Hollywood & Vine and Le Cellier and Gratuity

[buckinrutt]

First post because we, after many trips to Disney World, had our first bad experience.

Hollywood and Vine has always been one of our favorite buffets and we've always included it on our dinning plan reservations each year. However, we were disappointed with the waitress and her comments about gratuity.

I am so angry right now about this that I'm struggling to keep this above the belt. But here it goes ...

We're just your ordinary middle-class family that saves each year to spend 7 days staying inside Disney. We don't carry a lot of extra cash, not that we have much to carry, and one reason is because we pay for everything ahead of time when we purchase the package.

So this year gratuity is not included in the dinning plan and I get the check for the meal and there are two sets of numbers at the bottom stating what grautity would be appropriate based on the total cost of the meal. The tip/gratuity was $20. Seven days times $20 was going to drain my wallet. This was unexpected and I surely did not come prepared to pay a $20 gratuity each time we ate dinner.

So my wife and I talked it over (we have two young children as well) and I told her that if we paid gratuity every evening the most we could pay was $10. So I paid the waitress $10.

She was working the table beside us which had about 10 people eating together. When she brought their check back she thanked them over and over and wished them well. She then turned to our table and handed me the receipt and said, "Thanks, I need you to sign .... " When she walked away I looked at my wife and we both were thinking the same thing. But it did not end here.

The waitress returned in just a few minutes and thanked the table beside us again and told them how she had three daughters to feed, etc. Of course, she said it loud enough to be heard at our table. Again, my wife looked at me and our thoughts were the same.

As I said, I did not have $20 to give as a tip. Secondly, this is a serve yourself buffet and all she did was bring us drinks ONCE!

The behavior of this waitress just about got the best of me. Not only am I disappointed in her behavior (first time any cast member was ever anything but nice), but I am not pleased with the way gratuity is being handled on the dinning plan. I had rather the plan price go up to include gratuity once again than to have it placed on my table and me get the shock and awe. At least in this way we could pre-pay when we purchased the package.

Something similar happened at Le Cellier (EPCOT Canada). When the waitress brought us the check she confused me with what she was asking. It was not until it was all over that I realized that she wanted a credit card so she could charge the gratuity amount listed at the bottom of the check - which was about $25.

Though the food was as good as ever, the behavior of the waitress at both locations was both strange and somewhat unprofessional. Yes, the check says gratuity is an option, but it creates an uncomfortable situation at times, something that has never ever existed at Disney in all our trips.

The waitress has to make a living, but I can only give the living I have made or, better yet, brought with me at the time. I hope Disney will work gratuity back into the dinning plan price so it can be paid up front.

 

[Haley]

Isn't the suggested amount on the check 15%? So you were giving what, 7%???

If you knew gratuities weren't included then why didn't you budget enough money to tip the waiter/waitress- it shouldn't have been a surprise.

Trust me- I'm young and probably make a lot less $$ than you but I would never under tip someone like that- I plan the tips as part of my vacation budget.

 

[Willow1213]

I think the poster was referring to the fact that they did not know that tip was no longer included.

It's unfortunate that Disney did not include gratuities this year in the dining plan, but things change. It was fairly well advertised that gratuity was not longer included, especially if you were on the DIS boards, so I don't know how it wasn't noticed. But that's beyond the point.

Even if having to pay a gratuity came up as a surprise, tipping approprietly should not be a budget breaker on vacation. If she did not deserve the tip, that's one thing, but if you cannot afford to tip maybe you should have chosen a less expensive restaurant or cut back in some other area. Sorry if that sounds harsh, but it's my opinion on the matter. Hope your vacation was a good one, and sorry if the wait staff was rude to you and your family.

 

[dallastxcpa]

Isn't the suggested amount on the check 15%? So you were giving what, 7%???

If you knew gratuities weren't included then why didn't you budget enough money to tip the waiter/waitress- it shouldn't have been a surprise.

Trust me- I'm young and probably make a lot less $$ than you but I would never under tip someone like that- I plan the tips as part of my vacation budget.

I don't believe this is right. The standard gratuity suggested is 18%. However, as the original poster said I don't think it is necessary to tip someone 18% at a buffet were all they do is refill your drink. And by definition it is a gratuity and not a requirement.

 

[srwarden1928]

I tip 10% for buffets and 15% for table service. I went to H&V and tipped 10%. I did not have to listen to such rude comments from the wait staff. I'm sorry they were so rude to you.

BTW I dont know where Disney got the idea of 18% gratuity, but as far as I'm concerned, they can keep it unless there is OUTSTANDING service. And even then I wouldnt tip over 15% for a buffet.

 

[kaytieeldr]

I think the poster was referring to the fact that they did not know that tip was no longer included.

No, I think the OP did know about the change, in advance:

So this year gratuity is not included in the dinning plan and

Now, too, the 18% and 20% printed on the receipt are suggested amounts, calculated for the Guest's convenience - and, okay, to increase the likelihood but most certainly not the requirement, that the Guest tip that amount.

While the non-included gratuity may have been a surprise to the OP at this first meal, rather than penalize this and all future servers for a business decision made by the company (which, by the way, was driven at least in PART by Guests' complaints that they were getting poor service using the Dining Plan because the servers' tips were guaranteed), they could have instead opted to make food selections in lower price ranges at all subsequent restaurants. This would have kept the gratuity down to a more affordable/less anger-inducing level.

She was working the table beside us which had about 10 people eating together. When she brought their check back she thanked them over and over and wished them well. She then turned to our table and handed me the receipt and said, "Thanks, I need you to sign .... " When she walked away I looked at my wife and we both were thinking the same thing. But it did not end here.

Unless the OP saw the other party's check AND tip, or eavesdropped throughout their entire meal, the OP has NO idea whether they were just super-friendly toward the waitress, whether they already knew her, whether they left a tip in the 50% range...

As I said, I did not have $20 to give as a tip. Secondly, this is a serve yourself buffet and all she did was bring us drinks ONCE!

If you don't have it, you don't have it. Again, the amounts on your receipt are suggestions; the 18% on that other party's check is MANDATORY (and again, maybe they tipped above that amount). But if all you got was one round of drinks, no attention from your server whatsoever, and your empty plates piled up on the table - yeah, tip whatever you want.

Something similar happened at Le Cellier (EPCOT Canada). When the waitress brought us the check she confused me with what she was asking. It was not until it was all over that I realized that she wanted a credit card so she could charge the gratuity amount listed at the bottom of the check - which was about $25.

The Guest has at least as much responsibility here as the server. If you don't understand what is being requested, especially when it may involve your money, ASK. Don't pay for anything until you know what you're paying FOR.

 

[kaytieeldr]

BTW I dont know where Disney got the idea of 18% gratuity

The typical tip is 15% to 20%.
The average of 15% and 20% is 17.5%.
Mathematics rules for decimals round UP when a number is .5 to .9, to provide a whole number (people have enough trouble calculating an even percent, never mind throwing a fraction in there).
17.5% therefore is rounded UP to 18% - the amount Disney tipped its servers for Dining Plan checks,,, and nobody complained about the rate when it was coming out of Disney's pocket (note that this is a different issue from the "we get poor service because the tip is guaranteed" thing).

Could they, instead of 18% and 20%, provide the 15% and 20% calculations? Sure - but DDE users and parties of size or more Guests are assessed a mandatory 18% service charge; why would Disney make it simple for people deciding on the tip amount themselves, to leave less?

 

[Mackey Mouse]

I am sorry this happened to you.... truly. I think the word we need to remember here is that this is a voluntary offering....a tip is not mandatory unless you know that going in.. We had Mother's Brunch at the Intercontinental in Boston, there were 7 of us plus my grandson, the tip was included and trust me the service was not incredible, it was a buffet and when the bill came it was 20%. We paid the bill, we knew it up front, it was included..

In this case, it is voluntary and if the person did not budget that in for his trip than he has to do the best he can. Where I live it is at least 15% and probably always 20% so that is the way I tip when I am in WDW. I tip the same for table service as I would for buffets....it just makes life easier and these people live on their tips.. I know that. I had a Mom who was a waitress, back in the day we called them waitresses, so I remember my roots and always keep that in mind when tipping. If they are terrific, I am talking terrific, they get more than 20%, but I have that money budgetted for their tips.

I know what happened to you was hearsay at the Hollywood & Vine, truly I would not care what she said in earshot of me... you did the best you could with the monies you brought... You could have left her nothing as it is still voluntary.

As far as the server at the other restaurant asking you if you would like to give a credit card to leave the tip, well I think that is a bit nervy and I might follow that up with a letter to Disney.. seriously, they created this monster by taking the tips off the Dining plan....so I would let them know how you feel about being accosted at each meal for more of a tip...

 

[LittleStinkerbelle]

From what I can gather, it doesn't sound to me that the waitresses did something rude. Are you offended that they brought you a check with suggested tip amounts printed on the bottom? When we were there last month those amounts were printed (not handwritten) on the receipt as part of the print out. We weren't on the dining plan. I think everyone's receipt had that printed on it.

It's not mandatory that you tip the amount printed, I think it's just there for those who don't want to do the math in their head.

Did you know before arriving that tips were no longer included? If not I'm sorry for the confusion. If so, I think you should've budgeted accordingly. If it were me and tips didn't fit into the trip budget I would've either gone for 6 nights instead of 7 and used the savings towards tips or nix the meal plan and eat CS where tips aren't an issue.

 

[TDC Nala]

I think they believe it is rude that the server made comments within their hearing that she had "children to feed" and appreciated a larger tip.

Where the tip is not mandatory, servers have to take what they're given without comment.

The suggested amounts are probably placed on the tip as 1) a reminder to those who are not aware that the tip is no longer included in the dining plan 2) a guidance as to what the customary tip is at a resort destination like WDW and 3) an alert to foreign visitors who aren't aware of U.S. tipping customs. But a party of less than 6 people is still given the option to tip whatever they feel like tipping. Although 7% is a very low tip and far below what is customary at WDW for good service, the diners are given that option.

I don't believe WDW has any interest in paying guests' gratuities FOR them anymore and the tip will not be included in the dining plan.

 

[DISNEY1975]

Isn't the suggested amount on the check 15%? So you were giving what, 7%???

If you knew gratuities weren't included then why didn't you budget enough money to tip the waiter/waitress- it shouldn't have been a surprise.

Trust me- I'm young and probably make a lot less $$ than you but I would never under tip someone like that- I plan the tips as part of my vacation budget.

The suggested amounts on the bottom of the bills are 18 and 20 %. 20% if you get good service, 18% is the norm.

Where I am from, 15% is the norm. 15% has been the norm for about 30 years now. The way the wait staff gets more money is because the restaurant prices have increased over the years. I dont think the tip % should increase as well...especially at Disney where everything is overpriced to begin with.

The original poster should not feel guilty. I recently read that Disney wait staff make between $100 - $140 THOUSAND per year.

 

[philmagic]

I have used the dining plan when tips were included and when they weren't. It is a toss up. With tips included, I found the service to be terrible, but when they aren't included, meal times are more stressful as you have to plan for the tips.

We tip 20% pretty much all of the time. The reason being is waitstaff rely on tips to make there paychecks. Do you realize that most wait people are paid under minimum wage? Even as low as $2 an hour because they make tips. In some states, the wait staff must pay taxes on what they sell. For example, if the server sells $10000 in food, it is assumed they were tipped 15%. That means that their earnings are taxed on $150. Which means their small paycheck is even small due to the larger taxes taken out. Trust me, I know people in the business who take home about $65 on their paychecks. If they aren't tipped by the customers then they aren't making a living.

I agree that poor service can be tipped accordingly, but I tip them pretty much all the same - because everyone has a bad day once in a while.

 

[philmagic]

I meant to say a $1000, not $10000

 

[Allison]

Not commenting on the behavior of the servers but in our area the standard tip is 15%-20%. If the service is good, then that is what we tip. If we can't afford this as part of the cost of the meal, we would be going somewhere else. That is part of how I do my budgeting.

 

[Narnia]

I think $150 (about $18 an hour) is great pay for a waitress. What makes the waiters in one resteraunt better then others at Disney? why don't they pay a wage? if I were working at lets say trails end I'd be really upset that people at coral reef were going to get a bigger tip.Sure they aren't getting dr's wages but in canada that pay is great(my dh get's $14 an hour). I tip acordingly. I also tip to what I can afford. I go ti pizza hut dine in and I only leave $5 tip sometimes a $2 on a $15-30 bill and i only leave 5 at chinese all-you-can-eat no matter how much the bill comes too.geez I have no Idea why waiters would worry about the amount they get it all evens out rightI'm going to be tying to pay the right amount of $$ but if the survice suck well....($10 is a good tip

 

[dav264]

I tip 10% for buffets and 15% for table service. I went to H&V and tipped 10%. I did not have to listen to such rude comments from the wait staff. I'm sorry they were so rude to you.

BTW I dont know where Disney got the idea of 18% gratuity, but as far as I'm concerned, they can keep it unless there is OUTSTANDING service. And even then I wouldnt tip over 15% for a buffet.

I completely agree with you. My wife and I were very surprised to see that the lowest “suggested” tip was 18%, especially for a buffet. Our rule or thumb is also 10% for buffets and 15% for table service and that’s for good service.
I also want to point out that, as far as I am concerned, Disney is slipping badly in the food department across the board. We had many instances on our recent trip were the food was average to bad quality at best. We had a few instances where hot food was actually cold and in some cases just poor quality. We also had a rather bad experience at the Yachtsman steakhouse with both the service and the food, which we have not experienced in the past and is simply unacceptable given the prices they charge.
I get the impression and I am sure this has been voiced before, that this is a case of Disney knowing that they have us where they want us and just not caring about the quality or simply thinking that their reputation can make up for the decline in quality, which I would guess in either case is profit driven, since their prices have certainly not declined.

 

[BluOrchid2]

If you didn't know that tips were not included in the dining plan anymore, then I am sorry.

If you did know, and just didn't plan for having enough money to tip appropriately, which is 15% - 20% for decent to good service at a table service restaurant WHEREVER you go, Disney or not, then I don't. You have to figure the cost of an appropriate tip into the total bill whenever you are planning to dine out, whether you are at Disney World or not. And 10% is just not considered appropriate anymore, unfortunately.

Oh, and for the record, I agree that 15-20% is not necessary at a buffet where the waitress has only refilled your glass one time. But not at LeCellier, where you presumably received good service. Tips are earned. And if you did not receive good service, you should have discussed it with the manager.

 

[ShellyLynn3630]

Hey, I'll give you one better. We are having to eat seperately from some family members in September at our dinner ressies because they only plan only leaving five dollars at each of our ten TS dinners. We will tip 15% to 18% at each dinner. They bugeted only $50 for tips. I am sure that they will have some pissed of waiters.

 

[Pumbaa_]

Hey, I'll give you one better. We are having to eat seperately from some family members in September at our dinner ressies because they only plan only leaving five dollars at each of our ten TS dinners. We will tip 15% to 18% at each dinner. They bugeted only $50 for tips. I am sure that they will have some pissed of waiters.

I wouldn't eat with them either

 

[cymbaldiva]

This is why I am at heart a counter service girl - Disney food has been, while remaining overpriced, on a decline for a while, so I'm overpaying for mediocre food. Then to top it off the waitstaff has the nerve to be snarky if they feel that they're not being tipped enough?

No thanks - I'll be the one on the bench people-watching eating my hot dog...I don't need the stress!