just back...too many scooters!

[DisneyPhD]

Yes, and maybe its kinda silly to pretend that all people who use the hanicapped stalsl in the restroom really need it. Many times when I enter the rest room there are many able stalls empty but the Handicapped
one (which is the only one I can use) is being used by a mom and 1 or 2 children. I could say she is abusing the use of the HA stall or I could think prehaps she has an invisible disabily or a special needs child. I always chose the benifit of the doubt.
Because it is a HA stall and it for peopke with special needs just as the scooters are.

I understand your point of giving people the bennifit of the doubt. However that situation is rather different. The person in it is only there for a few min. It isn't like she is talking up the spot for hours like a parking spot. To wait 3 min for a rest room stahl isn't out of the ordinary. I agree with All Aboard, that the term convenience is too board and easly used. However, I am glad they are there for people who could not enjoy the parks with out them.

As far as ECV use and possible over use in the parks, sounds like another good reason to keep my older preschooler in the stroller. To keep her from getting run down by someone who may or may not really need the EVC, but still learnig how to handel it.

 

[ClarabelleCow]

Yes, and maybe its kinda silly to pretend that all people who use the hanicapped stalls in the restroom really need it. Many times when I enter the rest room there are many able stalls empty but the Handicapped
one (which is the only one I can use) is being used by a mom and 1 or 2 children. I could say she is abusing the use of the HA stall or I could think prehaps she has an invisible disabily or a special needs child. I always chose the benifit of the doubt.
Because it is a HA stall and it for people with special needs just as the scooters are.

While I see your point, how do you know when that person with the 3 kids entered the rest room, all the stalls weren't full? If they were full, should she have waited, or used the open stall?

I overheard a family at VWL 2 years ago, they were proud they were bucking the system and using a scooter, it got them to the head of the line! this really irritated me. Plus the fact they were letting the kids ride the scooter around the pool and almost tossed me it.

I am a somewhat out of shape overweight 37 year old. I have Vericose veins in both legs and when I walk for long periods of time my legs hurt. I also have hip issues from falling off a horse. I have to sit and put my legs up a few times during the day. Sure renting a scooter would help me, and I guess you don't need a doctors letter stating so. Should I get one? I would never! I just don't do as much, I inconvenience myself. Pretty soon everyone with the slitest issue will be riding a scooter around the parks.

 

[DVCLiz]

Yes, and maybe its kinda silly to pretend that all people who use the hanicapped stalsl in the restroom really need it. Many times when I enter the rest room there are many able stalls empty but the Handicapped
one (which is the only one I can use) is being used by a mom and 1 or 2 children. I could say she is abusing the use of the HA stall or I could think prehaps she has an invisible disabily or a special needs child. I always chose the benifit of the doubt.
Because it is a HA stall and it for peopke with special needs just as the scooters are.

Handicapped stalls in public restrooms are not reserved for handicapped people only. They are accessible to a person with a handicap, but they are legally able to be used by anyone - unlike a handicapped parking space, which is restricted by law to only those with a proper tag. There are several threads about this subject on these boards - do a search and you'll see all sorts of opinions about whether they should be used and by whom, but no one is breaking a law just because they'd like a little more leg and sitting room in the larger stall. Of course, anyone who sees a handicapped person in need should, in my opinion, make sure he or she is the next person for that stall, if it is occupied, but that's just my personal feeling. Others will tell you that handicapped people should wait their turn like everyone else.

 

[Merylj]

We were knocked out of the way by an ECV on our way into Mickey`s Philharmagic, although this large party were behind us they were determined to get in before us. Just as well DH was in his wheelchair, he would not have moved quick enough to get out of the way! So in the hierarchy of things ECV`s look to have the right of way.

 

[MainStreetFan]

I see a lot of people who are very careful on scooters. Most will wait until a crowd thins out to take off for their next destination. But while waiting for Wishes in September, I watched 4 women drive up to a pathway near CP to wait. One sat there and 3 went to ride Haunted Mansion ON FOOT. When they got back, one had lost the key to her scooter, so another member of the party, actually picked up her scooter (it was her personal one, and the small 3 wheel type) so she could look under it. This is what gives a bad name to the scooter riders. We all get tired and would love to have a scooter occasionlly. I think even those who do need the scooter would agree that there are people out who don't need the scooters, using them.

 

[In a hurry]

When we were ther last time, my mom, who was scooter bound (chemo recovery, too, CV) had a whole line of people crash in front of her when she was trying to enter the park. It took my husband going and pointing out she was handicapped (the CM did nothing) to get her into the park. In my opinion she should have run over the whole lot of them.

We had people racing in in front of it, pushing strollers across the path, some mom put her kid in mom's lap to watch a show (we told her that was NOT okay), Cashiers and other shoppers ignored the fact she existed. There was not one "quick entrance" to a ride. People need to get past that idea. Often we had to wait for a special bus or boat.

For those who think it is such an easy time, try it. I hope you don't need it, but chances are that you or a loved one will at some point. Hope the people you encounter have more empathy than you do.

 

[minnie61650]

, .....but no one is breaking a law just because they'd like a little more leg and sitting room in the larger stall.....
QUOTE]

I never said anyone was breaking a law because they wanted a little leg room. I was just trying to make a point about how people can and do have different ideas about who is abusing different things. It saddens me when people do not understand how much those of us with hidden disabilities are hurt by some of remarks posted on these boards. If it were not for the scooters I would not be able enjoy the parks at.WDW

 

[addicted_to_WDW]

For those who think it is such an easy time, try it. I hope you don't need it, but chances are that you or a loved one will at some point. Hope the people you encounter have more empathy than you do.

I have complete empathy for people who are unable to walk through the parks, for whatever reason. I have no sympathy for anyone who (1) decides that a scooter means they can plow through the crowds with impunity, or (2) uses a scooter because they are tired, lazy, or think its a toy.

My poor husband pushed me around in a wheelchair during one trip (I had stitches in the bottom of my foot). It sucked. People were rude and more often than not I ended up hobbling around on my heel in order to see anything. I needed the wheelchair. On that same trip, I saw groups of kids wheeling each other around all day every day. Just because *some* people need the assistance does not mean that *everyone* who rents a scooter or wheelchair needs it. I don't understand why some people can't admit that or get defensive when it is suggested that some people are not above board.

 

[laura001]

I can see both sides of this. I have taken both of my grandparents to WDW over the years, used a wheelchair once and the other time a scooter. Now they really needed to use them so it was not a choice. I found most people oblivious to a scooter being around them and quite often walked in front of it, my grandmother almost hit a couple of people, both times it was not her fault. I think that everyone is so wrapped up in what they are doing and enjoying the day themselves that they just don't notice. On the other hand, I have almost been mowed down a couple of times....and whoa! that was scary, and yet no "sorry" or acknowledgement at all.

It is fantastic that these are available as it was neither trip would have been done by my grandparents without them.

I am not sure what the answers are. I have recently injured my knee and have been on crutches for 13 weeks so far, and I could not tell you how many times I have been knocked over, mowed over, tripped, pushed etc., expecially in a crowd, by people. I would just hope that it is for the same reasons for the most part, I can't imagine that people are that mean spirited.

The part that gets my goat ...is this....pulling up to the shopping mall or place of business, having to park so far away and walk with my crutches to get where I am going. Then out comes someone and practically runs and jumps into their car parked in the handicap spot....oooh, that is maddening. Yes, there are people that don't have outward disabilities, but I believe there is a lot of mismanagement on the priveleges that are given out...IMHO




Oh, by the way, I have had the experience of some very helpful people also since injuring my knee, justed didn't want anyone to think that it has all been bad.

 

[Raevyn_Wolfe]

Ok, I'm a little confused.

I am taking my grandparents (in the 65-70 age range) to Disneyworld for the very first time.
My grandfather has had multiple hip surgeries and has bad knees.
My grandmother has painful varicose veins.
BOTH of them can walk and do in their normal every day life.

I was planning on renting a scooter for them in the parks. I feel it will make it eaisier on them, and I want them to be comfortable and enjoy themselves, not be suffering. Which I am sure they will be if they walk through the park all day.

Is this wrong?? :shrug

Like I said, they can walk.
So if after riding the scooter my grandfather can't park it right, it looks bad if he gets out of it and can lift it or move it?

And it looks bad if my grandfather is riding it, and then my grandmother needs a break cause her legs are hurting her. . . so they switch?

It's not the walking itself. . . it's how MUCH walking that I am worried about. They are both capable and could if they HAD to, but I don't want them to kill themselves by walking miles and then getting up and doing it again the next day.

It is the bad attitude towards scooters and wheelchairs that has caused my granfather to have had mutliple surgeries. He's been told to use them, but is too proud.

 

[TiggerDaisy]

I agree with your post. I understand that some people have disabilities and they need to use the scooters, but WDW needs to rethink their current transportation system. They truly need to train their bus drivers how to load and unload passengers with both scooters and wheelchairs. On one occasion, the bus driver did not know how to properly buckle the passenger on the scooter in the bus. He had to get another bus driver to come over and do it for him. Talk about time consuming! Three buses to our resort had passed us while the bus driver was still loading this person. It was so frustrating!

 

[laura001]

Ok, I'm a little confused.

I am taking my grandparents (in the 65-70 age range) to Disneyworld for the very first time.
My grandfather has had multiple hip surgeries and has bad knees.
My grandmother has painful varicose veins.
BOTH of them can walk and do in their normal every day life.

I was planning on renting a scooter for them in the parks. I feel it will make it eaisier on them, and I want them to be comfortable and enjoy themselves, not be suffering. Which I am sure they will be if they walk through the park all day.

Is this wrong?? :shrug

Like I said, they can walk.
So if after riding the scooter my grandfather can't park it right, it looks bad if he gets out of it and can lift it or move it?

And it looks bad if my grandfather is riding it, and then my grandmother needs a break cause her legs are hurting her. . . so they switch?

It's not the walking itself. . . it's how MUCH walking that I am worried about. They are both capable and could if they HAD to, but I don't want them to kill themselves by walking miles and then getting up and doing it again the next day.

It is the bad attitude towards scooters and wheelchairs that has caused my granfather to have had mutliple surgeries. He's been told to use them, but is too proud.

Oh my, of course you should use the scooter or wheelchair service. If it makes their trip more enjoyable for them and more able to cope physically, by all means, I wouldn't even think twice about it.

My grandparents were in the same boat and it made the whole trip possible and enjoyable. On the other hand, we didn't use disney buses to get around, we only used the scooters/wheelchairs in the parks so I don't know how difficult it is to use outside of the parks.

Have a great trip!

 

[Otter49]

Those of you with legitimate need, or with relatives with legitimate need, as has been said, are being thin-skinned to think this debate is directed at you (unless you happen to be a bad scooter driver of course). I for one am thrilled that those in need can enjoy better access not just to Disney, but to most things our society has to offer.

But to suggest there isn't abuse is at best naive, and at worst - politcal correctness. I don't know whether the number is 10% or 90%, but some people are riding these things out of sheer laziness. Sorry - I have little patience for laziness.

I was lucky - I haven't had a bad runin with an ECV until yesterday, when my right foot was run over twice at AK. No, no apology either time.

I'm afraid this is a problem without a solution - but I think for starters that Dis should put speed governors on these things that would limit the top end to the walking pace of the average adult.

 

[Talking Hands]

I can give you the other side of the story. When my children were in their early teens I had to start using a wheelchair at WDW because without it I was short of breath and had leg pain. My husband would push me and I can't count the times he had to stop short to avoid someone walking in front of me or stopping short. Then ten years ago I graduated to a scooter (ELECTRIC CONVEYANCE VEHICLE). WHile it returned my independence it certainly was not a convenience. Whe you are in it you are overlooked. People walk in front of you, walk into you, trip over you, shove in line in front of you. You get the idea. Five years ago I changed to a power wheelchair. Same things still happen of course. It can be very frustrating. I would rather be able to walk but I am at a point where it brings me to tears just to go from one end of my school to the other. No way I can walk through Disney.
The scooters rented by Disney are very difficult to drive. Really awkward and hard to judge stopping and turning. Don't turn on a dime or stop on a dime. The outside rentals are somewhat better and easier to control. Now my powerchair is easy to manuever and control. I love it. I try very hard not to run over people but sometimes it is really difficult when they are pressing the side of the wheelchair they are so close. And decide you aren't moving fast enough or are in their way so they literally climb over you or shove the back of the chair.

 

[brerrabbit]

I don't have a problem with peopl that need scooters or even think they need scooters. I will not judge the need. Having said that I do get annoyed with people using the scooters that think that because the scooter can go faster than the prevailing foot traffic trying to dart around in and through people walking who can only go so fast as the the crowd around them. The EVC's are desiged to allow peopl to get around who have a problem with being on their feet for long periods of time. They are not designed to let you get places faster than the normal healthy person that can walk. While we were there ar Thanksgiving we saw one group whose scooter user had the assigned task of getting fastpasses for the rest. They would speed ahead and run over anybody that got in their way to get passes. I feel that those who use scooters should move at the same pace as everyone else and go with the flow of traffic rather than trying to speed in and around us walkers.

 

[Talking Hands]

Ok, I'm a little confused.

I am taking my grandparents (in the 65-70 age range) to Disneyworld for the very first time.
My grandfather has had multiple hip surgeries and has bad knees.
My grandmother has painful varicose veins.
BOTH of them can walk and do in their normal every day life.

I was planning on renting a scooter for them in the parks. I feel it will make it eaisier on them, and I want them to be comfortable and enjoy themselves, not be suffering. Which I am sure they will be if they walk through the park all day.

Is this wrong?? :shrug

Like I said, they can walk.
So if after riding the scooter my grandfather can't park it right, it looks bad if he gets out of it and can lift it or move it?

And it looks bad if my grandfather is riding it, and then my grandmother needs a break cause her legs are hurting her. . . so they switch?

It's not the walking itself. . . it's how MUCH walking that I am worried about. They are both capable and could if they HAD to, but I don't want them to kill themselves by walking miles and then getting up and doing it again the next day.

It is the bad attitude towards scooters and wheelchairs that has caused my granfather to have had mutliple surgeries. He's been told to use them, but is too proud.

PLease do what you need to make your grandparents trip an enjoyable experience and forget these people who don't like scooters in the parks. Those of us using scooters and wheelchairs pay the exact same price to visit the parks as those who are able bodied. We have the same right to enjoy ourselves.

 

[Amy&Dan]

Just because *some* people need the assistance does not mean that *everyone* who rents a scooter or wheelchair needs it. I don't understand why some people can't admit that or get defensive when it is suggested that some people are not above board.

I admit that I do get defensive. I have the sad luck in life to have some family members who have serious health problems. I see things so differently now than I used to! I guess I just never like to have blanket statements about scooters (and I guess I am guilty of going the other way) and how people are too "fat", "lazy" and like to use them as "toys". I take it personally because my fil has chronic heart problems, he was born with. He has literally lived 40 years longer than they thought he would. We rent him a scooter at Disneyland all the time and will next month at WDW. I cannot tell you the rude, hurtful comments we have endured. He will get up walk a bit to stretch his legs or go into a store to buy an ice cream cone and this is looked at as some sort of federal offense. I had a lady assure me that God would punish us for lying about a handicap to get to the front of the line (a phenomenon that doesn't even exist). Sure, I have seen people who appear to be abusing the scooter thing. But the bottom line is that so many people enjoy WDW and other places that require a lot of walking because of those scooters. As for picking up a scooter for one reason or another, they aren't that heavy. Think about it, what good do these things do for handicapped people with health problems if they can't be lifted into a car or over a curb? They are meant to be conveniences to help make life a little easier. There will always be people who abuse anything and scooters are no exception. Just try to remember that there is a story behind every person and you may not know all the parts to it just by looking.

 

[Woodcourt]

Well, at first when reading this, I thought, this is a silly discussion with people having some valid points and have read this all here before..

So, this is what I think.

First, if you need a scooter, use one. Who cares what anyone else thinks or says, you are at Disneyworld and the person looking at you funny, getting irritated, or whispering under their breath will probably never see you again. Enjoy yourself!

Also, I am the mom of three (now one is only three weeks old and hasnt been yet), but I have gotten cranky people making comments and getting irritated waiting for me, my small children (last trip, age 1 and 2 1/2 last May), our bags and stroller to get on the bus or get bumped by the stroller as we are walking etc. But, you know what, we dont let that get us down. I smile, be as nice as I can and enjoy being at Disneyworld.

Its like a crying baby on an airplane. People get irritated, but really, do you think the mom wants to have a crying baby.

So, my thoughts are...lets be more patient and just realize that its not our place to guess what people are doing and why even waste good Disney air on venting about it! Enjoy yourself. Dont worry about who gets upset with you! You are at Disneyworld!!!!

 

[Talking Hands]

I'm afraid this is a problem without a solution - but I think for starters that Dis should put speed governors on these things that would limit the top end to the walking pace of the average adult.

From what I have been told by castmembers the Disney ECVs do have a speed governor. They are certainly slower than a normal scooter. But offsite rentals do not nor do privately owned scooters and power wheelhchairs.
Also be careful not to hit the controller on a power wheelchair. It is very sensitive and hitting the drivers arm, hand or the controller itseld can cause the chair to turn and bite your feet.

 

[Talking Hands]

I'm afraid this is a problem without a solution - but I think for starters that Dis should put speed governors on these things that would limit the top end to the walking pace of the average adult.

From what I have been told by castmembers the Disney ECVs do have a speed governor. They are certainly slower than a normal scooter. But offsite rentals do not nor do privately owned scooters and power wheelhchairs.
Also be careful not to hit the controller on a power wheelchair. It is very sensitive and hitting the drivers arm, hand or the controller itseld can cause the chair to turn and bite your feet.