Major Policy Change in DVC/DCL Trade Policy UPDATE ON POST #193

[Petraman]

We came back from Disney last night,and on the DVC tour they told us that we could go on a 5 day cruise inJuly family of 4 in2011 for 260 points total.Now reading the threads the whole sales pitch sounds wrong.We are debating wether are not to join. They also stated that the point values for the resorts and cruises havent changed in 15years and will be the same for ever is this true

It is true about the points not changing but it may not actually be true depending on what you thought you heard.
Here is kind of a rough sketch of the situation. If you take the cruise or if you take a particular resort, you then total up all the required points it uses for all the different seasons, weekdays, weekends, etc, then yes the total pointsfor ALL the different ways to rent will not change. But that doesn't mean that the total points for you to book the 3rd week of December (just an example) will be exactly the same as it was last year... OR if you go Mon-Thu one year, then next year Mon-Thu can be different. What they do is each year they look at each season, weekdays, weekends, and then decide where they may need to raise the points to book there. But in order to raise the points on weekdays, they have to reduce the points to book somewhere else so that the total points in a year do not change. Does that make sense?
With the cruise line the points, they change pretty much every year as far as I can tell.
Example:
2010 Oct22 (Value Season) 7night Magic cruise for a Cat11 room was 317 points
2011 Oct23 (Value Season) 7night Magic cruise for a Cat11 will be 297-325 points. They broke the Cat into more types, then charged less for some and more for the others... thus keeping TOTAL points the same

The points to stay on weekdays has been sizably increased for the last 2 years while weekend rates have dropped.... some peak seasons have adjusted as well. I can honestly say that cruise points have changed

My wife and I are the people who go to Disney world every 5-7 years.We are no sure if we should join the DVC.What we are looking at are the other resort accomodations in Hawaii or outside of the Disney resort network. We tend to go on a vacation every year and wonder if this is worth joining.financially it is not an issue,and we also were looking into RCI which i know Disney partners with.

Don't make the same mistake that some of the rest of us have made, just view DVC as another timeshare company. Just like with any timeshare, the smart thing to do is only buy where you know you will go. The way DVC works you can bank last years points and borrow next year's points so if you don't plan to go every 3 years, you will not be able to use your points. Now if you are the type of timeshare owner who enjoys banking your weeks, renting your points, etc then you could always buy and do that. DVC has managed to retain its overall value so far so renting points seems to be easy to do... however, tomorrow may be different. Don't buy any timeshare that you won't be able to use, becasue you may or may not be able to recoup your investment in the years you don't use it. And remember, today RCI and Disney are partners, tomorrow may be different.... sa you have heard in this thread, that is a "perk" with DVC, not a legal obligation. They could end that relationship whenever they want.

Hope this made sense for you, it can be pretty overwhelming. I can tell you if you bought DVC you would probably enjoy it, but based on what you are decribing, it may not be the best choice for you. It really depends on you.

 

[Sammie]

You know, I've read this at least 5 times and am really not sure what you are trying to say.

I am saying if anyone expected more from Disney than other timeshares, if some bought with "pixie dust" in their eyes, it was because DVC was selling "pixie dust".

From the DVC website:

Discover the Disney Difference in Vacation Ownership

What sets Disney Vacation Club apart from other vacation ownership programs? We call it the Disney Difference.

It's the heritage, tradition and values that began with Walt himself, carried forth to the present.

The Disney Heritage
Disney Vacation Club embodies the values that Walt instilled when he first conceived of a magical land.

I expected them to tell the truth, I guess you saw them for what they truly are, just another timeshare hiding behind near truths. When we bought in they practiced what they preached, I do not find that to be true today.

Maybe its a difference of when you bought in. Or as many us believe the focus with DVC has changed from one of values and tradition, honesty and heritage to one of sale at any cost.

 

[Petraman]

Sammie Sammie Sammie....

There you go again reading their brochure instead spending that ime with a magnifying glass and legal counsel figuring out what was really being said in the POS

What were you thinking?


No joke Sammie, I was actually over at the disneyvacationclub.disney.go.com site while you were writing your post. No joke, man that is too funny. If any of you folks who are a little frustrated with DVC right now need a little humorous uplift, you really have to go over there and just read. You just have to laugh.
Pay close attention to the "How Membership Works" section
They let us all know that for only 102 points we can book 3 nights at GCV in May 2010... forgot to mention same room now in 2011 is now 117. hehe...
For only 194 points you can have a 4 night Bahamian cruise... of course we all know by now that it doesn't matter how many points you own, you can't book that cruise in 2011 at all now. hehe..

And of course the "What Membership Costs" section is riot as well. Did you know with only owning 160 pts, you can book a 1BR AKV Savannah view in May? Well, you could in May 2010... but not in 2011 thanks to the point reallocation... now only 1 year later, you don't have enough points. hehe...

C'mon guys, you gotta laugh!

And I didn't even mention the ever entertaining "Flexibilty & Choice" section, you definitely have to peruse that one... it's great!

 

[Sammie]

Sammie Sammie Sammie....

There you go again reading their brochure instead spending that ime with a magnifying glass and legal counsel figuring out what was really being said in the POS

What were you thinking?

I really need to get rid of these rose colored glasses don't I. Oh well it was nice while it lasted. I guess nothing good last forever. We got enough good years out of ours, we can honestly walk away from it and nothing lost.

I just hate it for those just buying in, they truly do not know how great it was before.

I do wonder when we will be told this change was based on member feedback.

 

[cruiseletters]

Well back to the problem of no availability on DCL. I find it interesting that they took away our option to cruise Alaska with Holland America on points so that if we wanted to use points to cruise we would be forced into reserving space through DCL on the wonder and now they have discontinued that option. Maybe while were writing in to voice our opinion about this situation we need to point out that they need other cruise line options if they are going to continue to shut us out of DCL. They probably wouldn't want to do that because they still want everything kept in house instead of what is best for overall membership satisfaction.

 

[Sammie]

Well back to the problem of no availability on DCL. I find it interesting that they took away our option to cruise Alaska with Holland America on points so that if we wanted to use points to cruise we would be forced into reserving space through DCL on the wonder and now they have discontinued that option. Maybe while were writing in to voice our opinion about this situation we need to point out that they need other cruise line options if they are going to continue to shut us out of DCL. They probably wouldn't want to do that because they still want everything kept in house instead of what is best for overall membership satisfaction.

Good point and I found it interesting in reading the website, that use of the DCL is listed as a "special vacation."
Quote:
"Let's say you want to take the family on a really special vacation, like a 7-night cruise aboard Disney Cruise Line."

 

[Petraman]

Good observation Cruiseletters. Hey, let's give Disney and DVC the benefit of the doubt for a moment. Maybe there simply was no other option than to suspend this perk. But you make a great point... now what is Disney willing to do in order to try and make it up to us? They don't "have to" do anything, but it would sure be nice to see them treat DVC owners the same way they treat guests at MK.... do what you can to make the customer happy. How about offering a new cruise perk? Good idea ... how about offering to return people who are stuck not being able to go on their scheduled cruise, but now not being able to use those pooints for another one. Return those points to their accounts as normal status instead of reservation status

Be interesting to see if they make some effort. We can always hope

 

[tjkraz]

When we bought in they practiced what they preached, I do not find that to be true today.

That's probably where our difference of opinion differs the most. All of the faults you seem to loathe today stretch back at least as far as my 8-9 year exposure to DVC. Not staying that it's right or wrong, just that it is what it is and it's been that way for as long as I can remember.

 

[Sammie]

That's probably where our difference of opinion differs the most. All of the faults you seem to loathe today stretch back at least as far as my 8-9 year exposure to DVC. Not staying that it's right or wrong, just that it is what it is and it's been that way for as long as I can remember.

TJ, TJ, TJ, loathe is such a strong work, believe me DVC has never upset me enough to "loathe" them. Disappoint, Yes, Loathe, never.

And yes our most plesant DVC experiences were prior to 9 years.

 

[tjkraz]

And yes our most plesant DVC experiences were prior to 9 years.

Guess it's been a long, slow spiral then since JL has only been on the job since '04.

 

[Petraman]

That's probably where our difference of opinion differs the most. All of the faults you seem to loathe today stretch back at least as far as my 8-9 year exposure to DVC. Not staying that it's right or wrong, just that it is what it is and it's been that way for as long as I can remember.

tj, makes you wonder sometimes if we were allowed to "test drive" DVC or "lease with an option to buy" how many people might think twice after they realized that a great sales pitch does not a great investment make.

I probably would have still bought if I had known all I know now, but I definitely would have approached it differently and much more cautiously.

 

[NewDCLGuy]

I'm sorry some of you guys aren't happy. But to me, the base product is 95% the same as it's always been.

Except now we have more choices, including a monorail resort , a DLR respert and soon to be Hawaii. We have free Internet, nice new TV's and access to the dining plans. And if the downside is that it's hard to book a DCL cruise to Alaska on points, it just doesn't seem that big a downfall.

Something about message boards brings out the doom and gloom in people. When you feel that way, take a trip to Disney. Set on your balcony, soak it all in , and ask if it's really all that bad. If it is, time to sell.

 

[gkrykewy]

If you take the cruise or if you take a particular resort, you then total up all the required points it uses for all the different seasons, weekdays, weekends, etc, then yes the total pointsfor ALL the different ways to rent will not change.

Just FYI, this is not entirely correct. While the 'total annual combined point cost' is guaranteed to remain the same for DVC resorts, it does not remain the same for cruises. Cruises are an exchange trip, and anything outside DVC proper is subject to change annually or periodically.

 

[JOANNEL]

I wonder is any one here is a lawyer and could scare Disney with some kind of lawsuit!!

 

[JOANNEL]

Well I am PO'd at DCL/DVC. We cannot pay off our Alaska cruise with points. Their allotted number of cabins for our sailing is full. She would not tell me how many rooms were allotted, it changes by sailing. They are so full of S*&^. They just want to make more money. We bought in specifically for cruising and now we can't use our points. I am sorry I ever recommended DVC to any one. We live in Florida so we don't use our points at the resorts, but thought it would be nice to cruise every other year and have paid for it in our younger years.

I have never been so disappointed in Disney before. Makes me want to cancel all our cruises and sell DVC and go on Princess!!! They are really screwing with the wrong set of guests. Being in the hospitality business you want to keep your repeat guests happy. They are the ones that keep you afloat in tough times!!

 

[Brian Noble]

With all due respect, buying primarily to cruise was probably unwise. However, you can still "use" your points to cruise---rent them out and use the proceeds to pay for the cruise of your choice. DCL will always accept cash, and you will probably find that you need to rent out fewer points than would be required to book "directly".

 

[cruiseletters]

I'm sorry some of you guys aren't happy. But to me, the base product is 95% the same as it's always been.

Except now we have more choices, including a monorail resort , a DLR respert and soon to be Hawaii. We have free Internet, nice new TV's and access to the dining plans. And if the downside is that it's hard to book a DCL cruise to Alaska on points, it just doesn't seem that big a downfall.

Something about message boards brings out the doom and gloom in people. When you feel that way, take a trip to Disney. Set on your balcony, soak it all in , and ask if it's really all that bad. If it is, time to sell.

I don't think anyone is dissatisfied with the resort situation, but DVC does definately market their product with the outside resort options upper most, hence the sales office and presentation on every DCL cruise. They may under their breath whisper that the DCL is a trade out but at their presentations on board its a shout out that this is virtually another Disney Resort option for your family. That's the reason for frustration. If I wanted to trade out for hotels instead of DCL and was coming up empty I would be just as frustrated because though they maybe technically correct that they offer it, morally they are wrong, you need to stop marketing your product that way when you know you can't follow through. I''m going to be on the ship in 14 days, I will definately be at one of their meetings do you think they will mention what is currently going on with their DCL options to the roomful of potentials?

 

[JOANNEL]

With all due respect, buying primarily to cruise was probably unwise. However, you can still "use" your points to cruise---rent them out and use the proceeds to pay for the cruise of your choice. DCL will always accept cash, and you will probably find that you need to rent out fewer points than would be required to book "directly".

I understand that cruising is not the smartest way to use our points but that is the reason we bought in. Directed by the what the sales team told us. Wanted to buy future vacations when we had the cash in our younger years to vacation in our 60's!! Just like slimy car salespeople DVC can now be added to that list!!

 

[tlynk]

I understand that cruising is not the smartest way to use our points but that is the reason we bought in. Directed by the what the sales team told us. Wanted to buy future vacations when we had the cash in our younger years to vacation in our 60's!! Just like slimy car salespeople DVC can now be added to that list!!

I was just on a Disney Cruise and attended a DVC meeting. This is one of the reasons I was able to convince DH to let me buy into a DVC in the near future. Maybe I should reconsider my decision?

 

[JOANNEL]

I was just on a Disney Cruise and attended a DVC meeting. This is one of the reasons I was able to convince DH to let me buy into a DVC in the near future. Maybe I should reconsider my decision?

I would unless the rules change. I feel like I have been scammed.


Does any one know Jim Lewis's email address?