Just a crazy idea about FastPass running

[bcla]

I'm wondering what would happen if someone sent a runners to collect FP using photocopies of the tickets. Obviously this wouldn't work to get into the parks, but the machines themselves don't seem to be anything more than barcode readers, unless perhaps there's something else to them that checks the tickets. Maybe some RFID tag or other technology in a ticket or annual passport.

 

[todzwife]

I don't understand why you'd want to do that? You can only have 1 fast pass at a time (except for the few that are disconnected)

 

[ParkHopper1]

Yeah....even though no fraud is intended, the disadvantages of possibly getting ejected for fraudulent tickets would far outweigh any benefits of time savings.

What would the benefit be?

 

[bcla]

I don't understand why you'd want to do that? You can only have 1 fast pass at a time (except for the few that are disconnected)

I was thinking of someone using a set to run for passes at DCA while another gets passes at DL, since they're not specifically linked.

The thought that maybe a CM notices and sees it as something suspicious did cross my mind.

 

[AussieCaribou]

The passes need to be activated for the park on the day. We go to one park and get passed, cross to other and get passes. When we can get next passes, we cross back.

 

[bethbuchall]

The passes need to be activated for the park on the day. We go to one park and get passed, cross to other and get passes. When we can get next passes, we cross back.

They only need to be activated in one park for the day. I ran from Disneyland over to California Adventure with my husband's and son's tickets and got RSR FastPasses for all of us and then went back to Disneyland for a few more hours before we all headed to DCA.

One way using photocopies could have helped us when they went back for a mid-day rest and I stayed in the parks. There were a couple of times that I would have liked to have obtained FastPasses for all of us to use when they got back, but they had their tickets back at the hotel with them so that they could re-enter the park. I could have held their tickets and met them outside the gates, but it wasn't that big of a deal. (And I'd never risk using photocopies...it's just a time that I could see them being "helpful.")

We didn't need it, but it would also come in handy when people are running for WoC, Frozen, and RSR FastPasses at the same time.

 

[julesann]

I'm uncomfortable with the idea of photocopies. Somehow, although not fraudulent per se, it feels like cheating a system that is set up to make it as fair as possible.

 

[avalon451]

On a side note, I'm interested to find out when they do institute a new FP+ system as was talked about earlier in the summer... the idea of it being that you can obtain FPs once in the park via your smartphone. I like that idea, rather than "running."

 

[bethbuchall]

I'm uncomfortable with the idea of photocopies. Somehow, although not fraudulent per se, it feels like cheating a system that is set up to make it as fair as possible.

I agree. I think that the question was just a hypothetical one. Sometimes it's interesting to think through things like that.

 

[bethbuchall]

On a side note, I'm interested to find out when they do institute a new FP+ system as was talked about earlier in the summer... the idea of it being that you can obtain FPs once in the park via your smartphone. I like that idea, rather than "running."

Having experienced both, I much prefer the standard FP.

 

[julesann]

I agree. I think that the question was just a hypothetical one. Sometimes it's interesting to think through things like that.

Thanks-Beth--it was a long day

 

[Kittyskyfish]

Hm! That's pretty creative! I don't see a technical problem with it. The duplicate card can't get an extra FP ticket because the machines issue one FP per guest, not based on the number of cards inserted. Any additional attempts will be declined once the first card is scanned and a FP is distributed. It doesn't game the system.

If you scan the duplicate first, the original park pass will be rejected until FP tickets are available again.
If you scan the original park pass first, the duplicate will be rejected until FP tickets are available again.

I can't speak for park policy and what would happen if a CM caught you using a duplicate card in the FP machines. You're on your own there.

 

[SMD]

Hm! That's pretty creative! I don't see a technical problem with it. The duplicate card can't get an extra FP ticket because the machines issue one FP per guest, not based on the number of cards inserted. Any additional attempts will be declined once the first card is scanned and a FP is distributed. It doesn't game the system.

If you scan the duplicate first, the original park pass will be rejected until FP tickets are available again.
If you scan the original park pass first, the duplicate will be rejected until FP tickets are available again.

I can't speak for park policy and what would happen if a CM caught you using a duplicate card in the FP machines. You're on your own there.

It is gaming the system because the system assumes that only one copy of each ticket exists, and that FPs aren't being obtained at 2 different parks in a shorter period of time than one can walk between parks. Anyone doing this is unfairly decreasing FP availability for other guests who are using the system as intended.

 

[bcla]

Hm! That's pretty creative! I don't see a technical problem with it. The duplicate card can't get an extra FP ticket because the machines issue one FP per guest, not based on the number of cards inserted. Any additional attempts will be declined once the first card is scanned and a FP is distributed. It doesn't game the system.

If you scan the duplicate first, the original park pass will be rejected until FP tickets are available again.
If you scan the original park pass first, the duplicate will be rejected until FP tickets are available again.

I can't speak for park policy and what would happen if a CM caught you using a duplicate card in the FP machines. You're on your own there.

I was thinking of different scenarios, such as running between DL and DCA, one even a group getting lunch at Downtown Disney or hanging back in a hotel room while one runner gets passes. I think it's gaming the system when one can send a runner in the first place, and there the loophole that the ticket can be used for the day but still used to collect passes at the other park where it was never presented for entrance.

 

[Kittyskyfish]

It is gaming the system because the system assumes that only one copy of each ticket exists, and that FPs aren't being obtained at 2 different parks in a shorter period of time than one can walk between parks. Anyone doing this is unfairly decreasing FP availability for other guests who are using the system as intended.

DLP's central computer system recognizes the barcode as a unique account. Fast Passes are distributed based on that individual account's activity. It doesn't matter if the Fast Pass machine scans a duplicate or an original - the duplicated barcode accesses the same account. Once any of those those cards are used, it suspends the account's ability to get more Fast Passes until the next time available to scan. Once a FP is drawn, then both the original and the duplicate are ineligible to get more FP until the ticket says so.

The time saved is similar to that of a normal runner hopping between parks with regular park tickets, leaving the family behind to do other things. That is an "unfair" advantage to those who only wish to get their own tickets, but we are long since adjusted to the concept of a runner.

 

[Kittyskyfish]

@bcla , everything you described can be done with original tickets. There is nothing new to runners going ahead to the other park to get FPs, or to enter back in and get them while the rest are eating lunch or shopping in DTD. If we go to app-based FP distribution or wristbands, then that second modality will act as a duplicate to the park pass, just as what you are considering on paper. Bands, apps, paper duplicates. They all access the same account, and if a person used them all, the central computer system still will not issue more FPs than a person with only a park pass.

I think the issue of a runner is a separate argument. One benefit of the runner is it makes the FP line quicker. It's quicker for one person to get six FPs than for six people to get six FPs, as there is a time cost in moving from one person to the next.

 

[bethbuchall]

@bcla , everything you described can be done with original tickets. There is nothing new to runners going ahead to the other park to get FPs, or to enter back in and get them while the rest are eating lunch or shopping in DTD. If we go to app-based FP distribution or wristbands, then that second modality will act as a duplicate to the park pass, just as what you are considering on paper. Bands, apps, paper duplicates. They all access the same account, and if a person used them all, the central computer system still will not issue more FPs than a person with only a park pass.

I think the issue of a runner is a separate argument. One benefit of the runner is it makes the FP line quicker. It's quicker for one person to get six FPs than for six people to get six FPs, as there is a time cost in moving from one person to the next.

I guess I didn't see it as gaming the system. I saw it more as keeping the FP line clearer in the same way that I would do within a single park. Oops! They had lunch or a snack while I went and got the FPs. I missed out on lunch/snack. I guess I should have brought them with me to all the FP machines.

 

[bcla]

@bcla , everything you described can be done with original tickets. There is nothing new to runners going ahead to the other park to get FPs, or to enter back in and get them while the rest are eating lunch or shopping in DTD. If we go to app-based FP distribution or wristbands, then that second modality will act as a duplicate to the park pass, just as what you are considering on paper. Bands, apps, paper duplicates. They all access the same account, and if a person used them all, the central computer system still will not issue more FPs than a person with only a park pass.

I think the issue of a runner is a separate argument. One benefit of the runner is it makes the FP line quicker. It's quicker for one person to get six FPs than for six people to get six FPs, as there is a time cost in moving from one person to the next.

Of course this was just a what if scenario. A runner carrying original tickets is going to spend time meeting up with the rest of the group and may even have to exit and reenter. I was also thinking of the possibility that two passes (one each at DL and DCA) could theoretically be pulled seconds apart, even though it's a physical impossibility to do so with the same original ticket.

 

[agamble]

I think it would be somewhat difficult to photocopy a ticket anyway. They are a specific size and thickness and the machines could easily reject them. I think the danger doesn't lie so much in Dad running to DCA to get FP for his whole family while Mom keeps them at DL to get FP for the family there. That is only a minor plus and saves very little time overall as Dad could just have grabbed the DL FP on his way to DCA. The bigger issue would lie with multiple families or groups using copied tickets together. For example Family A wants to spend the day at DL and Family B wants to spend the day at DCA. If they gave eachother copies of their tickets it would allow each family to get double FP at the park they are in. That would definitely be gaming the system. I do not know how smart the machines are, and I hope they are able to tell photocopied tickets, but if they're not then this is another way that the rumored App FP could be better. Though I suppose you could potentially give someone your login and share FP availability between parks too, unless the new system only allows you to have a FP at one park or the other.

 

[SMD]

The FP machines don't recognize the ticket media or thickness. Here's a tip. Instead of putting each ticket in individually, just leave each ticket in the machine and put the next ticket on top until all FPs have come out. You can get 8-10 in there. Then pull all the tickets out in one stack. That's how CMs do it, and it cuts down on accidentally scanning a ticket twice and having to figure out which one you missed to get that last FP.

I don't see runners so much as gaming the system. When it's crowded, CMs often recommend one party member get all FPs. Plus, if someone wants to leave their group and miss something to get FPs, that's their choice. But making a second copy of a ticket so that you can obtain an FP in DL while similtaneous obtaining an FP in DCA is definitely not how the system was intended to be used. That fact that it requires a second copy of the ticket which Disney doesn't provide means it's gaming the system.