It's Father's Day and I am TRULY BLESSED!

[dcentity2000]

she had a miscarriage, and I was incredibly relieved

OK, nice that you now, half a decade on, have a different opinion, but dude...

Seriously...

NOT cool.



Rich::

 

[KristaTX]

Sorry to hear your wife had a miscarriage and while she was suffering, you were 'incredibly relieved'. I imagine that was a very lonely place for her to be.

Okay, so this is not directed at poohandwendy, but as a general question. I just don't quite understand why everyone can't try to understand that he felt some relief, but was probably quite sad for his wife. It makes me wonder something. . .

What if a woman posted here on Mother's Day that at some point years ago she had had an abortion and that she felt a sense of relief afterwards because she wasn't ready to be a mother. But that the father had been upset about the abortion because he really wanted the baby? And then later they had twins, and she had really come to love and enjoy those kids?

I can understand how some of you might be upset at how Papa Deuce felt, and at first I was like "Huh??". But it is how he felt and he was just saying so. I'm not trying to stir up an abortion debate. But I just get the feeling that some of you are being too hard on him, when some of the same ones of you might be all hugs and pixie dust with the hypothetical woman who had felt relief when she got an abortion but then posted about having grown to love being a mother to her now 5-year-old twins.

I am not going to debate anything on any side. I just wanted to point out that there might be a double standard that some people need to think about.

 

[FlowersChild]

Papa Deuce I have not seen many of your posts, but I want to say that I am so happy for you I wish only the best for you and your children and your wife Blessings and Peace to you and your family

 

[va32h]

I can understand how some of you might be upset at how Papa Deuce felt, and at first I was like "Huh??". But it is how he felt and he was just saying so. I'm not trying to stir up an abortion debate. But I just get the feeling that some of you are being too hard on him, when some of the same ones of you might be all hugs and pixie dust with the hypothetical woman who had felt relief when she got an abortion but then posted about having grown to love being a mother to her now 5-year-old twins.

This makes me say Huh? I think you are assuming a lot. In the first place, what has abortion got to do with anything? That's just bringing in something that was never remotely referenced in the thread - and for no reason except to cast a negative light on those of us who were critical of the OP.

Second, I think people would be far less forgiving of a woman who stated that it took her four years be happy with her children. Women are presumed to have a maternal instinct that predates actual birth or even pregnancy.

Third, "that's how he feels and he's just saying so" is not an excuse for saying things that are quite hurtful. Speaking as the grown child of a father who wasn't into the baby thing, and didn't really want to have kids - no amount of parental interest and devotion later on makes up for the knowledge that your own father did not really want you to be born.

Is it okay to have those feelings? Yes, although I personally find them rather odious feelings, yes it's okay to feel that way. Is it okay to share them in a context in which the mother of those kids - or those kids themselves - might read those hurtful words? That's a big fat "no" from me.

 

[N.Bailey]

I think I can understand what you're saying to a certain extent PD. I too am going to get flamed, but here goes anyway.

When I found out I was pregnant with my son I was so happy. I had bought a home pregnancy test at one point hoping beyond all hope that I was pregnant. Later that same evening, I got my you know what and I was really bummed. A couple months later, I just decided to take the test just to see how it works. I was shocked when the thing tested positive and ran out and bought another that was positive, then a 3rd for confirmation. LOL I was so happy and so was my husband.

I had my son in November, and well, I got pregnant again somewhere around March because my daughter came along the following December. I was on the pill and obviously it didn't work. I was so depressed the entire pregnancy. I'm unable to put all my thoughts and feelings into words really, but I'd cry at every little thing. I was losing my lap again and that made it difficult to hold my son toward the end. You name it, I thought of every negative thing this imaginable during my 2nd pregnancy. I just felt so cheated out of getting the time to really enjoy my son. When I had my daughter, I wasn't really thrilled at first. I was so sick (I hemorrhaged) when I delivered her and had a horrible delivery. I will spare everyone the gory details, but I wasn't well for 2 days afterward, so I really didn't get much time with her at first. Once I started feeling better though, I was holding her and I seen a tiny tear in her eye. I'm sure it wasn't a tear, but that didn't matter. I immediately was in love with her and so ashamed of myself. I couldn't believe that I couldn't see the bigger picture sooner, but I just didn't see it. I just cried and cried for how I'd felt earlier.

I have talked to my daughter and told her all about my feelings. I am ashamed of how I felt, but I just tell my daughter that God knew what was best for me, even when I couldn't see straight. She knows how loved she is and she knows there isn't a thing in this world that I wouldn't do for her.

Sometimes, it really does just take time. I'm sure you're not anymore proud of your actions than I am of mine.

Happy Father's Day!

 

[L107ANGEL]

This makes me say Huh? I think you are assuming a lot. In the first place, what has abortion got to do with anything? That's just bringing in something that was never remotely referenced in the thread - and for no reason except to cast a negative light on those of us who were critical of the OP.

Second, I think people would be far less forgiving of a woman who stated that it took her four years be happy with her children. Women are presumed to have a maternal instinct that predates actual birth or even pregnancy.

Third, "that's how he feels and he's just saying so" is not an excuse for saying things that are quite hurtful. Speaking as the grown child of a father who wasn't into the baby thing, and didn't really want to have kids - no amount of parental interest and devotion later on makes up for the knowledge that your own father did not really want you to be born.

Is it okay to have those feelings? Yes, although I personally find them rather odious feelings, yes it's okay to feel that way. Is it okay to share them in a context in which the mother of those kids - or those kids themselves - might read those hurtful words? That's a big fat "no" from me.

Another excellent post!

 

[PatriciaH]

You are not alone:

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1202940,00.html

Studies reveal that most married couples start out happy and then become progressively less satisfied over the course of their lives, becoming especially disconsolate when their children are in diapers and in adolescence, and returning to their initial levels of happiness only after their children have had the decency to grow up and go away. When the popular press invented a malady called "empty-nest syndrome," it failed to mention that its primary symptom is a marked increase in smiling.

Psychologists have measured how people feel as they go about their daily activities, and have found that people are less happy when they are interacting with their children than when they are eating, exercising, shopping or watching television. Indeed, an act of parenting makes most people about as happy as an act of housework. Economists have modeled the impact of many variables on people's overall happiness and have consistently found that children have only a small impact. A small negative impact.

 

[goofygirl]

Some of you may know, as I have mentioned before, that I am not a "kid" person. I just don't really enjoy children for the most part.

And, as my kids turned 5 just about a week ago, I sit here and feel truly blessed. I never wanted kids at all. I hoped that my wife never became pregant before I turned 40, as I told her before I was married that if we didn't have kids by the time I was 40, I was getting snipped.

Then, at age 37 I found out my wife was pregnant. I was not happy about it for myself, but was "OK" with it because it made my wife very happy. Then she had a miscarriage, and I was incredibly relieved. At age 38, I found myself again, going to be a father, and again, I was not at all happy for myself. But I was "resigned" to the fact that I was going to be a father. So, imagine my surprise, when 3 weeks after the first ultrasound, the doctor found another baby --- I was going to be a father of TWINS!

I really wasn't happy now! But, since I had told my wife that we could try UNTIL I was 40, I kept my mouth shut.

Then the babies were born, and still, I wasn't all that happy. There was a small part of me that was, but overall.... NOPE, not happy.

Years 1 and 2 went by, and I still wasn't all that excited. Sleepless nights, loss of free time, constant crying and minor illnesses in my children, and it wasn't getting any better for me.

Then came year 3. Slowly but surely I was getting a little bit happier. I was getting "some" sleep. My kids were able to verbalize things instead of just crying all the time. And, I started to enjoy them. And as year 3 went on, it only got better. I am NOT a patient man. And those first few years taught me to learn "some" patience, or else I would have literally exploded, I felt like.

And then came year 4. It was in this year that my love for my kids really grew by leaps and bounds. They weren't babies anymore. I was bonding with them now! And I could "feel" their love for me! That was so special! I hadn't expected it. And I couldn't believe how wonderful it felt! And I couldn't believe how much love I was feeeling towards them, too! It was just the greatest feeling ever.

So, now they are 5. And they are literally busting at the seams to help me celebrate Father''s Day! Breakfast in bed, presents, and a trip to the park is on the agenda for later today.

These last 2 years have been AWESOME! I feel so BLESSED most of the time. Sure, we still have bad moments, but by and large my children are my biggest joy, and the best thing I have ever done in my life. I feel LUCKY to be able to guide them in their lives. I feel PRIVILEGED to have kids who love me so much.

I can't wait to wake up later today!

Happy Father's Day Dads!

PapaDeuce, I like you, I really do. But I don't really "get" you.

I don't get that if you really didn't want kids in the first place, then why didn't you seek out a mate who felt the same way? Sounds like you and your wife weren't exactly on the "same page" with this issue.

I don't get NOT using better birth control-more carefully, if you didn't really want kids- especially after accident#1.

I don't get having kids if you are not a "kid person". I would never advise a person who is not a "cat person" to get a cat, let alone a non-kid person to have a kid.

I CAN understand feeling relief at a miscarriage since I know I would feel the same way. (and all you anti-abortion people, PLEASE take your agenda elsewhere, OK?)

BUT- I have to give you some credit. While a lot of men who didn't want to be fathers would bail out and leave the woman alone to raise them, you did NOT do that. You stuck around, and you are happy about it. At least you are a real man, and not a deadbeat dad or absentee dad.

Happy Fathers Day!!

 

[jipsy]

To quote someone from a totally different post:

wow, just wow

It's your choice, but don't be surprised if you end up in a really craptastic old folks home one day.

 

[jimmalru80]

Happy Fathers Day. Every day with your children is a gift.

 

[bumcat]

We get that people change thru the years, some for worse and some for better. We get that you did change.
Here's what I don't get, you said it was you doing everything for them after they were born. How on earth do you not bond with them if you were right there doing everything for them 24/7? Sorry I just don't get that. Sounds like something wasn't wired correctly. Is it possible you were angry because you had to do everything so you put a wall up? Just trying to get it here...

 

[chobie]

I think all of us who either are, or who are married to, men who fell in love with their kids from either before or right after birth should be incredibly thankful. My DH did not really want one either, but when he he saw that first ultrasound and the first time he held his DD in his arms... My grandmother told him years ago that he could worry about money and all that, but the first time he held his child in his arms he would feel like the richest man in the world. My Dh has never forgotten those words and repeats it quite often even though our babies are 9 and 12.

 

[Aidensmom]

Thank you for this post, it makes me extremely grateful for my husband who has always loved our son more than life itself, though he was unplanned and we were unmarried when he was conceived.

I am sorry that you seem to have missed out on all of the signs of how much they loved and adored you from the day they were born, even between their crying and temper tantrums and illnesses. It's something you'll never be able to experience again. I too read your post as though you couldn't really feel love for your children till they were "easier" and were able to really show you how they felt about you, and I hope that is not really true. Cherish your children, through good times and bad times, they are truly a gift.

 

[MosMom]

Well, at least you won't be having anymore!

 

[cteddiesgirl]

Well, Happy Father's Day.

While I personally can't wait to be able to have kids, I can understand why some do. I would also never marry a man who obviously doesn't care to have children. Heck, I won't even waste my time with someone like that. Even though I realize that in time they may come around. When I was younger, I might have considered it, but at my current age, I won't.

While the way you started out was terrible in many people's view (mine included), I am very truly happy that you finally came around and are now a good and loving father. Many fathers never do (I've known too many of them).

I also feel extremely blessed today. Yesterday, my very active dad had a mild heart attack. If the friends he was with had not called the paramedics and if he had not finally consented to getting checked out by them, he would now be gone. After getting checked out, they found a 97% blockage of one artery. And there still may be more after the stintz that they put in.

But, as I said, I feel very blessed that the friends he was with were quick thinking and that I still have a father around to have a Father's Day with.

Truly, I am very glad for your happy (Disney-like) ending.

 

[Laura]

This thread makes me realize how wonderful a man my father is. He tells me often that he's loved me since the day I was born--even before I was born. Thanks, Dad!

 

[Desnik]

KristaTX
You cannot in any way compare a person who does not want a baby and then decides to have an abortion to a person who wants a baby and then miscarries. I have people very close to me who have had an abortion and I myself have suffered a miscarriage and it is NOT the same.

 

[Buckalew11]

A crappy old folks home?

Honestly, if the man is a descent father now, even though he may not have wanted kids to begin with, why would you say that? My goodness, you all seem so focused on the negative part of his post. PD seems like a good dad from most posts I have ever read. We can't really know what anyone is like as a parent from posting on the DIS but he certainly comes across as a decent man and father. I had a grandfather who was a crappy dad to his 3 kids and they still didn't put him in a crappy old folks home when the time came.

I thought KristaTX made a good point. Just because a mom may have made a desicion earlier in her life not to have a baby, doesn't mean we should judge what kind of mother she is to her kids now. I think the two can be compared in a way even though they aren't the same situations.
N. Bailey also had some good thoughts. I have known people who have also had those exact feelings.

For whatever reason, PD is very commonly ripped a new one and he seems like a tough skinned soul who can take the heat but I really think people are focusing too much on one part of his post and seem to skip the other part. Oh well.

 

[KristaTX]

In the first place, what has abortion got to do with anything?

It has nothing to do with the political debate over abortion. I was not saying anything politically about abortion, so I don't appreciate your implying that I am trying to change subjects and turn this into an abortion debate. I am not, and I know very well that it is pointless to discuss one's stance on abortion on the DIS.

However, miscarriage is also known as spontaneous abortion. So for a woman to feel relief about not mothering a child by choosing to have an induced abortion is not much different from a father feeling relief over an abortion (spontaneous or induced) - especially if he and his mate weren't trying to become parents in the first place. But it seems that here on the DIS we can't allow a man to admit to any feelings other than positive ones about being or becoming a father .

I was simply saying that the feelings might be very similar for a man or a woman no matter which type of abortion it is (induced or spontaneous) if that person does not feel like they are ready to become a parent. And maybe you would also blast her, va32h, but my point was simply that if that hypothetical situation were posted by a woman on the DIS, I just don't think the overall reaction would be the same. Even though the feeling of relief felt by Papa Deuce or that hypothetical mother who had the abortion might be nearly identical. Like I said, I think there would be a lot of hugs and pixie dust.

I'm not friends with Papa Deuce, and I think he can be kind of abrasive or opinionated (sorry, Papa Deuce). Perhaps his wording could have been more tactful. I'm just attempting to see this from his perspective. But some of you are acting like he is the most horrible person ever, or using this as an opportunity to vent your feelings about him as a poster in general.

From the way it sounds, he is adjusting at parenthood better than a LOT of people. Just think of how many parents never adjust. I've seen TONS more bad parenting issues that people think are terrific (mostly women since the men are either too nice or too afraid to post anything negative about being a parent or husband) posted here on the DIS. If the fact that he has had to warm up to fatherhood is the worst parenting example you've ever read here, then count yourself lucky.

 

[KristaTX]

KristaTX
You cannot in any way compare a person who does not want a baby and then decides to have an abortion to a person who wants a baby and then miscarries. I have people very close to me who have had an abortion and I myself have suffered a miscarriage and it is NOT the same.

Perhaps not the pregnant woman. I would wholeheartedly agree with you on that. But I am not so sure about the father.