Is anyone getting as turned off as I am?

[pcoleman]

I have been following this tread for awhile, since we just got back I now feel I can weigh in. Change is good. Good to have fond memories of things. Many things that are gone now i would like back but that's how it goes. With all that being said; I do not like all the planning that has to go into a vacation anymore. I have to know where I want to be, where and when I want to eat and what rides i want to go on months before i even arrive. Don't like the FP+. We had major problems with the electronic readers and spend countless hours at guest services DAILY to get some new glitch ironed out. You would think a place like WDW would be able to have this figured out by now. Ya, not going back until something changes. If I know anything, its that change will always come.

 

[Davey Jones II]

I want change, and I want it badly.

I look at the projected shows like Muppets and Philharmagic and I think "my local theater has better pictures than this now, DISNEY NEEDS TO CHANGE IT.

I go on rides with broken animatronics and out of date technology, I think DISNEY NEEDS TO CHANGE IT.

I see what was supposed to be an awe inspiring vision of the future at attractions in Tomorrowland or Future World that became dated 10 years ago, I think DISNEY NEEDS TO CHANGE IT.

I see a princess musical or a stunt show I've seen a dozen times now, I think DISNEY NEEDS TO CHANGE IT.

I am not terribly nostalgic or sentimental and I know most people fall far to the other side of the curve, so I certainly understand why other people want to keep some of these things the same like a comfortable pair of shoes. But THAT's what being resistant to change means.

I agree with some of this post. But I have to disagree with you about PhilharMagic. It is a wonderful and unique 4D experience.

And while IMAX 3D is admittedly dazzling, it doesn't offer any experience like having Donald Duck coming out of the screen and ending up right in front of your face, so you feel like you can reach out and touch him.

Most 3D movies in theatres use the extra dimension for depth of field, while rarely pulling characters (or anything else) out of the screen. Theme park 3D deliberately puts things right in your face, and enhances it with unique, in-theatre 4D effects. To me, that's the best 3D/4D magic.

 

[Ellwood970]

I want change, and I want it badly.

If Comcast had bought Disney in Feb. 2004 . . .

 

[Planogirl]

In my almost 50 years of visiting Disney theme parks, I've never felt more like a $ to them as I do now, as opposed to feeling like a welcomed guest.

Actually you are seen as many $'s and they hope to increase that to more.

I agree with those who said MK was the prettiest at Christmas time. There are nice things in the other parks but they are more barren. I was there last December too.

 

[Mambo Junkie]

My question then is: is it possible to walk up to ANY restaurant in Epcot, say, 11:30 am for lunch or 4:30 or 5 pm for dinner, and get seated??? In reading the boards, it seems that UNLESS you have a reservation at a Disney or Epcot sit-down restaurant NO ONE will be able to be seated. Maybe I am misunderstanding. Thank you.

I am always checking, testing, just to see how things work now. (I've been going since 1972). I play a game, based on the 24 hour cancellation rule. I pretend I'm at WDW with no reservations, and I pick a park I'm going to tomorrow, and I check for dining reservations. I have come up with some pretty interesting places being available at the last minute. People now have to cancel before midnight the day before (if I read it correctly) so you should have no problem getting something decent at the last minute. Walkup? Maybe not. We had a very nice young man tell us to walk back up to Tony's right when it reopened for dinner and we got right in (where there were no reservations available)

I have been at Christmas 4 times and we were there year before last. I felt it wasn't finished, that maybe we were there too early right after Thanksgiving. We were all pretty disappointed.

I have 1 dining reservation per day, with an extra at HS (Sci Fi) and the Candlelight processional. I have booked the Tomorrowland Terrace, BBB, Pirates League and Wonderland Tea Party. Now we are wondering where to squeeze in FP+s, down time at the resort, swimming, etc. Some time this weekend I think we're going to start trimming. Definitely not BBB, so don't ask, lol. That's a MUST do.

 

[DOOM1001]

Actually you are seen as many $'s and they hope to increase that to more.

I agree with those who said MK was the prettiest at Christmas time. There are nice things in the other parks but they are more barren. I was there last December too.

Honestly,the Disney parks seem to have fewer Christmas decorations every year,even MK aside from Main Street doesn't have much.I visit all the Florida parks regularly and for Christmas the most impressive one for me the last couple of years has been Sea World,no upcharge admission for their Christmas events and shows which it's sister park Busch Gardens does have or like MVMCP at MK but all you have to do is walk around Sea World after the sun goes down and it's almost shocking at how many lights and decorations are around the park,not just in one area but all over.

 

[MouseClubMama]

I'm sure Disney hopes most of its guests think as you do. Fortunately, many of us do NOT think change for the sake of change is good, and we do NOT always trust their judgement.

Judgement is often clouded when the incentive to increase revenue is the driving force. We all get it... Disney is a business that wants to make a big profit, and they want all of their rooms filled, but IMHO they need to take a step back, and listen to their loyal customers who want more attractions in the parks vs more DVC rooms. As far as the Magic Bands/ FP+ , I do think think they put the cart before the horse.

 

[JanaDee]

I have to agree with this but I think AK is very well decorated. They have decorations on all the ride entrances and they have those adorable trees over near Camp Minnie/Mickey, or they did. I think Epcot is the least decorated in my opinion but I still think it looks great. And the resorts are stunning!!!

Camp Minnie/Mickey is gone.

 

[NancyIL]

Judgement is often clouded when the incentive to increase revenue is the driving force. We all get it... Disney is a business that wants to make a big profit, and they want all of their rooms filled, but IMHO they need to take a step back, and listen to their loyal customers who want more attractions in the parks vs more DVC rooms. As far as the Magic Bands/ FP+ , I do think think they put the cart before the horse.

Exactly! I think Disney spent so much money on Fastpass+/Magic Bands/equipment associated with it that they are making the entertainment cuts at Epcot (replacing some with cheaper acts - if there is a replacement), and adding additional revenue enhancers. The Halloween and Christmas parties used to be only during the months of those holidays. Now Halloween begins in early September and Christmas begins in early November - with parties being scheduled up to 4 nights a week. Ticket prices for the Halloween party range from $58+ tax (DVC/AP in September) to $77 + tax (Oct. 31). On top of that, this year they've added the Villains Sinister Soiree @ $99 + tax for some desserts in the castle, and preferred viewing for the parade and fireworks that can only be seen after you shell out the extra $60+ to attend the Halloween party! I wouldn't be surprised if Disney offers something similar during the Christmas parties. Good grief, folks - when are some of you going to say "ENOUGH!"?

 

[maxiesmom]

Judgement is often clouded when the incentive to increase revenue is the driving force. We all get it... Disney is a business that wants to make a big profit, and they want all of their rooms filled, but IMHO they need to take a step back, and listen to their loyal customers who want more attractions in the parks vs more DVC rooms. As far as the Magic Bands/ FP+ , I do think think they put the cart before the horse.

Maybe you missed that the expanded the Magic Kingdom? And are planning Avitar Land? They are working on the more attraction thing.

 

[clsteve]

I'm sure Disney hopes most of its guests think as you do. Fortunately, many of us do NOT think change for the sake of change is good, and we do NOT always trust their judgement.

Change.

It can be handled many ways by a corporation. What has turned me off more than anything is how Disney has managed change and how poorly guests have been treated/informed during the changes.

For example, last Jan. we were all set up for a split stay: 4 nights at YC and 3 nights PBH at UO. Then, all the MB and FP+ implementation started for the Resorts - with no plan or info to the Guests.

Then, Tiering

Then, I saw what happened to the guests at Pop.... MB-only.... which went through the Holidays .... only for them

I cancelled our YC portion of the trip and extended the Uni portion. Very glad I did since YC went MB-only on the day we would have checked in. So sorry I missed that.....

Now, I'm planning our Jan trip back to PBH, hoping for a few days at WDW as an off-siter. And, what's happened while I'm trying to decide....?

The SB+ "test" at Soarin' and A&E (with no advanced notice to guests). Are they going to try that again? God forbid, implement it?

And Maelstrom - EPCOT's one of our top 2 Parks and one we would spend a day at in Jan. Is there a refurb? For how long? Will it be "Frozen" or not? Will we be fighting through hordes of little princesses just to get past Norway? Will I be getting nasty stares from their mothers while I order my re-branded Olaf Aquavit shots...?

I have been very disappointed in Disney's arrogant approach to guest management, guest information and guest service through all of this "Change".

Beyond all the "whys" and "hows" "whens" of all of this - that's my biggest issue...

 

[Angel Ariel]

Maybe you missed that the expanded the Magic Kingdom? And are planning Avitar Land? They are working on the more attraction thing.

I do enjoy NFL, and I am happy they are expanding Animal Kingdom...but they are "working on the more attraction thing"? Could they work any slower? With the same amount of time and the same budget that WDW had for MM+, Disneyland completely revitalized DCA. I think Avatarland is already taking longer than it took to do everything to DCA (from the time it was announced, til the time it will open).

Again, I appreciate that there are plans in motion, but TDO is making it pretty obvious that getting attractions done is not their main priority.

 

[JanaDee]

Exactly! I think Disney spent so much money on Fastpass+/Magic Bands/equipment associated with it that they are making the entertainment cuts at Epcot (replacing some with cheaper acts - if there is a replacement), and adding additional revenue enhancers. The Halloween and Christmas parties used to be only during the months of those holidays. Now Halloween begins in early September and Christmas begins in early November - with parties being scheduled up to 4 nights a week. Ticket prices for the Halloween party range from $58+ tax (DVC/AP in September) to $77 + tax (Oct. 31). On top of that, this year they've added the Villains Sinister Soiree @ $99 + tax for some desserts in the castle, and preferred viewing for the parade and fireworks that can only be seen after you shell out the extra $60+ to attend the Halloween party! I wouldn't be surprised if Disney offers something similar during the Christmas parties. Good grief, folks - when are some of you going to say "ENOUGH!"?

 

[Praying Colonel]

Maybe you missed that the expanded the Magic Kingdom? And are planning Avitar Land? They are working on the more attraction thing.

I think it's...interesting that they're adding attractions in the 2 parks where FP+ tiering is not necessary to ration FP+ for high-demand attractions. The 2 parks where they have to tier FP+: crickets.

 

[maxiesmom]

I think it's...interesting that they're adding attractions in the 2 parks where they FP+ tiering is not necessary to ration FP+. The 2 parks where they have to tier FP+: crickets.

I agree, Epcot is kind of the pits when it comes to FP+. My nephew actually laughed at the choices.

I am curious though as to why people are assuming the new entertainment in Epcot is a bid to save money. Has anyone seen any actual figures, or are people just on the Everything Disney Does Is To Save Money bandwagon? To me it would seem putting on a lumberjack show would cost more than a music group.

Why would Disney waste time and money to change things (if they are as tight as many people think they are) just for the sake of change?

 

[Ellwood970]

When the Magic Kingdom opened there were few attractions. What made it special was the immersion, the attention to detail, and wonderful over the top guest treatment. I remember thinking wow, they really want me to feel welcome and appreciated. When you could get in for 3.75. Now? They really appreciate my amex credit card. I love Disney. But this is the trend as I see it.

 

[NancyIL]

I agree, Epcot is kind of the pits when it comes to FP+. My nephew actually laughed at the choices.

I am curious though as to why people are assuming the new entertainment in Epcot is a bid to save money. Has anyone seen any actual figures, or are people just on the Everything Disney Does Is To Save Money bandwagon? To me it would seem putting on a lumberjack show would cost more than a music group.

Why would Disney waste time and money to change things (if they are as tight as many people think they are) just for the sake of change?

The replacement entertainment at Epcot isn't going to be immediate. I have read that it will be at holiday time - so that will save Disney several months of salaries for a bunch of people. I have no idea what it costs to put on a lumberjack show, but it surely won't have the fans that return to Epcot year after year just to see it.

 

[Angel Ariel]

I agree, Epcot is kind of the pits when it comes to FP+. My nephew actually laughed at the choices.

I am curious though as to why people are assuming the new entertainment in Epcot is a bid to save money. Has anyone seen any actual figures, or are people just on the Everything Disney Does Is To Save Money bandwagon? To me it would seem putting on a lumberjack show would cost more than a music group.

Why would Disney waste time and money to change things (if they are as tight as many people think they are) just for the sake of change?

On the DISUnplugged podcast episode after the cuts were announced, Pete said that at one point (a few years ago, IIRC) a member of one of the groups was making $25/hour (pointing out the groups weren't being paid minimum wage) I believe he also said some (or all?) were Equity members. He went through a lot of reasoning to show why he believed this decision was financial, and that whatever shows they brought in would definitely be making less than the shows leaving were. IMO, his reasoning was very well thought out and absolutely possible, if not probable. All you have to do is look around the rest of World Showcase and see what they've just straight out cut and never replaced. If it weren't *at all* about saving money, why not replace all acts instead of just removing them?

 

[msb578]

Exactly! I think Disney spent so much money on Fastpass+/Magic Bands/equipment associated with it that they are making the entertainment cuts at Epcot (replacing some with cheaper acts - if there is a replacement), and adding additional revenue enhancers. The Halloween and Christmas parties used to be only during the months of those holidays. Now Halloween begins in early September and Christmas begins in early November - with parties being scheduled up to 4 nights a week. Ticket prices for the Halloween party range from $58+ tax (DVC/AP in September) to $77 + tax (Oct. 31). On top of that, this year they've added the Villains Sinister Soiree @ $99 + tax for some desserts in the castle, and preferred viewing for the parade and fireworks that can only be seen after you shell out the extra $60+ to attend the Halloween party! I wouldn't be surprised if Disney offers something similar during the Christmas parties. Good grief, folks - when are some of you going to say "ENOUGH!"?

No doubt. However, part of it comes down to consumers making choices. On my family's recent trip, we stayed at All-Star Sports for $73 a night, taxes included, for five nights. We only bought one-day MK tickets. My children are all under 6. They enjoyed swimming and playing games at the pool. We toured resorts- they surprisingly liked that. We had a couple of fun table service meals- walk-ins at Trail's End and Beaches & Cream (sat at the counter). We did pony rides at Fort Wilderness for $5. Watched fireworks from several locations. Etc. We had a wonderful time!

Is this the typical WDW vacation? Of course not. But, there are opportunities to spend less, and also much much more, if you want to. I don't know how much I can fault Disney for charging for exclusive events when a sizable number of guests are clearly willing to buy in.

 

[Grammy4Lizzy]

Turn offs for me is the price of WDW (increasing so much over the years) and the food. Friends of ours did Mexico, all inclusive, 7 nights, 8 days for 2800. Two adults and two kids 10+. The kids raved about it. The adults loved it. I can't even get hotel and tickets for that price for the four of us at WDW. That's not even counting food.

If I'm paying the inflated prices for food can it least be decent? Half the time it's crap. When I vacation I like convenience. I don't want to go off site for food or pack food. I want to grab and go. Or sit and eat where I am.

FP+ doesn't bother me so much. It is kind of irritating to plan your rides 60 days out but we go during very low crowds so I don't think it will be too bad for us. ADR's I'm used to.

My kids haven't been since 2011. They are begging to go. I will take them next year and I don't think I'll be back for at least another 4-5 years . Or just go for mother/daughter and mother/son trips when they are 16 or graduating. I LOVE Disney but we like doing other things which we have these past few years. We did Nicaragua, Jersey shore, Ocean City, Virginia. For much much cheaper. We want to go to Puerto Rico and maybe do a cruise or two.

When you go to Mexico, the employees are paid very little, you take your chances on the sanitation, the food may make you ill and then there is the violence there. I have gone there and will never go back. I never get of the cruise ship there anymore.
If you just want to go somewhere because its cheap, go ahead.