Laws regarding public breastfeeding

[lizabu]

Just saying.....

If it is okay for women to have boobs out in a public space and have some type of excuse for it then it should be ok for men to have their meat and 2 veggies out and about with some type of excuse. I understand you have children and are feeding them BUT please remember there ARE alternatives. From what I understand men get chafing and what not from being under wraps, so they can choose to let it loose. There are pros and alternatives to both things. Who's right is it to judge what body parts should be covered at certain times for certain reasons? Why is it ok for for a woman breastfeeding to have her boob out and about because she is breast feeding but not a woman just walking down the street? I know what's coming next "women dress with low cut cleavage baring clothes all the time, it's the same." Sorry, it isn't.

You are comparing breast to penises when you should be comparing penises to vaginas. If it was legal for a women to expose vaginas you might have an argument. And it is legal in many places for a woman to walk down the street without a top.

 

[Teresa Pitman]

It is legal where I live for women to go topless wherever men can be topless. You don't see it often (occasionally at the beach or at some of the music festivals) but it's certainly legal. It's also legal for women to breastfeed anywhere they are entitled to be with their babies. I hope everyone can just get over this silly reaction to babies breastfeeding in public. It's a baby, he's eating. If you don't like it, don't look.

 

[Hrhpd]

It's funny how often that happens when ten thousand people target a small business.

Then perhaps a business that caters to moms and babies should have actually checked the law before they made illegal statements online.

They invited the backlash by not being informed. I don't feel sorry for them at all.

Really, even if you do get a glimpse of a nipple, which is very rare, it is just a nipple. You see them on every guy on the beach. And some guys have those nipples on bigger breasts than some women. It really is just a body part.

This country really needs to move out of the puritan age.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

This is a local establishment & the story is all over FB & I guess is also receiving some national exposure:
http://www.masslive.com/news/index....ere_to_breastfeed.html#incart_related_stories

Apparently, I live in a state that has a law that protects breastfeeding women to be able to do so in public or private. I don't breastfeed my children, but I am not bothered by anyone that does in public or private.

I've never been to this place & know nothing about the owner but from what I read, I personally think the owner of this place just put her foot in her mouth & was reacting to some customers who had complained that women were openly breastfeeding in the middle of a busy play area.

Just wondering...if the owner had instituted a different policy that stated ALL feeding (whether it be breast, bottle, or snacks) need to happen in a designated open area, would this have met legal requirements? This way, it does not discriminate against anyone? Apparently, a bunch of customers are going to file lawsuits.

Likely not since because of the way the law is written. Unless they choose to ban the bottle feeding and nursed infants from
Anywhere except the designated space, they would not have a leg to stand on.

(Not directed at you OP, but to where I know
This thread will go...) And to anyone who doesn't like it? Their opinion is legally irrelevant and would never stand a chance to overturn any law. (The opinions of, whipping it out, flashing, not your home, etc.). It is discrimination. So deal with it, or patronize elsewhere where children are banned and you have no risk of encountering that which disgusts you. Immaturity doesn't justify discriminatory attitudes.

 

[LBIJim]

Sorry, I worded that wrong. I was talking about pumping milk.

I was referring mostly to pumping, but several new moms i have worked with were able to have their husbands or their child's grandparents or caregiver bring their infant in during mom's lunch break for a feeding.

Thanks for the clarification.

The only time I've noticed a breastfeeding mom with everything hanging out was at a shopping mall. She was sitting on a bench across from us, and it seemed she was disappointed that people WEREN'T staring or paying her any attention.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I'm not a mom, so I'm probably lacking some insight here, but I thought all the "public breastfeeding" debate had to do with the baby being under a blanket or something. I didn't realize women actively wanted to pop out their boob in public.

I suppose that's their business, but I think it will mean that everyone has to be allowed to be topless at will, doesn't it?

And as an aside, I hate to see small businesses get taken down by one of those Facebook or Yelp dogpiles. The owner was obviously responding to complaints.

ILLEGALLY responding to complaints. Doesn't matter of their heart was in the right place or not. It was illegal.

The reasons for these laws is that in a disturbing resolution to this "problem"
Was to criminally to after mothers for indecent exposure.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I was referring mostly to pumping, but several new moms i have worked with were able to have their husbands or their child's grandparents or caregiver bring their infant in during mom's lunch break for a feeding.

If the child is otherwise not permitted by the employer/business to be in the facility, then providing a location that allows
Them that opportunity--I am pretty sure--is perfectly legal.

Most of these laws protect mom for public spaces (even in supposed "private" establishments) where both she and her baby are otherwise legally permitted to be.

So--McDonalds okay. A bar that bans minors, not okay.

 

[Oodalally13]

You are comparing breast to penises when you should be comparing penises to vaginas. If it was legal for a women to expose vaginas you might have an argument. And it is legal in many places for a woman to walk down the street without a top.

Actually I'm comparing what society considers private and intimate parts of the body. Breasts, nipples, penises, vaginas, testicles, anuses. Take your pick. If it is ok to show one it should be ok to show all. If it is frowned upon to show one, it is frowned to show all

 

[aaarcher86]

Likely not since because of the way the law is written. Unless they choose to ban the bottle feeding and nursed infants from
Anywhere except the designated space, they would not have a leg to stand on.

(Not directed at you OP, but to where I know
This thread will go...) And to anyone who doesn't like it? Their opinion is legally irrelevant and would never stand a chance to overturn any law. (The opinions of, whipping it out, flashing, not your home, etc.). It is discrimination. So deal with it, or patronize elsewhere where children are banned and you have no risk of encountering that which disgusts you. Immaturity doesn't justify discriminatory attitudes.

I think discrimination is a bit strong here.

Me judging someone for utilizing their boob as their own personal Theraputty isn't discriminating against them. Telling them they can't do it would be.

I do find it a little ironic that everyone insists that people should have a little common courtesy for others in all aspects of life EXCEPT when it comes to breast feeding.

Breast feeding doesn't disgust me in the slightest. But someone flicking their orangutan nipples (which I can only assume we will now justify as meal prep) when I'm trying to eat my meal does. Feed your kid. No need to show boat it.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

There is no possible way not to flash someone, briefly or not, while breastfeeding without a cover in place to start, sorry. There is no reason anyone has to sit down in the middle of a public place to feed their child. Respect goes both ways and if you are eating at a restaurant and you know your child will probably be hungry during that time, ask for a booth so you can be discrete. I breastfed all of our children. I am not against breastfeeding in public, but I also don't think you need to flash everyone doing so. Yes, most people care discrete, but the ones that usually cause this kind of uproar are not and those are the ones people here are talking about.

For the couple at Mayo, when those 70 year olds were growing up, public nudity was not acceptable. Girls were not wearing skimpy bikinis on the beach. It's a comfort level. You can respect their modesty level as well.

When those 70 yo people were young new parents, segregation was alive and well. Should we respect their disdain if a person of color walked into the office?

Breastfeeding is not indecent exposure.

I can keep things covered. But let's not pretend the prudish world is okay with this. See below.

Just saying.....

If it is okay for women to have boobs out in a public space and have some type of excuse for it then it should be ok for men to have their meat and 2 veggies out and about with some type of excuse. I understand you have children and are feeding them BUT please remember there ARE alternatives. From what I understand men get chafing and what not from being under wraps, so they can choose to let it loose. There are pros and alternatives to both things. Who's right is it to judge what body parts should be covered at certain times for certain reasons? Why is it ok for for a woman breastfeeding to have her boob out and about because she is breast feeding but not a woman just walking down the street? I know what's coming next "women dress with low cut cleavage baring clothes all the time, it's the same." Sorry, it isn't.

Understand that your comparison is ridiculous. In every sense.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I think discrimination is a bit strong here.

Me judging someone for utilizing their boob as their own personal Theraputty isn't discriminating against them. Telling them they can't do it would be.

I do find it a little ironic that everyone insists that people should have a little common courtesy for others in all aspects of life EXCEPT when it comes to breast feeding.

Breast feeding doesn't disgust me in the slightest. But someone flicking their orangutan nipples (which I can only assume we will now justify as meal prep) when I'm trying to eat my meal does. Feed your kid. No need to show boat it.

Legally accurate though.

For the one woman you mentioned, she was not nursing. From experience, I would guess she was suffering from some clogged ducts that may be heading to mastitis. Her prepping her breast like that has no other explanation. And if indeed she needed to do that, she was not nursing her infant and I can concede that would have been more appropriate in private.

This is just a guest based on my own experience as that technique is a solution for the issues I described.

But otherwise--it is immature, it is discriminatory to fling opinions for an otherwise legal activity in an effort to stop said legal activity.

Additionally some laws to further because sometimes accidental exposure occurs. So for example--Florida law covers that. Because some kind discriminatory souls wanted to charge women for indecent exposure when their sole intent was to feed their baby and not flash you.

 

[Teresa Pitman]

I can't quite figure out the new way to do quotes. But I am curious as to how the person above could tell that the breastfeeding mother "was disappointed that people WEREN'T staring or paying her any attention." Do you have some mind-reading ability? I just can't see how you could possibly know what she was thinking.

And also, in reference to breasts and nipples being private parts that should not be shown, when the cases here went to court one of the arguments made was that this is discriminatory. Men and women both have nipples. At that time, men were allowed to have their nipples exposed in public but women were not. That was declared by the courts to be unfair and discriminatory against women.

 

[mnrose]

Actually I'm comparing what society considers private and intimate parts of the body. Breasts, nipples, penises, vaginas, testicles, anuses. Take your pick. If it is ok to show one it should be ok to show all. If it is frowned upon to show one, it is frowned to show all

Men show their breasts all the time. Why is that allowed? Heck, even encouraged. I don't get the hysteria over the same body part on women. And, we are one of the only countries (aside from Muslim countries) where this hysteria over breasts exists. You won't find this level of concern anywhere in Europe.

 

[Teresa Pitman]

Also, people saying they "don't want to see" breasts/nipples/babies breastfeeding... That's life. When you go out in public, or eat in public places, you're pretty much guaranteed at some point to see things you don't like or don't want to see. Some people don't like to see same-sex couples holding hands. Some people don't like to see people who slurp their soup. Some people don't like to see people eating meat (because they're vegetarian).

 

[aaarcher86]

Legally accurate though.

For the one woman you mentioned, she was not nursing. From experience, I would guess she was suffering from some clogged ducts that may be heading to mastitis. Her prepping her breast like that has no other explanation. And if indeed she needed to do that, she was not nursing her infant and I can concede that would have been more appropriate in private.

This is just a guest based on my own experience as that technique is a solution for the issues I described.

But otherwise--it is immature, it is discriminatory to fling opinions for an otherwise legal activity in an effort to stop said legal activity.

Additionally some laws to further because sometimes accidental exposure occurs. So for example--Florida law covers that. Because some kind discriminatory souls wanted to charge women for indecent exposure when their sole intent was to feed their baby and not flash you.

It's not accurate. Discrimination is an action that denies participation.

I haven't seen anyone here state they wanted these laws changed. In fact, it sounds like all the posters are all for breast feeding rights in general. If it makes me immature to say I'm not a fan of showboating your breast feeding, okay.

Just because you're legally allowed doesn't mean it's a great thing to do. I'm legally allowed to walk my dog topless. It doesn't mean I'm running around with hot pink pasties and telling people they're discriminating if they don't like it. I don't have to like something just because it's a law.

The other woman I mentioned had her unused bare boob out for the store to see, and you can bet your bottom dollar she was taking offense if anyone looked taken aback.

It's just getting a bit obnoxious that I'm some kind of tyrant for not agreeing with every little aspect of public breast feeding.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

I haven't seen anyone here state they wanted these laws changed. In fact, it sounds like all the posters are all for breast feeding rights in general. If it makes me immature to say I'm not a fan of showboating your breast feeding, okay.

Just because you're legally allowed doesn't mean it's a great thing to do. I'm legally allowed to walk my dog topless. It doesn't mean I'm running around with hot pink pasties and telling people they're discriminating if they don't like it. I don't have to like something just because it's a law.

The other woman I mentioned had her unused bare boob out for the store to see, and you can bet your bottom dollar she was taking offense if anyone looked taken aback.

It's just getting a bit obnoxious that I'm some kind of tyrant for not agreeing with every little aspect of public breast feeding.

Did I call you a tyrant? No, I did not.

Once you determine, that for your (general not you specifically) comfort that additional measures should be taken to assure you comfort, you are encouraging the violation of the law.

It is that simple.

The ONLY and legally correct obligation of the business is to be fully aware of the law and to communicate to guests who complain that the business is unwilling and unable to violate the law.

As for the family dollar woman--I wasn't there, so I cannot comment. But I have heard the "they only want attention" argument too much (mentioned a time or two In this thread) to give it much credence either way. Only you know what you saw. Make only she knows whether she was deliberately trying to seek attention or not while not actually breastfeeding.

And again--if we want to equate breastfeeding to parading like a stripper--if doesn't make you a tyrant, but it does demonstrate the necessity for these laws.

Nobody asked you to like it. We are just reminding you that it is legal and any efforts to stop it are illegal.

And I will remind that it is my opinion that equating it to a lewd and lacivius act, makes me wonder the maturity level of the observer. Speaking generally, of course and not about you specifically. If one doesn't want to be observed that way, then perhaps thus need to rethink their stance on the sexual nature of breastfeeding that concerns them so.

 

[Lisa loves Pooh]

Also, people saying they "don't want to see" breasts/nipples/babies breastfeeding... That's life. When you go out in public, or eat in public places, you're pretty much guaranteed at some point to see things you don't like or don't want to see. Some people don't like to see same-sex couples holding hands. Some people don't like to see people who slurp their soup. Some people don't like to see people eating meat (because they're vegetarian).

They don't want to see it = I can't even know you are even doing it because if it comes into my conciousness that OMG you are breastfeeding, then you were not discreet enough. Discreet = invisible.

 

[aaarcher86]

Did I call you a tyrant? No, I did not.

Once you determine, that for your (general not you specifically) comfort that additional measures should be taken to assure you comfort, you are encouraging the violation of the law.

It is that simple.

The ONLY and legally correct obligation of the business is to be fully aware of the law and to communicate to guests who complain that the business is unwilling and unable to violate the law.

As for the family dollar woman--I wasn't there, so I cannot comment. But I have heard the "they only want attention" argument too much (mentioned a time or two In this thread) to give it much credence either way. Only you know what you saw. Make only she knows whether she was deliberately trying to seek attention or not while not actually breastfeeding.

And again--if we want to equate breastfeeding to parading like a stripper--if doesn't make you a tyrant, but it does demonstrate the necessity for these laws.

Nobody asked you to like it. We are just reminding you that it is legal and any efforts to stop it are illegal.

And I will remind that it is my opinion that equating it to a lewd and lacivius act, makes me wonder the maturity level of the observer. Speaking generally, of course and not about you specifically. If one doesn't want to be observed that way, then perhaps thus need to rethink their stance on the sexual nature of breastfeeding that concerns them so.

My comparison (and you got me before the edit that discrimination is not legally accurate here) was only to show that using the "it's legal get over it" mentality, IMO, is just as obnoxious. People only seem to use that method of thinking towards breast feeding mothers. I don't see why a little discretion and/or consideration for those around you is off base. It's not as if saying, "yeah. Show boating because you can is kind of obnoxious" means your anti-breast feeding. There is a middle ground, IMO.

You didn't call anyone a tyrant, but that's definitely the vibe some posters are putting off. I didn't mention Family Dollar so I don't know if you're thinking of my examples or someone else's.

Reminding people of something that isn't happening in thread isn't really necessary.

 

[Hrhpd]

I think discrimination is a bit strong here.

Me judging someone for utilizing their boob as their own personal Theraputty isn't discriminating against them. Telling them they can't do it would be.

I do find it a little ironic that everyone insists that people should have a little common courtesy for others in all aspects of life EXCEPT when it comes to breast feeding.

Breast feeding doesn't disgust me in the slightest. But someone flicking their orangutan nipples (which I can only assume we will now justify as meal prep) when I'm trying to eat my meal does. Feed your kid. No need to show boat it.

People chewing with their mouth open, especially with noises, disgusts me. Perhaps we should ban that too.

But see, I understand that seeing chewed up food in somebody's mouth and being disgusted is my problem. I would never be so egotistical to think that people should bend to my perceived notions of how they should behave. As long as the behavior does not harm a person in any way, it is none of my business. I have the option to look away, move or leave if it really offends me.

 

[Teresa Pitman]

I don't know why the woman described earlier had both breasts out. But I do know that often new mothers are pretty overwhelmed and sleep-deprived and exhausted. I really, really doubt that she was trying to get attention. When you have a newborn, you're just trying to cope, and you don't always remember things like "cover up the first breast when baby goes on the second one."

I am laughing at Lisa loves Pooh's last comment. I was once sitting in church nursing my baby; I had a kind of cape/shawl on that completely covered me and the baby. Someone complained. When I spoke to that person afterwards saying "but I was completely covered," she said "yes, but we knew what you were doing under that cover." Okay then...