Is anyone else hugely entertained by the FP+ tier system test?

[surferdave]

Loyal customers: can we start with families that stay on property 1+ times a year? And work our way up to those who "bought a piece of the magic"?

If the later means DVC members I think Disney likes them best. Money in the bank is their favorite form of loyalty.

 

[WillAustin]

I'm betting there are a whole bunch of mom2rtk's in their customer base. I think way more than they are imagining or see coming (or not in this case).

I think so, too. I also think they may be underestimating how much people like her affect other potential guests. I know I have personally influenced how several families decided whether to travel to WDW or not, where and how long they stay, and what plans they made.

Loyal customers can have a far wider effect than just the revenue they actually spend.

 

[Planogirl]

Am I following the logic correctly?

Disney brings in fastpasses in order to better distribute guests while at the same time making said guests happier. Then they discover that some guests don't get it and aren't reaping the benefits. So Disney comes up with a new system to again better distribute guests while at the same time making guests happier. However it looks like potentially many of the guests won't be happier but Disney will just have a new group of happy guests and hopefully that new group will spend more money.

Hey, maybe in a few years they can come up with another way to appeal to an even wealthier clientele. From my understanding the truly wealthy want little to do with Disney parks and their hotels so maybe that should be the next project. Since it's all about maximizing profit and all of that...

 

[dansamy]

If the later means DVC members I think Disney likes them best. Money in the bank is their favorite form of loyalty.

Yes. However, DVC doesn't really get a lot of perks. The merchandise discount is only 10%. The annual pass is the Florida resident rate, which *is* a pretty good size discount, but they are still quite pricey. Renewals are also pricy. The tiw card price went up, making it take a higher dollar amount to break even & then start saving.

DVC members still outlay thousands of dollars in tickets and food every trip. (Well, I suppose you could skip parks & cook in your villa, but if you're doing that you might as well book a beach condo or a mountain cabin. If you're vacationing in central Florida, the attractions are kind of part of the vacation.)

 

[MrInfinity]

DVC members still outlay thousands of dollars in tickets and food every trip. (Well, I suppose you could skip parks & cook in your villa, but if you're doing that you might as well book a beach condo or a mountain cabin. If you're vacationing in central Florida, the attractions are kind of part of the vacation.)

If you believe that, have I got a mountain cabin in Florida to sell you!

(PS the highest elevation in Florida is 345 ft)

 

[Mad Hattered]

Yes. However, DVC doesn't really get a lot of perks. The merchandise discount is only 10%. The annual pass is the Florida resident rate, which *is* a pretty good size discount, but they are still quite pricey. Renewals are also pricy. The tiw card price went up, making it take a higher dollar amount to break even & then start saving.

DVC members still outlay thousands of dollars in tickets and food every trip. (Well, I suppose you could skip parks & cook in your villa, but if you're doing that you might as well book a beach condo or a mountain cabin. If you're vacationing in central Florida, the attractions are kind of part of the vacation.)

Our friends are DVC owners. The last three trips they stayed there they went to Universal and never stepped foot in the Disney parks. Yes, they ate one meal at DTD if you want to count that.

 

[dansamy]

If you believe that, have I got a mountain cabin in Florida to sell you!

(PS the highest elevation in Florida is 345 ft)

Well, I suppose it depends on the purpose of your trip. I've gone pretty cheaply. I've also spent thousands. We're also a family of five. In a world that caters to parties of four, we certainly notice the additional cost a fifth requires. From larger vehicles to larger vacation rentals, the extra person makes a difference.

 

[dansamy]

Our friends are DVC owners. The last three trips they stayed there they went to Universal and never stepped foot in the Disney parks. Yes, they ate one meal at DTD if you want to count that.

We own DVC. We're to the point that, after this Christmas trip, we'll probably not spend as much time in Disney parks & spend more time elsewhere. We also tend not to eat at TS as much. After this trip, I plan to go back next fall to mostly do WWoHP expansion & 7DMT.

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

I also think they may be underestimating how much people like her affect other potential guests. I know I have personally influenced how several families decided whether to travel to WDW or not, where and how long they stay, and what plans they made.

Loyal customers can have a far wider effect than just the revenue they actually spend.

This!! As other have mentioned, we tend to speak more about things we are unhappy with. It would not make good business sense for Disney to make off-site guest to feel left out. And I've been telling others that I know travel to Disney but don't read any message boards about the changes coming to Disney. I haven't talked to one yet that liked the idea of pre-booking 3 FP+ that very well may be all they get for the day.

And yes!!! I know things can change but all I know for sure is what Disney has done so far and until they tell me something different, I'll have to go with that.

 

[peyjax]

I think the point is that Disney has long been the vanguard for queue management and guest satisfaction.

As such they're credible, whereas anonymous message board posters going on and on incessantly with dire predictions are not.

Someday Disney may not be credible, if all this fails. that day is not today.

I really would not say incessant dire predictions. All this talk of gloom and doom when I just see it as people analyzing a business and then making a decision on wether they want to continue to invest in the company and its products. Not really doom and gloom for that I will read the newspaper! Plenty of that there

I keep going back to the idea that folks look to Disney for guest satisfaction and the company that sets the standards. I do think that for generations they did just that. After taking a trip to Disneyland to see Carsland I will say at times they still do got it!

With that said I am sure GM/Ford came out with a few gems in the 80's too. Yet it did not stop those companies from deteriorating to the brink of a government bailouts/Loans to save the companies. I am sure you could talk to many back in the late 70's and early 80's who would tell you there is no way GM or Ford would ever go under. They invented the car! No one does it like they do. For years (50's-60's) I am sure they were right. Eventually though others came in and saw where they were lacking and filled that niche. Perhaps that is something Universal is doing now? You can only ride on your reputation for so long before the cracks will begin to show. Ford Pinto? anyone

 

[dansamy]

I'll see your Pinto & raise you an Edsel.

 

[Mad Hattered]

I'll see your Pinto & raise you an Edsel.

You have to throw the Mustang II into the mix. I mean they did put it on a Pinto chassis.

 

[peyjax]

I think so, too. I also think they may be underestimating how much people like her affect other potential guests. I know I have personally influenced how several families decided whether to travel to WDW or not, where and how long they stay, and what plans they made.

Loyal customers can have a far wider effect than just the revenue they actually spend.

Brand recognition is important and lets face it Disney has that down. However there is a fine line to where you can cheapen your product and well Disney can skirt that line at times.

Now word of mouth advertisement, well now there is the $$$

The loyal customers are the ones who help promote the company. With statements like "what only 4 days?" "you really need to escape it all, stay on property!" all word of mouth.
Personally I knew nothing about on property hotels and how did I learn? A loyal customer of course! They certainly do have a wider effect than just their own wallet.

 

[DPCummerbund]

I have a theory. Many of you will hate it. My theory is as follows: people on this board like to be "insiders". They like to be the people who have gamed the system, who have figured out all the tricks. They figured out when to get to the parks, which attractions to sprint to, and how to collect the maximum number of fastpasses.

Now, Disney has taken away your well-crafted little system. You still get to go on the rides, but now it looks like you'll have to wait like everybody else who didn't know all your tricks. Now, with MDE, you're getting the exact same number of fastpasses as every Joe Schmoe from Idaho.

Yes, your "specialness" is gone. And as of now you may not get to go on as many rides as you do, because being a Disney know-it-all doesn't get you what it used to. But you know what? It looks like Joe Schmoe is going to love this system. According to some posts in this thread, Joe was so dumb he used to buy park tickets, go to the park, and then wander around without even going on any rides. Now, Joe has been told that there are RIDES he can go on, and he can even reserve them ahead of time!

That's how it's supposed to work, and I think it's why a lot of people are mad. Here's a big tip, though, Disney insiders: the new system is WAY more complex than a Fastpass-. The Fastpass- was a little trashcan looking thing - put your ticket in, get free pass. It was about as simple as it gets. And yet Joe Schmoe never figured it out. YOU figured it out, and every time you walked into a Fastpass return line, you saw Joe and thousands of his buddies in the standby line. Many of you even chortled when you heard Joe make snide remarks like "I wish I was rich enough to afford to go in that line."

If Joe couldn't figure out the old system - put in ticket, get pass - how in the world is he supposed to figure out a multi-tiered, strangely restricted, internet-based reservation system?

If YOU, the Disney planning maniac, are hesitant to plan your fastpasses, how do you think Joe feels? If Joe couldn't be bothered to figure out fastpass-, is he really going to be on MDE planning his multi-tiered rides several months out?

For starters, something like 20% of Americans don't use the Internet. None of those people will have FP+. Another LARGE chunk does minimal research, and won't be bothered to learn stuff like this. Another chunk will learn a little, but won't plan nearly as far ahead. If you're reading this, you're already way ahead of the curve.

Yes, it's new. But it's a whole new system to figure out - a whole new game plan will be needed. But in time, and with some thought, effort, and experience, you'll be running rings around Joe again.

 

[robpa]

I have a theory. Many of you will hate it. My theory is as follows: people on this board like to be "insiders". They like to be the people who have gamed the system, who have figured out all the tricks. They figured out when to get to the parks, which attractions to sprint to, and how to collect the maximum number of fastpasses.

Now, Disney has taken away your well-crafted little system. You still get to go on the rides, but now it looks like you'll have to wait like everybody else who didn't know all your tricks. Now, with MDE, you're getting the exact same number of fastpasses as every Joe Schmoe from Idaho.

Yes, your "specialness" is gone. And as of now you may not get to go on as many rides as you do, because being a Disney know-it-all doesn't get you what it used to. But you know what? It looks like Joe Schmoe is going to love this system. According to some posts in this thread, Joe was so dumb he used to buy park tickets, go to the park, and then wander around without even going on any rides. Now, Joe has been told that there are RIDES he can go on, and he can even reserve them ahead of time!

That's how it's supposed to work, and I think it's why a lot of people are mad. Here's a big tip, though, Disney insiders: the new system is WAY more complex than a Fastpass-. The Fastpass- was a little trashcan looking thing - put your ticket in, get free pass. It was about as simple as it gets. And yet Joe Schmoe never figured it out. YOU figured it out, and every time you walked into a Fastpass return line, you saw Joe and thousands of his buddies in the standby line. Many of you even chortled when you heard Joe make snide remarks like "I wish I was rich enough to afford to go in that line."

If Joe couldn't figure out the old system - put in ticket, get pass - how in the world is he supposed to figure out a multi-tiered, strangely restricted, internet-based reservation system?

If YOU, the Disney planning maniac, are hesitant to plan your fastpasses, how do you think Joe feels? If Joe couldn't be bothered to figure out fastpass-, is he really going to be on MDE planning his multi-tiered rides several months out?

For starters, something like 20% of Americans don't use the Internet. None of those people will have FP+. Another LARGE chunk does minimal research, and won't be bothered to learn stuff like this. Another chunk will learn a little, but won't plan nearly as far ahead. If you're reading this, you're already way ahead of the curve.

Yes, it's new. But it's a whole new system to figure out - a whole new game plan will be needed. But in time, and with some thought, effort, and experience, you'll be running rings around Joe again.

So Disney needed to dumb down its system for its clientele? If Joe couldn't figure out how to stick a card in the slot he's gonna have an even tougher time navigating the web site or figuring out a smart phone app.

 

[mom2mickeyfan]

I have a theory. Many of you will hate it. My theory is as follows: people on this board like to be "insiders". They like to be the people who have gamed the system, who have figured out all the tricks. They figured out when to get to the parks, which attractions to sprint to, and how to collect the maximum number of fastpasses.

Now, Disney has taken away your well-crafted little system. You still get to go on the rides, but now it looks like you'll have to wait like everybody else who didn't know all your tricks. Now, with MDE, you're getting the exact same number of fastpasses as every Joe Schmoe from Idaho.

Yes, your "specialness" is gone. And as of now you may not get to go on as many rides as you do, because being a Disney know-it-all doesn't get you what it used to. But you know what? It looks like Joe Schmoe is going to love this system. According to some posts in this thread, Joe was so dumb he used to buy park tickets, go to the park, and then wander around without even going on any rides. Now, Joe has been told that there are RIDES he can go on, and he can even reserve them ahead of time!

That's how it's supposed to work, and I think it's why a lot of people are mad. Here's a big tip, though, Disney insiders: the new system is WAY more complex than a Fastpass-. The Fastpass- was a little trashcan looking thing - put your ticket in, get free pass. It was about as simple as it gets. And yet Joe Schmoe never figured it out. YOU figured it out, and every time you walked into a Fastpass return line, you saw Joe and thousands of his buddies in the standby line. Many of you even chortled when you heard Joe make snide remarks like "I wish I was rich enough to afford to go in that line."

If Joe couldn't figure out the old system - put in ticket, get pass - how in the world is he supposed to figure out a multi-tiered, strangely restricted, internet-based reservation system?

If YOU, the Disney planning maniac, are hesitant to plan your fastpasses, how do you think Joe feels? If Joe couldn't be bothered to figure out fastpass-, is he really going to be on MDE planning his multi-tiered rides several months out?

For starters, something like 20% of Americans don't use the Internet. None of those people will have FP+. Another LARGE chunk does minimal research, and won't be bothered to learn stuff like this. Another chunk will learn a little, but won't plan nearly as far ahead. If you're reading this, you're already way ahead of the curve.

Yes, it's new. But it's a whole new system to figure out - a whole new game plan will be needed. But in time, and with some thought, effort, and experience, you'll be running rings around Joe again.

And so if this isn't going to benefit Joe Schmoe and it isn't going to benefit us "insiders", what is the point???

And btw, you post implies that we have been doing something wrong. I've never felt I was more special than anyone else in the parks and would tell anyone that would listen how to use the FP system. I managed to figure things out and use FP fully on my very first trip since I was a child.

Another point is no matter if Joe Schmoe figures out the new system or not, I will still be limited to 3 FP+ a day. And please don't tell me it is still in testing! 3 has been pretty constant from the beginning.

My theory is FP+ doesn't have anything to do with make any set of guest happy. It is about money. Some guest being happy is only a side effect.

 

[Msmithmd]

A+ DP Cummerbund. A+!

 

[bcrook]

I have a theory. Many of you will hate it. My theory is as follows: people on this board like to be "insiders". They like to be the people who have gamed the system, who have figured out all the tricks. They figured out when to get to the parks, which attractions to sprint to, and how to collect the maximum number of fastpasses.

Now, Disney has taken away your well-crafted little system. You still get to go on the rides, but now it looks like you'll have to wait like everybody else who didn't know all your tricks. Now, with MDE, you're getting the exact same number of fastpasses as every Joe Schmoe from Idaho.

Yes, your "specialness" is gone. And as of now you may not get to go on as many rides as you do, because being a Disney know-it-all doesn't get you what it used to. But you know what? It looks like Joe Schmoe is going to love this system. According to some posts in this thread, Joe was so dumb he used to buy park tickets, go to the park, and then wander around without even going on any rides. Now, Joe has been told that there are RIDES he can go on, and he can even reserve them ahead of time!

That's how it's supposed to work, and I think it's why a lot of people are mad. Here's a big tip, though, Disney insiders: the new system is WAY more complex than a Fastpass-. The Fastpass- was a little trashcan looking thing - put your ticket in, get free pass. It was about as simple as it gets. And yet Joe Schmoe never figured it out. YOU figured it out, and every time you walked into a Fastpass return line, you saw Joe and thousands of his buddies in the standby line. Many of you even chortled when you heard Joe make snide remarks like "I wish I was rich enough to afford to go in that line."

If Joe couldn't figure out the old system - put in ticket, get pass - how in the world is he supposed to figure out a multi-tiered, strangely restricted, internet-based reservation system?

If YOU, the Disney planning maniac, are hesitant to plan your fastpasses, how do you think Joe feels? If Joe couldn't be bothered to figure out fastpass-, is he really going to be on MDE planning his multi-tiered rides several months out?

For starters, something like 20% of Americans don't use the Internet. None of those people will have FP+. Another LARGE chunk does minimal research, and won't be bothered to learn stuff like this. Another chunk will learn a little, but won't plan nearly as far ahead. If you're reading this, you're already way ahead of the curve.

Yes, it's new. But it's a whole new system to figure out - a whole new game plan will be needed. But in time, and with some thought, effort, and experience, you'll be running rings around Joe again.

I don't understand this need to analyze insiders. This isn't about insiders. This about a drastically different interface and system being unveiled to tour wdw. It is different. The conversation is about how different it will be. Disney has explained the purpose over and over again. They want as many people on site as possible using magic bands and fastpass+. They expect customers to spend 15-20% more while in the park. They want rides booked up in advance so they can plan accordingly and get people to commit to staying all the days they have tickets purchased. They fully expect off site guests to be equally involved (they want them committed and spending 20% more too).

With a huge influx of new fastpass users the number of fastpasses available per customer will go down and lines will get longer because a higher percentage of people will be riding rides. This is why they are investing in interactive ride queues. Standby will become the norm, fastpass the special perk of the day (much more limited).

It doesn't matter who this benefits and who it hurts. It is different. A much different landscape. People need to know how the game will be played in the future. We already know how to "game" this new mymagic+ system.

1. Take your time, enjoy the little things appreciate the ability to walk in DHS at 5:00 pm and ride toy story midway mania. Sleep in, enjoy a hot breakfast. Go fishing spend more time at the newly improved DTD. If you want to ride headliners multiple times, add more days to stay. Stay 10 days that way you can be guaranteed to ride all your favorite rides.

2. If you want to go commando. We know that too. Get to park earlier than open, ride as much as you can, save your fastpasses for afternoon when parks are at their peaks, skip parades and fireworks and enjoy short lines at the rides. Stay until close. If you hop, save fastpasses for second park.

Either way - get in there early 60 days in advance to book the best times for rides.

Here is what we don't know yet:

1. Will people show up to their scheduled fastpasses early in morning? Will that change ride availability at rope drop? Somebody will be stuck with those times.

2. Will holes in the schedule be filled? Will expletive stay in line instead of going to parades because their fastpass windows are then.

3. Will people stay in animal kingdom after 3:00 pm and fill those rides up later in day?

4. Will minor rides lose their walk on status when everyone starts using fastpass. Like 8:00 pm pirates of the Caribbean. Will more people stick Around MK to ride Pirates because they have a bonus fastpass?

How good will disney be at moving people into these holes in the schedule?

 

[clsteve]

I don't understand this need to analyze insiders. This isn't about insiders. This about a drastically different interface and system being unveiled to tour wdw. It is different. The conversation is about how different it will be. Disney has explained the purpose over and over again. They want as many people on site as possible using magic bands and fastpass+. They expect customers to spend 15-20% more while in the park. They want rides booked up in advance so they can plan accordingly and get people to commit to staying all the days they have tickets purchased. They fully expect off site guests to be equally involved (they want them committed and spending 20% more too).

With a huge influx of new fastpass users the number of fastpasses available per customer will go down and lines will get longer because a higher percentage of people will be riding rides. This is why they are investing in interactive ride queues. Standby will become the norm, fastpass the special perk of the day (much more limited).

It doesn't matter who this benefits and who it hurts. It is different. A much different landscape. People need to know how the game will be played in the future. We already know how to "game" this new mymagic+ system.

1. Take your time, enjoy the little things appreciate the ability to walk in DHS at 5:00 pm and ride toy story midway mania. Sleep in, enjoy a hot breakfast. Go fishing spend more time at the newly improved DTD. If you want to ride headliners multiple times, add more days to stay. Stay 10 days that way you can be guaranteed to ride all your favorite rides.

2. If you want to go commando. We know that too. Get to park earlier than open, ride as much as you can, save your fastpasses for afternoon when parks are at their peaks, skip parades and fireworks and enjoy short lines at the rides. Stay until close. If you hop, save fastpasses for second park.

Either way - get in there early 60 days in advance to book the best times for rides.

Here is what we don't know yet:

1. Will people show up to their scheduled fastpasses early in morning? Will that change ride availability at rope drop? Somebody will be stuck with those times.

2. Will holes in the schedule be filled? Will expletive stay in line instead of going to parades because their fastpass windows are then.

3. Will people stay in animal kingdom after 3:00 pm and fill those rides up later in day?

4. Will minor rides lose their walk on status when everyone starts using fastpass. Like 8:00 pm pirates of the Caribbean. Will more people stick Around MK to ride Pirates because they have a bonus fastpass?

How good will disney be at moving people into these holes in the schedule?

I agree 100% with your points but I would add one more that is causing a lot of pain right now:

How they are conducting this production rollout/test.

Disney lost a lot of credibility with those of us who are in the window of going or planning to go in the very near future by springing the tiering of EPCOT on us mid-stream.

I think they've been been pretty good with presenting the long-term, strategic plan, but not the tactical plan.

They know when/if they're going to tier the next Park and they know when and what is the intended roll-out for AP and off-site. Most of this angst many are having would be manageable if some form of that timeline was presented.

 

[Jeslynb]

I agree 100% with your points but I would add one more that is causing a lot of pain right now:

How they are conducting this production rollout/test.

Disney lost a lot of credibility with those of us who are in the window of going or planning to go in the very near future by springing the tiering of EPCOT on us mid-stream.

I think they've been been pretty good with presenting the long-term, strategic plan, but not the tactical plan.

They know when/if they're going to tier the next Park and they know when and what is the intended roll-out for AP and off-site. Most of this angst many are having would be manageable if some form of that timeline was presented.

One of the most interesting parts of this for me was how incredulous some "insiders" were regarding the fact that not everyone knows what Disney is testing and planning when they decide to go. As if the majority of park visitors visit this site or routinely scroll the WDW site! The reality is that most people just...book a trip and go. They. Could. Not. Believe. This.

This site is hugely valuable in many ways, but the groupthink has gone 'round the twist in certain respects.