I am so upset and don't know what to do....

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

The only problem I see is that she is 17 and minor. A minor cannot make a contract with you about going on the trip so I think "legally" you would have to give her her money back. Personally I think she should eat the cost.

That's what I was thinking. I think, legally, it depends on who you entered into the agreement with - her or her mom. If you didn't discuss this with her mother, then, unfortunately, you owe her the money back. However, if the agreement was actually with the mother and not the daughter, the money is yours and she gets the tickets.

Sorry I don't agree with the last post. Anyone can purchase Disney Tickets if you have the money. Being a minor has nothing to do with it.

Actually, it does because a verbal contract was created when the OP agreed to take the girl's money in exchange for certain items.

Yes, I saw a case almost identical to this one on Judge Judy (or was it People's Court? Whatever - can you tell I watch too much TV? ). The response: The tickets are non-refundable. You can still use them if you wish; that's not the defendant's problem. Defendant, give plaintiff the tickets and we're done.

But did it deal with minors? I saw a case, too, with a 17 year old who bought a car from someone and it was an "as is" sale. The kid got it home and found out it was a lemon. In court, the kid got every bit of his money back because Judge Judy said minor's can't enter into contracts. She said, if the kid would have been over 18, he wouldn't have gotten back a cent.

 

[suprgrlx]

But did it deal with minors? I saw a case, too, with a 17 year old who bought a car from someone and it was an "as is" sale. The kid got it home and found out it was a lemon. In court, the kid got every bit of his money back because Judge Judy said minor's can't enter into contracts. She said, if the kid would have been over 18, he wouldn't have gotten back a cent.

But, wouldn't that mean that anytime a 16 year old went to the mall and bought something, they could return it whenever they liked?

Also, from what it seems to me, the OP didn't sell the girl the ticket. The girl gave the OP the money to buy something on her behalf. I wouldn't think that was the same thing.

 

[HdnMickeyGrl]

Hmm, this would make a good bar question. The minority deficiency only comes into play in contracts. Not in general sales. So the purchase of a t-shirt in the mall would not be considered a contract. The sale of something that requires a signature on a contract would, like a house, car, boat, etc...

But the money was given to buy something on her behalf and not to sell something. But offering someone money to buy something on your behalf would likely be a contract. There's probably an undue hardship argumet in here somewhere. However, if the minor got the money from the parent and the parent sort of approved the transaction then it's likely you could get around the whole minor issue anyway.

In any case it's unlikely that they would bother with all of this or even be aware of it. I would just offer them the tickets, tell them they can't be refunded and that you suggest they try craigslist.

 

[rt2dz]

I would not allow the mother to insist on cash. She was not forced at gunpoint to give you the money. The GF and the mother made a choice. They are not out money; they are getting what they paid for. If they choose to try and sell them at their own risk (I don’t recommend it), then so be it. If the GF decides to keep them and use them at a later date, she will probably gain money down the line (ticket increases). The GF or mother could call Disney themselves and try to get a refund. Either way, it is the GF problem, not yours. I do not feel it is your son’s responsibility as long as she gets what she paid for. I’d send it to the GF registered mail (cover your bases from the mother) with a letter of explanation.

As far as the MNSSHP ticket, I’d be nice and if she couldn’t get a refund from Disney, I’d take it and see if you could sell it yourself (not for profit). If you can, then give her the money. If you can’t, tough lesson learned for her. It might be the first time in her life something like that happens, but it won’t be the last. At her age, it’s time to start taking the hits of an adult with the comfort of parents as a cushion. It’s helping to prepare her for real life.

I would NOT take the GF as a friend, but maybe your son would like to take another friend (of the male variety, just in case)? Then the new friend could buy the tickets off the GF.

 

[rie'smom]

nevermind.
OP, you have to decide what's right for you.

 

[teachingmyown]

I'm assuming you didn't purchase them from Undercover Tourist, right? Cause if you did and they haven't been opened, they will give a full refund. If by chance you did, then I'd call them asap.

Otherwise, give her the tickets and explain they were purchased in good faith, at her request and are non-refundable, and non-transferable. IF the mom decides to pursue it legally (which, imo, is a HUGE "IF") then you could offer to take them back and maybe even give her a bargain deal for them, if you are so inclined. ($800 for the lot or some such) You will surely have an opportunity in the future to use them yourself on another trip (I HOPE you're planning to return). If all else fails, go ahead and pay for them. It's not like you're "eating" the cost, because the tickets won't expire and since they were purchased before any upcoming price increase they could be considered a bargain anyway.

You have to decide what your priorities are. Is the relationship with the girl and her mom (maybe a life-long relationship--you never know with teens) more important than $1000? If so, remember that when you make your decision and be careful about burning bridges or creating hard feelings. If not, ... well, then, don't be a pushover about it.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

As the PP suggested, would you have a use for the tickets in the future? It's not like you'd be out anything if you kept them and used them later.

 

[BroganMc]

You have to decide what your priorities are. Is the relationship with the girl and her mom (maybe a life-long relationship--you never know with teens) more important than $1000? If so, remember that when you make your decision and be careful about burning bridges or creating hard feelings. If not, ... well, then, don't be a pushover about it.

What difference does it make how long term the relationship is? Money matters are never handled well when you allow emotions to dictate the rules.

This seems to be a clear case of loan vs. gift. The girl produced the money to pay her way for a trip. She should get what she paid for (i.e. tickets and airline credit). She can decide what to do with it.

Now if her mother lent her the money and doesn't know enough to understand refund policies, then maybe she needs a real life lesson too.

As for the son's choosing of girlfriends (or ex-girlfriends), unfortunately that is the bane of every family's existence. You can not chose who someone loves. Believe me, my brothers brought home a bunch of winners. Even the ones they chose to build lives with often leave me annoyed and frustrated at times. But all you can do is listen, maybe offer a word of wisdom here and there, and mostly pray they find someone who'll treat them and you right. Or else disown them once they turn 18 and wash your hands of it all.

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

This seems to be a clear case of loan vs. gift. The girl produced the money to pay her way for a trip. She should get what she paid for (i.e. tickets and airline credit). She can decide what to do with it.

I'm not understanding how a gift enters into this? Nobody's saying that anyone gave or received a gift.

 

[PaDisney02]

I think she should still go. Ask her if she wants to come just as a family friend like the previous posts have said. If she declines then just give her the ticket and its her problem. Good Luck

 

[VeroBeachGirl]

If the ex-gf has tickets and a room of her own, maybe you can suggest she invite another friend and just vacation independently of you and your family?

 

[TinkRBel_In_Training]

It sounds like its the girl's mom who has the problem here and demanding a cash refund. But honestly, that is not your responsibility to take on. If I were you, I would give the girl her tickets and she can decide what to do with them. If the mom gives you any more grief over not getting the cash back, then kindly explain to her that Disney does not give refunds on tickets paid for, and the airline will only give credit back. Regardless of who paid for the tickets, the mother knew (or should have known) the risk she or her daughter were taking in forking over $1000 6+ months in advance for her daughter to take a trip with her boyfriend. They are not married, and therefore the chances of the relationship ending before the trip are significantly higher. The bottom line is, her mother needs to realize that the tickets are non-refundable and you're very sorry but thats just how it works. Do not let her force you into giving her $1000 in cash, there is no reason for you to have to pay for a risk that she and her daughter took in spending that much money that far in advance and then whoops, it didn't work out.

As for her getting all of her money back, that is a nice thought but I don't think that is possible unless she takes a trip all on her own at the same time as your family is going. She will be out the money of the special party tickets (unless she can convince them to give her a refund) because those are for a specific day, along with any other specific-day tickets you may have purchased. It really is an unfortunate situation, but their relationship did not work out and that is not your fault.

 

[suprgrlx]

But the money was given to buy something on her behalf and not to sell something. But offering someone money to buy something on your behalf would likely be a contract. There's probably an undue hardship argumet in here somewhere.

Please everyone else feel free to ignore me here, I just have a purely academic interest in this.

You say above "offer" someone money. I would think this would have to mean that the OP made money on the transaction (like a commission, or like UT presumably does). For example, if I told person A "I'll give you $5 to procure me a soda", I would see how you could call that a contract. However, if I said to person B "Here's $5, could you pick me up a soda when you go to the store" I wouldn't think that was.

Also, I looked on Wiki and found this:

Also, barter transactions such as purchasing a retail item in exchange for a cash payment is generally recognized through a legal fiction to not be a contract due to the absence of promises of future action. A minor may not disavow such a trade.

So wouldn't that be a similar situation here? She gave the OP money in exchange for a ticket?

 

[BostonRob]

Also, I looked on Wiki and found this:

Also, barter transactions such as purchasing a retail item in exchange for a cash payment is generally recognized through a legal fiction to not be a contract due to the absence of promises of future action. A minor may not disavow such a trade.

So wouldn't that be a similar situation here? She gave the OP money in exchange for a ticket?

Don't believe wiki. They're wrong. A retail purchase is most certainly a contract.
Because the girl is a minor, she can (in theory) demand her money back from the mother. So then the mother is stuck with the non-refundable tickets. The ironic thing is that if the girl bought the tickets from Disney herself, she (being a minor) wouldn't be bound by the terms of the deal (nonrefundable) and could get her money back and nobody would be stuck with anything.

 

[suprgrlx]

Don't believe wiki. They're wrong. A retail purchase is most certainly a contract.
Because the girl is a minor, she can (in theory) demand her money back from the mother. So then the mother is stuck with the non-refundable tickets. The ironic thing is that if the girl bought the tickets from Disney herself, she (being a minor) wouldn't be bound by the terms of the deal (nonrefundable) and could get her money back and nobody would be stuck with anything.

So does that mean that a minor could buy a 5-day ticket, use four days and then demand their money back? If not, what makes this different?

 

[rie'smom]

The law is different in different states. We don't know where the OP lives.
The girl's mom won't file unless she's an idiot. Lawyers and court fees will end up costing more than the tickets.
OP have there been any updates?

 

[Dopey's twin Dippy]

i personally feel that the girl paid for plane and disney tickets then its her problem if she doesnt want to go. i also, would not still invite her. i dont think it would be a very happy trip...........she will have a credit for plane tickets and the disney ticket is still good for whenever...if i were that mother iwould just give the ex girlfriend her tickets and let her do whatever she must do. and i def. would not even have anything to do with the other mother. she does not have to.

 

[CanadianGuy]

While interesting to read.. there's not a lot of planning or themepark info in this thread.. moving it over to the ThemePark Community Board.

Thanks,

Knox

 

[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]

The law is different in different states. We don't know where the OP lives.
The girl's mom won't file unless she's an idiot. Lawyers and court fees will end up costing more than the tickets.
OP have there been any updates?

Most people don't hire a lawyer to go to small claims court. The court fees are actually pretty small and, depending where you are, you can ask to be awarded those fees in your claim. If you do ever happen to catch one of those daytime court shows, you'll see that people go to court for far less than $1000. I wouldn't rule it out.

 

[disneyin2008]

So are ya'll saying that the $1,000 was handed to OP in CASH? If not, how was it paid to OP....by a check written by mom? If so, then all this discussion about whether or not it's a contract with the minor is rather moot, because if the mom wrote the check, then any contract would have been with the mom, not the daughter.

And, please, don't judge the legal system on those hokey courtroom drama shows. They do way too much editing of the law for "good television". Ever notice at the credits it either says, or an announcer says, that these people had a real case filed in small claims but agreed to dismiss their case and have it settled here in People's Court (or whatever the show is?). That's because the cases are found for their television value.....the more TV value the better chance of being picked. And they have to agree to dismiss their case with prejudice (meaning they can't file it again if they don't like the TV verdict) because many, if not most, of the legal decisions are based on good TV not good law. Ask any lawyer how much reality in legal basis goes into those verdicts. Kinda like believing that every medical show you watch is true to symptoms and treatments and cures. Entertaintain yes, reality no.


OP doesn't owe cash back to this family...she owes them the tickets they asked her to purchase for them, and that's all.