How to Include DVC in a Will?

[DisneyStarWisher]

My DH and I are getting ready to update our will. How exactly do you include DVC into a will?

 

[OKW Lover]

We just explained DVC to our lawyer and left the legalities up to him.

 

[Her Dotness]

We just explained DVC to our lawyer and left the legalities up to him.

Sounds like the best approach because state laws may vary widely on how such must be dealt with.

 

[DisneyStarWisher]

We just explained DVC to our lawyer and left the legalities up to him.

So, I'm curious. What were the terms you used to explain DVC?

 

[OKW Lover]

So, I'm curious. What were the terms you used to explain DVC?

Basically that it was a time share with a deeded ownership.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Time share with deeded ownership and a termination date. The state in which it is deeded is also relevant (is, do you own in Florida, Hawaii, SC...)

 

[Murron]

Why not just add whomever you're leaving it to on the deed?

 

[CarolMN]

If you do not live in Florida (or in the state that includes the resort you own), ask your attorney if a trust would be a good choice for you. If your DVC contract(s) are passed on via a will, your heir will have to go through probate in Florida (or South Carolina or Hawaii) as well as in your state of residence. Probate can be an expensive and lengthy process. Property in a trust does not go through probate. Trusts are also private. Wills are not. That may or may not be important to you.

Good for you for dealing with this now. You might be surprised to find out how many people avoid the subject and leave a mess for their survivors.

Off topic story: I remember some clients who were quite resistant about making a Will. They were told that without a Will, the state would decide who would get custody of their minor children. They were also told who that would probably be under current the law. (State laws vary). They were shocked. (Apparently, the state pick was not their pick at all. They told us on their next visit that they now had a Will.

 

[DisneyStarWisher]

Time share with deeded ownership and a termination date. The state in which it is deeded is also relevant (is, do you own in Florida, Hawaii, SC...)

We own in Florida and SC but are not residents of either state.

Why not just add whomever you're leaving it to on the deed?

I have read about that on here. If I understand correctly, that process would require us to have a new title written, correct? Also, how would that affect the current use of our membership?

If you do not live in Florida (or in the state that includes the resort you own), ask your attorney if a trust would be a good choice for you. If your DVC contract(s) are passed on via a will, your heir will have to go through probate in Florida (or South Carolina or Hawaii) as well as in your state of residence. Probate can be an expensive and lengthy process. Property in a trust does not go through probate. Trusts are also private. Wills are not. That may or may not be important to you.

Good for you for dealing with this now. You might be surprised to find out how many people avoid the subject and leave a mess for their survivors.

Off topic story: I remember some clients who were quite resistant about making a Will. They were told that without a Will, the state would decide who would get custody of their minor children. They were also told who that would probably be under current the law. (State laws vary). They were shocked. (Apparently, the state pick was not their pick at all. They told us on their next visit that they now had a Will.

We are familiar with trusts (my parents just went that route) but we are not ready for that yet. We will definitely go that route eventually. We have had a will since our DSs were young, but now that they are adults, it's time to get it updated. As of right now I doubt either of our DSs would be interested in keeping any of our contracts because they wouldn't want to assume the annual dues. I honestly doubt they would want to go through probate if it's expensive and lengthy. So I'm assuming if they don't complete that process or pay the annual dues, Disney just takes the contracts back. Is that correct? (Of course, I would hope they wouldn't do that, but I wouldn't have control at that point, would I? LOL!) Obviously, we need to have that discussion with them before proceeding with anything in the will.

 

[CarolynFH]

We own in Florida and SC but are not residents of either state.


I have read about that on here. If I understand correctly, that process would require us to have a new title written, correct? Also, how would that affect the current use of our membership?



We are familiar with trusts (my parents just went that route) but we are not ready for that yet. We will definitely go that route evidentually. We have had a will since our DSs were young, but now that they are adults, it's time to get it updated. As of right now I doubt either of our DSs would be interested in keeping any of our contracts because they wouldn't want to assume the annual dues. I honestly doubt they would want to go through probate if it's expensive and lengthy. So I'm assuming if they don't complete that process or pay the annual dues, Disney just takes the contracts back. Is that correct? (Of course, I would hope they wouldn't do that, but I wouldn't have control at that point, would I? LOL!)

There’s lots of discussion on TUG about inheriting TS. One thing I’ve learned there is that a person can refuse to accept an inheritance, including a TS. I’ll look for some links for you, since you say your sons won’t want yours.

 

[bbeagle]

So I'm assuming if they don't complete that process or pay the annual dues, Disney just takes the contracts back. Is that correct? (Of course, I would hope they wouldn't do that, but I wouldn't have control at that point, would I? LOL!) Obviously, we need to have that discussion with them before proceeding with anything in the will.

Why would they just 'give it away' to Disney if it has value if sold?

When I've witnessed a will where there were properties that someone was given but did not want:
a) whoever is handling the estate can just sell the properties and have everyone split the profits
b) if someone does want it, and nobody else does, and it's low-value - it's just given to the person who wants it
c) if someone does want it, and nobody else does, and it has a significant value - many times the person pays the others what they think is reasonable for the person to keep it. Sometimes nobody cares about the money and lets the one person have it.

(properties refers to anything like a desk, chair, painting, house, real property, etc)

When our family was willed the family farm, all 3 did not want to share in the farm. One person was given it, and the market value of the farm was divided and the person who bought it gave 1/3rd to each of the other two.

 

[RoseGold]

We own in Florida and SC but are not residents of either state.

You own deeded real estate in two states that you do not live in. You need a plan to probate real estate in both of these states. This will require lawyers in both, because your estate won't be in either. It's a lot easier to figure this out now than when you die.

There are a lot of other ways to structure this. Trusts, LLCs, "adding people" or changing the ownership of the properties. Florida does have ways to hold real estate that some states don't, so your local lawyer needs to know about all the options on the table. South Carolina might have even more?

Don't forget US tax law can be very complicated in this area, especially if you are talking about a property with significant increase in value. That needs to be considered before "adding people" or changing the ownership of the assets.

You need local legal advice and possibly tax advice. This is a part of smart estate planning, and your lawyer will know what to do.

 

[_auroraborealis_]

Everyone has hit on many of the reasons you gotta tell your lawyer where the property is deeded. It matters quite a lot.

 

[RoseGold]

As of right now I doubt either of our DSs would be interested in keeping any of our contracts because they wouldn't want to assume the annual dues. I honestly doubt they would want to go through probate if it's expensive and lengthy. So I'm assuming if they don't complete that process or pay the annual dues, Disney just takes the contracts back. Is that correct?

Property belongs to your estate, and it has to be handled in the court system where it is located. Think about it like owning a house in Florida. Yes, if you do nothing, it will get foreclosed. But to get the deed changed, for someone to either own it or sell it, it has to go through the proper channels.

If you die, your estate can't sell deeds in Florida without clear title. There are other structures that could still have clear title whether you are alive or not, like an LLC or a trust. This is a question for your local lawyer, as local laws vary significantly, and this can be VERY expensive to operate in some states. I can think of many scenarios where probating in Florida is the correct answer. You just plan for it and have it ready to go. It's a math/tax question to me. Maybe not so much at HH...

 

[drusba]

DVC is real estate and would be put into a will in a similar way as any other real estate you own. Nevertheless, you should consider having this done by a lawyer. Some reasons for that:

1. Assuming you bought the timeshare together, your deed most likely says that both of you own the timeshare as husband and wife. That means the property is in joint ownership with right of survivorship. If one dies, what is in the will has no real application at the time. Under the law, the surviving spouse automatically becomes the full owner of the property and the property is not subject to any distribution in the deceased's will and is not subject to probate. Note that is a usual situation with any real property, including a home, owned by a married couple who purchased the property together.

2. The issue is thus what is needed if both die at the same time or what happens when the surviving spouse dies. That is when the property becomes subject to what may be in a will or other document, such as a living trust, controlling distribution. In other words, the main consideration for putting the property in a will is who gets it after both spouses die, such as children. If there is more than one child, you also have the problem of which one gets it because any particular contract that you purchased from Disney cannot be divided for any distribution. In other words, if you have two children, you cannot give half to one child and half to another; you either must give it to both as joint owners or give it to only one.

3. When that second spouse dies, the property becomes subject to probate. The problem with any real estate is that any probate procedure for the property must be brought in the state where the property is, meaning Florida for any WDW timeshare. In the words, if, for example, the deceased owner lived in in New York, you will need the generally applicable probate proceeding in New York, and pay separately for another probate proceeding in Florida for the timeshare where the estate will likely need to hire a lawyer in Florida.

4. That leads to considering what you really want to happen after the surviving spouse dies. Having a will to cover it is one issue but avoiding probate may be another. That leads to the consideration of whether you should create what is called a living trust applicable to everything that will be distributed upon death of the owners. The living trust is created to define distribution of just about everything the married couple owns, similar to a will, but it also creates a legal entity for ownership of any property, the trust, and once it is created, ownership of any real estate is transferred via deed to the trust entity. The will that is created mainly just cites to the living trust and usually sends anything that might not already be controlled by the living trust at time of death to the living trust. What then occurs is that all real property, including the timeshares is not subject to any probate, because ownership has previously been transferred to the living trust, an entity that is considered still "living" at time of the surviving spouse's death, and the property is distributed according to the terms of the living trust.

Bottom-line is that you may have a lot more to think about than just creating a will, and legal help on the issue is something you should consider.

 

[anricat]

Why not just add whomever you're leaving it to on the deed?

There are a few reasons one may not want to do this. For college age kids, I believe it could count as an asset in situations like financial aid. Plus, I think it costs money to add them. Also, you may want to leave it to your kids, but if your kids are currently under the age of 18, that doesn't work very well.

 

[paults]

drusba, thanks that's is info I needed.

 

[Her Dotness]

This may not be your situation, but reading this reminded me of a similar thread on another forum.

The potential heir asked how to tell her parents gently that she'd long since had all the Disney she ever wanted. Spending her money to keep up dues or renting out the points to cover them was way down among last things she'd care to do.

Her parents were still devout Disney goers and wanted her to have a contract that represented wonderful times and memories--for them, not so much for her.

I don't know how it was resolved, but since you say neither DS may want to have to cover dues,"Would you rather we stipulate the contract(s) be sold and the money given to each of you instead?" is an important discussion to have.

 

[DisneyStarWisher]

This may not be your situation, but reading this reminded me of a similar thread on another forum.

The potential heir asked how to tell her parents gently that she'd long since had all the Disney she ever wanted. Spending her money to keep up dues or renting out the points to cover them was way down among last things she'd care to do.

Her parents were still devout Disney goers and wanted her to have a contract that represented wonderful times and memories--for them, not so much for her.

I don't know how it was resolved, but since you say neither DS may want to have to cover dues,"Would you rather we stipulate the contract(s) be sold and the money given to each of you instead?" is an important discussion to have.

But in order to do that wouldn't it still have to go through probate? If they go through all of that, then the decision should be theirs as to whether they want to keep it or sell it. I would not want to stipulate that in the will in case they changed their minds.

 

[Her Dotness]

Sorry. I wasn't very clear, was I?

The woman's parents had told her they wanted her to have their points when they were gone. She didn't know how to tell them she'd rather they didn't leave them to her.

In the event you'd both die unexpectedly, having to deal with dividing or selling the contracts could feel more like a burden than a legacy.

I meant to discuss with them now if they want any of the points at all.