GRAND OPENING - GRAND CLOSING (Florida)

[Jrb1979]

https://www.borderreport.com/health...s-county-hospital-takes-in-covid-19-patients/
Hopefully this doesn't happen in places but I'm afraid it will unless more things are done to slow down the spread.

 

[shh]

No one is saying to shelter in place any more. At the same time Florida needs to put in better measures to help bring the numbers down. Make masks mandatory and fine businesses and people for not complying. Instead it feels many have no interest in doing that as it infringes on their freedom.

I've been one of the most vocal about the FloriDUH morons...but at least in some areas, it does feel like it's getting better from a compliance standpoint the past couple of weeks. More businesses fined...more people following the rules. I avoid Miami like the plague though...so not sure what's going on in that area.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

No one is saying to shelter in place any more. At the same time Florida needs to put in better measures to help bring the numbers down. Make masks mandatory and fine businesses and people for not complying. Instead it feels many have no interest in doing that as it infringes on their freedom.

The mayor of Los Angeles has threatened another SIP for the last two weeks. As of last night, he said it won’t happen this week, but there is talk out there.

Part of me thinks it’s a threat to try to get people to take the current measures seriously in order to avoid it, but I can see it happening again.

 

[TLSnell1981]

The mayor of Los Angeles has threatened another SIP for the last two weeks. As of last night, he said it won’t happen this week, but there is talk out there.

Part of me thinks it’s a threat to try to get people to take the current measures seriously in order to avoid it, but I can see it happening again.

Are masks mandatory there?

 

[Heigh-Ho]

Who is sheltering in place??

No one is saying to shelter in place any more.

From what I've seen from at least several posters they still only leave the home to go to the grocery store once every few weeks, maybe taking a walk or so. I do know a few people whose relatives haven't really left the house in months. Some people though do really hone in on the "stay home" thing. They'll respond to comments about activities here and there and say something to the effect of "or you could just stay home".

May not be a majority these days but there are still some people out there.

 

[Jrb1979]

The mayor of Los Angeles has threatened another SIP for the last two weeks. As of last night, he said it won’t happen this week, but there is talk out there.

Part of me thinks it’s a threat to try to get people to take the current measures seriously in order to avoid it, but I can see it happening again.

They are doing the same here in some provinces. Unfortunately it might be the only way to get people to understand. Here they have been fining people almost $900 for not complying and it has been working for the most part.

 

[Heigh-Ho]

The mayor of Los Angeles has threatened another SIP for the last two weeks. As of last night, he said it won’t happen this week, but there is talk out there.

Part of me thinks it’s a threat to try to get people to take the current measures seriously in order to avoid it, but I can see it happening again.

That might be the hard part these days with what works and won't work in each area. What we did in the spring we should improve on and I think that not all areas will benefit from shelter in place/stay at home/safer at home orders. That doesn't mean you don't do something.

There was a place I was reading about and for the life of me I can't remember where it was but they were starting to see a sharp increase in their cases relative to what it was all along. Once they were able to pinpoint that it was the bars and what few nightclubs they had there reopening (really just those) coupled with the ever growing evidence about mask usage they closed the bars and nightclubs back down though they can still sell alcohol and food curbside and made masks mandatory and after about 2 1/2 weeks their cases sharply dropped again though still somewhat higher than they were earlier on (they were a place that got hit later than other areas IIRC). So would a shelter in place/stay at home/safer at home order be effective or the right choice to make there? ...hmm not really sure it was needed and you'd want to weigh the pros and cons to that.

It's maybe a bit opposite of what people think but in my opinion some think we need a national thing and I think that time has long since passed. Instead I think we need to see what worked in each area, what didn't work, what things can be done here and there to help mitigate, slow/reduce spread, lower the strain on the hospitals so they can do other things as well, etc.

I think we've seen some places far more resistant to certain measures than others. That may take a different approach than another area. Maybe that's wrong that it's that situation but that to me is neither here nor there. You can take that information and create a plan that you think will work best with the population you have that will likely get the most compliance.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

Are masks mandatory there?

Yes, they’re required state wide, although that change just came fairly recently and wasn’t required in LA before that. There doesn’t seem to be a lot of compliance from what I’m reading though.

Many places in CA are moving to fines for both individuals and business for non-compliance of safety measures. My county is talking about it right now.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Yes, they’re required state wide, although that change just came fairly recently and wasn’t required in LA before that. There doesn’t seem to be a lot of compliance from what I’m reading though.

Many places in CA are moving to fines for both individuals and business for non-compliance of safety measures. My county is talking about it right now.

Curious to see if mandatory masks stop the spread. I hear people still contract the virus even though they are required.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

SARS-CoV-2 will likely be with us for quite a while with no guarantee of a vaccine or immunity. It will spread once we resume life. How long should we shelter in place?

Well it's crystal clear we should have sheltered in place longer than we did. Sad thing was, we were getting decently close. It's EZ. If people can't wear their masks and do distancing properly, We shelter in place until numbers are low enough that we can contact trace and put out hot spots such that it won't cut loose like it is now any more.

 

[DisneyJamieCA]

That might be the hard part these days with what works and won't work in each area. What we did in the spring we should improve on and I think that not all areas will benefit from shelter in place/stay at home/safer at home orders. That doesn't mean you don't do something.

There was a place I was reading about and for the life of me I can't remember where it was but they were starting to see a sharp increase in their cases relative to what it was all along. Once they were able to pinpoint that it was the bars and what few nightclubs they had there reopening (really just those) coupled with the ever growing evidence about mask usage they closed the bars and nightclubs back down though they can still sell alcohol and food curbside and made masks mandatory and after about 2 1/2 weeks their cases sharply dropped again though still somewhat higher than they were earlier on (they were a place that got hit later than other areas IIRC). So would a shelter in place/stay at home/safer at home order be effective or the right choice to make there? ...hmm not really sure it was needed and you'd want to weigh the pros and cons to that.

It's maybe a bit opposite of what people think but in my opinion some think we need a national thing and I think that time has long since passed. Instead I think we need to see what worked in each area, what didn't work, what things can be done here and there to help mitigate, slow/reduce spread, lower the strain on the hospitals so they can do other things as well, etc.

I think we've seen some places far more resistant to certain measures than others. That may take a different approach than another area. Maybe that's wrong that it's that situation but that to me is neither here nor there. You can take that information and create a plan that you think will work best with the population you have that will likely get the most compliance.

I don’t know if you’re talking about a particular place or a state, but that’s what happened in California. Things were ok here (relatively) until they opened bars and indoor dining back up and that‘s when things went crazy. So there is now a state watch list and if your county got put on it, you had to close those things and go back to curbside/outdoors. Then more recently it be some a statewide order and those on the watch list also had to close hair salons, barbers, nail salons, massage, etc.

Most places still have another week or so to see if those measures were enough. But our Gov has been clear that he has no problem rolling more things back. And that counties (and cities) have the authority to do even more.

 

[TLSnell1981]

That might be the hard part these days with what works and won't work in each area. What we did in the spring we should improve on and I think that not all areas will benefit from shelter in place/stay at home/safer at home orders. That doesn't mean you don't do something.

There was a place I was reading about and for the life of me I can't remember where it was but they were starting to see a sharp increase in their cases relative to what it was all along. Once they were able to pinpoint that it was the bars and what few nightclubs they had there reopening (really just those) coupled with the ever growing evidence about mask usage they closed the bars and nightclubs back down though they can still sell alcohol and food curbside and made masks mandatory and after about 2 1/2 weeks their cases sharply dropped again though still somewhat higher than they were earlier on (they were a place that got hit later than other areas IIRC). So would a shelter in place/stay at home/safer at home order be effective or the right choice to make there? ...hmm not really sure it was needed and you'd want to weigh the pros and cons to that.

It's maybe a bit opposite of what people think but in my opinion some think we need a national thing and I think that time has long since passed. Instead I think we need to see what worked in each area, what didn't work, what things can be done here and there to help mitigate, slow/reduce spread, lower the strain on the hospitals so they can do other things as well, etc.

I think we've seen some places far more resistant to certain measures than others. That may take a different approach than another area. Maybe that's wrong that it's that situation but that to me is neither here nor there. You can take that information and create a plan that you think will work best with the population you have that will likely get the most compliance.

I've heard the virus has mutated and while probably weaker it is also more contagious.

I do agree about bars. Intoxicated people are less likely to social distance or practice good hygiene.

 

[TLSnell1981]

Well it's crystal clear we should have sheltered in place longer than we did. It's EZ. If people can't wear their masks and do distancing properly, We shelter in place until numbers are low enough that we can contact trace and put out hot spots such that it won't cut loose like it is now any more.

How long would it take...weeks, months, YEARS? Would that have eradicated the virus? It was never the goal and likely not realistic.

 

[Heigh-Ho]

I don’t know if you’re talking about a particular place or a state, but that’s what happened in California. Things were ok here (relatively) until they opened bars and indoor dining back and that things went crazy. So there is now a state watch list and if your county got put on it, you had to close those things and go back to curbside/outdoors. Then more recently it be some a statewide order and those on the watch list also had to close hair salons, barbers, nail salons, massage, etc.

Most places still have another week or so to see if those measures were enough. But our Gov has been clear that he has no problem rolling more things back. And that counties (and cities) have the authority to do even more.

It wasn't CA I know that but I'm blanking on where it was.

I think many places have seen spikes related to bars especially with indoor dining in part as well.

I don't disagree with rolling things back I really don't in some ways I think places need to do that now not wait and wait. I think what my thoughts were that each place should hopefully be able to figure out what they need to roll back and what they don't. Shelter in place/stay at home/safer at home all meant many places were shut down. We know more about the virus and each place may have different reasons (geographically speaking too, climate related too, citizen related, regional related, etc) why they are spiking.

Like I could imagine CA being able to be more successful in more of its places for outdoor dining just due to the weather overall (not to say there aren't differences just that they have an overall more temperate climate) but some place that gets severe winter weather isn't going to be able to do that come October/November/December and on. Or the opposite a place that has heat and humidity quite high may see businesses having a harder time getting enough people to eat outdoors to sustain only having outdoor dining open if say they rolled back indoor dining. College towns may need to close bars and nightclubs down earlier and for longer than another place.

A watch list for counties sounds like a decent idea though. Some places aren't having outbreaks with salons, etc mostly due to mask usage though so hopefully a place is trying to contact trace to see if those are actually a risk or if it is really just a perceived risk. That's kind of what I was getting at. Originally we all thought this way or that way but it turns out this and that was probably not the best route to go OR that this and that could be done so long as this was done (like mask usage by all at a salon), etc.

 

[Heigh-Ho]

I've heard the virus has mutated and while probably weaker it is also more contagious.

I do agree about bars. Intoxicated people are less likely to social distance or practice good hygiene.

I have been reading about the G strain mutation. There seems to be a more consensus these days towards it being the predominant strain but that it's way more infectious (though no more or less severe) than the D strain (Wuhan strain) but it's not total consensus so who knows.

And yes with the bars from what all I've seen it's that you have been talking loudly often, without masks on, the alcohol lowers your inhibitions and can make you less likely to keep distance and more likely to have particles and more of it and farther come out (which is gross when you think about it haha). I'm all for places selling the alcohol though curbside and allowing people to take it home, shout all you want I guess in your backyard or garage or whatever just not with 30 other people around lol and in close quarters in a bar where everyone is up moving around and not staying apart.

 

[gwynne]

How long would it take...weeks, months, YEARS? Would that have eradicated the virus? It was never the goal and likely not realistic.

Well, the goal was to reopen safely. That required the US to work together, follow the reopening guidelines. Since many (most?) states ignored them, here we are.
When everyone wears a mask and distances Covid is much more difficult to transmit. That starts your path to opening safely...and getting on with life.
The epidemiologists know how to guide this....we just have care enough to listen to them.

 

[Cannot_Wait_4Disney]

How long would it take...weeks, months, YEARS? Would that have eradicated the virus? It was never the goal and likely not realistic.

That's a nice catch of red herring you have there angler. Nobody said we have to do it until we eradicate the virus. Nobody. The goal was to reopen when we had it under control and could do so safely. Clearly, it was not under control. Further, it wouldn't take years. Other countries are in the process of doing it as we speak. And they're not racking up nearly the toll we are.

 

[TLSnell1981]

That's a nice catch of red herring you have there angler. Nobody said we have to do it until we eradicate the virus. Nobody. The goal was to reopen when we had it under control and could do so safely. Clearly, it was not under control. Further, it wouldn't take years. Other countries are in the process of doing it as we speak. And they're not racking up nearly the toll we are.

Most expected the virus to spread after we reopened. The goal was to be better prepared to treat those who needed to be hospitalized. The cost to our society was way to high to stay locked down.

 

[wvjules]

Most expected the virus to spread after we reopened. The goal was to be better prepared to treat those who needed to be hospitalized. The cost to our society was way to high to stay locked down.

So what do you suggest *we* do?

 

[butterscotchcollins]

Most expected the virus to spread after we reopened. The goal was to be better prepared to treat those who needed to be hospitalized. The cost to our society was way to high to stay locked down.

I have a sincere question - if you contracted it and passed it along to someone who then got super sick and passed away, have you thought through how you'd feel about that? I'm not asking to shame or lecture, I'm genuinely curious. For me, being young and healthy and statistically unlikely to get super sick and die doesn't scare me, but the thought that I may unknowingly pass it along to my elderly parents does, and that's what keeps me taking every measure to stay safe and keep my distance.

I think a lot of people feel similarly, and that's why even in places where there isn't a ton of community spread, even with low overall mortality rates, you're not seeing the economic recovery and activity come "roaring" back. Until we can get better compliance with masks and social distancing, people just won't feel safe going about their daily lives as usual. Those who won't take this seriously are literally ruining it for the rest of us because they're eroding the trust of an already anxious population.