Las Vegas Shooting

[robinb]

In my previous post, I did not take the time to type out my full thoughts on the topic other than trying to get some money into the girlfriend's hands while he could. However, what you have typed out above is very similar to what I think may have happened in terms of gambling debt, planning this horrible event, etc.

I wouldn't be surprised if he sent her away so she's be gone while he made his final plans and enacted his horrible terrorist plot.

 

[TLSnell1981]

In the dark. In chaos. Looking for one broken window in a huge hotel with many, many windows. Up many floors. From the ground, as bullets are flying at you.

Now, I'm the first to admit I'm especially incompetent with a handgun, having placed more than my fair share of bullets in the ceiling of an indoor range, but I don't think any of us would have a hope in heck of hitting the gunman under those circumstance. Chances are good, he'd never even notice anyone firing from the ground, much less feel threatened by them!

I stayed at Mandalay last month. It looks like a great big shiny gold mirror. It wouldn't be hard to spot a broken window. Now, if you were dodging bullets...probably not looking for the shooter. And, not much luck subduing them on the 32nd floor with a handgun.

 

[Gumbo4x4]

At a time when there really was no professional US Military. The US now has one of the largest Armed Forces in the world with no need for a civilian militia. The laws have not kept up with the times or technology. That "right" the 2nd amendment was for a militia with single shot muskets and pistols that were loaded with gun powder and a a shot ball.

If you wish to debate 2nd amendment further, I'll be happy to do so offline.

 

[bcla]

I heard some news story that one of the places in the Vegas area that have machine guns for customers to shoot at their range is closed for the time being.

 

[LYSE]

They can refuse to allow passage. Wynn's was searching bags and using handheld wands starting Monday. They had already started using less obvious security means from last year. I was curious about this

4th amendment would protect you from prosecution by the government, yes? A hotel could search a room and kick someone out for trespassing I believe.

Correct, they can refuse you entry but already checked in and then having the room searched gets quite complicated...they could do it and open them selves up to being sued.

Some states like CA have actually already ruled a hotel room is your temporary residence and you cannot restrict firearms, If i recall correctly this actually stemmed from a case involving the homeless and their 2a rights.

I live in Canada, we aren't allowed the many types of guns Americans have, and our ideology around them is very different. The idea of having a gun in the house for "protection" is crazy. Protection from what? Some people may have a hunting rifle for their annual hunting trip or in rural areas to scare off predatory animals. If the general population didn't have guns in their homes children, suicidal people wouldn't have access to them. As to the claim that having a gun increases your safety, I disagree.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24054955
http://annals.org/aim/article/18144...timization-among-household-members-systematic
https://www.bradycampaign.org/risks-of-having-a-gun-in-the-home

First of all I tend to take suicides out of the equation since I don't believe they have some magical influence over your brain chemistry that makes you more suicidal, that was already there and the vast majority would find another way to ago about offing themselves.

Second, I will say that I agree that very generally speaking if you have tons of guns then there will be more gun related crime.....BUT that doesn't matter, we need to look at overall violence..I truly do not understand why the tool matters the overall numbers are what matters.

The truth is there no concrete research that proves gun ownership increases crime OR reduces it, so if it has no affect the only possible thing restrictions can do is make it harder for citizens to effectively defend them selves

See:https://www.researchgate.net/public...Rates_A_Methodological_Review_of_the_Evidence

urpose: This paper reviews 41 English-language studies that tested the hypothesis that higher gun prevalence
levels cause higher crime rates, especially higher homicide rates.
Methods: Each study was assessed as to whether it solved or reduced each of three critical methodological
problems: (1) whether a validated measure of gun prevalence was used, (2) whether the authors controlled
for more than a handful of possible confounding variables, and (3) whether the researchers used suitable causal
order procedures to deal with the possibility of crime rates affecting gun rates, instead of the reverse.
Results: Itwas found that most studies did notsolve any of these problems, and that research that dida better job
of addressing these problems was less likely to support the more-guns-cause-more crime hypothesis. Indeed,
none of the studies that solved all three problems supported the hypothesis.
Conclusions: Technically weak research mostly supports the hypothesis, while strong research does not. It must
be tentatively concluded that higher gun ownership rates do not cause higher crime rates, including homicide
rate

The Impact of Gun Ownership Rates on Crime Rates: A Methodological Review of the Evidence (PDF Download Available). Available from: https://www.researchgate.net/public...Rates_A_Methodological_Review_of_the_Evidence [accessed Oct 3, 2017].

Your Brady link is a Joke mostly because they are the obviously completely bias and use many, many of the poorly done and discredited studies.

 

[TLSnell1981]

I thought I read that he did have fertilizer in his car. At the end of the day though, that's not what he used.

Nope, but where there is a will there's a way.

 

[Domo]

At a time when there really was no professional US Military. The US now has one of the largest Armed Forces in the world with no need for a civilian militia. The laws have not kept up with the times or technology. That "right" the 2nd amendment was for a militia with single shot muskets and pistols that were loaded with gun powder and a a shot ball.

Old laws are often not fit for purpose as it is. I mean, until recently, it was law that all taxis in London must carry a bale of hay

 

[erin1715]

Annnnd now the police are saying the girlfriend is indeed a person of interest.

 

[Domo]

With regards to the second amendment, which has more holes than Swish cheese, it's just an old law. It can be altered or binned. Remember, we in the UK used to have rights to firearms, old rights. But after a tragedy, we changed them and have been better off ever since.

 

[TLSnell1981]

With regards to the second amendment, which has more holes than Swish cheese, it's just an old law. It can be altered or binned. Remember, we in the UK used to have rights to firearms, old rights. But after a tragedy, we changed them and have been better off ever since.

Has it solved the problems?

 

[bcla]

Not 100% banned. No new ones have been legal to manufacture since 1986. Existing ones are grandfathered & require special licensing.

Machines guns are still being made though. Where do you think the police and military get theirs? And firearms dealers can still obtain them, which is where a lot of these "shoot a real machine gun" places and movie/TV sets obtain them. They can't transfer them to private owners though.

I used to think that all the movies shot in the US were using pre-1986 machine guns, but then I heard about the loophole for dealers. They just need a movie armorer with a firearms license and meticulous paperwork.

 

[Domo]

Has it solved the problems?

All I can tell you that whilst there are annual tragedies in the US with multiple casualties, gun crimes in the UK are extremely rare.

 

[erin1715]

In addition it sounds like they just gathered computer equipment and hard drives so I think ruling out a foreign connection is premature

 

[AnnaFloridaLover]

Annnnd now the police are saying the girlfriend is indeed a person of interest.

Does it make you feel better knowing a Filipino girlfriend may or may not have known? Still has absolutely nothing to do with ISIS. Still has everything to do with a crazed or evil American.

 

[BLAZEY]

Old laws are often not fit for purpose as it is. I mean, until recently, it was law that all taxis in London must carry a bale of hay

I agree that the laws need to be amended as times and technology change. I think you, like I come from a country that doesn't have mass murders by armed civilians due to laws that make it more difficult to get weapons such. Also the mentality that everyone is out to get them and they need gun for "personal protection" isn't prevalent in Canada.

 

[robinb]

In addition it sounds like they just gathered computer equipment and hard drives so I think ruling out a foreign connection is premature

Making any kind of assumptions about the killer is premature.

 

[erin1715]

Does it make you feel better knowing a Filipino girlfriend may or may not have known? Still has absolutely nothing to do with ISIS. Still has everything to do with a crazed or evil American.

You have no idea that it has nothing to do with ISIS at this point. The police ruled out the girlfriend yesterday and today she’s a person of interest. And they haven’t even gone through computer equipment

And I’m not sure what you’re accusing me of with the Filipino girlfriend remark.

 

[Domo]

I agree that the laws need to be amended as times and technology change. I think you, like I come from a country that doesn't have mass murders by armed civilians due to laws that make it more difficult to get weapons such. Also the mentality that everyone is out to get them and they need gun for "personal protection" isn't prevalent in Canada.

The worst we have here are drive-by arguments

 

[LYSE]

All I can tell you that whilst there are annual tragedies in the US with multiple casualties, gun crimes in the UK are extremely rare.

I will admit, I have not looked into pre and post crime in the UK too much, however what do you have to say about this?

For an example of homicide rates before and after a ban, take the case of the handgun ban in England and Wales in January 1997 (source here see Table 1.01 and the column marked “Offences currently recorded as homicide per million population,” UPDATED numbers available here). After the ban, clearly homicide rates bounce around over time, but there is only one year (2010) where the homicide rate is lower than it was in 1996. The immediate effect was about a 50 percent increase in homicide rates. Firearm homicide rate had almost doubled between 1996 and 2002 (see here p. 11). The homicide and firearm homicide rates only began falling when there was a large increase in the number of police officers during 2003 and 2004. Despite the huge increase in the number of police, the murder rate still remained slightly higher than the immediate pre-ban rate.

 

[ELKA]

Has it solved the problems?

Actually there are less gun related deaths in the U.K. I would say that knife attacks are up, but there aren't mass shootings where the death tolls are above 20. I will give you another country where there is gun control. Israel is a country where if you don't need a gun in your job or where you live, you aren't getting a license to own one. I mostly hear about terror attacks using vehicles, knives and axes. Usually guns end the attacks.