For $2 Billion Disney could have built 16 major attractions instead of fast pass+

[Davey Jones II]

Davey, my point was that its not just Disney in the budget cut ball game............Uni is having big money issues and so is Sea world.

I do not understand ......*Diagon Alley* is a cup of butterbean?

I liked the first HP, but have not seen Diagon Alley yet....I have heard things.

AKK

Universal had previously announced $500 million in new investments in their parks every year. When I heard that, I was salivating, but it did sound highly ambitious. Even if they have to scale down some of that promise, I'm sure they can still add good new attractions. At least there is a lot in the pipeline.

I was trying to make a cute variation on "all that and a bag of chips." It doesn't help that I misspelled butterbeer. Corrected. Okay, here's another one: Diagon Alley is the bomb. In plain language, it's great.

 

[bryanb]

Cultural differences aside...Disney could pay their CMs more. These poor people have to deal with us for barely more than minimum wage. They could train them better (numerous threads have discussed how Disney has cut corners in that area).

Disney could spend whatever it takes to make an attraction as good as it possibly can be. They could fully develop new gates, instead of opening a "barely half day park" with the intention of adding to it slowly over the coming decades.

Maybe WDW can never be TDR. But the Japanese set the bar, and Disney ignores it.

I would definitely be interested in knowing how TDR is able to invest so much money in its parks, when we wouldn't find that to be the most profitable strategy in the USA. Obviously, their park attendance is very strong and perhaps the average Japanese guest spends more money per visit? Or is the owner of TDR willing to take bigger financial risks?

I'd like to think that the executives of Disney think they're making the right decisions for their shareholders. I'm just not sure why there's such a disparity in strategy.

 

[mummabear]

To paraphrase Tonka: "WELL Said Sir!. It's not everyone with the resort thing....more just the vocal few."

I like the resorts and the pools and the grounds and even (some of) the restaurants just as much as anyone else but I'm not going to try to kid anyone - I go for the parks and the entertainment experience (I hope) they provide.

Otherwise, there are tons of great resorts and pools and restaurants on pristine grounds around the world that I can go to.

Yes it is a resort-a resort built around theme parks.
I hate the snobbery around here where if you arent happy just people watching and enjoying the atmosphere then you arent a true fan.
I am not flying from the other side of the world, spending all that money to just soak up an atmosphere, it is part of what I enjoy but I want to ride.
Building rides would be doing a much better job of dispersing crowds, attracting new guests and retaining its existing base than MM+
4 x carslands would make a huge difference to guest experience and IMO the major thing that has changed at WDW is the way they have started getting money out of you-and not in a good way.

 

[kamik86]

What? No way. Starbucks should stop putting money into these digital payment systems. How does that help the customer - Do they get more coffee? NO. All it does is help them take more of my money, faster! Starbucks raised their prices and spent a boatload on payment systems and doesn't even give the customer more coffee? And there's longer lines since it's even more popular than ever?

Starbucks sure better go back to a paper system over this newfangled technology stuff... or they're doooomed! doomed I tell you! I will not go, and I'll post on the internet about it (then go anyways).

Oh wait - what? Starbucks stock is up 4-fold since 2010?

Erm...

Oh um. Well then they're lying. This sucks! Cut trees! Burn your smartphones! Maybe if I protest... we can get Starbucks-- and Disney to stop moving forward with technology and being the best most profitable forward-thinking companies in their respective markets.

It does help the customer the customer can now pay with their cell phone and the starbucks app that did so was also an awards program that gave the customer... free coffee!!!

From the end user prospective what the MM+ did was allow (or make me depending on your point of few) to book attractions before I leave home (ok in some cases somewhat cool but since I could book my room before I left home that doesn't seem like a 2 billion dollar investment worth) and use an RFID in a wristband instead of one in a card. Again not nearly as impressed as not having to remember my starbucks loyalty card because its in my phone.

 

[tim123]

You didnt pay $100 a day to get in back then though did you

In 1976 it cost $15.75 for admission and a 10 coupon booklet for one adult…or approx. $65 in todays inflation adjusted dollars calculated from government inflation numbers (we all know its higher)…
So really its not so far off from today if you think about it…. a discounted one day ticket today is what $99….and if you by a multi day hopper it goes down to that $65 area…..just seems higher today but $15.75 was a lot of money then too.

 

[MrInfinity]

From the end user prospective what the MM+ did was allow (or make me depending on your point of few) to book attractions before I leave home (ok in some cases somewhat cool but since I could book my room before I left home that doesn't seem like a 2 billion dollar investment worth) and use an RFID in a wristband instead of one in a card. Again not nearly as impressed as not having to remember my starbucks loyalty card because its in my phone.

Yes but you're also comparing the practice of buying a cup of $30 coffee to that of planning a week-long family vacation. And if buying a cup of coffee you're willing to tolerate the need to be tied to your smartphone, then surely that's acceptable in planning a mega family vacation costing thousands.

One of the many "against MM+" arguments is that people don't want to be tied to their phone. Yet in everyday life, down to buying coffee, we're perfectly willing to look at that as a convenience. Same thing in WDW. They've replaced a paper system with digital. You get perks, they get data.

 

[Laketravis]

Parks and Resorts is considered a mature market for the Disney Company. They will do just enough to maintain its current base and grow their market by focusing on nostalgia and adding new things driven by their film division.

And if anyone thinks the Disney corporation wouldn't gladly sell that division off at the right price in a heartbeat under an arms-length arrangement that permits the continued use of the Disney name in return for royalties and franchise fees, you're mistaken.

 

[tim123]

And if anyone thinks the Disney corporation wouldn't gladly sell that division off at the right price in a heartbeat under an arms-length arrangement that permits the continued use of the Disney name in return for royalties and franchise fees, you're mistaken.

I wish they would…to the Japanese! Wouldn't that be somethin?

 

[Laketravis]

I wish they would…to the Japanese! Wouldn't that be somethin?

It would! Let's hear from the "love the atmosphere and all things Disney and of course it's a corporation but they are so smart they know what they are doing" crowd. "Oh no! They'd NEVER do THAT!"

Of course they would. And if you think it hasn't already been contemplated and explored, you're really drinking the kool-aid.

Disney couldn't get out from under that land based, facilities-encumbered operation fast enough so they could concentrate their efforts on higher margin electronic entertainment.

 

[kamik86]

Yes but you're also comparing the practice of buying a cup of $30 coffee to that of planning a week-long family vacation. And if buying a cup of coffee you're willing to tolerate the need to be tied to your smartphone, then surely that's acceptable in planning a mega family vacation costing thousands.

One of the many "against MM+" arguments is that people don't want to be tied to their phone. Yet in everyday life, down to buying coffee, we're perfectly willing to look at that as a convenience. Same thing in WDW. They've replaced a paper system with digital. You get perks, they get data.

See being tied to my phone isn't an issue for me. I'm just not impressed with the improvements WDW gave us for all the hassle and money invested. It doesn't seem like such a great accomplishment to me. What was the huge technology you think we now have? It just seems to be a reservation system online. And the use of RFIDs to call up those reservations...

Heck the local 6 flags has kiosks where you can sign up for flash pass reservations and then ride using a wrist band too. I don't know if I can also add those using my phone or computer but that is really all Disney added to the equation.

They don't even really get more data then they used to have. I mean if I put my KTTW card in the FP machine they knew I got a FP and could have that data. They know if I used it if my paper got turned in (this could go digital with a simple scanner on the paper on the other end) Money was already tracked on my KTTW card for purchases. So again besides having which rides I will ride sooner... Disney didn't even really get much for new data.

 

[Donut23]

This is pure hearsay and I hope to heckles they are wrong. Most probably don't know Hubsters is a 30+ year cast member. I can only imagine the changes he has seen and purges he has survived. This tid bit came from some IT co-workers.

Besides being implemented long before the servers and technology was ready...

Remember long ago the choice industry/consumers had between BETA and VHS? Apparently there are similar differences in the technology for Disney's billion $$$ (initially budgeted at $450,000) system. One being cheeper but the others being far easier to operate, update, maintain.

Basically what Hubby was told was, Disney selected the cheeper version. They choose "BETA" instead of VHS. One reason so any other resorts/businesses are implimenting their systems with so few problems vs. Disney's ongoing challenges.

Sounds just like BOATUS about 20 years ago. They bought a cheep POS system. Shortly later the original software suppier went out of business. I'm shocked they survived. I recall that summer I ordered a pair if binoculars for my boat and got 8 different deliveries of 35 LB. Anchors!

That's what happens when you always default to....cheep vs. Value.

 

[Davey Jones II]

I would definitely be interested in knowing how TDR is able to invest so much money in its parks, when we wouldn't find that to be the most profitable strategy in the USA. Obviously, their park attendance is very strong and perhaps the average Japanese guest spends more money per visit? Or is the owner of TDR willing to take bigger financial risks?

I'd like to think that the executives of Disney think they're making the right decisions for their shareholders. I'm just not sure why there's such a disparity in strategy.

It's not all about cold, cynical spreadsheet and number crunching calculations. It's also about pride. And faith. Faith that, if you reinvest in your business (in ways that give your customers what they want, not just rook them into spending a little more), you will be rewarded for that.

 

[Laketravis]

That would certainly explain why the RFID readers Food Service has to use and have so much trouble with are the size of and resemble first-generation bar code scanners.

This is pure hearsay and I hope to heckles they are wrong. Most probably don't know Hubsters is a 30+ year cast member. I can only imagine the changes he has seen and purges he has survived. This tid bit came from some IT co-workers.

Besides being implemented long before the servers and technology was ready...

Remember long ago the choice industry/consumers had between BETA and VHS? Apparently there are similar differences in the technology for Disney's billion $$$ (initially budgeted at $450,000) system. One being cheeper but the others being far easier to operate, update, maintain.

Basically what Hubby was told was, Disney selected the cheeper version. They choose "BETA" instead of VHS. One reason so any other resorts/businesses are implimenting their systems with so few problems vs. Disney's ongoing challenges.

Sounds just like BOATUS about 20 years ago. They bought a cheep POS system. Shortly later the original software suppier went out of business. I'm shocked they survived. I recall that summer I ordered a pair if binoculars for my boat and got 8 different deliveries of 35 LB. Anchors!

That's what happens when you always default to....cheep vs. Value.

 

[Donut23]

Want an "apples to apples" comparison for the luscious Toyko Disney to WDW? Go to you tube and look at each night parade. Sure Electric light parade is nostalgic.....but wait till you see the Genie float alone in Tokyo Disney's parade....don't even need to see the rest.

This is a perfect example of maintenance, update and park management between the two park systems.

 

[typhoonlagooner]

...Meanwhile, Universal IS going all out to maximize their parks. Why can't Disney, that mega-billion dollar media conglomerate, do the same?

Even Comcast (owners of Universal) are realizing the slight error in their ways.

Disney [World] has been able to ride the coat-tails of Universal's expansion for a few years now. Meaning, Disney's attendance and profits went up... with minimal direct investment.

Comcast has recognized this... and has scaled back quite a bit. Knowing that Disney has an AK and DHS expansion on the horizon and Disney Springs... the idea of 'more' expansion and attractions is almost worthless, in the immediate future that is.

Comcast is looking to sit back, and let Disney dump millions into their own parks [for a change] and reap the benefits. They certainly have some positive changes on their horizon with Kong, Jurassic Park, and City Walk... but nothing on the investment level of either Harry Potter addition.

It will be interesting to see what the next 5 years bring to the Orlando area parks...

 

[tim123]

It's not all about cold, cynical spreadsheet and number crunching calculations. It's also about pride.

Japan Disney World gleams with PRIDE!

 

[MrInfinity]

See being tied to my phone isn't an issue for me. I'm just not impressed with the improvements WDW gave us for all the hassle and money invested. It doesn't seem like such a great accomplishment to me. What was the huge technology you think we now have? It just seems to be a reservation system online. And the use of RFIDs to call up those reservations...

Well, good... that's a common thread among the naysayers which I think is a terrible argument. You seem to embrace tech like me so that's cool.

They don't even really get more data then they used to have. I mean if I put my KTTW card in the FP machine they knew I got a FP and could have that data. They know if I used it if my paper got turned in (this could go digital with a simple scanner on the paper on the other end) Money was already tracked on my KTTW card for purchases. So again besides having which rides I will ride sooner... Disney didn't even really get much for new data.

They get to track pretty much every person everywhere they go. They know how many rides you ride, how much you spend on food, where you buy it, and even better... they can control it. Before they had little ability to use FP- to any sort of benefit. Now they can offer 0-day FP to day passers, 30-day to advance purchases, and 60-day for resort guests.

That's the main thing. They've created a "perk" they can sell (in the form of resort rooms) that previously was just a paper ticket system that didn't do anything for them.

FP- was just a ticket system that some guests figured out how to use to ride a lot more than everyone else. It did little else profitable.

That's what they're getting out of it. FP+ can be monetized. FP- could not.

It's digital, so it can be recoded or sold differently with a few clicks of a mouse.

 

[tim123]

Want an "apples to apples" comparison for the luscious Toyko Disney to WDW? Go to you tube and look at each night parade. Sure Electric light parade is nostalgic.....but wait till you see the Genie float alone in Tokyo Disney's parade....don't even need to see the rest.

This is a perfect example of maintenance, update and park management between the two park systems.

See my Japan films.

I think Im turning Japanese
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L7brMX8Y9sk

Japan
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIFx6gvqfys

 

[Davey Jones II]

This is pure hearsay and I hope to heckles they are wrong. Most probably don't know Hubsters is a 30+ year cast member. I can only imagine the changes he has seen and purges he has survived. This tid bit came from some IT co-workers.

Besides being implemented long before the servers and technology was ready...

Remember long ago the choice industry/consumers had between BETA and VHS? Apparently there are similar differences in the technology for Disney's billion $$$ (initially budgeted at $450,000) system. One being cheeper but the others being far easier to operate, update, maintain.

Basically what Hubby was told was, Disney selected the cheeper version. They choose "BETA" instead of VHS. One reason so any other resorts/businesses are implimenting their systems with so few problems vs. Disney's ongoing challenges.

Sounds just like BOATUS about 20 years ago. They bought a cheep POS system. Shortly later the original software suppier went out of business. I'm shocked they survived. I recall that summer I ordered a pair if binoculars for my boat and got 8 different deliveries of 35 LB. Anchors!

That's what happens when you always default to....cheep vs. Value.

Disney went with the cheaper version? That's so unlike them

So they went with "cheaper", it ended up costing them MUCH more, and that's what we got instead of some new E Tickets. Merry Christmas, folks.

 

[Davey Jones II]

Even Comcast (owners of Universal) are realizing the slight error in their ways.

Disney [World] has been able to ride the coat-tails of Universal's expansion for a few years now. Meaning, Disney's attendance and profits went up... with minimal direct investment.

Comcast has recognized this... and has scaled back quite a bit. Knowing that Disney has an AK and DHS expansion on the horizon and Disney Springs... the idea of 'more' expansion and attractions is almost worthless, in the immediate future that is.

Comcast is looking to sit back, and let Disney dump millions into their own parks [for a change] and reap the benefits. They certainly have some positive changes on their horizon with Kong, Jurassic Park, and City Walk... but nothing on the investment level of either Harry Potter addition.

It will be interesting to see what the next 5 years bring to the Orlando area parks...

This might still be a rumor, but I've heard more than once that a third Potter land, Ministry of Magic, is in the planning stages.