Freedom to Marry Day Protest Planned

[JoeEpcotRocks]

So, will God's love and grace make you stop being a hate-filled bigot?

No hate here.

God and I want what's best for all His children.

I will not jump on the bandwagon of those who encourage people to leave God's path for an immoral lifestyle.

 

[jimmiej]

I'm happy to hear that Jimmie is struggling with this issue. If he is a true follower of Jesus Christ, he should be!

Not sure what you mean by that statement. What do you base that on? Are you a believer also?

 

[LukenDC]

No hate here.

Joe, I disagree with many people on the DIS who oppose homosexuality on religious grounds and have engaged in several spirited debates. You, however, are the only person whose posts seeth with anger and hate. Why is that?

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

If jimmiej always took the same high road, I would agree with you.

But he's somebody who doesn't have any problem joking that people who don't follow exactly what he does better get fire insurance and the like. Far from the perfect citizen you are seeing so far on this thread.

All sin is forgivable thru Christ Jesus. There is no fire for those who accept the gift of Salvation.

 

[L107ANGEL]

No hate here.

God and I want what's best for all His children.

I will not jump on the bandwagon of those who encourage people to leave God's path for an immoral lifestyle.

21 pages Joe, 21 pages!!! Just that wanted to be said before I tell you that I showed restraint, avoidance, and flat out no points today thank you, I think I may feel differently!!
You will not change my views, as I am sure I will not change yours, thats the beauty of this!
As it was said "EQUAL RIGHTS" thats all Joe! No need to pray for me or debate me. I'm cool. EQUAL RIGHTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its amazing to me that I can say that to an 8 year old and he understands, yet............

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

Joe, I disagree with many people on the DIS who oppose homosexuality on religious grounds and have engaged in several spirited debates. You, however, are the only person whose posts seeth with anger and hate. Why is that?

No hate at all.

I saddens me greatly that people deceive others into staying off God's path instead of helping them.

 

[jimmiej]

Mark 10 talks about orphans getting married as much as it talks about gay marriage

Mark 10 references the Creator's institution of marriage.

A cover to cover marriage will give you the impression that God is fine with polygamy, sexual surrogates, and all sorts of arrangements other than one man / one woman.

Can you provide a reference?

Legalizing gay marriage isn't giving your approval for gay marriage. There is no bigger sin than, say, being a Hindu. Would you vote for a law that would make being a Hindu illegal? Would you vote for a law that would ban Hindu's from marring?

Even if you find being gay to be sinful, shouldn't gays be treated like every other sinner under the law?

Note - being glad that it hasn't come up, is the same things as being glad that it's illegal - no?

Note - I've always appreciated you thoughts and the way you express them on the subject, even if I disagree.

Thinking solely as an American, I completely understand the equal rights argument. As I said earlier, from a Christian standpoint, I struggle with giving my stamp of approval (in the voting booth) to a lifestyle I believe God disapproves of.

Thanks for the kind words...ditto from me.

 

[L107ANGEL]

No hate at all.

I saddens me greatly that people deceive others into staying off God's path instead of helping them.

You are not helping me with your views

 

[JunieJay]

Not sure what you mean by that statement. What do you base that on? Are you a believer also?

I believe Jesus considered judgementality and lack of charity as very grievous sins. Jesus stands for love and tolerance. And I think if you are a follower of Jesus Christ, you should be struggling with this issue. Some of the words that have used on this thread by self proclaimed Christians do more to separate people from Jesus than to illustrate his infinite love for us. Its no wonder you are struggling.

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

21 pages Joe, 21 pages!!! Just that wanted to be said before I tell you that I showed restraint, avoidance, and flat out no points today thank you, I think I may feel differently!!
You will not change my views, as I am sure I will not change yours, thats the beauty of this!
As it was said "EQUAL RIGHTS" thats all Joe! No need to pray for me or debate me. I'm cool. EQUAL RIGHTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Its amazing to me that I can say that to an 8 year old and he understands, yet............

I understand what many here are saying, but I don't agree. To me it's a morals issue, not a rights issue.
God's ways and "other" ways are not equal.

I have said though that we all have the equal right to vote and influence society. It amazes me how some on this thread want tolerance for their view but don't seem to be tolerant of having the voters decide between their view and the other side.

 

[MassJester]

Two completely separate issues.

The fight for racial equality and society-blessed homosexual lifestyles are independent.

I'm sure the polygamist will be re-newing their efforts soon.

Joe,

For the third time I ask you to explain how the issue settled by Loving v Virginia (Virginia's ban on interracial marriage) is so completely separate from this one. Is there a reason you will not address your assertion?

 

[L107ANGEL]

I understand what many here are saying, but I don't agree. To me it's a morals issue, not a rights issue.
God's ways and "other" ways are not equal.

I have said though that we all have the equal right to vote and influence society. It amazes me how some on this thread want tolerance for their view but don't seem to be tolerant of having the voters decide between their view and the other side.

Oh, its not a morale issue with you? Where were my manners? So Sorry! I thought this was for against. Not much grey area,

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

You are not helping me with your views

You misread my post. I talking about those who deceive people by telling them to stay in a homosexual lifestyle instead of helping them back on God's path.

 

[jimmiej]

Yes, that's the whole Paul thing referred to in the USA Today opinion piece.

"For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet."
Romans 1:26-27

Pederasty was practiced by the Romans, whom he was addressing here. Perhaps that's what he was referring to; in any case the "unnaturalness" was a result of turning away from God.

"Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever."
Romans 1:25

Besides, this only addresses men+men, not women+women. I guess lesbians are okay?

And what is "natural"?

I Corinthians 11:14--"Does not nature itself teach you that if a man wears long hair, it is degrading to him? but if a woman has long hair it is her glory?"

As for I Corinthians 6:9-10--
"Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God."

So "homosexual offenders" are the target here. The word in Greek is malakoi. Not "paiderasste", the standard term at the time for homosexuals. Malakoi can mean "effeminate", "soft", "fine". (So will women inherit the kingdom of God?) Malakoi can also be translated as "loose", as in "loose morals", or "pliable".

Women:

Romans 1

26Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones.

From the Matthew Henry Commentary (1706):

adulterers, fornicators, effeminate, and Sodomites are the words used.

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

Joe,

For the third time I ask you to explain how the issue settled by Loving v Virginia (Virginia's ban on interracial marriage) is so completely separate from this one. Is there a reason you will not address your assertion?

Sorry I missed your question. Not familar with the Virginia case.

God has nothing against interracial marriage (although the Bible warns against "mixed religions"). He's quite clear that marriage is between a man and a woman, though.

 

[L107ANGEL]

You misread my post. I talking about those who deceive people by telling them to stay in a homosexual lifestyle instead of helping them back on God's path.

We are back to its a choice, its not a choice!!!!

 

[BuckNaked]

Thinking solely as an American, I completely understand the equal rights argument. As I said earlier, from a Christian standpoint, I struggle with giving my stamp of approval (in the voting booth) to a lifestyle I believe God disapproves of.

Thanks for the kind words...ditto from me.

And I believe that dilemma is both a common and valid one. This is something I have struggled with as well, at least when it comes to calling such unions "marriages". I'm 100% behind the notion of equal legal rights, but it is has been very difficult for me to get to the point of calling them "marriages", because I keep going back and forth between what I've always believed to be a marriage, based on my upbringing and religious teachings, and the notion of changing that definition to encompass something completely different.

Honestly, I still go back and forth on it, and despite what many here and elsewhere would say, that doesn't make me a homophobe, it doesn't mean I hate homosexuals, and it doesn't mean that I don't favor equality. It simply means that I'm having to readjust the way I view marriage, and that is going to take time.

But I can tell you for certain, one thing that has not aided me as I struggle with this is people belittling my religious beliefs, and telling me I hate homosexuals simply because I'm not prepared to throw away everything I was raised to believe on a whim.

All I can suggest to you is to think about it and to pray about it - I did, and do.

 

[LuvDuke]

Yes it is His Truth, His Word, the Bible.

Those who deceive others my telling them they should stay in their homosexual lifestyle because "it's the true you" or implying that God condones it are truly hurting others instead of helping them overcome it.

On that "overcome" note, the fabulous Rev. Ted (meth n' massage) Haggard is leaving rehab and has declared himself "cured" of homosexuality. He and his wife are leaving CO and will more than likely set up another church and live off the tithes of more blind suckers.

 

[jimmiej]

I believe Jesus considered judgementality and lack of charity as very grievous sins. Jesus stands for love and tolerance. And I think if you are a follower of Jesus Christ, you should be struggling with this issue. Some of the words that have used on this thread by self proclaimed Christians do more to separate people from Jesus than to illustrate his infinite love for us. Its no wonder you are struggling.

Again, I ask you, are you a disciple of Jesus?

IA with your first statement. However, your mention of tolerance is misguided, IMO. Jesus was/is tolerant of SINNERS, NOT SIN! Are you aware Jesus spoke more about Hell than Heaven?

As far as separating people from Christ:

Hebrews 4:11-13

12For the word of God is living and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart. 13Nothing in all creation is hidden from God's sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account.

The words of Jesus:

Matthew 10:34-36

34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn
" 'a man against his father,
a daughter against her mother,
a daughter-in-law against her motherinlaw—
36a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'

 

[JoeEpcotRocks]

On that "overcome" note, the fabulous Rev. Ted (meth n' massage) Haggard is leaving rehab and has declared himself "cured" of homosexuality. He and his wife are leaving CO and will more than likely set up another church and live off the tithes of more blind suckers.

I glad he's back on God's path.