MDE/FP+ Poll Results

[Alfalfa]

After talking to people while standing in line I know there are a lot more who didn't vote that don't like it either. I guess you could say I took my own poll and more people didn't like it than did. Sorry I didn't count them all up.

 

[Laketravis]

Even Lake has backed off his "expect to ride 3 things with minimal waits then you better like to shop" stance.....

Uh, no I haven't. I was just echoing what I read in a stockholder's report somewhere............

 

[Shaden]

No, it's saying that the overall sentiment of these small samplings of people that are the fans that tend to spend time on boards or podcasts, 2 years ago, spoke overwhelmingly against FP+. Today, we see a similar poll, and results are now not only not overwhelmingly against, but are between 51% and 84% for.

Nothing's gospel. You can draw your own conclusions.

Seriously look at the polls posted, they are all from the last 13 or 14 months, 2 from march/april last year, and one from the end of October .... not 2 years ago ...

http://www.htp.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3344036&page=4

 

[JimmyV]

I don't know where this poll is and I didn't vote on it but you can count me as hating it. And after talking to people while standing in line I know there are a lot more who didn't vote that don't like it either. I guess you could say I took my own poll and more people didn't like it than did. Sorry I didn't count them all up.

Thanks for relaying your real world experience. That often gets lost here in the static! The hosts of this site have posted links to their various social media outlets at the top right of each Board page. There is one for Facebook, Twitter, Pinterest, You Tube, etc. Each week the Board hosts do a live podcast to discuss all things Disney. And in conjunction therewith, they often post a poll to their FB account. Given that only 1,300 people responded, it is safe to say that the poll succeeded in self-selecting the most die-hard, drilled down members of the Dis community. Heck. You could probably have polled 1,300 people all by yourself while waiting in lines. I feel fairly safe in assuming that if you polled the people who were waiting in kiosk lines trying to make or change FP+ reservations, you'd get more than 10% of them living in Bitter Town. And if you could locate and poll all the people who booked their FP+s 60 days in advance, got everything they wanted, and managed to book 3 more FPs while they were in the park, you'd probably find far more than 51% "liking" it. So it goes.

 

[Shaden]

Shaden,
I don't beat around the bush. I'll openly call FP- what it was. It was a scantily used system that benefitted someone who took the time to learn it extensively-- at the expense of those who did not.

That is the common thread among dislikers of FP+ right? Under FP-, we could pull tickets all day long, never waiting to ride. Now, we cannot.

You know as well as I do, that it only worked that way, because most people did not use it. That is WHY there was so much available. If everyone used it, we'd have... oh yea... FP+. There would be nothing available by midday.

I can point out why I liked FP-. Because it got me, specifically, on rides faster than most guests.

So you cannot w a straight face come out here and talk about how you're all upset and worried about the "newbie user" not understanding or using FP+ and losing interest in Disney World.

Which system do you prefer. Really.

* A system in which all guests get to ride equal.
* A system in which you get to ride headliners more than most.

Be honest.

The more people that don't understand FP+, the more like FP- it is. The "problem" with that is FP+ is so much easier to understand and use that everyone is doing it. When everyone is super, no one is super.

So don't call me out for asserting that the guests who "lost" the most by the transition from FP- to FP+ were the "sliver" of guests (which included most people on the Dis). It is. That is why the sentiment out here was so negative. We were the ones who got the benefit out of FP-, and that system was taken away.

But in time, many of the Dis'ers have found that FP+ can indeed work for them in practice, despite originally thinking it would be a disaster.

A scantily used system that only benefited the people who took the time to learn it, extensively.

Didn't I hear that about half the people used to use FP- ??? Only half the people are currently using MBs ... are MBs scantily used ?

The first time we arrived in WDW we had done no research, I was not a member of these boards, nothing. It was our Disneymoon. We FP'd the hell out of stuff. No research, no need to extensively learn anything, VERY simple.

Oh look, the line is long here, but I'd like to ride it. Pick up a Fast pass for it and go over to that other line right there that is shorter, then pop back over here to ride it without a line.

There is your learning curve.

FP+ on the other hand, quite more involved, and penalizes people more if they do not use it due to the increased wait times on secondary rides.

I am not worried about the newbie user, not particularly at least, though I would think that the overall impact of FP+ would be negative on them as well. It was for at least a couple of the families I know.

FP- didn't just get me on rides faster, it allowed me to go with the flow more (without being at a disadvantage compared to other guests), it didn't require the pre-planning, it didn't require us criss-crossing the parks, it didn't increase the SB wait times on the non-majors, it was a more enjoyable experience, less stressful, less regimented.

Your assertion was that its only a sliver of guests who dislike FP+, its not, there are plenty of them out there, likewise your assertion that only a sliver of guests lost something with FP+ is also wrong, this has changed the parks for everyone, even people who didn't use FP- and don't use FP+.

Its not a matter of "working" for me ... A Porsche and a Mazda 3 will both get me to work. But when I have been paying for a Porsche and you replace it with a Mazda 3 and jack up the price a bit, you're damn right I am not going to be happy.

Your argument rests on 2 principles "Only the people who used to make the most of the FP- system are negative/angry about the new system" - absolutely false ... "The System works because its still -possible- to get lots done" - True but absolutely missing the point. You can also dig a 10 foot deep hole with a Backhoe or a small garden hand shovel. That doesn't make them the same and doesn't make the small garden hand shovel a "success" because they can both end in the same result.

 

[flicx]

To say fast pass plus is easier to use than legacy is just plain silly. Come on man!

 

[SeanTomorrow]

Seems to me a fundamental problem that WDW ride capacity is constrained, therefore rides are a zero sum game. If some people ride more, it mathematically means others ride less (at full capacity). Fastpass can only ever minimize wait time and redistribute rides from the top riders to the rest of the visiting population. But it can't help EVERYONE do more.

The kinds of thing Disney can do to let EVERYONE experience more are things like:
- Fill up all rides (no empty seats)
- Speed up flow of rides (basic ops stuff like making loading more efficient)
- Extend park hours
- Add more attractions
- Reduce attendance (same # of seats divided over fewer people)

I mean, this is no solution for world peace among the FP debate crowd. But it struck me that for an individual person less waits = more rides. But for the entire population, that just doesn't hold. FP can reduce wait times, but can't increase capacity.

 

[WillAustin]

I mean, this is no solution for world peace among the FP debate crowd. But it struck me that for an individual person less waits = more rides. But for the entire population, that just doesn't hold. FP can reduce wait times, but can't increase capacity.

I think the argument would be that they try to make it a little better for everyone in small ways while only hurting the experience of a few. Sounds almost political.

 

[DisneyKidds]

To say fast pass plus is easier to use than legacy is just plain silly. Come on man!

Eh......

I guess it depends on the person and what they find "easy", but for many with either system some amount of work has always been required.

IMHO FP- required more planning in terms of having a touring plan. There were myriad plans out there. Hit this or that park at opening, hit this ride, then that ride, then the next ride.....in a particular order, until the lines caught up with you. Determine which of those rides would be FP- versus SB, send runner for FP-, cross-cross park to use FP when the windows opened. Maybe everyone didn't tour that way, but many a uber-user did. It was like Eisenhower planning the assault on Normandy! Now with FP+ it requires some more planning up front in terms of making ride reservations, but the assault strategy becomes somewhat less crucial and we find there is far less FP running and park criss-crossing.

Personally, I've found FP+ to be a breeze to use. Yes, in park the app has glitched a few times, but other than that everything has worked as advertised, and I've had no trouble reserving all the FP+s I've wanted, at the times I've wanted them, during the busiest times of the year. So, no......I don't really find FP+ to be any harder to use, just different.

 

[SeanTomorrow]

Sounds almost political.

That would explain the passion! There are a lot of similar concepts involved (how benefits should be distributed, "size of the pie", super-riders vs the common-man/woman, "fair-share" of rides).

This could get even messier....so here's a butterfly :

 

[JimmyV]

IMHO FP- required more planning in terms of having a touring plan.

But you're thinking like a Dis'er here. What percentage of people walk through the turnstiles with a "touring plan"? 2%? 5%? Look at this from the perspective of a family of 5 who is new to all of this, rents a time share from the secondary market or stays at one of the many resorts off site that just got named a Top Family Resort Nationwide by TripAdvisor in the Orlando area. That family was not bombarded by emails reminding them to "lock in" their FPs. They enter the gates with no FPs pre-booked. Is FP+ easier for them to use? Does it improve their day more than FP-? What is their opinion when they go to a kiosk and can't get any headliners? Know what? I just described a demographic that dwarfs the Dis Board uber planners. 1,300 people responded to the Dis poll over a span of more than a week. That is the number of people who ride 7DMT in about an hour.

 

[flicx]

Eh......

I guess it depends on the person and what they find "easy", but for many with either system some amount of work has always been required.

IMHO FP- required more planning in terms of having a touring plan. There were myriad plans out there. Hit this or that park at opening, hit this ride, then that ride, then the next ride.....in a particular order, until the lines caught up with you. Determine which of those rides would be FP- versus SB, send runner for FP-, cross-cross park to use FP when the windows opened. Maybe everyone didn't tour that way, but many a uber-user did. It was like Eisenhower planning the assault on Normandy! Now with FP+ it requires some more planning up front in terms of making ride reservations, but the assault strategy becomes somewhat less crucial and we find there is far less FP running and park criss-crossing.

Personally, I've found FP+ to be a breeze to use. Yes, in park the app has glitched a few times, but other than that everything has worked as advertised, and I've had no trouble reserving all the FP+s I've wanted, at the times I've wanted them, during the busiest times of the year. So, no......I don't really find FP+ to be any harder to use, just different.

Insert ticket take return time slip, that's it. No computers,Iphones ,apps etc. No 60 days ,30 days etc. Still need a runner with the new system if you want a 4th or more fast pass. No argument, legacy was easier to learn to use, required far less planning and everyone had an equal chance to get there early and grab one, didn't matter if you were onsite, offsite or an annual passholder.

 

[Laketravis]

This FB poll was conducted in January, a month with historically low crowd level days and ample opportunity for additional FP's into the evening hours.

I wonder how different the results might have been if it had been conducted in July, when kiosks run out of most desirable FP's by noon?


.

 

[Suvadoo]

This FB poll was conducted in January, a month with historically low crowd level days and ample opportunity for additional FP's into the evening hours.

I wonder how different the results might have been if it had been conducted in July, when kiosks run out of most desirable FP's by noon?


.

Interesting question. I also think it's interesting that the poll was worded in such a way to assure that very few posters would respond that they "hate" FP+. Hate is such a strong word. What if they had used the word dislike instead of hate?

 

[Laketravis]

Interesting question. I also think it's interesting that the poll was worded in such a way to assure that very few posters would respond that they "hate" FP+. Hate is such a strong word. What if they had used the word dislike instead of hate?

You know what? You just made me realize something.

Why was the question "Do you LIKE" and not "Do you LOVE" when the other question was, in fact "Do you HATE" ?????

If you are going to use the word HATE at one end of the spectrum, why wasn't LOVE at the other?

I'm pretty sure I know the answer.

 

[soupy11]

Haven't experienced FP+ yet, but am thoroughly entertained by the tight loyalty each "side" has towards their opinion.

I also love PC VS. Mac debates!

 

[Suvadoo]

You know what? You just made me realize something.

Why was the question "Do you LIKE" and not "Do you LOVE" when the other question was, in fact "Do you HATE" ?????

If you are going to use the word HATE at one end of the spectrum, why wasn't LOVE at the other?

I'm pretty sure I know the answer.

Could it be for the same reason that a Disney FP+ survey allows guests to choose: 1.Spectacularly Marvelous
2.Quite Marvelous 3.Marvelous about their FP+ experience?

 

[Laketravis]

Could it be for the same reason that a Disney FP+ survey allows guests to choose: 1.Spectacularly Marvelous
2.Quite Marvelous 3.Marvelous about their FP+ experience?

Well, I think it goes back to what JimmyV originally posted:

"Pete expressed "surprise" over the "big minority" of people who say that they "do not like" the new system".

I also watched the podcast and heard him ask that people "please" post their positive responses.

My understanding is that Pete founded DISboards.com, and then later founded Dreams Unlimited travel. I could certainly understand how it would not be desirable for one to contain negative reviews about a destination the other promotes packages for. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with that, but from a business perspective it makes sense why I would want more people to express positive views and reviews and it's a completely legitimate reason. I'd make the same request to those who "liked" something as opposed to those who "hated" something - please post more!

 

[MrInfinity]

But you're thinking like a Dis'er here. What percentage of people walk through the turnstiles with a "touring plan"? 2%? 5%?

Jimmy, you're exactly right, and you counter Shaden's post above. Yes. Only 2% or 5% (you pick) came with a plan and as a result got much use out of FP-. Now, everyone with a phone or a computer and who knows enough to post on facebook is picking 3 fast passes. What is the number 50%? I don't know... it was quoted in that report from Rasulo. But so many more ppl are using FP+.

Look at this from the perspective of a family of 5 who is new to all of this, rents a time share from the secondary market or stays at one of the many resorts off site that just got named a Top Family Resort Nationwide by TripAdvisor in the Orlando area. That family was not bombarded by emails reminding them to "lock in" their FPs. They enter the gates with no FPs pre-booked. Is FP+ easier for them to use? Does it improve their day more than FP-? What is their opinion when they go to a kiosk and can't get any headliners?

You are describing the guest who did not use FP-. They just showed up w no idea, and went on rides. See a ride? Get in line. This is how most people tour. Only those who learned what FP- was optimally used it, which is why we (you, I, others) could pull massive amounts of tickets. I would get back to the hotel with my pockets full of them!

Now, all those regular old guests w no knowledge but their phone are queuing up a 1st ride before we can get a 2nd. Thus by the time we want a 3rd, they're all gone.

 

[JimmyV]

You are describing the guest who did not use FP-. They just showed up w no idea, and went on rides. See a ride? Get in line. This is how most people tour. Only those who learned what FP- was optimally used it, which is why we (you, I, others) could pull massive amounts of tickets. I would get back to the hotel with my pockets full of them!

I agree with all of that which brings me back to where another thread began. (The "Have you changed your mind" thread). FP+ is just another way to create a different breed of super-user. The family I described in the earlier post probably didn't benefit from FP-, and they certainly aren't benefiting from FP+. But the critical difference is, if they have an in-the-park epiphany about using either system, they could actually derive some benefit from FP-, but very little if any from FP+. Why? Because other than TSMM, FP- was available for every single ride up to about 2:00-3:00 p.m., and many later than that. Yes, I have seen posts such as the one above where a poster said that no matter how early she arrived, she could never get a FP. You and I both know that that is not true. Soarin' was never gone before lunch. Nor was Test Track. So the "rookie" family that stumbled upon FP- could actually use it. The "rookie" family that stumbles upon FP+ is not getting a Soarin' FP, or a Test Track FP, or a 7DMT FP, even if they make their discovery at 10:00 a.m., unless they are visiting on a "2" or "3" day, which moots most of this discussion.

What's it all mean? Not sure. But we have a poll of 1,300 anal retentive Disney planners and 51% like it, 39% don't currently like it, but have not given up hope, and 10% think it is the devil incarnate. Ask a different set of 1,300 people who used it yesterday and who each got 10 FPs, and the numbers would be 95%-5% in favor. Ask 1,300 people who visited on 12/27 and who did not think to make advance reservations and who waited in 45 minute kiosk lines to get FPs for non-headliners and it would be 5%-95% against. In he end, super-users are going to figure this out and love it. Is that the litmus test? Luddites are going to never figure it out and hate it. Is that the litmus test?