Looking to purchase resale...are any of these good deals?

mmackeymouse

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I've been planning to purchase resale for a while. I'm in a good position to be able to purchase now, and I am hoping that between re-sales and ROFR, now is a good time to pull the trigger. I've spent all weekend looking at listings and crunching numbers. And things are starting to get all jumbled up as far as value. I don't think numbers are as low as they could be, I don't want to wait too long and lose out on a deal.

Here are some of the details on listings I am looking at. Could you let me know which you think are the most valuable, which one you would go for, and what your offer would be for them?

AKV- 100 points. $117/pp OR. 160 points. $100/pp.

Aulani- 160 points $99/pp.

BLT- 91 points. $160/pp

BWV- 125 points. $135/pp

VGF- 100 points. $158/pp

OKW extended 130 points. $112/pp

Poly- 100 points $140/pp

SSR 150 points. $94/pp OR. 120 points. $110/pp


Are any of these good deals? Should I put an offer in?
 
This is quite a spread you've got. Where do you actually want to stay? With tightening availability, owning where you want to stay most often is more important than ever.

Will you travel to Hawaii at least 2 out of every 3 years? If no, take Aulani out of your considerations.
 
Need more info. Contract size and price are fine, but are they stripped or loaded or just in the middle?

Buy where you want to stay. You've listed a lot of resorts there. Do not count on 7 month booking, especially in the next 3 years.
 
Glad to hear you're thinking about getting into DVC. I want to urge some caution, however, since it appears you're looking most of the properties, including Aulani. I suggest you narrow down your search.

You will hear all sorts of different advice as to how to pick what to buy. Some advocate buying where you want to stay. Others advocate for buying the least expensive, with "least expensive" being defined as either the initial purchase price or calculated on a best guess as to what the expected costs over the lifetime of the contract will be. These issues and analysis can be found on these boards. Some even have run complicated and impressive spreadsheets.

My suggestion, and take it with a stiff handful of salt, is as follows: Find contracts with banked points where you want to stay and make low offers ($10-15 below ask) until you find a taker. Ignore the realtor telling you its either not going to pass ROFR, won't be accepted, or otherwise tries to make you feel bad. Once you find where you want to stay and that you want to buy DVC (an emotional decision), treat the purchase process itself as a business decision.

Good luck!

Eric
 

I've been planning to purchase resale for a while. I'm in a good position to be able to purchase now, and I am hoping that between re-sales and ROFR, now is a good time to pull the trigger. I've spent all weekend looking at listings and crunching numbers. And things are starting to get all jumbled up as far as value. I don't think numbers are as low as they could be, I don't want to wait too long and lose out on a deal.

Here are some of the details on listings I am looking at. Could you let me know which you think are the most valuable, which one you would go for, and what your offer would be for them?

AKV- 100 points. $117/pp OR. 160 points. $100/pp.

Aulani- 160 points $99/pp.

BLT- 91 points. $160/pp

BWV- 125 points. $135/pp

VGF- 100 points. $158/pp

OKW extended 130 points. $112/pp

Poly- 100 points $140/pp

SSR 150 points. $94/pp OR. 120 points. $110/pp


Are any of these good deals? Should I put an offer in?
What is your goal? in 2021 91 Bay Lake Tower points won't be enough to stay a week, even in a studio, ever. 160 AKL points OTOH will get you a week in a 1BR Standard View in low season or 10 days in a Savannah View studio most of the year. So "is it a good deal" depends on your plans.

That Boardwalk one is not a good deal right now no matter your goals. Nor is the 120 point SSR one.
 
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This is quite a spread you've got. Where do you actually want to stay? With tightening availability, owning where you want to stay most often is more important than ever.

Will you travel to Hawaii at least 2 out of every 3 years? If no, take Aulani out of your considerations.

Yeah, that was the biggest drawback with Aulani. If the 7 month window falls through, having Aulani as a backup isn't really feasible.

That said, my thought process was that we do want to do Aulani eventually, and if we do, it will be a big family vacation, probably a Grand Villa. In order to have a chance at availability, I felt like that was the best option. And, if we did a Grand Villa at Aulani in cash, it's almost as much as buying an Aulani contract anyway. That's why I had it in the running.
 
What I would do is decide where you want to own. If there are a few, then narrow it down,

After that, decide when you want to go, and how often. Try to find a UY that starts just before typical travel so you maximize your ability to use or bank points if something happens to cancel the trip, including resorts being closed,

Once you have that, then use the ROFR thread here to get a general idea of what people are paying for contracts, Asking prices are just that...asking,

The contract I am selling for BWV just passed at 115.5. I think anything above $120 is too much in today’s market.

However, as a buyer, it is really up to you. If you find exactly what you want, it may not be worth waiting out for a perfect price. DVC is long term. If you pay an extra thousand or so now, it doesn’t amount to much long term.

If you Really don’t care where you stay, SSR is a pretty great and economical one to purchase
 
I've been planning to purchase resale for a while. I'm in a good position to be able to purchase now, and I am hoping that between re-sales and ROFR, now is a good time to pull the trigger. I've spent all weekend looking at listings and crunching numbers. And things are starting to get all jumbled up as far as value. I don't think numbers are as low as they could be, I don't want to wait too long and lose out on a deal.

Here are some of the details on listings I am looking at. Could you let me know which you think are the most valuable, which one you would go for, and what your offer would be for them?

AKV- 100 points. $117/pp OR. 160 points. $100/pp.

Aulani- 160 points $99/pp.

BLT- 91 points. $160/pp

BWV- 125 points. $135/pp

VGF- 100 points. $158/pp

OKW extended 130 points. $112/pp

Poly- 100 points $140/pp

SSR 150 points. $94/pp OR. 120 points. $110/pp


Are any of these good deals? Should I put an offer in?
This is said with the best of intentions, so please forgive anything that comes across harsher than intended. Your post contains a bunch of red flags that would lead me to recommend none of the above contracts. You said that you spent all weekend crunching numbers and that things are starting to get all jumbled up. This points to deficiencies in your analysis. If you accounted for all the variables then a weekend of analysis should lead to clarity, not confusion. It also sounds like this is a pretty big FOMO buy. Relax. Breathe. Take your time. You're not missing out on anything and if anything deals will likely get better in the upcoming months, not worse.

That aside, it is impossible to answer the question as presented. Without knowing use years or point statuses, it is impossible to value these contracts properly. Maybe you factored those variables into your analysis and simply didn't include that info here. But without that data, it is impossible to say what I feel the contract is worth.

I'm guessing the replies you are receiving on this thread are probably not what you expected and I'm sure that is disappointing. I'm sorry about that and I'm sorry to be contributing to that. But hopefully you take what you're reading here to heart and reexamine your process a bit. Good luck! :)
 
Need more info. Contract size and price are fine, but are they stripped or loaded or just in the middle?

Buy where you want to stay. You've listed a lot of resorts there. Do not count on 7 month booking, especially in the next 3 years.

The problem I have with "Buy where you want to stay" is twofold.

If this were the case, I would choose BWV hands down. That's where we love to be. But, the practical side of me knows that there is only 22 years left on the contract, and studios are notoriously difficult to get, even for BWV owners. So, my head and my heart are sort of at odds. I feel like if I buy points at a longer-contracted resort, I could bank and/or borrow, and get into a 1 or 2 BR at the BWV.

Secondly, the issue with "buy where you want to stay" is we want to stay everywhere. We want to sample resorts. We want to try them all. Some owners are very loyal and want to only ever stay at their resort. And, that's perfectly fine. We would rather have a more Around the World approach.
 
The problem I have with "Buy where you want to stay" is twofold.

If this were the case, I would choose BWV hands down. That's where we love to be. But, the practical side of me knows that there is only 22 years left on the contract, and studios are notoriously difficult to get, even for BWV owners. So, my head and my heart are sort of at odds. I feel like if I buy points at a longer-contracted resort, I could bank and/or borrow, and get into a 1 or 2 BR at the BWV.

Secondly, the issue with "buy where you want to stay" is we want to stay everywhere. We want to sample resorts. We want to try them all. Some owners are very loyal and want to only ever stay at their resort. And, that's perfectly fine. We would rather have a more Around the World approach.

Maybe instead of where you want to stay where you don’t mind staying when you can’t trade.

Be aware that all 2 bedrooms at BWV are lock offs, That means when studios are gone, so are those,

Also be aware that due to the closing, there is a temporary change in borrowing, in which you can only borrow 50% of your points,

We don’t know how long this will last, but keep that in mind.
 
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studios are notoriously difficult to get, even for BWV owners

I think you're working off a bad assumption right there. Standard studios are hard to get. Pool/Garden can be booked by owners without much bother at 11 months, with only a few dates of the year that stand as potential exception cases.

I feel like if I buy points at a longer-contracted resort, I could bank and/or borrow, and get into a 1 or 2 BR at the BWV.

And this is your second bad assumption. While at many resorts a 2BR may be available at 7 months, every 2BR at BWV is a lock-off. Which means that if you're thinking studios are impossible... so are 2BRs, because once every studio is gone, every 2BR is also gone.

We want to sample resorts. We want to try them all. Some owners are very loyal and want to only ever stay at their resort. And, that's perfectly fine. We would rather have a more Around the World approach.

I think you should adjust a bit of your expectation around 7 month booking. If forced to stay at your home resort frequently, would you be unhappy? Are you willing to book at 11 months to get your dates and spin the wheel at 7 to see what you can get? If the answers here are that you'd be unhappy at "home" or that you're not booking at 11 months, DVC may be a poor product for you, or the resort you're buying may be a bad choice.

If you're after trying to switch, I think you do need to immediately discard Aulani.
 
The problem I have with "Buy where you want to stay" is twofold.

If this were the case, I would choose BWV hands down. That's where we love to be. But, the practical side of me knows that there is only 22 years left on the contract, and studios are notoriously difficult to get, even for BWV owners. So, my head and my heart are sort of at odds. I feel like if I buy points at a longer-contracted resort, I could bank and/or borrow, and get into a 1 or 2 BR at the BWV.

Secondly, the issue with "buy where you want to stay" is we want to stay everywhere. We want to sample resorts. We want to try them all. Some owners are very loyal and want to only ever stay at their resort. And, that's perfectly fine. We would rather have a more Around the World approach.
You should 100% buy at Boardwalk if that’s where you’d want to stay the most.

It is incorrect to say that Studios are hard to book even for owners. It is correct to say that Standard View studios are hard to book for owners. But BWV’s points chart is so generous that a garden or pool view is still as few or fewer points than a studio at any of the newer resorts. Those are hard to get in the fall Even for owners but not most of the year.

Buying Aulani based on your plans you’ve laid out is probably something you should avoid!
 
I havent stayed at any property. However we have a contract going through ROFR right now for BLT. We decided on BLT because we have two little ones and felt with the monorail and close proximity to MK it was the best starter "home" for us. Not sure what that contract holds that you listed but the one we signed for is for 120 points, September UY(we plan on doing most travel between oct-march) 94 banked points for 19(banked from 18), 240 points for 2020(all of 19 were banked into 20). Asking was $150 we offered $140 and they accepted in a day.
 
Glad to hear you're thinking about getting into DVC. I want to urge some caution, however, since it appears you're looking most of the properties, including Aulani. I suggest you narrow down your search.

You will hear all sorts of different advice as to how to pick what to buy. Some advocate buying where you want to stay. Others advocate for buying the least expensive, with "least expensive" being defined as either the initial purchase price or calculated on a best guess as to what the expected costs over the lifetime of the contract will be. These issues and analysis can be found on these boards. Some even have run complicated and impressive spreadsheets.

My suggestion, and take it with a stiff handful of salt, is as follows: Find contracts with banked points where you want to stay and make low offers ($10-15 below ask) until you find a taker. Ignore the realtor telling you its either not going to pass ROFR, won't be accepted, or otherwise tries to make you feel bad. Once you find where you want to stay and that you want to buy DVC (an emotional decision), treat the purchase process itself as a business decision.

Good luck!

Eric

Oh, I've done the spreadsheets. Haha. Many of them.

As far as the ones I listed, they all either have points now, or will be having points coming later this year or early 2021....so before we would need to use them. I didn't see any stripped contracts that I was crazy about.

Thanks for giving me a general price range to try to negotiate.





What is your goal? in 2021 91 Bay Lake Tower points won't be enough to stay a week, even in a studio, ever. 160 AKL points OTOH will get you a week in a 1BR Standard View in low season or 10 days in a Savannah View studio most of the year. So "is it a good deal" depends on your plans.

That Boardwalk one is not a good deal right now no matter your goals. Nor is the 120 point SSR one.


Oh yes, I am aware of all of that. It's not uncommon for us to do a short week combined with a cruise, though. And, it would be an every other year sort of thing, plus it gets me into the monorail loop for sort of the cheapest option. That's why we kept it in the running.

And, while I know they aren't necessarily good deals, I was thinking by making an offer, I could make good deals out of them. If that makes sense.

What I would do is decide where you want to own. If there are a few, then narrow it down,

After that, decide when you want to go, and how often. Try to find a UY that starts just before typical travel so you maximize your ability to use or bank points if something happens to cancel the trip, including resorts being closed,

Once you have that, then use the ROFR thread here to get a general idea of what people are paying for contracts, Asking prices are just that...asking,

The contract I am selling for BWV just passed at 115.5. I think anything above $120 is too much in today’s market.

However, as a buyer, it is really up to you. If you find exactly what you want, it may not be worth waiting out for a perfect price. DVC is long term. If you pay an extra thousand or so now, it doesn’t amount to much long term.

If you Really don’t care where you stay, SSR is a pretty great and economical one to purchase

I'll definitely check out that thread. Thanks! Believe it or not, this WAS the narrowed down list.

I keep seeing such low prices on these forums, and yet...when I get to the listings, I never find any that low.




This is said with the best of intentions, so please forgive anything that comes across harsher than intended. Your post contains a bunch of red flags that would lead me to recommend none of the above contracts. You said that you spent all weekend crunching numbers and that things are starting to get all jumbled up. This points to deficiencies in your analysis. If you accounted for all the variables then a weekend of analysis should lead to clarity, not confusion. It also sounds like this is a pretty big FOMO buy. Relax. Breathe. Take your time. You're not missing out on anything and if anything deals will likely get better in the upcoming months, not worse.

That aside, it is impossible to answer the question as presented. Without knowing use years or point statuses, it is impossible to value these contracts properly. Maybe you factored those variables into your analysis and simply didn't include that info here. But without that data, it is impossible to say what I feel the contract is worth.

I'm guessing the replies you are receiving on this thread are probably not what you expected and I'm sure that is disappointing. I'm sorry about that and I'm sorry to be contributing to that. But hopefully you take what you're reading here to heart and reexamine your process a bit. Good luck! :)

I don't take offense at all. But, I also know how I am. Yes, I am sure for most people it should provide clarity, but....I am an overthinker. I shop and re-shop and overthink everything. Everything. It's rare for me to have a "This is....the one" feeling about anything.

As far as FOMO....there is a bit of that yes, but there is also a bit of....this is the time. The last time I was on the market was about 5 or 6 years ago. I was pretty dead set on doing it. But, my Mom got sick, my sister got pregnant, then my Dad nearly died, then my sister got pregnant again....lol. Long story short, life happened, and other things occupied mind and time. Well, by the time I got back to looking at listings, prices had gone significantly up. And, I was really kicking myself for not following through. So, I definitely don't want that to happen again.
 
Honestly, I think narrowing down your resorts to one or two or three would be helpful. Prices have really only begun to drop and IMO the sheer number of contracts hitting the market in the past week hasn't shifted prices yet. The DVC news on borrowing that hit Friday also has not effected prices yet, but it will. Buyers often want to get what they paid for their contracts, and understandably so but the market doesn't work like that. They will come around when the offers aren't coming in...

I'm always watching the market and I do jump in and buy when I find the right deal. I can count on one hand the number that caught my eye recently, and actually none were my UY, so I'm just waiting. I'm not a poker player, but I think you have to have that mentality as it is really easy to let your emotions get the best of your wallet! Good luck!
 
Maybe instead of where you want to stay where you don’t mind staying when you can’t trade.

Be aware that all 2 bedrooms at BWV are lock offs, That means when studios are gone, so are those,

Also be aware that due to the closing, there is a temporary change in borrowing, in which you can only borrow 50% of your points,

We don’t know how long this will last, but keep that in mind.

Yes, I knew about the new rules. It probably won't really affect us a ton.

Yeah, that's the thing. I really wouldn't mind staying at any of them. We like SSR, but we don't want to get "stuck" there either. By stuck, I mean that every single vacation will be there. But, I don't know that we'd really want to be stuck anywhere, actually.

I think I knew that about BWV, but it slipped my mind. But, it could get us into a 2BR almost anywhere else, depending on the time of year.



You should 100% buy at Boardwalk if that’s where you’d want to stay the most.

I struggle with the idea that I would be paying almost or around the same as some of these other contracts for 22 years, instead of 35-40+ years.

If BWV was priced like a resort with only 22 years left....it would be a no-brainer.


I havent stayed at any property. However we have a contract going through ROFR right now for BLT. We decided on BLT because we have two little ones and felt with the monorail and close proximity to MK it was the best starter "home" for us. Not sure what that contract holds that you listed but the one we signed for is for 120 points, September UY(we plan on doing most travel between oct-march) 94 banked points for 19(banked from 18), 240 points for 2020(all of 19 were banked into 20). Asking was $150 we offered $140 and they accepted in a day.

Good luck!



Honestly, I think narrowing down your resorts to one or two or three would be helpful. Prices have really only begun to drop and IMO the sheer number of contracts hitting the market in the past week hasn't shifted prices yet. The DVC news on borrowing that hit Friday also has not effected prices yet, but it will. Buyers often want to get what they paid for their contracts, and understandably so but the market doesn't work like that. They will come around when the offers aren't coming in...

I'm always watching the market and I do jump in and buy when I find the right deal. I can count on one hand the number that caught my eye recently, and actually none were my UY, so I'm just waiting. I'm not a poker player, but I think you have to have that mentality as it is really easy to let your emotions get the best of your wallet! Good luck!

So, I guess if I were narrowing it down, I would say AKV, SSR, or VGF.

If I could get a fantastic deal at BWV or BLT, those aren't outside the realm of possibility.

Yeah, like I said in a previous comment, I was in the market before, life happened, and then by the time I was ready again, prices had jumped. I know it will be a sweet spot, to pick the right time to buy. I am afraid to wait too long, and prices will jump and DVC will hit hard with the ROFRs.

I saw a TON of VGF contracts, and weirdly enough, the prices held steady. Typically when the market is flooded with something, the price drops. I dunno...
 
When I am looking to add a contract, one of my number one concerns is the maintenance fees for that resort.

I just hate that huge chunk of cash that is due every year, and I am always paranoid about jumps in cost--like how they hiked up a bit in the last couple years.

So I look at the resorts with the lowest maintenance fees and pick my favorite one that seems affordable among them.
 
I struggle with the idea that I would be paying almost or around the same as some of these other contracts for 22 years, instead of 35-40+ years.

If BWV was priced like a resort with only 22 years left....it would be a no-brainer.
I would encourage you to price not in terms of $/point but instead in terms of $/night. Pick a week you’re likely to go and use the 2021 charts as your baseline. BWV’s chart requires so many fewer points than for example the monorail resorts that it’s modest discount on $/pt vs the monorail resorts becomes a fire sale on $/night.
 
Yes, I knew about the new rules. It probably won't really affect us a ton.

Yeah, that's the thing. I really wouldn't mind staying at any of them. We like SSR, but we don't want to get "stuck" there either. By stuck, I mean that every single vacation will be there. But, I don't know that we'd really want to be stuck anywhere, actually.

I think I knew that about BWV, but it slipped my mind. But, it could get us into a 2BR almost anywhere else, depending on the time of year.





I struggle with the idea that I would be paying almost or around the same as some of these other contracts for 22 years, instead of 35-40+ years.

If BWV was priced like a resort with only 22 years left....it would be a no-brainer.




Good luck!





So, I guess if I were narrowing it down, I would say AKV, SSR, or VGF.

If I could get a fantastic deal at BWV or BLT, those aren't outside the realm of possibility.

Yeah, like I said in a previous comment, I was in the market before, life happened, and then by the time I was ready again, prices had jumped. I know it will be a sweet spot, to pick the right time to buy. I am afraid to wait too long, and prices will jump and DVC will hit hard with the ROFRs.

I saw a TON of VGF contracts, and weirdly enough, the prices held steady. Typically when the market is flooded with something, the price drops. I dunno...

When you go will make a difference in terms of how easy or hard it will be to trade out? Length of time too,

You May need to do split stays. I will say 1 bedrooms do tend to be available at the near park resorts more often than other room sizes,

But, ultimately, you may not be able to trade to the exact resort you want to try for the trip you want to do that,

Given the closure, there is going to be more difficulty at 7 months at the popular resorts,

So, having to pick a home resort is part of it, and you do have to be okay that trading can be hard. It has gotten harder, other than summer, and be comfortable with where you own,
 















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