Good News out about Disneyland

[Bstanley]

From Mr. Lutz's latest MiceAge article

Greg Emmer is guiding a stunning restructuring of the maintenance and facilities departments in Anaheim. For the first time in years, they've just begun hiring additional machinists, tradesmen, and even painters to help bolster the ranks of the reorganized Facilities Department. In fact, Facilities has now completely eliminated all of the Pressler-era structure it's been saddled with for the last eight years, including the infamous "Maintenance Response Teams". Greg Emmer has successfully turned back the clock ten years to a time before Paul Pressler hired outside consultants to tell him how to downsize and cut back on Disneyland's once vaunted maintenance processes.

I like this Greg Emmer guy. It's great to hear about people in senior positions at Disney doing things 'better' and not just 'cheaper'.

 

[WDSearcher]

Originally posted by Bstanley
I like this Greg Emmer guy. It great to hear about people in senior positions at Disney doing things 'better' and not just 'cheaper'.

We really miss him at WDW.

 

[Bstanley]

WDSearcher - is that a general "we miss him", or are you familiar with his replacement - and is his replacment not made of the same stuff?

 

[raidermatt]

Assuming this is true (Lutz takes a lot of grief about being inaccurate when he posts anything negative), it sounds great.

It almost makes me want to go look up old threads to see who said things like this weren't possible. That dynamics had changed, and "old" practices weren't fiscally responsible anymore.

But honestly, its probably not any of the regular posters around here, so there wouldn't be much point.


As I've said before, I'm sold that park management has improved significantly since the Pressler ouster*. Now, if we could just get the right guy/team at the top, maybe we can see what these guys could do without the handcuffs.


(I still find it comical that Pressler's name is thrown around in articles that discuss possible successors to Eisner.)

 

[Peter Pirate]

Geez, don't let Landbaron see this...Or your comment about Emmer, Bruce. We'll never hear the end of it.

 

[Bstanley]

Well Peter - Herr Baron already has me down in his book as a snowglobe polishing brand monkey because (one example) I think AKL is as well themed as the Polynesian so I don't imagine he takes anything I 'say' very seriously

It's still early in the game but, so far at least, everything I've read about the new DL management gives me hope that Disney still has people in all levels of management (except one ;-) that know how to manage things the 'Disney' way - like Sleeping Beauty they are simply 'sleeping', awaiting someone who truly loves Disney to awaken them.

 

[Peter Pirate]

They must be busy as well. I've tried three times to get rooms at DL in Oct and Nov and all Disney rooms were gone!

Ouimet and gang seem to be directly on the ight course. Let' hope the positive direction continues and spills over to some other venues...Animated features, perhaps.

 

[WDSearcher]

Originally posted by Bstanley
WDSearcher - is that a general "we miss him", or are you familiar with his replacement - and is his replacment not made of the same stuff?

It's a general "we miss him." The person who took his place is doing a great job in their own right, but Greg was at WDW for a long time, so for DL to have him now is kind of like having a member of the family move to the other side of the country, and you don't get to see them any more, you know? You're glad they have the opportunity, but you hate to see them go.

 

[Bstanley]

Roger that.

 

[crusader]

Ouimet and gang seem to be directly on the ight course. Let' hope the positive direction continues and spills over to some other venues...Animated features, perhaps.

Agree.

Are you talking this past oct and nov at DL for rooms? I know I booked May '05 several months ago.

 

[Peter Pirate]

Yeah crusader I was trying for 3 or 4 specific periods in Oct/Nov and (actually Dec) of 04. I've always wanted to see the Christmas editions at DL (thus the Nov & Dec attempts)...

 

[raidermatt]

The parks are far from saved.

Improved, yes. But all that's happening is some things, like maintenance, are being restored to a level that they never should have fallen from.

Important things, yes. But there are still HUGE issues with DCA no matter how pretty the paint is across the plaza. The lagoon issue at DL still isn't settled, and even if it is, it appears the best we can hope for is a Nemo makeover, due to cost (per Lutz).

There's still larger, strategic issues that are not resolved, and frankly, won't be until a postive change comes from higher up.

 

[crusader]

The parks are not far from saved. I was just there in May. You can use that line forever and it is purely subjective.

There is no way that these changes that are taking place at the parks are only a restoration of cutbacks. There are major attraction improvements/enhancements/additions happening all over the place.

And CA has much more to offer than AK and MGM so what are these "huge" issues.

 

[raidermatt]

The parks are not far from saved. I was just there in May. You can use that line forever and it is purely subjective.

So you're dismissing my subjective opinion based on your subjective opinion.

There is no way that these changes that are taking place at the parks are only a restoration of cutbacks.

Yes, there is a way.

There are major attraction improvements/enhancements/additions happening all over the place.

Yes, because existing park development was largely ignored for several years (much longer in some cases). The baseline for successful parks includes additions on a regular basis. The moves Disney has been making are steps to get back to that baseline.

A baseline that should be just that, a baseline, not an ultimate standard.

DL is so far behind the 8-ball that they're having to consider resurrecting the Subs, be even that idea is apparently struggling to get approval.

DCA... C'mon. The park has been a major disappointment for Disney. They've added some patches, but that's hardly brought it to the level the public expects from Disney.

Further, using AK and MGM as comparisons to justify DCA show just how far apart we are on even agreeing what Disney is supposed to be about. Its for that reason that I'll give you the last word, should you choose to refute my positions. There's no point in continuing as we are not even talking the same language.

 

[crusader]

I think you're giving DCA a bum rapp.

I was one of those who criticized this park based on not having even been there. My "subjective" opinion (HA!) was because the coaster looked lame to which Voice remarked it was one of their shining achievements. (which I found hard to believe and dismissed it as sarcasm)

Well I visited this park. Soarin was excellent. Grizzly River Run was the best rapids I've ever experienced. Aladdin is the absolute best show I've ever seen and California Screamin' deserves a major apology from me.

That's four new attractions which are worth the price of admission. Add in all the others - Tower of Terror, the Animation Building, Bug's Land et al and this park is a great time.

What's your problem with it?

 

[raidermatt]

Ok, so I'll allow myself one lie and respond...

That's four new attractions which are worth the price of admission.

See, right here we are already so far apart I'm not sure what to say. Forgetting whether I agree about the individual merits of the attractions for a second, 4 great attractions don't even come close to fufilling the value proposition that Disney has created with the public.

At the most basic level, it does not meet the spirit of the mission the company was founded on. There's just no way that in Walt's vision, the current Disney company, with all of its resources, would open a park of the scope of DCA (or AK and MGM when they opened).

Beyond that, with DCA, the public was so emphatic in their distaste, that attendance never even got into the same league as Disney's projections. Remember, when DCA opened, they didn't even offer a combo AP. They were prepared to have to close the park on certain days due to overfill.

They were so far off base that not only did the overflow crowds never materialize, they had to offer heavy discounts to get ANYBODY to show up. (acknowledged hyperbole, so please don't take it literally) They've at times even essentially offered FREE admission to any local (local = south of Bakersfield) who bought a ticket to DL.

The theme has been altered because the original idea just didn't work at all. At this point, there really isn't much of a cohesive theme anymore... just a collection of attractions that have varying connections to California, or things that might be found in California, like bugs.

On the individual attractions, I can agree on Grizzly. Screamin' is a nice coaster, but it is relatively tame. Since it offers no other theme/story, I can't see it being all that strong. Its best point is the trouble they went through to make it look like a wooden coaster.

I've made my opinion on Soarin' know several times... great ride, lacks story and theme. There's no real backstory, no effort to hide the ride mech or even build it into some kind of story. The film is a collection of images, with no rhyme or reason other than they are in California.

Again, its fun, but it's appeal is based on the ride mech and little else, which is very un-Disney.

Haven't seen the Aladdin show. I have heard it is very good.

The Animation building IS very good.

Bug's land is a nice kiddie addition, but again, smacks of management by guest surveys, much as Dinorama was. (Though admittedly its better executed for its purpose than Dinorama)

ToT? A proven attraction, so a very safe addition. But the park needs more uniqueness. A lot of people have done the WDW ToT, so its not as big a deal as it could be. And now, they have one less reason to go to WDW. But I'm going off on a tangent there. Let's just call it a good addition.

But the rest of the park is a mess. The other Paradise Pier rides are so lacking in imagination that even my linear mind can smell them out right away. Superstar Limo? Mulholland Madness? Like many of the Paradise Pier rides, they didn't even try.

I'm not saying that there aren't any people out there who enjoy the place... of course there are. But take a step back and look at it objectively, comparing it to the value proposition Disney built, and I just can't see how we can say DCA is even close to being up to snuff, even with the additions. Not in quantity, and certainly not in quality.

I can at least understand the AK defense, that its only a matter of quantity and not quality, but with DCA, it just doesn't add up that way. And honestly, I haven't even seen much of a spirited defense from the car 1'ers who have been to DCA. (The regulars, not the hit 'n runners.)

 

[Peter Pirate]

Well...Since you asked. my family, like crusader, really like DCA. As I argued with AV many times, perspective is everything. We've visited twice, had park hoppers both times, the price of the hoppers was no more expensive than before DCA...HUGE added bonus for us.

Of course this doesn't mean that I don't think Disney didn't make HUGE mistakes here...They did. Heck, the very theme has proven quite inappropriate given their huge local base. But beyond that DCA is a beautiful park with many great things to see and do and the GC and new DD add a tremendous amount of cache to the Resort.

To be sure Paradise Pier is the biggest downer. I understand Cal. Screamin', but Mull Madness, Maliboomer and two swingy rides makes Jack a dull boy...This can be fixed.

Back to the point, my point that is, I've always said Disney Magic CAN make chicken salad out of...Well, you know and I believe they will do this with DCA.

As to DL, TL was and remains a real mess...Do something anything constructive here and with the return of proper maint. (and no more BTMRR accidents) DL will be more than just fine.

 

[raidermatt]

Here's a shocker, Pete. My family enjoys DCA also.



But that just isn't enough, as the general public has made painfully obvious. This isn't like AK, where depending on how you twist the numbers things can be made to look adequate.

That pricing you speak of for hoppers... they only offered that after the disappointing opening. I know, that doesn't make any tangible difference to your experience, but we are talking about how the park rates as a whole.

And on the things you say can be easily fixed... when do you believe they will be fixed? And why in the world were they done so poorly in the first place. Again, I can see that argument with AK, that they tried to make things "Disney", but except in certain individual pieces, that just isn't there at DCA.

Yes, Disney Magic CAN do the things you speak of, but true Disney Magic wouldn't have thrust DCA upon us in the first place.

Having better park management is an improvement, but to correct and prevent mistakes like DCA, it takes more than just good park management.

Again, where this goes is very dependent on what happens at the top.

 

[Peter Pirate]

True and oddly I have little quarrel with what you say except to say that we don't live in a vaccum and mistakes have/are/will always be made.

Eisner let a lot of things get away from him in the past few years, but you know what? It's just growing pains. Disney experienced them under Walt, certainly under Roy, Card & Ron and probably even more so under Eisner- but lets not forget that he gave us the most in volume during his tenure (at the expense of quality as argued by some, I understand).

The fact that our families do enjoy DCA is telling, but the fact that many Californians do not is more so. It means there is somethig there but maybe not what was needed.

Adding ToT is a good step. The Aladdin show was big and is tremendous. Surely, as I said PP needs a lot and although I can't explain why it was built (well, I think I could but it's moot and the premise was a failure) the fact is that over time a new and improved Park will appear (theres the glass half full Peter Pirate again). Over time new generations will start to enjoy it more and more. Eventually kids of kids will see the new and improved park and just think "it's always been that way" much like the people who visited Walt's very unfinished DL at its inception (sure this is a loaded analogy as Walt was breaking new ground and the next Disney will simply be repairing old ground). Although, suffice it to say many of the original ideals of Walt and the 'light' held by so many old time disneyphiles will be lost along the way...I just can't address that now.

It is true and it is sad that Disney has lost its way in many areas of the entertainment they offer. BUT it is a testmonial to what Walt built, to the committed CM's and the management at levels under the big cheese that magic is still alive today and still has the chance to flourish in the future.

 

[KNWVIKING]

DW and I spent 9 days in DL Hotel. Majority of that time was spent in DL and DCA. We were there in Sept so we weren't seeing either park at their bests due to seasonal refurb, but I'll have to say that I'll take my AK over your DCA anyday.

But that doesn't mean we didn't enjoy DCA. I grew up on the amusement piers of Atlantic City, Ocean City & Wildwood so I was quit familiar with the ride offerings in DCA. But the similarities stopped there. In many areas DCA meets Walts vision of what a theme park should be. First, the park was very clean. Second, the rides were family friendly. Cal Scream'in is not the most thrilling coaster on the market, but no Disney coaster is. Disney has rightfully left those coasters to the Six Flags of the world. But Cal Scream is a beautifull, fun coaster.Even the other pier rides are done better then their "boardwalk" counterparts. Third, there is nothing "sleazey" about the carnival area. They may look like the typical carny games, but at least they are honest games of skill ( Michael Jordon couldn't make a basket in a Jersey hoop game) and don't have sleazey operators trying to lore unwitting children to give them a try. The park offers something for the whole family.

I agree they need to retheme the park. They may be adding attractions, but the more they do the more of a hodgepodge the park becomes. Hey, maybe someday they'll rename it Disney Greatest Hits Park.