I want to speak to Jim Lewis, so why can't I?

[going/again]

if you've ever been in line to check in and witnessed someone like the OP blow up and rant at a castmember about what they are entitled to as a result of their investment in DVC, you might not think so...but opinions vary.

there are reasonable and appropriate ways to register dissatisfaction with DVC. "i demand to speak to jim lewis immediately!" is not on that list for most of us.

Re read the op post nowhere in his post does he say that?

 

[Horace Horsecollar]

Al Weiss, President of Worldwide Operations, Walt Disney Parks and Resorts is between Lewis and Staggs

Thank you! I was thinking that might be the case, which is why I asked.

Al Weiss is President, Worldwide Operations, Walt Disney Parks and Resorts.

 

[going/again]

DVC needs .

When members trade to those options, a DVC room is turned over to cash to offest the cost of the trade. No cash guests, no trades.

Surely thats no trades, no cash guests

 

[WilsonFlyer]

I want to speak to Jim Lewis, so why can't I?

Good luck with that. Let me know how it works out for ya.

 

[Anthony1971]

DVC members AND cash guests have paid "full price" for their resort accommodations. They've just paid in two different ways.

DVC involves a large up-front financial commitment and an ongoing financial commitment year after year. It expensive, but in the long run, it can work out well for people who use their DVC points every year.

Cash guests often pay a high nightly rate, especially at deluxe resorts. But there's no long-term commitment. Next year, those guest can go to London or San Francisco or Yellowstone.

Regardless of whether a guest uses DVC points, pays the full rack rate, or a discounted promotional rate, the guest should get the same courteous, efficient treatment at the check-in counter and elsewhere at the resort. None of these guests deserve superior or inferior treatment.

Now if a guest pays a premium for Concierge service, and that service explicitly includes a special check-in location, that's fine. We're now talking about a different "product."

DVC is paying upfront for a hotel at a disounted rate -- It is NOT paying full price and advertised as such. Do not see why 500,000 people would pay full price for use of a hotel for 50+ years upfront-- there must be someting more.. like a BIG discount.. Cost me average of a little under 100 a night including 2 weekend nights to stay at BLT lakeview in Sept. Does that sound like full price or even a discount within reason. (this was done by dividing my buy in by the number of years on the contract plus my dues per point no I did not include the time value of money which would make little difference at this point)

ALL Disney resort guests get the same courteous and type of treatment where did I mention different???????

However as I said a guest who pays rack rate for a hotel park tickets meals etc will certianly be offered something special for future travel by Disney it is good buisness period.......and Disney is a buisness...

 

[Greysword]

To the point Horace and Tim are making, I think there is a significant bleed between Resorts and DVC on an operational level. Without any hard evidence and just speculation based on my business experience, I would believe it if Disney Parks & Resorts attempted to reduce their personnel costs by shifting some (as much as they can get away with) of the "shared" resorts' labor costs to the DVC side (mechanically by moving staff to the DVC payroll or if downsizing is required to do so with resort staff, while asking the DVC paid staff to supplement the workload for cash rooms).

Due to the large number of points, such a move would only be a fractional increase in our dues, but would save the resorts tens of thousands in overhead. If it happens would it be wrong? No, I don't think so, since we (DVC members) are good neighbors. I just want to be sure we get fair treatment.

I think we (the members of the DVC DIS community) have to agree that our dues do have a net positive effect on the expense line for the "shared" resort's Profit & Loss statements, since we do contribute to everything from additional staff to transportation to toiletry costs for the resort as a whole. If someone knows for a fact that the DVC side and Cash side has separate management, oversight, and P&Ls, please let me know.

Thanks!

- Chris

 

[crisi]

Surely thats no trades, no cash guests

No, they'd still have some cash guests with no trades. Trade inventory is only one component of cash guests. The other two - DVD owned inventory and breakage inventory, they would still retain.

And the "no cash guests, no trades" isn't true either - RCI trades aren't a cash trade. But all the Disney collection DOES get paid for by trading room inventory between Resorts/DCL and DVC.

 

[disney1474]

I think that some DVC members think that they are more important than everyone else, for some reason. I think that some members have unrealistic expectations and that ruins their trips a lot of times. I have been a member for 6 years and go twice a year for a week each time. I have never had anything happen at a DVC resort (or Disney for that matter) that has ruined my vacation or made me so mad that I needed to speak with Jim Lewis.

However, I do not go into my vacations expecting royal treatment because I am a DVC member. I go into my vacations happy to be on vacation and have some time to relax in my favorite place. I have never been treated like a second class citizen by anyone at Disney and I suppose if I had several trips that have made me so mad that it ruined things, I would sell my DVC contracts and move on.

 

[Chuck S]

Surely thats no trades, no cash guests

Actually, no. You see, Disney would always likely have some cash rooms available, even if no member traded out, and every DVC room was filled with a DVC points reservations every day. This is because Disney retains some ownership interest that they can rent out.

But, if there were not enough demand for DVC Cash reservations, there could not be member trades to non-DVC locations, other than RCI or other inter timeshare trade. The cash income from the room pays for the non-DVC locations.

 

[Lynne M]

Surely thats no trades, no cash guests

No, Chuck has it in the right order.

The companies at the other end of these trades.....DCL, ABD, Disney Resorts....they expect to be paid for the use of their accommodations. it's the renting of a villa that's comparable in value that generates the money that's used to pay them. Think of it as a way of converting the member's points to currency.

If that mechanism isn't there....how does DCL, etc, get paid for the member's reservation?

 

[eliza61]

I am very frustrated that as members, we are not allowed to have direct contact with Jim Lewis. If we have issues every time we visit Disney, and member satisfaction does not follow up, then we sould be able to send correspondence directly to Jim Lewis.

I am struggling to understand the value of Disney, when each time we travel we keep hearing, "Oh that is for our cash paying customers not DVC members, you do not get that." Really? My dues make it possible for cash paying customers to stay at these DVC resorts so why should they receive better treatment? Over the years we have slipped from being valued members to numbers - in our opinion, DVC is treated as second class citizens, and our perks continue to decrease.

Being that I own 460 points, the yearly dues $2,400 alone that I pay would yield two weeks of accommodations anywhere. I am sure guests at these premium hotels are treated as valued customers.As I am typing this, I have been on hold with DVC member services with a person who can hardly speak english for now 24 minutes.

whoo-whee. I can't even began to imagine the chaos that would be my life if every customer of my company had direct access to me. Sorry but I would not be able to do my job.

Sorry but even guest at 5 star hotels do not have access to the company president. You get direct access to the hotel manager but doubt if you're going to be chatting with Steve Wynn down at the Bellagio.

 

[Dean]

Reasonable people leave reason at home when they vacation at Disney. As they should. That's the beauty of it. It's an escape from a reality that for some is necessary. One week of fantasy at Disney with a return trip next year is enough to deal with the other 51 in the real world. Why would you expect someone who visits Fantasyland every year (some multiple times) to be reasonable while they are there. They take pictures with imaginary characters and spend unreasonable amounts of money on overpriced food and merchanise. It would defeat the purpose. This is the place where characters eat rainbows and poop butterflies... or is that Universal?
You've been here longer than I, (to the tune of 6,000 times) but something seems to have the natives restless.

Some of the issues are real but more of the reason people are upset are of their own doing. That one should reason behind in buying a timeshare seems a little risky to me and reminiscent of teenagers on spring break. There is no way to have a rational and reasonable discussion about the issues if one of your premises is that you don't have to be reasonable and rational. I'd say that if you take that approach, you deserve what you get. One can have a great time on Vacation and a magical time at Disney without leaving your brain at home.

1) Most DVC member trade outs seem to go through RCI...and the proceeds of that rental go back to DVC (the $95 fee), at least in part. They're not rented for cash UNLESS the trade out is for something in the Disney collection (cruise, resort room, etc). In those cases, THAT members dues are (as they should be) paying for upkeep at the resort while going to a cash guest.

2) The resorts wing is paying for the mousekeeping, because that "upgrade" is to a room in cash inventory, not DVC inventory. And the cash inventory pays it's "share" of maintenance fees PLUS covers the costs of any additional benefits the cash guest is getting (mousekeeping, free dining, etc). That they think it's worthwhile to do speaks volumes on their profit margins.

Most points traded are actually for cash options historically. The $95 fee is an exchange fee used to run the exchange system, not as an income generating measure.

 

[Sammie]

I don't think it is reasonable for the OP to want to speak to Jim Lewis and honestly I can't imagine why anyone would want to.

However I am somewhat surprised at some of the comment in this thread and not surprised the OP has not returned to comment.

I think many of you, whether you will own up to it or not have been the lucky ones that have not experienced major problems using DVC. If so honestly how do you know how you would react to serious problems. I am not talking about not getting your room view request, or being on hold for longer than 10 minutes.

I doubt Jim Lewis would respond to a letter, but I have received one from Thomas Skaggs, so some executives do still care about the little people.

 

[Dean]

1) Most DVC member trade outs seem to go through RCI...and the proceeds of that rental go back to DVC (the $95 fee), at least in part. They're not rented for cash UNLESS the trade out is for something in the Disney collection (cruise, resort room, etc). In those cases, THAT members dues are (as they should be) paying for upkeep at the resort while going to a cash guest.

2) The resorts wing is paying for the mousekeeping, because that "upgrade" is to a room in cash inventory, not DVC inventory. And the cash inventory pays it's "share" of maintenance fees PLUS covers the costs of any additional benefits the cash guest is getting (mousekeeping, free dining, etc). That they think it's worthwhile to do speaks volumes on their profit margins.

Actually I think most trades are through cash type exchanges both total number of trades and even more so, number of points.

I don’t enjoy when a poster raises a valid point or invalid misunderstood point, and other posters start piling on with “just sell your points then”.

Honestly, I don't see hardly any of that on DIS, certainly not like on the old Prodigy Board. However, there are clearly some people with unreasonable concerns/expectations that clearly are not going to be happy with DVC and I see nothing wrong with reminding that group of the option not to belong if they are unhappy. Again, I'd refer you to reallocation and valet thread's as good examples as well as many of the complaint threads about trivial issues.

There is a third, very small, category of points DVC turns over to CRO....if a room isn't booked 60(?) days out, DVC turns that room over to CRO and CRO tries to rent it for cash. If they can, then DVC gets at least some of the money. This offsets member dues and shows up in your statement as "breakage income."

Crisi, it's not really that small. ASAMOF, DVC has the right (and I understand they do) to anticipate this 60 day availability and take those rooms at 11 months out. The money generated goes back to DVC to offset dues BUT only up to a certain amount, I think it's 2.5%, the rest is simply profit to DVD.

No, Chuck has it in the right order.

The companies at the other end of these trades.....DCL, ABD, Disney Resorts....they expect to be paid for the use of their accommodations. it's the renting of a villa that's comparable in value that generates the money that's used to pay them. Think of it as a way of converting the member's points to currency.

If that mechanism isn't there....how does DCL, etc, get paid for the member's reservation?

DVD has to pay all of those options (CC, DC, DCL, ABD) in cash or equivalent. They get the cash by securing and renting those rooms (often through CRO). But given CRO takes 50%, there are built in costs, not all such rooms are rented, and DVD doesn't grab the best times to rent, it is a very inefficient system. BTW, all similar ones I know of are as well. They basically work backwards from what cash is generated and then adjust the points accordingly to keep it a zero sum situation.

 

[eliza61]

I don't think it is reasonable for the OP to want to speak to Jim Lewis and honestly I can't imagine why anyone would want to.

However I am somewhat surprised at some of the comment in this thread and not surprised the OP has not returned to comment.

I doubt Jim Lewis would respond to a letter, but I have received one from Thomas Skaggs, so some executives do still care about the little people.

I have been very lucky Sammie in that I haven't had any major problems at DVC, but I have had major problems on vacations (caught on a cruise ship in the middle of a hurricane, caught in a 5 star hotel in Spain while the dang thing was on fire in the middle of the night).
Never did I once think the CEO of the company would get on the phone with me.

Maybe it's because I'm in management and I know how the chains generally work in large companies. A lot of times people scream that they want to speak to the "head" guy in charge thinking they will get their problems solved and a lot of times the "head" guy is not the person to speak too.

 

[jimmytammy]

It would be hard to have direct access to a CEO of any co. Not that they are above it, but even some employees never meet them. We know a CM who works for DVC, still hasnt met him. Heck, I have trouble getting my rep. at times

 

[pilferk]

Most points traded are actually for cash options historically. The $95 fee is an exchange fee used to run the exchange system, not as an income generating measure.

I actually did an edit to change the language minutes after I posted because I wasn't being clear....missed the "most" part in the first line though

Are we 100% sure that every dollar of the $95 is going to run the exchange system?

In any event: The cash rate gotten by CRO looks to be enough of a "premium" over the "points cost" that, even allowing for a healthy profit, the difference would more than cover the ancillary services that have been mentioned.

 

[tjkraz]

Without any hard evidence and just speculation based on my business experience, I would believe it if Disney Parks & Resorts attempted to reduce their personnel costs by shifting some (as much as they can get away with) of the "shared" resorts' labor costs to the DVC side (mechanically by moving staff to the DVC payroll or if downsizing is required to do so with resort staff, while asking the DVC paid staff to supplement the workload for cash rooms).

From what I have been told about the budgeting process, there shouldn't be wiggle room for Disney to improperly pawn-off expenses to DVC.

There really isn't a "DVC payroll" vs "cash payroll." The resorts independently set their operating budgets for the year and then the costs are divided between the cash and DVC components.

If a resort is 30% DVC and 70% hotel, DVC will be charged with 30% of the operating costs in all categories (front desk, transportation, utilities, etc.)

Some accommodations are made for larger sizes of villa rooms but the process should be fairly representative of the resources that members utilize. At the resort itself, you won't find any staff members who are specifically employed by DVC. They all work for the hotel itself and DVC contributes its share of the overall operating funds.

However I am somewhat surprised at some of the comment in this thread and not surprised the OP has not returned to comment.

I think many of you, whether you will own up to it or not have been the lucky ones that have not experienced major problems using DVC. If so honestly how do you know how you would react to serious problems. I am not talking about not getting your room view request, or being on hold for longer than 10 minutes.

I guess it depends upon the details, which we will apparently never know. OP did get piled-on rather quickly, which could make it uncomfortable to post. However, if s/he has a horror story to tell, the tide would quickly turn.

Wanting to speak to JL isn't a reasonable expectation. But if OP has experienced truly horrible service or accommodations, every person on this thread would offer encouragement and suggestions for getting some satisfaction.

Unfortunately, the lack of any details suggests this could be another "I can never book my home resort 3 months out" or similar situation.

 

[EWL]

However I am somewhat surprised at some of the comment in this thread and not surprised the OP has not returned to comment.

I am quite disappointed that the OP has not returned. As a new DVC member trying to learn as much as possible, I'd really like to understand what the issues were that caused such frustration. Was this one of those heat-of-the-moment posts/emails that causes regret after hitting "send"? Or would I be asking the same thing if in the same situation?

I'd really like to understand better what started the whole thing and hope that if the OP is going to post such a provocatively titled thread that she/he will return to elaborate, if for nothing more than to tell us how it was resolved and show that he/she really does have better things to do than just stir the pot.

 

[Brian Noble]

BUT only up to a certain amount, I think it's 2.5%, the rest is simply profit to DVD.

Indeed. And, I bet the spoilage rate is a lot higher than that.