FP + What we know and what we want to know

[mesaboy2]

I've tried to thumb through all of this giant thread but are they actually booking the fastpasses for all of this online yet or we still in speculation phase of it? I have been on the website and see no place where you can reserve any of it yet.

Second thing is my dvcmember log on is different than my wdw.com log on which, of course, is resulting in me having problems with putting on my affiliation on my profile at wdw.com, anyone come across this problem before?

Large parts speculation, with no ability to reserve anything yet.

 

[doggydoc]

EXACTLY. Some people will scurry off to SB lines. Others will leave to do other things, like shop or eat. Quite simply, the person who used to ride Soarin' at RD and grab a FP for later will now ride Soarin' at RD, use their FP+ for Test Track which they previously obtained, and then, at 2:00 pm, when the line at Soarin' is 100 minutes will have to choose to get in that line, or go do something else. Many folks, especially the seasoned veterans, will go do something else. Maybe stroll around WS and spend money in shops. Even the people who are lauding the system here are admitting that the days of them doing rides like Soarin', Test Track and TSM 4 or 5 times in a day will be over. I think that on this point, there is uniform agreement. The question is, what are you going to do in the time that you used to spend repeating rides? Are you going to wait in SB lines for attractions that interest you to a lesser degree or are you going to do something at WDW that causes you to spend money? There is no wrong answer to that. But WDW is counting on a certain, not insignficant percentage of people going to do other things instead of sitting through Impressions of France three times a day.

Many may decide to avail themselves of the myriad other attractions that Orlando has to offer. I have posted about his earlier in the thread but here goes. For those that think this is about "a more even experience" for the majority, fine I get that but Disney has to get them there in the first place. Universal is constantly expanding and upgrading. Disney doesn't want to "get into a rides war" with them, I think because they feel they will lose. So what do they do, they take one of the prime advantages Disney has over US and make it a lesser advantage. I used to laugh at the US Express Pass system. Not anymore. You have to pay for Express Pass and you only get 1 ride on each Express available ride, but you at least get a ride on ALL of them. This without having to schedule or pull passes for a given window.Then look at what on-site US guests get, they get the same system but with UNLIMITED rides. Now say you are one of the poor information disenfranchised, unable to get out of bed in the morning, never been to Orlando vacationers and you are looking at vacation opportunities. You look at the available amenities. You have a confusing, forced regimented FP+ system versus the awesome ride what you want Express Unlimited system.

Being limited to 3 FP's per day won't stop me from going to Disney but now I will be MUCH more likely to stay at US. That way we can spend a few days at Disney, use our feeble 3 FP's, spend an evening at MK for parade and fireworks but the rest of the time at US where we can ride our brains to mush on ever newer and exciting attractions.

 

[JimmyV]

We all want more than 3 fastpasses. That's the bottom line of this whole "the sky is falling" fp+ panic.

A very logical and eloquent post. But it loses steam when you get to the sentence quoted above. If everyone wants more than 3 FP+ per day (even the people who are leading the cheers for the new system...and I agree with your premise here), and we don't get them, how does this play into your conclusion that the ultimate goal is to make everyone happy? Haven't they done the one thing that will make people complain and downgrade their Trip Advisor rating? It seems to me that there are two camps developing. Those that are assuming that the 3 FP+ system with one e-ticket will be implemented as stated with no FP1.0 option available, and those who are hoping that this is not the case and that the allotment will increase. I'm not sure I hear anyone saying that the 3 FP+ per day system is an improvement. Only those who hope it will not roll out the way we are assuming it will.

 

[JimmyV]

And your assertion is flawed, because you have no idea on the money that people spend that may just be riding attractions most of the day. They may spend more money than those that spend less time riding attractions. They could be DVC members, staying in a Deluxe Disney resortw as opposed to offsite, dining in an upscale Epcot restaurant, spending more money on ticket options, etc.

Revenue streams are kept separate for the parks. This investment was by the park division, and the return on investment is for the park division. All of my comments about expenditure should be read to pertain to spending while in the parks. But if one spends money elsewhere, such as DTD or on a golf course, WDW is not going to complain.

 

[dadddio]

I still get to ride that ride twice without waiting in a long line. As a bonus, I get two additional advance FP+s and anything that I may or may not receive same-day. Even if I don't get same-day FP+s, I still have two fastpasses that I would not have under the current system.

But here's the rub. You have been "given" two "bonus" FP+ that you would not otherwise have, because you otherwise would not want them. You have traded a FP that would allow you to bypass a 100 minute line in favor of receiving a FP+ allowing you to transform a 25 minute wait into a 5 minute wait. A benefit to be sure. But not one that many people would trade for, even up.Further, it should be noted that under the current system, I pretty much always ride all of the big rides at DHS in addition to using my FPs how I like to.

I can't find any official release that states that when FP+ goes live that you will get 1 FP+ that you want and two that you don't want. Please share a link.

No. The sky is not falling. But here we will probably have to agree to disagree. You believe that WDW invested $1 billion dollars on a system that would allow more efficient use of attractions that generate no revenue. I believe that WDW invested $1 billion on a system that is designed to get people to utilize offerings other than attractions so that they will spend more money. In the business world, if you are correct and people find their attraction maximization to be greater causing them to ride more rides and spend less time in revenue-generating venues, then heads will roll.

I believe that happy people spend money on food and at gift shops. I believe that happy people return and spend again. I believe that this spending makes companies happy. Incidentally, this is pretty much what TPTB said when asked about how this will effect the bottom line.

 

[mom2rtk]

Many may decide to avail themselves of the myriad other attractions that Orlando has to offer. I have posted about his earlier in the thread but here goes. For those that think this is about "a more even experience" for the majority, fine I get that but Disney has to get them there in the first place. Universal is constantly expanding and upgrading. Disney doesn't want to "get into a rides war" with them, I think because they feel they will lose. So what do they do, they take one of the prime advantages Disney has over US and make it a lesser advantage. I used to laugh at the US Express Pass system. Not anymore. You have to pay for Express Pass and you only get 1 ride on each Express available ride, but you at least get a ride on ALL of them. This without having to schedule or pull passes for a given window.Then look at what on-site US guests get, they get the same system but with UNLIMITED rides. Now say you are one of the poor information disenfranchised, unable to get out of bed in the morning, never been to Orlando vacationers and you are looking at vacation opportunities. You look at the available amenities. You have a confusing, forced regimented FP+ system versus the awesome ride what you want Express Unlimited system.

Being limited to 3 FP's per day won't stop me from going to Disney but now I will be MUCH more likely to stay at US. That way we can spend a few days at Disney, use our feeble 3 FP's, spend an evening at MK for parade and fireworks but the rest of the time at US where we can ride our brains to mush on ever newer and exciting attractions.

Hey, how about this for a plan.....

Stay on US property. Buy multi day tix for each park (Those out days are really the least expensive anyway). Instead of park hopping between Disney parks....... park hop between US and Disney. 2 half days at the MK will get you double the number of headline FPs as 1 full day. Book all your Disney FPs grouped together for the AM or the PM, go to US the other half of the day. FP+ certainly makes this a much more doable plan than ever before. And so far it seems there won't be a "penalty" for not staying on Disney property.

I haven't been to US since 2004. Mostly because I didn''t like their Express Pass system. But Disney might just get me to give it a second look.

 

[JimmyV]

I can't find any official release that states that when FP+ goes live that you will get 1 FP+ that you want and two that you don't want. Please share a link.

Well, the "want" and "don't want" are unique to the individual. But when the FP+ system ws rolled out for test marketing, it was one e-ticket attraction and two other options. If you have any information that states that the full roll out will be different, you are free to post a link.

So neither of us knows. But which position is stronger? The one based on the test market that got very mixed reviews (even though those guests were not shut out of the FP1.0 system which has definitively been stated to be the case now), or the one that is predicated on the hope that something different rolls out? I get that you hope the actual system is different. And I hope you are right.

 

[g-dad66]

Do you have access to these FP+ surveys? Can you share them with us or give us a link where we can see the information for ourselves?

These are the ones I have been able to find --

http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=3033833
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2997786
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2987350 (last 2 pages of this thread)
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2995252
http://www.disboards.com/showthread.php?t=2920299 (last 2 pages of this thread)

 

[dadddio]

This is where you lose me. What is it, exactly, that they are going to go do? They are going to go to another attraction and get in the SB line, making that SB line longer than it was before. And I'm not sure what we are debating. You don't think that it will be a "net wash" and I don't either. I simply stated for the sake of the other poster's argument that at best, it is a net wash. I don't think it will be.

The bolded part is where we differ. For reasons that I explained in depth, I think that as far as wait time go, at worst, it is a net wash.

The fact is, I may or may not go wait in another standby line. If I do, it will likely be a fairly short standby line since I am already pretty satisfied with the mix of rides that we go on. We'll go check out other attractions, get something to eat, do some shopping (window or otherwise), etc.

 

[jbraught]

There has to be more to this than just limiting guests to 3 FP a day, with no repeating rides. THey could have re-programmed the FP kiosks to do this for a lot less that a billion dollars.



Also, a significant number of guests will not stand in a 100-minute ride to re-ride something they have experienced already that day with a FP. So, if 'super-user's ride once at RD, and once later with FP, they are probably not going to do that ride again. 'Regular users' will have slept in, and ridden once with their FP, but aren't going to wait again. The FP line will remain as busy as ever, because all FP will still be given out, but won't the SB line get shorter, as many who used to ride once SB, are now riding with their FP?

 

[dadddio]

For some it might!
The thrill and excitement will be deminished greatly.
We got to ride Expedition Everest 4 times by 2p the first week of July! only once did we use SB... (right at RD and the wait was 10 minutes).
This was my 8 yr old DGS favorite thing the entire trip!

I've also ridden EE several times quickly in a row. It was a bunch of fun. That being said, on most trips I only ride it once. Those trips are still fun, of course.

 

[Circus181920]

With the info we have now about NextGen, I can't imagine what the parks will be like during christmas and nye! As it was, I got a FP on nye (in 2010) for Mission Space at noon and the return time was midnight!!

Could you imagine what the attraction lines would look like with FP+

 

[jade1]

Hey, how about this for a plan.....

Stay on US property. Buy multi day tix for each park (Those out days are really the least expensive anyway). Instead of park hopping between Disney parks....... park hop between US and Disney. 2 half days at the MK will get you double the number of headline FPs as 1 full day. Book all your Disney FPs grouped together for the AM or the PM, go to US the other half of the day. FP+ certainly makes this a much more doable plan than ever before. And so far it seems there won't be a "penalty" for not staying on Disney property.

I haven't been to US since 2004. Mostly because I didn''t like their Express Pass system. But Disney might just get me to give it a second look.

I am 100% with you on this. US is great, and 1/2 days there are plenty.

I can guarantee we will select an evening at DHS-but hit IOA that AM.

 

[dadddio]

Actually it is. It just looks better to do it by satisfying. Its always about bottom line and always will be.

Not just 'looks better'. It is actually better to serve your bottom line by satisfying your customers because they spread that happy to their friends and they come back to be happy again.

 

[dadddio]

Honestly! Each of us has things about Disney that make our trip special to us. Certainly, for my teenage boys riding certain thrill rides over and over is part of that. Can't we just respect other people's feelings? I don't think we should be deciding what is and what is not important for other people's Disney experience.

How is asking a question about how someone will be affected 'deciding what is or is not important for other people'?

 

[Cinderumbrella]

Not just 'looks better'. It is actually better to serve your bottom line by satisfying your customers because they spread that happy to their friends and they come back to be happy again.

Of course. And that was my point. They are using "good customer service" to pad their bottom line, by the very way you stated above (as well as a PP did).

I am just pointing out that Disney is a business and with any sound business, the bottom line is most important. If good customer service causes their bottom line to expand exponetially, then its even better for them. But don't think they are doing this merely for the sake of good customer service, no matter what spin they put on it.

(Not that there's anything wrong with that...)

 

[g-dad66]

This goes back to the basic aspect..

FP distribution ends prior to 11am. Prior to 11am less than 1/3 of the park total is in the park or admitted for the day (some have already left, but that's not really important for this). So less than 1/3 of park guests control the FP allottment for a major attraction that guest consider a make/break for their overall enjoyment of the park (let's also add that people who ride Stitch rate the entire park less favorably than those who don't.. it really should statistically be closed.)

Considering that there's more than 1/3 of the park population worth of FP's to be had for that attraction for the entire day, this means that many of that minority have more than one FP for that attraction. This plays out over and over again at various attractions in various ways. A small group controls all the FP on average.

This group is to be stopped. All these comments of "well if they didn't want.. why don't they change.."

Now they are, this is the change. I fail to see how it could be more obvious.

FP+ will be distributed more evenly to the park population as a whole.

Interesting.

But my point remains: (1) Say, FPs for TSM currently run out by 11:00 am, so those who arrive later are out of luck. (2) With FP+, FPs for TSM will run out at some point (say, 10 days prior to park day.. or 5 days, or 2 days, or whatever...), so those who try to get a FP+ for TSM after that point will be out of luck.

But maybe there will be fewer complaints with the new system? Do procrastinators complain less than sleepyheads do?

As I said, I guess time will tell.

 

[WillAustin]

I haven't been to US since 2004. Mostly because I didn''t like their Express Pass system. But Disney might just get me to give it a second look.

I actually like the idea of the Express Pass. We've never been to Universal, but I'm thinking of looking into it though, especially since my kids are getting older. I personally don't mind the idea of paying more for shorter lines.

 

[mom2rtk]

But maybe there will be fewer complaints with the new system? Do procrastinors complain less than sleepyheads do?

As I said, I guess time will tell.

I guess time will indeed tell!

 

[ctl]

I've tried reading but I'm still confused. I don't think I want to do the FP+ at all even though we will be staying on site. I am looking to splitting more of my vacation at US. I spent my first trip there in November 2012 and if WDW is going to end up limiting FP on the bigger rides and if I don't use the FP+ system then others will have either a separate line or my regular FP line will have a longer wait then I may cut our days at WDW short. I like to make my decisions based on how the day is going, not on a regimented pre-plan. I hate the Dining Plan because I find it really limiting having to be somewhere at a particular time. My kids are older now and they don't want to see characters, so the FP+ plan is not that great for us.