Has Environmentality gone too far?

[DisLiss]

Not sure it's too far, but I do fear there is always the danger of unintended consequences. In DC, they implemented a 5 cent bag tax for plastic bags. The rational provided was that the money would be used to clean up the many plastic bags that find their way into the environment, most specifically the Potomac River. It sounds good, but ...... on more than one occasion I witnessed a bag get away from somebody and start to blow away. In both cases, the person made no effort to catch it and instead said something along the lines of "Oh well, I already paid for somebody to clean that up".

I'm willing to bet a whole lot of nickels that anyone who says that would not have gone after the lost bag before the tax, either. Now they just feel they have a cute little excuse to toss out when it happens.

 

[dominiondad]

I'm willing to bet a whole lot of nickels that anyone who says that would not have gone after the lost bag before the tax, either. Now they just feel they have a cute little excuse to toss out when it happens.

I get it. But when we make these rules, we have to keep in mind that if we tell people they have to pay to have their mess cleaned up, once they pay, they will expect somebody else to do it. We've given them an easy out.

 

[Dingdingding]

A paper straw biodegrades in 2-6 weeks. A plastic straw 200+ years. A paper bag is about the same. A plastic bag takes about 1000 years. So yes, short term blight versus long term blight. It's not something that can be ignored. As for straws, we tend to use metal ones these days. We travel with 3 kids, so it's rare we don't carry a bag of some kind on us. There are always straws in a travel toothbrush case in there. We have left a few behind in restaurants when we've been careless, but generally it's no big deal. As for shopping bags, I've got some reusable bags stashed in both our cars. If we are just running in to the grocery store for a few items, it's no big deal to bring 2 or 3 with me. We do tend to order Walmart pickup, so we get lots of plastic bags for our major food shopping. Fortunately that same Walmart has a recycling drop off for those bags as well. It's a pain, and we aren't 100% consistent about it, but we try.

It's really about effort. The consumer has to want to take small steps. So I agree the bans from the top down aren't perfect. But if it gets people thinking and talking and trying to change, then it's not a bad idea. It's just not a great system. I prefer the economic model. Charging people for single use plastics and let them decide if the convenience is worth the price required. Keep slowly jacking the price until behavior changes.

Problem is that paper bags are, when they are produced, a lot more poluting than plastic bags. Reusable helps, but only if you actually use it a lot more than plastic ones. Where I live there are little thin plastic bags, they are outfasing thicker plastic bags and promote reusable ones. Problem is; I know a lot of people with 10+ reusable bags. When you don't actually reuse them that often they become even more hazardous than the regular plastic bags. I actually reuse the thicker plastic bags a lot (about as much as I would with a resuable one) and think that is still better than doing so with reusable bags which are even thicker and more poluting to produce and harder to recycle afterwards.

 

[AurumPunzel]

Problem is that paper bags are, when they are produced, a lot more poluting than plastic bags. Reusable helps, but only if you actually use it a lot more than plastic ones. Where I live there are little thin plastic bags, they are outfasing thicker plastic bags and promote reusable ones. Problem is; I know a lot of people with 10+ reusable bags. When you don't actually reuse them that often they become even more hazardous than the regular plastic bags. I actually reuse the thicker plastic bags a lot (about as much as I would with a resuable one) and think that is still better than doing so with reusable bags which are even thicker and more poluting to produce and harder to recycle afterwards.

Same here, even though I've also bought into Disney's reusable bags, and I'm reusing them the best I can, but the quality issues I've noticed with them is making me question Environmentality, and especially DLP's forcing of them, even though they had no obligation to do so due to France still permitting 50µm plastic bags, yet they should at least charge a mere €0.10, instead of making the totes the only bag option and a costly one at that. That's Disney profiteering at the expense of the guest while the negative environmental impact indicators for RPET reusable bags and the need for convenience in a theme park setting is ignored.