IUI vs. ICI

[Pea-n-Me]

The problem I see with using donor sperm is that there is no guarantee that a pregnancy and/or child is going to be problem free that way, either. There's always the possibility you could be trading one set of problems for another. But the reality is there are never any guarantees with reproduction, period. (We have faced similar decisions as well so not making light of these choices in any way.) If the biggest issue is the genetic factor, then technology is such that the odds of having a successful pregnancy and healthy baby are in your favor (we are forunate today to have these options available - go to the absolute BEST center you can find). The biggest hurdles I see are financial (it's expensive), physical (the IVF process is taxing), emotional (are you prepared to deal with unsuccessful cycles - which could also happen with IUI) and moral (already stated). You'll need to do some soul searching and then get your medical and financial facts straight before you make your decisions.

 

[themarquis]

The OP didn't mention using donor sperm (that was suggested by others).

We're also considering using a sperm donor which is where the IUI or ICI would come in, I think. I haven't done any research about any of this.

The OP brought it up -- it wasn't suggested by others.

 

[crashbb]

The OP brought it up -- it wasn't suggested by others.

Yup, you're right. I forgot that line.

 

[satorifound]

I did a surrogacy and for our PGD I had to fly to NYC to get it done. I am sure there are more doctors who do it though... This one had been recommended by the clinic as he founded the process. That said, I do NOT recommend him. I just wish I could remember his name.

 

[BEloveDisney]

Right this second, I think we are leaning more towards donor sperm. Having just terminated a pregnancy at 15 weeks and 2 days, there is absolutely no way that I can do that again. Aside from the obvious emotional pain, it was by far, the most physically painful thing I have ever experienced. My husband has flat out refused to have me get pregnant if there isn't a "really good chance that the baby wouldn't have the same issues as Carrick (our son) and this baby" he went on further to say that he can't have it be his fault again which I understand. That's what is making us think donor sperm is the way to go.

 

[kbeverina]

In a word - NO! Sorry, but you have no idea what you are talking about.

Agree--that information is incorrect. I don't know why you would post information like that when you really don't understand what you're talking about.

My sister looked at PGD through this clinic:

http://www.givf.com/geneticservices/whatispgd.shtml

I think they have 100% guarantees on IVF, but not sure about PGD combined with IVF. I totally understand how your husband feels--my sister's son is the youngest cousin. After he was born, there was a lot of genetic testing and consulting just to figure out what was going on with him and, through that, we learned that my other sister and I have sons that also have the syndrome, just a much milder form of it, therefore all three of us sisters were carriers. We counted our blessings and decided to stop with the children we had.

At the time, we didn't know how my nephew was going to do, or that he would even make it past a few years. I really hurt for you because I remember that feeling of not wanting to have another child who would suffer like that. Fortunately, my nephew is 9 now mentally 100% and so, so smart, but he has many physical challenges.

What really struck me when we were deep in research trying to figure out what we were facing, is how much the understanding of genetics has changed since we were in school and learned about Mendel and dominant/recessive, etc. There is so much gray area in how genes are expressed. How the genes are expressed in one child may not be how the same genes are expressed in another child. Talking to a genetics counselor at one of these clinics would give you a better idea of your chances with each try of PGD. But, all in all, it sounds like going with a donor is going to be a good option for you, and since you have no problems conceiving and carrying a baby, you should easily be able to go that route.

 

[SandrA9810]

Well I'm not a doctor or scientist, and I was only trying to read up on the information briefly from the internet. It just seemed that each half of the chromosome was on the other half. So my thought line was that if they're divided and put with a complete one, it would make it imbalanced.

1 1 - 2 2
1 2 - 2 1 is the husband's chromosome

1 1 - 2 2
1 1 - 2 2 is the wife's

When his half meets her half, it creates an imbalance no matter which way you slice it. But he's normal since each side has balanced the other side. Guess there's more to the splicing and dicing than I thought when it comes down to it.

My family has it's own set of genetic issues, and I still really haven't figured it all out. Especially when it comes to how much one out of sync chromosome can really affect a girl or a boy. And how much of a dominant gene it really is (even though it was thought to be recessive).

Ohh and for the record, you know how you go over the dominant/recessive genes in plants sometime in middle school... yeah, I fail that year in science.

 

[satorifound]

PGD can be done after you are pregnant also. It is not only done on embryos. They insert a needle into your belly and take a sample so there is a risk of miscarriage with this.

 

[Bungle]

I know nothing about either one of these treatments (is that the right word?)

My husband and I just had to terminate a pregnancy due to a genetic condition. Our son was born last year and only lived two weeks due to the same condition. (My husband has a balanced translocation and our son and this last baby had an unbalanced translocation)

We're considering IVF with PGD, but it's so expensive. We're also considering using a sperm donor which is where the IUI or ICI would come in, I think. I haven't done any research about any of this.

Fertility is not an issue in that I've been able to get pregnant, we just can't get the genes to line up right.

What's the difference in success rates and cost for IUI and ICI (or whatever its called)?

Any experience with any of this?

First of all No matter which one you choose it will not be easy. IVF with PGD is expensive, but there are things that can help, getting into a study (where most or all) medications are covered would be ideal, then there is trying to find a clinic that has a garauntee would be next but most of those do not cover PGD. Do you have any fertility coverage at all?

IUI is semen inserted with a catheter into the uterus, ICI is where the sample is just placed in the cervix. IUI has better success rates. Using an ovulation inducing drug will also increase your chances of success. Success rates will depend on clinic and medications use. Usually if you are not pregnant within 4-6 IUIs you will be referred for IVF.

A good clinic will go over procedures, cost, and what to expect with you. The emotion side of it is hard to grasp until you are in the middle of it though. My children are not so far apart by choice, I've been down this road too, and it sucks, but totally worth it in the end.

Not sure how much more help I can be but you can pm me anytime.

 

[BEloveDisney]

Prior to getting pregnant with this baby, there was a 13-26% chance that a child of ours would have some kind of chromosomal issues (Either what Carrick had, the opposite genetic problem, or balanced like my husband). I would assume that since it has happened again those number would change and it would be more likely to happen again.

I'm fairly certain that my insurance doesn't have any fertility coverage. There's a chance that the meds would be covered. I've heard of doctors coding things differently to get things covered.

 

[Pea-n-Me]

I doubt you would need to do drugs since becoming pregnant is not an issue for you. You don't want to wind up with multiple babies at once.

I also don't know that your statistics have changed.

But all good questions to ask the RE and/or geneticist.

 

[crashbb]

Well I'm not a doctor or scientist, and I was only trying to read up on the information briefly from the internet.

...snip...

Ohh and for the record, you know how you go over the dominant/recessive genes in plants sometime in middle school... yeah, I fail that year in science.

I don't mean this meanly, but honestly, if you don't know what you are talking about (as you yourself stated), you are probably best not to post it as fact on the a discussion board.

And yes, genetics is far more complicated than taught in high school.

To the PP - I'm pretty sure that PGD cannot be done the way you suggested (amniocentesis). It is Pre-Implantation Genetic Diagnosis, so it is only done pre-Implantation (embryo or earlier). Testing can be done later, but not PGD.

OP - your odds are likely about the same, you were just "unlucky" (sorry, I don't mean to suggest luck or not, but cannot think of a better term), both times. However, can I totally understand wanting to go with a sperm donor, to bypass the issue completely.

I'm in Canada, so things are different here, but I'm wondering if your insurance would cover the fertility treatment if it was phrased as "preventing a case of the genetic disease" (as distasteful as that phrasing is). I know that sometimes, it is all about how you approach the insurance company.

 

[BEloveDisney]

I don't mean this meanly, but honestly, if you don't know what you are talking about (as you yourself stated), you are probably best not to post it as fact on the a discussion board.

And yes, genetics is far more complicated than taught in high school.

To the PP - I'm pretty sure that PGD cannot be done the way you suggested (amniocentesis). It is Pre-Implantation Genetic Diagnosis, so it is only done pre-Implantation (embryo or earlier). Testing can be done later, but not PGD.

OP - your odds are likely about the same, you were just "unlucky" (sorry, I don't mean to suggest luck or not, but cannot think of a better term), both times. However, can I totally understand wanting to go with a sperm donor, to bypass the issue completely.

I'm in Canada, so things are different here, but I'm wondering if your insurance would cover the fertility treatment if it was phrased as "preventing a case of the genetic disease" (as distasteful as that phrasing is). I know that sometimes, it is all about how you approach the insurance company.

I agree that we were unlucky. There isn't a better term as far as I'm concerned.

I think you are right that PGD can't be done with an amnio/cvs testing since both are done after the baby is already implanted and is developing. If I had to wait that long to do it, I absolutely would not be getting pregnant. There is no way that I would willingly submit my husband and myself to that again. I absolutely can not wait that long to end a pregnancy or give birth to a baby that I know is going to die.

I do wonder if there's some way to work with the wording with the insurance company.

 

[satorifound]

To the PP - I'm pretty sure that PGD cannot be done the way you suggested (amniocentesis). It is Pre-Implantation Genetic Diagnosis, so it is only done pre-Implantation (embryo or earlier). Testing can be done later, but not PGD.
nor, to bypass the issue completely.
.

I thought they had called whatever I had done PGD. After looking it up, just now, I was confused. I had nuchal translucency screening. This is the one they do at 10-14 weeks in utero. There are too many things we get done as surrogates, and that PGD term was flying around in my head. Sorry bout that.

 

[tlbwriter]

There's a blog I read by a woman whose husband has a balanced translocation. Her husband wasn't open to donor sperm (he was adopted and apparently it was handled horribly, and he was convinced that any nonbio child would have the same bad experiences he did) so they did PGD, and it didn't work - they transferred supposedly healthy embryos that actually had the translocation. And the "guarantee" simply meant the clinic would do another cycle for free, which isn't much of an option if you're trying to avoid miscarriage or termination. Statistically you'd think they would have at least one healthy pregnancy out of four, but they ended up with thirteen pregnancies, I think, and three children (one set of twins). It's a very long, hard road. Doing IUI or ICI with donor sperm is a very good option. And since you're fertile, ICI may be completely appropriate. You might want to look for forums that are specific to this procedure.

 

[BEloveDisney]

Thank you!