Is it Racist?

[Charade]

That speaks volumes about race in our society....sad, very sad.

I disagree. I don't think it speaks volumes because I don't think that attitude isn't as prevalent as some people think. I believe there are people like that, which is sad, but I would bet (a Mickey bar) that the majority of white folk don't care what color a person a candidate is.

OTH, I DO believe that the majority of black folk WOULD vote for a black candidate over a white candidate with most all other things being equal.

 

[java]

Dawn the point I was trying to make is that you vote based on what YOU know. Others vote based on what THEY know. Everyone votes based on their own personal lives as well as what they believe is best for all. But the bottom line is what is best for one isn't always best for the other. And you do post about the most controversial member of the democratic party which is why I call it pot stirring.

 

[inthemood]

I completely agree.

The same thing is happening in my own family, but regarding gender rather than race. My entire family votes democratic and every woman in the family other than my mom and myself have voted for Hilary and numerous of them have specifically stated her gender as a reason to vote for her. One of them said, "Women have to stick together--how will we ever get a woman elected if not Hilary? Who else will have a better shot?" Another one said, "Men have been president for hundreds of years and women have never had a shot. It's our turn now."

Clearly for them it is not merely about favoring a particular gender and they are not sexist against men. They have happily voted for men their entire lives and will do so again if Hilary doesn't get the nomination. In congressional races and state and local races they don't make a big deal of voting for the female democratic candidate over the male one because in those cases the glass ceiling has already been broken and the numbers of women in those offices has risen above 0% (Though it's still abysmally low at 16% which is quite amazing when we consider that Afghanistan has 27%!) So it isn't that they think one should always pick a female democrat over a male democrat.

And a big difference between those who are voting for Hilary because she is a woman and people who will vote for a man over Hilary are the reasons that support this decision. My aunt and grandmother don't assume that merely because Hilary has a ****** she will be a better president than Obama or that men as a group don't have what it takes to be president or that Obama will get his time of the month and screw something up (all of these things actual sexists my father works with have given as reasons for NOT voting for Hilary--now that IS sexism.) It's more that given the two of them are so similar and either would be a fine president, they want to use this election as a chance to make history for women. They rightly find it absolutely disgusting that in 221 years of our nation's history, no woman has ever come close occupying the government's highest office. And that fact is in marked contrast to 42 other countries which have had a female president or prime minister.

(Now I do have one problem with that kind of thinking--I don't understand why they privilege the history-making event of the first female president above the history-making event of the first black president. For me those things are equally important and so making history doesn't help me decide between the two candidates.)

I suspect that the situation of many African-American voters choosing Obama is very similar to the situation of my own female relatives choosing Hilary.

Who will they vote for when it is Obama vs. McCain?
I think this is going to become a very different angle when this is some peoples philosophy.
All we can hope for is that they vote for CHANGE... as both Dem. Candidates stand for, and color is not a factor for them when it comes down to it.

 

[wvrevy]

Doesn't sound all that well informed to me then........

Between thinking we can stay in Iraq without continued violence, adamantly supporting (after, at first, opposing) Bush's Iraq plan, and "bomb, bomb, bomb Iran", I think he's rather well informed, actually.

I agree with your first statement about it being racial rather than racist, but that one is just wrong, IMO.

----

As for the OP...How do you explain the attention and "outrage" over Wright's comments - specifically, the G-D America and "chickens coming home to roost" comments - when there is no matching outrage (at least, from the same people) over loons from the right-wing fringe like Pat Robertson, Jerry Fallwell, and John Hagee? Aside from the color of their skin, exactly what is different between their comments, other than Wright blaming 9/11 on America's foreign policy while the others blamed it on America's "sinful ways"? How do you explain the difference?

 

[Robinrs]

I disagree. I don't think it speaks volumes because I don't think that attitude isn't as prevalent as some people think. I believe there are people like that, which is sad, but I would bet (a Mickey bar) that the majority of white folk don't care what color a person a candidate is.

OTH, I DO believe that the majority of black folk WOULD vote for a black candidate over a white candidate with most all other things being equal.

Nope, we're not cattle OR of one mind.

I look at a person's record and vote accordingly.

 

[Robinrs]

Good morning, Dawn. You forgot to mention that if one doesn't vote for Hilary they're misogynist, and if they don't vote for McCain they're against the troops.
And, of course, if you don't vote for Nader you're anti consumer.

Always "intriguing" ...

 

[LukenDC]

There will be some people who will not vote for Obama because of his race. It is sad, but true. Those people, however, will be a small minority of voters. If Obama does not get elected, it will be because he is a liberal running in a center-right nation.

I have never voted for a person based on their demographics, nor will I ever. I'm a gay man, but I have passed over gay male candidates in favor of the candidate who best represents my views. I find Jeremiah Wright offensive and the fact that Obama has had a close relationship with that man for many years makes me even less inclined to vote for him in Novembver (I've come to accept that Obama will be the nominee. Sigh.).

 

[rayelias]

I think that Obama has the "right" combination for black voters; he is ademocrat and he is black. The African American community did not turn out for Michael Steel, the black, conservative GOP candidate in Maryland.

Or for Alan Keyes, when he lost to Obama in the Senate seat run. (Whom I voted for in the 2000 general election.)

One thing I can say about that area... they sure have some very eloquent orators.

 

[Terry36]

Yes I know it's sad, and if you read some of the replies on most Hillary threads across the internet you'd see that line of thinking. Some will try to spin it to keep their true feelings from being known...example...When one say's "I just can't bring myself to vote for Obama, some are actually saying "I can't bring myself to vote for a black man"

If Obama is nominated, the same people who say "I just can't bring myself to vote for him" would vote against their party, and a better life for their children solely based on the ignorance that was bred into them as children which cycled thru their adulthood. These same people will breed that same ignorance into their children because they have to continue that cycle.

That said, Not knocking anyone for their choices, I just think people should be honest, because some are as transparent as cellophane.

Ditto....

 

[inthemood]

There will be some people who will not vote for Obama because of his race. It is sad, but true. Those people, however, will be a small minority of voters. If Obama does not get elected, it will be because he is a liberal running in a center-right nation.

I have never voted for a person based on their demographics, nor will I ever. I'm a gay man, but I have passed over gay male candidates in favor of the candidate who best represents my views. I find Jeremiah Wright offensive and the fact that Obama has had a close relationship with that man for many years makes me even less inclined to vote for him in Novembver (I've come to accept that Obama will be the nominee. Sigh.).

It is a sad day then.
What about John McCains' groupies...Pat Robertson, Jerry Fallwell, and John Hagee? I don't understand how this is different, or okay.

Please, lets judge all by the same standards.

 

[smartestnumber5]

Who will they vote for when it is Obama vs. McCain?
I think this is going to become a very different angle when this is some peoples philosophy.
All we can hope for is that they vote for CHANGE... as both Dem. Candidates stand for, and color is not a factor for them when it comes down to it.

Oh the aunt and grandmother I'm talking about I think will vote for Obama no problem. They always vote for the democrat--it's just that this time around, they also were seeing their primary vote as a way to break the gender glass ceiling. And I don't get any sense that race is going to matter to them.

Now there are a few other members of the family who usually vote democrat, but who are apparently "worried" about Obama because of his name and because they think he's somehow associated with Muslims . I don't know what they will do when it comes to Obama vs. McCain--I think/hope that their politics will win out over their prejudices (or heck, maybe they'll even see that their prejudices are prejudices!).

 

[LohKee]

I disagree. I don't think it speaks volumes because I don't think that attitude isn't as prevalent as some people think. I believe there are people like that, which is sad, but I would bet (a Mickey bar) that the majority of white folk don't care what color a person a candidate is.

Sorry, but we ain't there yet!

OTH, I DO believe that the majority of black folk WOULD vote for a black candidate over a white candidate with most all other things being equal.

OTH, I DO believe that the majority of white folk WOULD vote for a white candidate over a black candidate with most all other things being equal

 

[LohKee]

There will be some people who will not vote for Obama because of his race. It is sad, but true. Those people, however, will be a small minority of voters. If Obama does not get elected, it will be because he is a liberal running in a center-right nation.

I have never voted for a person based on their demographics, nor will I ever. I'm a gay man, but I have passed over gay male candidates in favor of the candidate who best represents my views. I find Jeremiah Wright offensive and the fact that Obama has had a close relationship with that man for many years makes me even less inclined to vote for him in Novembver (I've come to accept that Obama will be the nominee. Sigh.).

Well you have a right to vote for who you want to vote for, but I have to say that Jeremiah isn't the one damning Gay people to hell nor is he blaming New Orleans for Hurricane Katrina.

 

[Charade]

Nope, we're not cattle OR of one mind.

How's that possible when Obama got 90+ percent of the Indiana and NC black vote?

Let's assume you're correct. Why is my claim any different than someone else saying the majority of white people wouldn't vote for a black candidate even if they gave them a get out of debt free card? That's not racist, it's stereotyping. And that shipped has pretty much sailed.


Do you think I would vote for a black candidate (Republican, of course)?

I look at a person's record and vote accordingly.

Good for you. Everyone should do that.

 

[Disney Doll]

Dawn the point I was trying to make is that you vote based on what YOU know. Others vote based on what THEY know. Everyone votes based on their own personal lives as well as what they believe is best for all. But the bottom line is what is best for one isn't always best for the other. And you do post about the most controversial member of the democratic party which is why I call it pot stirring.

The man is running for President. Of course he's the most controversial member of the democratic party.

So, the only time it wouldn't be pot-stirring is if we discuss democratic Senator Joe Blow from Wisconsin and the cheese lobby? The people in the democratic party who everyone cares about right now are senators Obama and Clinton. They are running for the Presidential nomination. They have brought the controversy on themselves, if you want to call it controversy.

 

[smartestnumber5]

OTH, I DO believe that the majority of black folk WOULD vote for a black candidate over a white candidate with most all other things being equal.

What do you mean by "most all other things being equal"?

Do you mean if African-Americans actually were proportionally represented in government (and other powerful positions) and we had had a number of black presidents which is proportional to the percentage of blacks in the general population that African-Americans would still vote for a black candidate over a white one? (That, to me, would be "other things being equal.") But I see no reason to assume that this is true. (I'm not saying it's false--I'm just not sure we as a nation have ever been in a situation in which we could get evidence one way or another.)

 

[Charade]

OTH, I DO believe that the majority of white folk WOULD vote for a white candidate over a black candidate with most all other things being equal

We'll just have to agree to disagree. But polls show Obama got nearly ALL the black vote in IN and NC.

 

[WildernessBride]

Well you have a right to vote for who you want to vote for, but I have to say that Jeremiah isn't the one damning Gay people to hell nor is he blaming New Orleans for Hurricane Katrina.

That is a very good point, LohKee.

 

[inthemood]

I don't know what they will do when it comes to Obama vs. McCain--I think/hope that their politics will win out over their prejudices (or heck, maybe they'll even see that their prejudices are prejudices!).

Now that will be a bright day in American history if/when people can see, admit and overcome their prejudices, and vote according to their own political ideals.

 

[Charade]

What do you mean by "most all other things being equal"?

Policies and platform.

Do you mean if African-Americans actually were proportionally represented in government (and other powerful positions) and we had had a number of black presidents which is proportional to the percentage of blacks in the general population that African-Americans would still vote for a black candidate over a white one? (That, to me, would be "other things being equal.") But I see no reason to assume that this is true. (I'm not saying it's false--I'm just not sure we as a nation have ever been in a situation in which we could get evidence one way or another.)

No.