thinking this is all a big conspiracy brought about by the people who own rental homes just minutes from WDW and all the offsite restaurants, Seems to me that getting reservations THERE is going to get harder next year.

 

[pamouselover]

I read this last night also, and you have to remember it is a rumor.
I just hope they keep doing the free dinning plan in the off season!