Might be cancelling—government shutdown

[n2mm]

In the news this morning that the FAA is halting flights from Laguardia in NYC due to a shortage of air traffic controllers. What a mess! I'm supposed to fly out of LGA in two weeks for a cruise... hoping it's over by then.

Yea, that’s why driving is our plan B. We are sailing feb 7th and I don’t plan to miss it. Though I do have travel insurance

 

[igrsod]

We are booked for Princess Marathon weekend. With the Government shutdown ongoing I’m starting to have less confidence in air travel safety. The news today is not encouraging. President of the Flight Attendant Association says air travel is becoming unsafe as TSA workers and Air traffic controllers are overtaxed. No vacation is worth the risk, but I’m really bummed. The points would already go into holding, so I’ll ride it out a bit. Plane tickets will go down the drain. Anyone else considering cancelling?

We are actually looking at a plan B of driving down if things don't improve.

 

[igrsod]

I agree. I will be waiting until the last possible moment to cancel. I’m hoping for a resolution. Perhaps given that I’m Canadian, the whole thing spooks me a bit more. Very well reasoned responses. Thanks to all.

Hello fellow Canadian. I share your concerns.

 

[bpadair32]

I am going in two weeks and I have no thought of cancelling. There may be some delays and whatnot, but I have no doubts about the safety of flying once you are in the air.

 

[CraigInPA]

We're flying out next Saturday 2/2/19. However, we're already prepared a backup plan to drive the 1,003 miles starting on Friday 2/1/19, if the situation takes a turn for the worst. While we don't relish 15 hours of driving, the alternative to lose the vacation is not on the table.

 

[jimim]

i personally think that is what they need to do to end this. ground flights.

but on a lighter note, i agree that air companies would ground flights if there was a greater risk. the news adds to the problem most of the time.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

Cancelling for financial reasons? Totally get that

Cancelling because you think that they aren't going to care about actual safety? I don't really get that but at least make an informed decision on that.

*I wouldn't be cancelling, I know my husband isn't cancelling his business flight for a week from today.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

If there is TRULY a safety risk, the airlines will collectively decide to ground flights until the risk is mitigated. They have an obligation to their employees, customers, and board members to NOT lose the airline money as the result of an avoidable accident.

I kind of hope they go this route, to be honest.

So in other words you want there to be a true safety risk?

I don't think grounding flights just to stick it to 'em is appropriate either but I sure as heck wouldn't be actually wanting a safety risk to the point where they ground all flights. You wanting another 9/11 event for that to be the case?

 

[crisi]

It’s a hoax. There is zero point zero diminished safety. It is possible there may be some delays, but no compromise in safety.

Edited to explain...

There are two major entities affected, Air Traffic Control (ATC) and TSA.
Granted, neither wants to work without a paycheck, but ATC still isn’t going to vector (turn) two airplanes so they will collide. It IS possible that some may call sick which would reduce the volume of traffic that can be handled.
TSA, unlike ATC which is truly a well paid career job, works on a different level. They do not make the money to handle multiple missed paychecks (although they will get paid eventually).
They may call in sick or resign in record numbers which may slow things down. But, I HIGHLY doubt any working TSA professional will purposely let a gun go through the checkpoint.
Again, it may slow it down, but in my opinion will not compromise safety.

Source: Professional Airline Captain

Open for questions...

On the other hand, a lot of what air traffic controllers and tsa agents do is pay attention. They won't purposely let anything go, but they may be thinking about making their mortgage payment, or just chewing on having to show up to work without pay and miss something. They are human and humans make mistakes....and the concern is that they will make more mistakes in the current climate - or be open to being bribed. https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/13/us/tsa-gun-flight/index.html

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

On the other hand, a lot of what air traffic controllers and tsa agents do is pay attention. They won't purposely let anything go, but they may be thinking about making their mortgage payment, or just chewing on having to show up to work without pay and miss something. They are human and humans make mistakes....and the concern is that they will make more mistakes in the current climate - or be open to being bribed. https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/13/us/tsa-gun-flight/index.html

What's the correlation here you're trying to make. It's stories (well maybe more aptly headlines) like that that use people's fears against them.

The article states:
"TSA has determined standard procedures were not followed and a passenger did in fact pass through a standard screening TSA checkpoint with a firearm at Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport on the morning of January 3,"

Furthermore your article actually states the following:
"However, the TSA dismissed suggestions the government shutdown contributed to the security lapse and said a normal amount of staffers were working that day.
"The perception that this might have occurred as a result of the partial government shutdown would be false," TSA said. "The national unscheduled absence rate of TSA staff on Thursday, January 3, 2019, was 4.8% compared to 6.3% last year, Thursday, January 4, 2018. So in fact, the national call out rate was higher a year ago than this year on that date."
The TSA noted that it will "hold those responsible appropriately accountable."
TSA screeners have struggled to detect weapons even in the absence of a shutdown. In 2015, the acting administrator for the TSA was reassigned after a report found that airport screeners failed to detect explosives and weapons in nearly every test that an undercover team conducted at dozens of airports."

*I really dislike when articles like this have such eye catching headlines people fail to actually either critically think or read it through entirely.

 

[bpadair32]

This is all a moot point, they are going to be announcing a deal to re-open the government in just a few mins. Apparently, shutting down LGA for a couple of hours was all it took.

 

[quandrea]

This is all a moot point, they are going to be announcing a deal to re-open the government in just a few mins. Apparently, shutting down LGA for a couple of hours was all it took.

This is good news. What a difference a day makes.

 

[Maistre Gracey]

On the other hand, a lot of what air traffic controllers and tsa agents do is pay attention. They won't purposely let anything go, but they may be thinking about making their mortgage payment, or just chewing on having to show up to work without pay and miss something. They are human and humans make mistakes....and the concern is that they will make more mistakes in the current climate - or be open to being bribed. https://www.cnn.com/2019/01/13/us/tsa-gun-flight/index.html

I don’t buy it. There are hundreds of different things that always stress people out.
If a controller making six figures doesn’t have a few months emergency stash, than I’m betting they are always stressed about money even when getting paid.
The bribe thing is laughable imo.

 

[DLgal]

So in other words you want there to be a true safety risk?

I don't think grounding flights just to stick it to 'em is appropriate either but I sure as heck wouldn't be actually wanting a safety risk to the point where they ground all flights. You wanting another 9/11 event for that to be the case?

No, I meant I hope the airlines decide to ground flights in protest, more or less. Why the heck would anyone WANT an air tragedy to occur?

It's a moot point now, anyway.

 

[Mackenzie Click-Mickelson]

No, I meant I hope the airlines decide to ground flights in protest, more or less. Why the heck would anyone WANT an air tragedy to occur?

It's a moot point now, anyway.

Well that's why I was wondering because of the way you worded your comment. Glad to know that's not what you were actually meaning.

 

[DLgal]

I don’t buy it. There are hundreds of different things that always stress people out.
If a controller making six figures doesn’t have a few months emergency stash, than I’m betting they are always stressed about money even when getting paid.

This is the kind of insensitive thing being said by many in the administration who just cannot fathom how anyone would need to use a food bank.

We make six figures, and my husband is active duty military. We don't have "a few months emergency stash." If we didn't get paid for a month, we'd have to start running up credit cards and liquidating retirement accounts and college savings accounts. It would not be a good situation for us if a shutdown meant going without pay for an indefinite amount of time. You can't just assume that people who make six figures are rich and have tons of money in liquid savings to fall back on. The reality is that the majority of Americans, across all income levels, cannot even cover a $1000 emergency with available cash.

 

[gdrj]

The impact of shutdown will potentially be felt for a longtime. Staffing levels even when getting paid is not where it needs to be.Many ATC are approaching retirement or are eligible. Training has been shutdown for a month, safety inspectors were out for a time. Some airlines reporting financial losses due to decrease travel (business travel). I am flying in a few weeks (not to Orlando) and while not changing right now, it does concern me. The shutdown doesnt make everything better overnight. As the ATC union says they need to perfect 100% of the time.

 

[Toolulu22]

So...... I live and will be flying in and out of NY airports in three weeks for our trip to FL. As I stated, we don’t intend to cancel, but I’m wondering that in light of the big questionmark of the looming Feb. 15 deadline for some sort of resolution, which in my opinion will come and go without any compromise, if we should change our plans coming home? Our flight home is on Sunday, Feb 24 and I HAVE to be at work Feb 25. We have a rule about not extending vacations and I can be in serious do-do if I am not back teaching on that Monday, especially since we have a heads-up that there is a potential for airport delays.

I just checked flights the day or two earlier out of both Tampa and Orlando and there is nothing for a reasonable price. I can get something on the Thursday, but that would be cutting my trip really short and my husband would stay in FL at that point (with his parents) and join me home Sunday. Would you all wait a bit to see what happens with the government and take your chances that the airlines will run on that Sunday fairly smoothly or change plans now, in which case would you bite the bullet on the higher fare? I think I’m overthinking this.

 

[Disneylovingmomof2]

So...... I live and will be flying in and out of NY airports in three weeks for our trip to FL. As I stated, we don’t intend to cancel, but I’m wondering that in light of the big questionmark of the looming Feb. 15 deadline for some sort of resolution, which in my opinion will come and go without any compromise, if we should change our plans coming home? Our flight home is on Sunday, Feb 24 and I HAVE to be at work Feb 25. We have a rule about not extending vacations and I can be in serious do-do if I am not back teaching on that Monday, especially since we have a heads-up that there is a potential for airport delays.

I just checked flights the day or two earlier out of both Tampa and Orlando and there is nothing for a reasonable price. I can get something on the Thursday, but that would be cutting my trip really short and my husband would stay in FL at that point (with his parents) and join me home Sunday. Would you all wait a bit to see what happens with the government and take your chances that the airlines will run on that Sunday fairly smoothly or change plans now, in which case would you bite the bullet on the higher fare? I think I’m overthinking this.

I’d be nervous too, as it seems he’s intending to announce a national emergency once these three weeks are over (assuming there’s no resolution).

 

[Matty B13]

So...... I live and will be flying in and out of NY airports in three weeks for our trip to FL. As I stated, we don’t intend to cancel, but I’m wondering that in light of the big questionmark of the looming Feb. 15 deadline for some sort of resolution, which in my opinion will come and go without any compromise, if we should change our plans coming home? Our flight home is on Sunday, Feb 24 and I HAVE to be at work Feb 25. We have a rule about not extending vacations and I can be in serious do-do if I am not back teaching on that Monday, especially since we have a heads-up that there is a potential for airport delays.

I just checked flights the day or two earlier out of both Tampa and Orlando and there is nothing for a reasonable price. I can get something on the Thursday, but that would be cutting my trip really short and my husband would stay in FL at that point (with his parents) and join me home Sunday. Would you all wait a bit to see what happens with the government and take your chances that the airlines will run on that Sunday fairly smoothly or change plans now, in which case would you bite the bullet on the higher fare? I think I’m overthinking this.

I would have a talk with your manager/boss about the situation, a family vacation shouldn’t be missed because of the political mess in Washington, especially if your a valued member of your staff. With unemployment as low as it is, your boss might not be able to replace you as easily they think. Plus, it cost a lot of time and money to train new personnel.