Harry Potter Complete Book Spoiler Thread

[Aneille]

Someone or something is going to convince Harry that he needs to return to Hogwarts for his final year, that he needs the additional schooling and practice. After all, he was pretty ineffective when trying to stop Snape, he's not ready to take on Lord Voldemort!

Yes and I have thought that as well and then I was thinking that if the school closed or even remained open I think at this time it may be more important for Harry and friends to have individual lessons. They need a mentor they like that can teach them these things on a one to one basis so they can learn it faster. But it seems more likely that they will somehow return to Hogwarts.

It would also be nice if the DA starts up again full swing. The sorting hat keeps telling the students that they need to stick together and he wishes he didn't need to seperate the houses. Currently the DA holds members from every house except Slytherin. I think someone from Slytherin is going to have to aid in the death of Voldemort and it may be Draco.

I was just in the shower and I was thinking even Draco feels alone and that is why he was crying to Myrtle. I don't have the exact quote but it was something to the effect that no one understands what he's going through. At Least thats what Myrtle tells Harry one day in the bathroom while she was hoping Draco would come by but instead it was Harry. I remember while I was reading it that Draco sounded a lot like Harry a few books ago at that point.

 

[bananiem]

The sorting hat tells you dring the 4th year "...By Gryffindor, the bravest were Prized far beyond the rest; For Ranvenclaw, the cleverest Would always be the best; For Hufflepuff, hard workers were Most worthy of admission; And power-hungry Slytherin Loved those of great ambition..."

You don't need to be pure-blood to be in Slytherin, just have great ambition.

AH! Thanks very much! I think because Draco makes such a big stink about Mudbloods that we got confused.

 

[Toby'sFriend]

ok, I've reread most of the "important" parts of the book and I now have a few thoughts.

#1. I honestly cannot imagine Hermione Granger not returning to Hogwarts for her final year of schooling. In the very first book, she states her fear of being expelled is greater than her fear of dying. In fact, I have always assumed that she would eventually become a teacher. I honestly believe Hermione will return to Hogwarts.

#2. Molly Weasley will place enormous pressure upon Ron to return to the school. She was quite unhappy over Fred and George leaving. That, plus the fact that Hermione will be at the school might win out over his feelings of loyalty toward helping Harry. I think that Neville, Luna and all of Harry's other friends will also be at the school.

Which leads me to
#3. I think Harry will set out on a Qwest to destroy all the Horcruxes solo. The identity of the Horcruxes rather troubles me.

The Locket - Slytherin
The Ring - Slytherin (destroyed)
The Goblet - Hufflepuff
Nagini - the snake
The Diary - (destroyed)
and then something from either Ravenclaw or Gryffindor.

That last bit seems rather messy to me. I think one of the first 5 items will turn out to be a decoy, and Harry will have to find something from both Ravenclaw and Gryffindor. And since Hogwarts is the location of the last known item belonging to Gryffindor (the dagger), I think the battle will culminate at the castle.

#4. In the end, Dumbledore has stated over and over that Harry's ability to LOVE is his greatest weapon and it is also what will defeat Voldemort in the end. Thus, I have no doubt that Ron, Hermione, and Ginny will tie into the final battle in some manner as they are the ones Harry loves. The Sorting Hat has warned for several years now that all the Houses need to work together -- so I foresee Harry getting help from others as well, with Draco most likely providing the Slytherin element.

 

[rascalmom]

Here's my off-the-wall theory:

I do think that DD is really dead.

Also, I think that somehow this was preplanned with Snape. There have been a few posts about this, but I have a theory. We know DD was after the horcruxes & had found the ring. We also know that his hand was injured & did not seem to be healing. What if in the attempt to take or destroy the ring, the horcrux somehow was transferred to Dumbedore. Snape knew this & knew that if DD was in a vulnerable position that might have allowed Voldemort or his followers to get to him, that DD had to be killed in order to destroy the horcrux. DD was struggling with the part of Voldemort's soul in him & that was why he seemed tired, weakened & older. Also why he asked to be killed when he drank the potion. Maybe the potion was there to strengthen the horcrux?

Still not sure how RAB got the real locket without drinking the potion. Did he have to have someone with him also? If RAB is Regalus Black or Amelia Bones - who are both dead, that means someone could be out there who knew what happened.

 

[stinkerbelle]

Also, I think that somehow this was preplanned with Snape. There have been a few posts about this, but I have a theory. We know DD was after the horcruxes & had found the ring. We also know that his hand was injured & did not seem to be healing. What if in the attempt to take or destroy the ring, the horcrux somehow was transferred to Dumbedore. Snape knew this & knew that if DD was in a vulnerable position that might have allowed Voldemort or his followers to get to him, that DD had to be killed in order to destroy the horcrux. DD was struggling with the part of Voldemort's soul in him & that was why he seemed tired, weakened & older. Also why he asked to be killed when he drank the potion. Maybe the potion was there to strengthen the horcrux?

omg...

kind of like when Harry came out of the Maze at the end of GoF and told Dumbledore that Voldemort was back..."the triumpant gleam" in Dumbledore's eyes....or something like that. (implying that a part of voldemort already resided in DD...but then, the whole Occlemcy thing...and DD was secret keeper for the OOtP)

I think he 'asked to be killed' while drinking the potion because he was reliving the terror that Voldemort (aka - Tom Riddle) put those 2 children through that he tortured in that cave.

if you read what dumbledore was saying...it very easily could have been said by these children.

 

[glass-slipper]

I'm simply not convinced that AD is dead. I was surprised when my sister called me and said the same thing We simply do not believe for a second that Snape has turned. I may be wrong, but I'm usually pretty darn good at picking up on endings...also why I can't get through a mystery all the way

1) AD was sick/dying from the poison he drank to retrieve the horcrux (he kept telling Harry to go get Snape to help him.) It strikes me that it's always possible that there was something about this, that both he and Snape knew (Snape being such a master at potions...and antidotes, dark arts) the only way to SAVE AD was to kill him first. That's not as likely, b/c how would snape know unless he could see tell tale physical signs of the poison. More likely is that Snape told AD all about the Unbreakable promise, and knew all of this could happen, and AD planned some sort of protection that would make everyone think he was dead, so that Snape could still stay a double agent and not be suspected. Remember, Snape and AD argued...perhaps AD was saying "you must" and Snape was saying "but I can't!". Plus, they went OVER AND OVER the whole thing about making spells without saying a word...and they were sure to say a few times that Dumbledore was very good at that. Perhaps he did that just before Snape did the curse. Remember at the funeral when the beir bursts into flames, and Harry thinks he sees a phoenix? Don't forget, a phoenix dies, but rises from the flames anew. Then immediately after the flames die away, we see the "corpse" is suddenly in a white tomb...aka cocoon? Get the symbolism..way heavy in the whole "rebirth" thing.

2) Remember how MUCH Rowlings played up the death of Sirius? I mean, HUGE emotional reactions, pages of gut wrenching description of sorrow. From a description stand point, Dumbledores death was, by comparison, almost an aside! They spent more time in the infirmary recapping what had happened and the whole werewolf thing, then they did Dumbledore! And AD was a MUCH bigger character then Sirius. I just think she didn't play it up nearly as much, and that is because she has something up her sleeve with AD.

3) I was actually disappointed with this book to a degree. There was very little in the way of big revelations, and she's still relying on this standard format of the book (this book, I felt like I was only reading it to get to the ending.) It felt like this book was a little TOO heavy in the romance department...sure, all of those were fun: Harry & Ginny, Ron & Lavendar, then Ron & Hermione, Luna & Remus, Bill and..err..french girl whose name I can't remember. It was like she just wanted to get it out of the way so she could get to meat of things in the last book.

4) I absolutely believe that we will find out Voldemort is related to Harry in some way. Rowling has mentioned too many times how much Harry looks like Voldemort...sure you can explain some of their connections b/c of their initial battle, BUT remember: they also say Harry looks JUST like his father! We have never heard anything about Harry's father's family, other then that he's supposedly pure blood. Rowling sure spent ALOT of time going into Voldemorts family background for that to not be leading us somewhere important. Now Harry says in the end he is going to return to where he was born, and see his parent's graves...something's going to happen there in regards to that, I can feel it

Ok, go ahead, call me crazy...I already had a spirited debate over this

Your idea about Voldemort and Harry being related is interesting. Both Harry's and Voldemort's familys were pure blood except for their mothers, and weren't we told previously that all pure-blood families are related?

I also think there is more to Snape and Dumbledore and the death scene. The phoenix rising at the funeral is a good observation. I think it was a plot to fool Voldemort and protect Draco and Harry.

Maybe the reason DD trusts Snape so much is because Snape told DD about the horacruxes and how to defeat Voldemort?

 

[rascalmom]

omg...

kind of like when Harry came out of the Maze at the end of GoF and told Dumbledore that Voldemort was back..."the triumpant gleam" in Dumbledore's eyes....or something like that. (implying that a part of voldemort already resided in DD...but then, the whole Occlemcy thing...and DD was secret keeper for the OOtP)

I think he 'asked to be killed' while drinking the potion because he was reliving the terror that Voldemort (aka - Tom Riddle) put those 2 children through that he tortured in that cave.

if you read what dumbledore was saying...it very easily could have been said by these children.

I don't think DD became the "host" for the horcrux until sometime after OotP. Not sure what the "triumphant gleam" was about in GoF - maybe it was when DD realized he was right about the horcrux theory.

As far as the potion - the horror that V's victims was my first thought too. But why don't the other horcruxes have that effect too - or do they?

 

[tiggernan]

I also think there's more going on with Snape. I think it's a strong possibility that Dumbledore was pleading with Snape to follow through with their plan and kill him. I also felt like Snape was trying to stop Harry from doing Unforgivable curses because he was protecting him, not just defending himself. His responses of "No, Harry" seemed more reprimanding than taunting. Such an interesting ending! And such a long wait ahead!!

 

[rascalmom]

Maybe the reason DD trusts Snape so much is because Snape told DD about the horacruxes and how to defeat Voldemort?

Oohhhhh! That could be it. DD trusted Snape even to the very end - that could be why.

This book opened up so many possibilities. I was kind of glad that JK took a break from some of the intense action that we had in GoF & OotP. I was surprised that more of the loose endings weren't addressed in HBP though. Book 7 is going to have to accomplish a LOT! How long are we going to have to wait?

 

[Aneille]

I don't think DD became the "host" for the horcrux until sometime after OotP. Not sure what the "triumphant gleam" was about in GoF - maybe it was when DD realized he was right about the horcrux theory.

The "Triumphant Gleam" Dumbledore gets at that moment always made me worried and confused. All I could come up with before HBP came out was that maybe there is more to the protection that Dumbedore gave Harry when his parents were killed. Maybe because Voldemort was reborn again using Harry's blood there would be some type weakness that will take hold of Voldemort. Although it could be completly wrong and Dumbledore is a bad guy and he knows that Harry's blood just made Voldemort all that much more stronger because he now has part of Harry's family blood which is still capable of love. I don't know, just always confused me

 

[phillybeth]

The Sorting Hat has warned for several years now that all the Houses need to work together -- so I foresee Harry getting help from others as well, with Draco most likely providing the Slytherin element.

What if the Sorting Hat was the last Horcrux? It's got something from all 4 founders.

 

[jellymanoffspring]

Hmm ..just thinking more about R.A.B. and the locket......
AD said you must be a powerful wizard to get in the cave.....and he said he could not have done it without Harry.....
so could r. black have done it with sirius along as a dog??
A dog would have been insignificant in the boat ...just as an underage boy(Harry was)......hmmmmm


HAHA I can't wait for the next book!! HAHAHA

 

[Rachie0507]

Harry said that he knew DD was really dead because the curse on him ended when DD was gone and Harry was able to move again. Perhaps, if Snape was in all of this and knew that Harry was with DD, he used a nonverbal curse to release Harry while running by with Malfoy. Hmmm, something else to think about.

My first instinct when reading all that yesterday was to think that Snape was a bad person. Now I am unsure about everything. JKR is good at that, she always make you stop and think about what REALLY just happened.

 

[rascalmom]

Hmm ..just thinking more about R.A.B. and the locket......
AD said you must be a powerful wizard to get in the cave.....and he said he could not have done it without Harry.....
so could r. black have done it with sirius along as a dog??
A dog would have been insignificant in the boat ...just as an underage boy(Harry was)......hmmmmm


HAHA I can't wait for the next book!! HAHAHA

That's an interesting theory - but wouldn't Sirius have told someone? My thought was Kreacher - the Black family house elf. I think just one of them had to be a powerful wizard (& small enough for both of them to fit in the boat).

I wonder too about Snape - is he an Animagus too? A bat maybe? Could be why he knew about the horcrux (he was with RAB?) & his telling DD could be why DD trusted him.

 

[va32h]

DD and I were just discussing that we thought you had to be full-blood to be placed in Slytherin, yet both Tom Riddle and Snape were half-bloods. Are we incorrect in what we remember?

When Slytherin was alive, he hand-picked only purebloods for his house, and tried to convince the other founders to not allow Muggle borns in the school at all. When they refused, Slytherin left the school.

The "Triumphant Gleam" Dumbledore gets at that moment always made me worried and confused

Dumbledore's triumpant gleam was because now that Voldemort had a mortal body, he could eventually be completely destroyed.

I absolutely believe that we will find out Voldemort is related to Harry in some way. Rowling has mentioned too many times how much Harry looks like Voldemort

Actually, JKR has repeatedly said in interviews that Voldemort and Harry are NOT related. The Dursleys are his only living relatives.

The similiarities between Harry and Voldemort at there to show that even if two people are brought up in the same circumstances, they can CHOOSE the course their life takes. "Our choices, not our abilities" are what defines us, as Dumbledore explains to Harry back in book 2.

 

[LoraJ]

I finally finished it this morning. I was mostly pissed off the whole time because some IDIOT on another message board blurted out what Snape did before the book even went on sale. At first i thought it was a joke, but once I read chapter 2, I started to get ticked. What kind of person does that? He owes me $16.19 for ruining it for me.

Gonna catch up with the thread now.

 

[Aneille]

Dumbledore's triumpant gleam was because now that Voldemort had a mortal body, he could eventually be completely destroyed.

Yes, good point.

Why could someone not kill him before when he was only part of a soul though? When he's that horrible looking baby slug of a thing that wormtail carries around. Couldn't someone have killed that? And if the other hocrux's were all taken care of, wouldn't that be the end since that slug of a thing was all that was left?

I am only questioning this for the sake of the argument, I do believe it is as you had said though that Dumbledore was excited because he could see an end to Voldemort. That makes a lot of sense in the story.

 

[va32h]

Why could someone not kill him before when he was only part of a soul though? When he's that horrible looking baby slug of a thing that wormtail carries around. Couldn't someone have killed that? And if the other hocrux's were all taken care of, wouldn't that be the end since that slug of a thing was all that was left?

Dumbledore didn't know about the baby slug thing, though, until Harry told him that's what Voldemort looked like prior to his resurrection. Until then, Dumbledore only knew that Voldy was possessing other bodies - not that he had any sort of body of his own.

 

[LoraJ]

I agree that DD sacrificed himself to save Draco. I think Draco will also play an important role in book 7.

that's what i think too.

 

[Aneille]

Dumbledore didn't know about the baby slug thing, though, until Harry told him that's what Voldemort looked like prior to his resurrection. Until then, Dumbledore only knew that Voldy was possessing other bodies - not that he had any sort of body of his own.

Actually I thought Dumbledore did know that Voldemort had some sort of body but they weren't sure on it.

Harry has that dream or connection into Voldemort's world where Harry see's Voldemort kill that old man that was the caretaker for the Riddle home.

"He as screaming so loudly that he never heard the words the thing in the chair spoke as it raised a wand. There was a flash of green light, a rushing sound, and Frank Bryce crumpled. He was dead before he hit the floor.

Two hundred miles away, the boy called Harry Potter woke up with a start."

I remember that at some point in this story Harry tells people about this dream, but I can't remember who it is. I am searching now. I only remember it because an emphasis was given to the fact that Voldemort could hold a wand.

Maybe he didn't tell Dumbledore but rather Ron and Hermione, but I will look.